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F2P is making more than TWICE as much money as P2P in the US

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  • OlgarkOlgark Member UncommonPosts: 342

    Its quite obvious to me that F2P companies are making more money than the P2P ones. Look at PWE they recently bought Cyrptic. They run countless other games of their own and are looking at more aquasistions in the western markets.

     

    Also F2P mmos have less staff and less patch releases than the p2p games which means updates and fixes are often months away. Your also having to pay out for things such as ID scrolls in PWE case just so you can gain the full benifits of armour and weapons. You have to buy them because the daily quests do not supply enough.  If the mmo in question has pvp then your going to have to fork out a lot of cash just to be competative because then it becomes a pay to win game.

    image

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,741

    F2P has less money invested, less staff, less patches less everything. So it is small wonder they make a big return on investment.

    And we as players get less of a game, it is all so wonderful. Keep taking those happy pliis and enjoy playing F2P folks!

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Member RarePosts: 1,607
    Originally posted by Scot

    F2P has less money invested, less staff, less patches less everything. So it is small wonder they make a big return on investment.

    And we as players get less of a game, it is all so wonderful. Keep taking those happy pliis and enjoy playing F2P folks!

    I don't need happy pills when I'm playing a game that I enjoy. Some of the cynics around here sure could use some though.

  • daltaniousdaltanious Member UncommonPosts: 2,381

    First time I realised what crap and trap at same time are so called "free-to-play" games. With Rappelz for crappy game with epic terrible performance ... I have spent double more money then at that time for i.e. wow, lotro, ... Then have tried 1 more, another ... and had enough for life time.

    Now I play some games that were gone F2P later but STILL HAVE sub model.

    Only big exception to rule is GW2, great game ... but is not truly F2P, it is B2P. But still great.

  • StonesDKStonesDK Member UncommonPosts: 1,805
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by KroxMalon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    http://2p.com/5170acba61fc1cbdad62bf61_1/March-2013-US-Digital-Games-Market-Overview.htm

    "Speaking of the MMO, the free-to-play MMO is definitely a trendy and have a growth of 3 million players in March, which also brings a slight improvement on monetization to $195 million. To the contrary, the pay-to-play MMO segment is going down in March and loses around 289,000 subscribers. Nonetheless, the overall revenues remained relatively stable at $86 million"

    Only if you spend the money. I personally dont.

    Most don't. It is well known that F2P games are paid for by a few whales.

    Can you cite a relevant study that proves this?  I've been looking around the internet since you've been saying this, and all I can find or 4 and 5 year old studies which are really outdated.

    Is there something from 2012 or 2013 that breaks down 2012 F2P and shows whales as the primary revenue source?  Is this true only for Eastern publishers or also Western publishers as well?

    The market has changed dramatically in the last year and it would be interesting to see how things break down now?

    http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/zyngas-quest-for-bigspending-whales-07072011.html

    From 2011

    The article is quoting Zynga saying "We only rely on a small percentage for nearly all our revenue"

     

    Seems legit, unless you want a year by year survey done by millions to satisfy your skeptisism in which case nobody can help you.... ever

    -The truth is out there

  • GenghisKronnGenghisKronn Member Posts: 4
    Doesn`t surprise me at all, it`s very deceptive though.  I don`t think many people realize how much more they end up spending in F2P cash shops as opposed to sub costs for P2P.
  • MibletMiblet Member Posts: 333
    Originally posted by Olgark

    Its quite obvious to me that F2P companies are making more money than the P2P ones. Look at PWE they recently bought Cyrptic. They run countless other games of their own and are looking at more aquasistions in the western markets.

     

    Also F2P mmos have less staff and less patch releases than the p2p games which means updates and fixes are often months away. Your also having to pay out for things such as ID scrolls in PWE case just so you can gain the full benifits of armour and weapons. You have to buy them because the daily quests do not supply enough.  If the mmo in question has pvp then your going to have to fork out a lot of cash just to be competative because then it becomes a pay to win game.

    Profits per title are significantly higher in the P2P market.

    However such titles cost a great deal more to develop and staff, and we lack the data to discover which is the more profitable model for investment, since we don't know development costs for all the P2P and F2P titles and their revenue.

    The profit ratio is still, acoording to Superdata only 2:1, despite there being far more than 2:1 in the ratio of games available.  It would be interesting if we could get the costs to find out which is more profitable per investment unit.  Either way both models are profitable, very much so in fact.

    You have to bear in mind though regarding the companies that almost every company producing AAA MMOs in the P2P market have investment elsewhere, whereas many F2P companies specialise in only the F2P market which would probably mean that many F2P companies would be somewhat behind.

  • doodphacedoodphace Member UncommonPosts: 1,858
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    Lets not all conviently forget that the F2P convertion games only did so because they were lack luster to begin with and couldnt hold subs. Games that are content rich enough to hold subs, are doing just that.

    And how many are those left? WOW?

    And is it because of lackbuster, or because of the competition? There is no game i would pay a sub for now, no matter how great .. just because there are fun FREE competition.

    Is WOW fun? Yes. Is WOW fun enough so i would pay $15 a month? Not anymore. Not when i can play Diablo 3 for free (oh yes, i play that for free .. i made back the $60 from RMAH), and STO fof free, and DCUO for free, and ... for free.

    Notice I said content rich, and didnt make the discussion about "fun"? (Fun is very subejective. Sheer amount of content on the other hand, is not)

    I also seem to recall a little game called EVE Online still alive and well....

  • SagasaintSagasaint Member UncommonPosts: 466
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    that doesnt prove they are sustainable, just they havent reached critical mass yet

     

    pyramid schemes are also able to hold on for some time before crushing on their own weight

     

    give them more time. I have absolutly no doubts that the future of F2P will mimic the current economy...epic disaster ahead....

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Scot

    F2P has less money invested, less staff, less patches less everything. So it is small wonder they make a big return on investment.

    And we as players get less of a game, it is all so wonderful. Keep taking those happy pliis and enjoy playing F2P folks!

    Yes, it is very wonderful. Less of ONE game, more of a thousand. Plus, all free. I am enjoying it. Are you?

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Sagasaint
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    that doesnt prove they are sustainable, just they havent reached critical mass yet

     

    pyramid schemes are also able to hold on for some time before crushing on their own weight

     

    give them more time. I have absolutly no doubts that the future of F2P will mimic the current economy...epic disaster ahead....

    No one can prove anything for the future, because it has not happened yet. So in that sense, you are right.

    However, it does susbtained growth in the last few years. How long will it last? No one will know, but i will bet money that it will last more than 2014. And personally, i don't particularly care if the whole F2P will crash and burn in 3-4 years. Entertainment can change drastic in that kind of time frame anyway. Who knows what we will be playing then?

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    Lets not all conviently forget that the F2P convertion games only did so because they were lack luster to begin with and couldnt hold subs. Games that are content rich enough to hold subs, are doing just that.

    And how many are those left? WOW?

    And is it because of lackbuster, or because of the competition? There is no game i would pay a sub for now, no matter how great .. just because there are fun FREE competition.

    Is WOW fun? Yes. Is WOW fun enough so i would pay $15 a month? Not anymore. Not when i can play Diablo 3 for free (oh yes, i play that for free .. i made back the $60 from RMAH), and STO fof free, and DCUO for free, and ... for free.

    Notice I said content rich, and didnt make the discussion about "fun"? (Fun is very subejective. Sheer amount of content on the other hand, is not)

    I also seem to recall a little game called EVE Online still alive and well....

    Eve is no where close to as successful as WOW (just check xfire ranking). But even if you count that ... TWO (wow & eve).

    Yes, you said "content rich". But that does not hold subs. Fun does. Produce 10x the amount of WOW content, but make it boring .. it is still not holding any subs. People don't play games for a lot of boring content, they do it for fun.

    And yes, fun is subjective. But still, it is about how to make it fun for many people.

  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 2,012
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Sagasaint
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    that doesnt prove they are sustainable, just they havent reached critical mass yet

     

    pyramid schemes are also able to hold on for some time before crushing on their own weight

     

    give them more time. I have absolutly no doubts that the future of F2P will mimic the current economy...epic disaster ahead....

    No one can prove anything for the future, because it has not happened yet. So in that sense, you are right.

    However, it does susbtained growth in the last few years. How long will it last? No one will know, but i will bet money that it will last more than 2014. And personally, i don't particularly care if the whole F2P will crash and burn in 3-4 years. Entertainment can change drastic in that kind of time frame anyway. Who knows what we will be playing then?

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    Fact

    All MMOs that have gone F2P is a cookie cutter of another game and has little content

    All the new MMOs today have players consume the content in a matter of a month or 2

    All MMOs that have gone F2P have had major decline in player population in the first few months because they don’t listen to the fan base

    Since WoW the genera has not changed yes in 2013 MMOs are going to move away from Themepark to Sandbox however still try to have the old hardcore rule sets that kept Sandbox populations low, no new ideas have come out yet.  (See Eqnext and Titan for new ideas later this year)

    At the end of the day many MMO players that will pay to play don’t feel that new games since WoW are worth paying to play.  Some players do however the masses do not. 

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by danwest58
     

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    LOL ... you are willing to bet money on that? No one knows what happens with games that are not released yet.

    And here is the fact, F2P players outnumber P2P 6 to 1. I have evidence to support it. You have none, except your opinion.

    http://www.superdataresearch.com/us-free-to-play-does-it-pay-to-switch/

    And i quote "If you were to look at the growth of the audience alone, the market for F2P games is substantially larger than that for pay-to-play. Six times larger, in fact."

    I guess you can keep sticking you head in the sand.

  • ThomasN7ThomasN7 87.18.7.148Member CommonPosts: 6,690
    People are materialistic. What did you expect ? Not only that but today's economy is bad. People would much rather pay on their own terms rather than have a bill each month.
    30
  • doodphacedoodphace Member UncommonPosts: 1,858
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Vorthanion
     

    How sustainable do you think it can remain when a good number of people freeload at the expense of others.  The resentment alone will eventually become explosive, but I have a feeling that more and more people will stop paying into the shops due to that very resentment and could very well dramatically shift the F2P paradigm into a bunch of game closures.

    Very sustainable. It has sustained the growth from p2p making more monety than f2p to f2p making now twice as much. And even if there will be dramatic game closures, which is just a guess with zero evidence on your part, we can have some free fun before that happens.

    So all good.

    Lets not all conviently forget that the F2P convertion games only did so because they were lack luster to begin with and couldnt hold subs. Games that are content rich enough to hold subs, are doing just that.

    And how many are those left? WOW?

    And is it because of lackbuster, or because of the competition? There is no game i would pay a sub for now, no matter how great .. just because there are fun FREE competition.

    Is WOW fun? Yes. Is WOW fun enough so i would pay $15 a month? Not anymore. Not when i can play Diablo 3 for free (oh yes, i play that for free .. i made back the $60 from RMAH), and STO fof free, and DCUO for free, and ... for free.

    Notice I said content rich, and didnt make the discussion about "fun"? (Fun is very subejective. Sheer amount of content on the other hand, is not)

    I also seem to recall a little game called EVE Online still alive and well....

    Eve is no where close to as successful as WOW (just check xfire ranking). But even if you count that ... TWO (wow & eve).

    Yes, you said "content rich". But that does not hold subs. Fun does. Produce 10x the amount of WOW content, but make it boring .. it is still not holding any subs. People don't play games for a lot of boring content, they do it for fun.

    And yes, fun is subjective. But still, it is about how to make it fun for many people.

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

  • doodphacedoodphace Member UncommonPosts: 1,858
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by danwest58
     

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    LOL ... you are willing to bet money on that? No one knows what happens with games that are not released yet.

    And here is the fact, F2P players outnumber P2P 6 to 1. I have evidence to support it. You have none, except your opinion.

    http://www.superdataresearch.com/us-free-to-play-does-it-pay-to-switch/

    And i quote "If you were to look at the growth of the audience alone, the market for F2P games is substantially larger than that for pay-to-play. Six times larger, in fact."

    I guess you can keep sticking you head in the sand.

    Going back to that quote again are we? Did we all forget thir data contains browser f2p games like farmville?

    Yes, browser based MMOs have vastly more players than P2P full seat MMORPGs do, but I'll stick to my full seat MMORPG tyvm.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by danwest58
     

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    LOL ... you are willing to bet money on that? No one knows what happens with games that are not released yet.

    And here is the fact, F2P players outnumber P2P 6 to 1. I have evidence to support it. You have none, except your opinion.

    http://www.superdataresearch.com/us-free-to-play-does-it-pay-to-switch/

    And i quote "If you were to look at the growth of the audience alone, the market for F2P games is substantially larger than that for pay-to-play. Six times larger, in fact."

    I guess you can keep sticking you head in the sand.

    Going back to that quote again are we? Did we all forget thir data contains browser f2p games like farmville?

    Yes, browser based MMOs have vastly more players than P2P full seat MMORPGs do, but I'll stick to my full seat MMORPG tyvm.

    Actually farmville is not included .. that is categorized as social games, not MMOS. But they do include games like LoL, and WoT. Which are close enough for me.

    Full seat MMORPG is a dinosaur. It is no accident that LoL and Wot are more popular than 99% of the "full seat" MMO out there (except WOW & GW2).

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by doodphace
     

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

    No .. more boring things .. are not fun.

    Examples. In EQ, you can stare at a spellbook. You can wait 20 min on a boat. Few wants those. They took some of that out. So more is not better.

     

  • doodphacedoodphace Member UncommonPosts: 1,858
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
     

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

    No .. more boring things .. are not fun.

    Examples. In EQ, you can stare at a spellbook. You can wait 20 min on a boat. Few wants those. They took some of that out. So more is not better.

     

    /Sigh...cuz im referring to staring at spell books right?

    Ill politely bow out of this discussion before I get troll baited further

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
     

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

    No .. more boring things .. are not fun.

    Examples. In EQ, you can stare at a spellbook. You can wait 20 min on a boat. Few wants those. They took some of that out. So more is not better.

     

    /Sigh...cuz im referring to staring at spell books right?

    Ill politely bow out of this discussion before I get troll baited further

    Not in particular, but you did say "More things to do = more things for different people to find fun", which is obviously not true because there are a lot of "things to do" is boring to many.

    Staring at a spellbook is a good example. Do you think WOW should implement "staring at a spellbook" just in the name of having "more things to do".

     

  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 2,012
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by danwest58
     

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    LOL ... you are willing to bet money on that? No one knows what happens with games that are not released yet.

    And here is the fact, F2P players outnumber P2P 6 to 1. I have evidence to support it. You have none, except your opinion.

    http://www.superdataresearch.com/us-free-to-play-does-it-pay-to-switch/

    And i quote "If you were to look at the growth of the audience alone, the market for F2P games is substantially larger than that for pay-to-play. Six times larger, in fact."

    I guess you can keep sticking you head in the sand.

    Yea and how many of the 6 Free 2 play accounts is 1 person with mutliple accounts?  Guess what, I have the following Free 2 Play accounts.  LOTRO, DDO, Tera, 1 of my 2 SWTOR accounts, GW2, Evony, Lords of Ultima, The Hobbit, AOEO, Vanguard, EQ1 and EQ2.  I also have or had until recently Paid 2 play accounts in WoW, Rift, SWTOR, UO.  Guess what each game counts 1 account as 1 player regardless of whether they have 1 or 5 accounts.  I have more F2P accounts because well at one time I played them; it does not mean that I am active in these games.  It does not mean that my Free 2 Play accounts out number F2P accounts just because I at 1 time played and still have an account.  It’s just a way for a Publisher to say HEY WE HAVE XXXXX PLAYERS!  When in reality it’s just a smoke and mirrors show.  They do not have the numbers they claim, just because someone register does not mean they have that many active players.  Only people like you with EPEEN Envy that cannot use Deductive reasoning believe what you read because it’s on the internet.  You know what I have played with dozens of other players, MANY of which have at least 1 account if not multiple Free to Play accounts in MMOs.  The fact is having a Free 2 Play account its always mark as an Active account even if that player NEVER plays. 

    Just because a Free2Play game as 1 Million Registered accounts does not mean it has 1 Million Actively players.  This is why the 6 to 1 F2P accounts out number P2P accounts.  Because P2P accounts are ONLY active when players are actively paying for them, MOST of the time; actively paying players are actively playing the game.  F2P does not go by the same rules, it’s the number of registered accounts regardless of whether the person is playing or not.

    So keep LOL and thinking you know more just because 1 internet website put out some information does not make it fact or true.  Its understanding the truth behind the information that was posted and having the ability to use Logical deductive reasoning to truly understand what is being represented.  Which honestly you do not have, if you did you would understand why 6 F2P to 1 P2P “PLAYERS” is just a FASLE statement.  Logic can tell you that, believing they cannot put anything that is false on the internet gets you to where you are at.  “I READ SOMETHING ON THE INTERNET ITS FACT”  /shakes head

  • doodphacedoodphace Member UncommonPosts: 1,858
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
     

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

    No .. more boring things .. are not fun.

    Examples. In EQ, you can stare at a spellbook. You can wait 20 min on a boat. Few wants those. They took some of that out. So more is not better.

     

    /Sigh...cuz im referring to staring at spell books right?

    Ill politely bow out of this discussion before I get troll baited further

    Not in particular, but you did say "More things to do = more things for different people to find fun", which is obviously not true because there are a lot of "things to do" is boring to many.

    Staring at a spellbook is a good example. Do you think WOW should implement "staring at a spellbook" just in the name of having "more things to do".

     

    I know full well I am getting trolled here, but I will slightly bite.....I can say im referring to "activities", and you will just rpely that ppl can interprate staring at a spell book as an "activity"...and this will go in circles without you acknowledging the point.

    BTW, your forum posts are the most entertaining to read. You are honestly one of the smartest and entertaining posters on this site. The jumps in meaning you take are turly masterfull, and i am dead serious about this lol.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Member EpicPosts: 6,601
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by danwest58
     

    It will last until EQNext and Titan come out because both will be P2P and both games will change the MMO Genera.  The Only reason why F2P is popular now is because how many cookie cutter copy MMOS there are out there.  O and BTW there are more P2P players than F2P players, just look at WoW they have 10 million Subscriptions.  No F2P game has that many players period.  You like your F2P mmo genera and several times stated that and no matter what you will not look at Facts and accept them. 

    LOL ... you are willing to bet money on that? No one knows what happens with games that are not released yet.

    And here is the fact, F2P players outnumber P2P 6 to 1. I have evidence to support it. You have none, except your opinion.

    http://www.superdataresearch.com/us-free-to-play-does-it-pay-to-switch/

    And i quote "If you were to look at the growth of the audience alone, the market for F2P games is substantially larger than that for pay-to-play. Six times larger, in fact."

    I guess you can keep sticking you head in the sand.

    Yea and how many of the 6 Free 2 play accounts is 1 person with mutliple accounts?  Guess what, I have the following Free 2 Play accounts.  LOTRO, DDO, Tera, 1 of my 2 SWTOR accounts, GW2, Evony, Lords of Ultima, The Hobbit, AOEO, Vanguard, EQ1 and EQ2.  I also have or had until recently Paid 2 play accounts in WoW, Rift, SWTOR, UO.  Guess what each game counts 1 account as 1 player regardless of whether they have 1 or 5 accounts.  I have more F2P accounts because well at one time I played them; it does not mean that I am active in these games.  It does not mean that my Free 2 Play accounts out number F2P accounts just because I at 1 time played and still have an account.  It’s just a way for a Publisher to say HEY WE HAVE XXXXX PLAYERS!  When in reality it’s just a smoke and mirrors show.  They do not have the numbers they claim, just because someone register does not mean they have that many active players.  Only people like you with EPEEN Envy that cannot use Deductive reasoning believe what you read because it’s on the internet.  You know what I have played with dozens of other players, MANY of which have at least 1 account if not multiple Free to Play accounts in MMOs.  The fact is having a Free 2 Play account its always mark as an Active account even if that player NEVER plays. 

    Just because a Free2Play game as 1 Million Registered accounts does not mean it has 1 Million Actively players.  This is why the 6 to 1 F2P accounts out number P2P accounts.  Because P2P accounts are ONLY active when players are actively paying for them, MOST of the time; actively paying players are actively playing the game.  F2P does not go by the same rules, it’s the number of registered accounts regardless of whether the person is playing or not.

    So keep LOL and thinking you know more just because 1 internet website put out some information does not make it fact or true.  Its understanding the truth behind the information that was posted and having the ability to use Logical deductive reasoning to truly understand what is being represented.  Which honestly you do not have, if you did you would understand why 6 F2P to 1 P2P “PLAYERS” is just a FASLE statement.  Logic can tell you that, believing they cannot put anything that is false on the internet gets you to where you are at.  “I READ SOMETHING ON THE INTERNET ITS FACT”  /shakes head

     How many of the p2p accounts are mutli-boxing.  Sheesh isn't the commong thinking that everyone in AC boxes, that most in Eve or Wow dual+box?

    I dont' believe the majority do box but that is the thinking that is pervasive here.

    Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by doodphace
     

    More things to do = more things for different people to find fun....did that really need to be explained? What I find fun may be completely different than what you find fun. If a game has more things to do in it, chances are it will have something we both find fun, even if its different activities. I really don;t understand how this can be debated lol

    No .. more boring things .. are not fun.

    Examples. In EQ, you can stare at a spellbook. You can wait 20 min on a boat. Few wants those. They took some of that out. So more is not better.

     

    /Sigh...cuz im referring to staring at spell books right?

    Ill politely bow out of this discussion before I get troll baited further

    Not in particular, but you did say "More things to do = more things for different people to find fun", which is obviously not true because there are a lot of "things to do" is boring to many.

    Staring at a spellbook is a good example. Do you think WOW should implement "staring at a spellbook" just in the name of having "more things to do".

     

    I know full well I am getting trolled here, but I will slightly bite.....I can say im referring to "activities", and you will just rpely that ppl can interprate staring at a spell book as an "activity"...and this will go in circles without you acknowledging the point.

    BTW, your forum posts are the most entertaining to read. You are honestly one of the smartest and entertaining posters on this site. The jumps in meaning you take are turly masterfull, and i am dead serious about this lol.

    Activites? How about clicking on a rock again, again, and again to increase your strength little by little? How about running in circles to unlock a box. They are all activities, but not necessarily fun.

    BTW, thank you for your kind words. It is nice to be appreciated, even if not agreed upon. And please feel free to disagree, and debate, as long as we use civil language.

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