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What SWTOR really needs

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Comments

  • RefMinorRefMinor MyTownPosts: 3,452Member
    A reverse NGE.
  • simpliussimplius nakskovPosts: 1,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by RefMinor
    A reverse NGE.

    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations

  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,836Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by simplius
    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

  • sethman75sethman75 the gongPosts: 212Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    Agree. Make it too hard and players will flock to something else.

    Hardcore has and will always be a minority group

  • RexGarvinRexGarvin Casa Grande, AZPosts: 28Member
    All your suggestions are not hardcore.  They are content that SWTOR did not want to take the time to program because they wanted to make as much money off the Star Wars name as fast as they could.  SWTOR is a joke.  Space flight in the game is the biggest joke on the players.  During beta testing us testers expressed our concerns about the lack of content but the developers did not care.  Why should they care because they knew  when the game was released they would make millions of profit. 
  • deniterdeniter LappeenrantaPosts: 805Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    hmm.. i thought they only have lost subs since the simplifying trend begun. i'm not saying WoW was too hardcore in the first place, but certainly they didn't win much by changing their design philosophy.

  • olepiolepi Austin, TXPosts: 1,150Member Uncommon

    Ridiculous! You are expecting a space type game, in *STAR WARS*???? hehe

    I don't remember any space action in the movies ...... oh, wait.

    ------------
    RIP City of Heroes. One of my favorite MMO's.

  • Vicar1492Vicar1492 Austin, TXPosts: 12Member
    Originally posted by sethman75
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    Agree. Make it too hard and players will flock to something else.

    Hardcore has and will always be a minority group

    I know that sarcasm is difficult to convey through the written medium of forums, but my interpretation of simplius' post was just that.  He was also agreeing with you about hardcore games not actually attracting more people, but he posted as such beginning sarcastically, the whole "bizzaro" weather comment kind of gave that away.

  • simpliussimplius nakskovPosts: 1,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by deniter
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    hmm.. i thought they only have lost subs since the simplifying trend begun. i'm not saying WoW was too hardcore in the first place, but certainly they didn't win much by changing their design philosophy.

    wow was definately MORE hardcore back in BC

    every expansion has made the game more accessible to the masses

    the result is, that an 8 year old mmo , is still the big dog

    and its funny, that the two "grand , old men" of mmos,,wow and EVE, both started in the "golden age"

  • simpliussimplius nakskovPosts: 1,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Vicar1492
    Originally posted by sethman75
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    Agree. Make it too hard and players will flock to something else.

    Hardcore has and will always be a minority group

    I know that sarcasm is difficult to convey through the written medium of forums, but my interpretation of simplius' post was just that.  He was also agreeing with you about hardcore games not actually attracting more people, but he posted as such beginning sarcastically, the whole "bizzaro" weather comment kind of gave that away.

    yes it was sarcasm, but it backfired....how ironic is that?

    payback is a .....

     

  • DocBrodyDocBrody EldridgePosts: 1,820Member
    Originally posted by simplius
    Originally posted by RefMinor
    A reverse NGE.

    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations

     How are these suggestions "hardcore" ?

    You mean people are too "casual" nowadays to steer a spaceship in a videogame? Therefore they put space combat on rails so all you need is clicking the left mouse button?

  • TokkenTokken Portland, ORPosts: 1,153Member Uncommon

    some of this.....

    SPACE EXPLORATION

    STAR SYSTEMS

    SPACE TRADING

    SPACE MINING

    ATMOSPHERIC FLIGHT

    OPEN WORLD

    DAY / NIGHT / WEATHER CYCLES

    CAPITAL SHIPS

    DEATHSTAR

    Brad McQuaid Quote:  So, God-willing, the Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen team and I will be able to make or allow that magic to happen a third time, and it too will be not just a great game, but also that catalyst again that brings people together, sometimes out of their comfort zone, learning how to work together not just tactically in a virtual world but also socially in the real world.
  • simpliussimplius nakskovPosts: 1,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by olepi

    Ridiculous! You are expecting a space type game, in *STAR WARS*???? hehe

    I don't remember any space action in the movies ...... oh, wait.

    exactly,,the name itself calls for jousting tournaments, barbeque , and limbo contests

    why would anybody spoil the mood, by fighting over such a small thing, as a star

    and even if you win the war,,what are you going to do with a star? put it in your pocket?

     

  • jesteralwaysjesteralways ChittagongPosts: 1,011Member Uncommon
    yes SWToR "need" all of these but EAWARE doesn't "want" all of this in their game. why? 1st, they already stated that their game engine is crap and not sutable for massive game mechanics. 2nd, look at the community, no matter what kind of crap eaware spit out of their ass this community is devouring it and they scream "the game is so awesome, it doesn't need anything else". the 2nd reason is the most viable for eaware, if community is dumping shit load of cash in this crap why do they need ot upgrade the game?

    i want an open world, no phasing, no instancing.i want meaningful owpvp.i want player driven economy.i want meaningful crafting.i want awesome exploration, a sense of thrill.i want ow housing with a meaningful effect on my entire gameplay experience, not just some instanced crap.i want all of these free of cost, i don't wanna pay you a cent, game devs can eat grass and continue developing game for me.
    Seems like that is the current consensus of western mmo players.

  • simpliussimplius nakskovPosts: 1,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DocBrody
    Originally posted by simplius
    Originally posted by RefMinor
    A reverse NGE.

    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations

     How are these suggestions "hardcore" ?

    You mean people are too "casual" nowadays to steer a spaceship in a videogame? Therefore they put space combat on rails so all you need is clicking the left mouse button?

    the reply was for RefMinor

    i agree with most of your suggestions

    i feel , that the difficulty level in space is good for casuals , theres just WAY too little of it, and its too restricted

    STO has shown , how it can be done

    but i dont think, that the famous HERO engine can do the same

    and when the new generation of space games goes live, the bar will go even higher

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon

    SWGs space was awesome for a MMO. You could have one person piloting, and other players manning the guns, which in effect would create an on rails experience like SWTOR for players who do not want to bother tricking out their own ship.

    STOs space is good, and the engine handles mass space combat well, compared to SWGs which stuttered with major lag when GCW 2 was put in giving mass PVE/PVP space combat. STOs space combat is a tad restrictive too, as the ships are all about the crew, but each player controls each ship and your companions man the ships controls which you yourself control, and other players can not, unlike SWG.

    SWG also had space mining, which was like playing Asteroids, but after seeing EVEs mining, will have to give that a go.

  • DocBrodyDocBrody EldridgePosts: 1,820Member
    Originally posted by simplius
     

    but i dont think, that the famous HERO engine can do the same

    and when the new generation of space games goes live, the bar will go even higher

     Hero Engine... that name might end up as the biggest euphemism in videogame history. Don´t see anything heroic about it.

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tokken

    some of this.....

    SPACE EXPLORATION

    STAR SYSTEMS

    SPACE TRADING

    SPACE MINING

    ATMOSPHERIC FLIGHT

    OPEN WORLD

    DAY / NIGHT / WEATHER CYCLES

    CAPITAL SHIPS

    DEATHSTAR

    PVP Space, less instancing, Player housing and Player cities missing there.

    While I personally do not take part in PVP space either in SWG or STO, SWTOR should still have it, and should be in instances, where you can just choose not to particpate

    The same goes for player cities and player housing. With SWTORs instancing these can be avoided too, like in LOTRO, but are always good time sinks for those wanting these things.

    SWGs player housing and cities could not be avoided, and were what made up the empty landscapes. If this was done again, then structure packups should have been put in from the beginning, to reduce the clutter of abandoned structures

    Here is a video showing Atmostphere flight and flying around my city and its structures. Graphiics and video could have been better but was done on my old crappy PC which struggled with it.

  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by sethman75
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    Agree. Make it too hard and players will flock to something else.

    Hardcore has and will always be a minority group

    I love how pepople on these forums completely forget thet SWG Pre NGE was bleeding subs at an alarming rate.

    Yes, that is correct....your mecca of sandbox games was failing hard...NGE was a last ditch effort to save it. Granted, the NGE made the game a lot worse, but nothing can hide the fact that Pre NGE SWG was going downhill fast. If it came out today, its population would dwindle faster that SWTOR.

  • MaakuMaaku ChengduPosts: 90Member

    I'm half and half I guess on most of these (Deathstar, really? Meh!). As for hardcore, just no. If I was still in college with nothing else to do of my evenings and weekends, ok, maybe but the mmo crowd is VAST. From the kid barely out of his diaper to old timers like me who enjoyed a good old text based game. This has been said a million times but there is NO WAY you'll satisfy everyone with a game. Even all the changes the OP asked for.

    So, is it what the game NEEDS, no. What the game needs is subscribers that stick with it long enough to get these changes, additions, suggestions in.

    Given the chance, time and money, I'm sure the swtor team could add these worlds and features (Most). There's so many ways to go around some of the games limitations, really not an issue. The problem is they'll never get the capital to do it so here people sit crying about what might be when you've already given up on your best chance.

    We've lived in a 'Consumer is always right' mentality for too fucking long. Hell, kids today are crying a damn fit if daddy doesn't buy them the latest iPhone... Well boohoo you little fucking snot osed spoiled dickless. In my time, there was ONE PHONE in the house and you made due! (.end grandpa rant). I think if we want the game to be what we wish it to be, we must first help it be successful instead of bashing it and moving on. Myself, I'm still subscribed to swtor and having a blast. Looking forward to the next update which brings in a new race (Cathar) and some nice dye options for armors.

    Plus, Star Wars is Star Wars, swtor makes me feel part of that verse and to me, that's what really counts at the end.

    ________________________
    "If RL was an MMO, I'd probably be getting laid more often..."
    image

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by sethman75
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by simplius

    Originally posted by RefMinor A reverse NGE.
    yup, hardcore games attract most players, thats common knowledge

     

    luckilly, there are no mmos, who have had success, by simplifying gameplay

    and now a look at tomorrows bizzaro weather...

    swtor need so many changes, that it would be easier and cheaper to make a new game

    and use a GOOD and TESTED engine,,most of the changes in the OP cant be done,

    because of the engines limitations


     

    disagree with this, hardcore games actually don't attract more people, not sure what you are basing that off of but you are definitely wrong.

    one only needs to look at wow to come to this conclusion. they copied a hardcore mmo design and simplified it all around and in came the masses.

    Agree. Make it too hard and players will flock to something else.

    Hardcore has and will always be a minority group

    I love how pepople on these forums completely forget thet SWG Pre NGE was bleeding subs at an alarming rate.

    Yes, that is correct....your mecca of sandbox games was failing hard...NGE was a last ditch effort to save it. Granted, the NGE made the game a lot worse, but nothing can hide the fact that Pre NGE SWG was going downhill fast. If it came out today, its population would dwindle faster that SWTOR.

    SWG was not failing hard or fast. It peaked on Xfire in 2004, no doubnt with the JTL expansion, that is one year after release. It kept a steady amount of players until they started screwing around with the CU and NGE in 2005, but the numbers were not what LA wanted. None of the servers were as dead as SWTOR for years, and there were no server merges until 2009, which was 6 years after launch. SWTOR had server merges within 6 months.

    I think if it came out today it would get more population, as at the end it had more features than most MMOs put together. People were mainly put off my the sweeping changes of the CU and NGE.

  • mrrshann618mrrshann618 Waseca, MNPosts: 227Member Uncommon

    It is quite simple. SWG failed, and failed hard. It would not be stronger today thanks to WoW and the dumbing down process.

    You want space combat, free flight, mining, ect..., quite simple, there is a game called eve. Quit trying to make SWTOR into Eve or SWG 2

    You want instanced housing. yeah well that is your thing. I for one  never bother with it and do not need to show off my e-peen about how great I am at decorating.

    Instancing - Well every game does it. however I do have to state that many games hide it much better. STO has just as much in the way of instancing.

    Day/night, Weather Cycles, Open world - Yeah, how are these a necessity? Most games I've run across do not really have it or if they do it rarely makes any difference except dimming of the lights. Asfor open world. most games are just better at hiding it. Lets take a Look at WoW, much of that game is NOT open world. you are herded from point A to point B and many times can only get from those two points via a set route. Now Rift on the other hand, if you can find a way over the hill,  you can cross dang near anywhere.

     

    SWG is a different game from SWTOR, and it failed

    Eve is a different game from SWTOR and it is going strong.

    Both are Sandbox styles. SWTOR is not. SWOTR is a Themepark! Go somewhere else for your Sandbox wishes. Quit trying to make a Themepark into a Sandbox even though you know IT WILL NEVER BE ONE and then bitching that the company isn't listening to you.

     

    Side note. I'd be "defending" ANY themepark against your sandbox wishes. I play Themepark games because I want to go on a ride and enjoy myself. NOT go to a "second life/job". I do not need a digital life/job my analog one is doing just fine.

    Play what you Like. I like SWOTR, Have a referral to get you going!
    -->  http://www.swtor.com/r/nBndbs  <--
    Several Unlocks and a few days game time to make the F2P considerably easier
  • RaysheRayshe London, ONPosts: 1,284Member

    I really think the open world would be a bad call on SWTOR's part. i just think that the file size would get to massive in order to do it. in order to balance that you would be stuck removing planets. I am getting the feeling that some people believe that mmo's are made by Wishful thinking and Candy Filled Dreams. FOr all these things that the people in this thread are asking for. Think about a year or 2 of development added on. And perhaps longer if they feel like adding it now. 

     

     

    SWTOR was never supposed to be a sandbox. Its a themepark, Get over it.

    Because i can.
    I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out.
    Logic every gamers worst enemy.

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mrrshann618

    It is quite simple. SWG failed, and failed hard. It would not be stronger today thanks to WoW and the dumbing down process.

     

    Not really. SWTOR failed. EA were expecting it to last 10 years as P2P

    Has SOE folded - Smedley left the business and gone beer making? Nope. Has the main people from Bioware done this? Yep

    Did SWG go F2P? No. SWTOR did and within the year.

    SWG did not cost a bomb to make, so was financilaly viable. SWTOR was not, and now EA are extorting more money from SWTOR subbers with the cash shop too 

    SWG also got many updates and 3 proper expansions, whereas SWTOR got a joke of an expansion which was really just an update and is the first MMO to charge for an update. If SWTOR did not fail it would have had a proper expansion, and plenty more content that it has been getting, which is just stuff that was mentioned nearly a year ago now.

    SWG was only shut down because they knew that SWTOR was not up to scratch, and would SWTOR failed even more as people flocked back to SWG.

    SWTOR was created too much from WOW, and BW even said that if you do not do what WOW does, then you are setting yourself up for fail, but as WOW does WOW better than SWTOR does, people just went back to WOW

    About 75% of people who bought SWTOR, proves that SWTOR failed and failed hard

  • Pongo_Pongo_ merced, CAPosts: 36Member Uncommon

    swg didn't fail, it was so horribly mismanaged that 'NGE' became synonomous with, 'how to FUBAR a game'.

    i mean it's analogous to handing a faberge egg to a ADD 3 year old with parkinson's

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