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When a MMO goes F2P what does that usually mean about the game's future?
MMOExposed
Member RarePosts: 7,387
Over the years, lots of AA MMOs have been converting to a non sub model.
but what does this usually mean regarding the game's future in terms of new content and new game features.
looking at Rift, which is the latest of the big AAA MMO to take the bite. Rift at on point was tossing content to the community rapidly.
Also they were dishing out brand new gameplay features constantly.
but after the conversion to a non sub based, it is usually assumed that with less money coming in that means less new game play features and less new content churning out.
but is that truly the case with most conversions?
what usually happens?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Comments
I thought FTP is usually a final cash grab before the game turns into a ghost town .
And in a lot of the cases: After it turns into a ghost town
Did LOTRO turn into ghost town? how about DDO? SWTOR? AOC? STO?..anything?
Let me guess now you will give me some made up time line in which these MMOS are supposed to go ghost town.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney
Basically what happens is exactly the opposite of what you just said.
Games fail or shutdown for a variety of reasons but it generally has nothing to do with the financial model but the game itself.
Been playing Fallen Earth for several months now and the pop is pretty healthy with new players every day. I am even running into a lot people in the wilderness now. Patches and content are being added. In short everything you said would not happen is.
Also played PWI about 4 years ago and that game is still going strong also.
I tend to side with the notion that sub based games (or at least mandatory sub games- FE allows you to sub also) are fast becoming ancient history. Would I have tried FE if it was sub based? Absolutely not. As an F2P, I can and did, and enjoy it enough to spend the occasional dime on it. The entire content of the game is free, and it is not P2W if that is what you are thinking.
Time to lose the F2P bias that you are saddled with and start trying these games. They are good games and they will SAVE you money over playing sub based games.
PS I tried the WoW free trial and while it was enjoyable I would never pay a sub to play that.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
Yes this thread does seem to reek of being yet another f2p is bad!!! BS.
Games that were focused on bringing players new content before going free to play seem to continue to do so. Games that never brought anything new seem to go for the cash shop junk is new content ! model.
So once again... it's the game and the company that makes it, not the payment model that is the deciding factor.
Well, if a existing subscription based MMO is converting to F2P with a cashshop it usually means numbers are falling and the game is dying.
If a new MMO is F2P and has a cashshop it usually means just a new way to bait players into dumping money (usually more/month then a sub based model) in that game, but it doesn't mean the game is dying, it could be thriving.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Nah. Once a few higher quality MMOs started going F2P (initially due to waning interest), the rest had to follow. Otherwise they are just setting up a barrier to entry that a lot of people are not willing to gamble on, especially when there are high quality alternatives on the F2P scene.
It would have to be an amazing genre breaking game to buck the trend at this point.
what it means content wise depends on the company entirely, for some it means the game is going into limbo for ever for other it depends on how well it dose after the F2P has setled in.
dont get me wrong im a avid hater of F2P for so many reasons but in the end the quality of the game itself depends o the comany and becuase of this it is difficult to predict what will happen to a game once it gose F2P.
the only things that is gurrenteed, is that anything new you will have to pay for in sections if you want it.everything else is kinda up in the wind.
F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.
Basically this is how it it is.
All you hard core guys seem to think sub based is the only way to go. So company X spends millions of dollars and says come play our triple A sub based game.
Hardcore players show up and blow though the content in 1 or 2 months.
Next, the hardcore player will come to the forums and say "Game X blows, there is no end game content, blah blah". Fellow hardcores that have not tried the game say "No way I am spending for a box and sub, for a game that blows with no end game"
Hence subs drop off, players leave, and there you have your "Ghost Town". And the game goes F2P.
Suddenly casual gamers start showing up and saying this game isn't so bad after all, I wonder what those hardcore guys were talking about? And its free too!!
More players show up. Some even stay stay and spend a little money. Everyone thanks the hardcore gamers for paying for both box and the the subscription fees so Company X could recoup most of their investment, while the rest of us enjoy the game for free or spend whatever we feel like paying.
And the cycle continues :P
Its freakin obvious boys! Time to wake up and smell the coffee!
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
Agreed. The company is, and has been, the deciding factor, not the payment model.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Look at the most successful MMORPGs, even if their sub peak is long past, I'm going to say that you can't keep a good MMO down. People will play it and in droves.
If you have a fantastic product, word of mouth is the only advertising you need.
If your product is mediocre, there is nothing you can do to make it popular.
"Build it and they will come" only works in the movies. Any MMO relying solely on word of mouth either has to pray for some viral miracle or become content with obscurity. Neither is a good marketing strategy.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
F2p, b2p, p2p, converted, and everything in between are all good. A game's future is it's player base plus the capability of the game's owner to keep the game running and running well. Pay model really has little to nothing to do with it unless the pay model is so bad it offends and drives away most the player base.
An MMO that has no fixed subscriptions (read: assured revenue)...is just waiting on death role.
Until someone pushes the button and shut the lights out.
I would never invest time in such games.
Wrong. A game's sole future is its revenue, not (free) player numbers. The moment you pull the subscription plug, you unplug your steady revenue. As such these games have a very doubtful future as nothing is for free in this competitive world.
What you see now is merely a MUCH needed shake out. Too much free garbage, it is time 95% of those free thingies are weeded out.
It is bad for the business to promote crap. And no, turning a turd to free to play is even worse.
Currently bored with MMO's.
There is nothing assured about the revenue of the subscription model. You're used to subscription, which is fine, but that doesn't mean there is any greater guarantee of longevity to them over hourly or microtransaction models
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Exactly
Always amuses me when I read posts like "f2p means the game is on death roll" and "shutdown becomes imminent"... sure.
Just a quick list based on my current hdd content (so without Aion, Tera and Rift among many others since I don't play them):
DDO and STO was literally saved by the f2p conversion, and is in a good shape since then (STO now with Romulus is in a great shape even)
CO and DCUO were in a declining state, both got stabilized with the switch, DCUO got many new players and a few DLC's since then, CO stopped losing players and also got a few updates.
AoC put in a far more restrictive model than its unlimited trial was, purely for cashing more from the Store. The subscribers stayed though (maybe because it's a great game
), the game was in a solid state and FC made TSW during those years. With TSW's switch they released a much better f2p model for AoC, since then the game is almost reborned.
SW:TOR same as AoC, but because it had much more potential players (those 2mill who purchased the box) the initial lame model was revamped in a much faster way, presently its f2p is a decent one, just like the playerbase numbers.
LotRO, it didn't even needed the switch but after DDO's success they wanted more money
there were 2 expansions since then, an the game is far from a ghost town - nicely put.
So yep, it really seems an f2p switch is a doom for every former p2p games...
(/sarcasm, just to be sure)
I don't say there aren't exceptions. Poor Vanguard, it's mostly in the same state as it was before the f2p switch, there was a model revamp to an even better setting (but I think the original f2p was a nice one too), and it seems the playerbase is not increasing. The other exception is the late CoH... But most p2p to f2p switched games are just fine.
So, to OP (and based on what Trion leaked so far), don't worry about Rift, I think it will be ok. Imo.
When an mmo goes f2p its usually at the end of its life.. subs are dropping slowly so less cash is coming in. So games switch to f2p to try and get some more cash in.. sometimes this works and allows the game to carry on running and in some cases grow..
Still if the game is bad in the first place going f2p will not help with that... it will still be bad.
This assumption has been proven wrong, how many times now?
I'm not real sure why this thread was created by a site "vet", if not for bating and riot inciting. We are now several years into the big P2P to F2P push and the big-name titles that made the change are doing fine.
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
The numbers don't seem to support the idea any more.
I'm struggling to remember; did they ever, or was it just a gamer "Truth By Repetition"?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Let's use EQ and WoW as examples. Both had excellent word of mouth advertising. People would call their cousins and tell them to stop what they are doing, they have to play this game now.
It's not so much as a strategy as a phenomena. After the population explosion, the main stream media picks it up.
If a game is good, you can't keep people away.
For the most part it is a cash grab. The development team switches from playable content being generated to generating items to put in the store for sale.
At least that is what I saw with LOTRO, and with EQ2.
I still play eq2 its got a lot of great content, but my number one complaint is the number of items being produced and put in the store, when they should be killing bugs that have been around since the dawn of the game,
EQ2 had a saying a while back "Play your way", honestly the mantra should have been play our way, as they sure taken a lot of fun out of the game with some very bad decisions lately.
Of course, both also had sizable advertising budgets, even early on.
Compare it to the 200 other titles on our mmorpg list? Massive advertising budgets, by mmo standards. Most of those other titles make do with (effectively) zero.
We get what you're saying, but not really the best examples. Blizzard or SoE or Funcom? The only guys that do get some actual ad money to play with?
CCP's a better one, I think. We're willing to start off really small, we'll just keep plugging for years, word of mouth will eventually make us big. But CCP's also a good example of his point--how much bigger, and how much earlier, with advertising?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.