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Poll - would you prefer ESO to be more like the series and a PvE sandbox only?

MargulisMargulis Glendale, AZPosts: 1,614Member
A lot of fans of the series seem to be unhappy with the game having a large pvp focus and not really staying true to the previous games in quite a few ways.  Others have argued there would be no point to an Elder Scrolls mmo without pvp since it would basically be just another of the same game.  So I figured I would make a poll to see waht the results looked like.  If ESO was made into a purely PvE mmo much in the vein of the series (sandboxy), with all of the free choice of exploration and so forth, would you prefer that over the game they are currently making?  Basically the same game as Morrowind - Skyrim, just developed for an online community (so group play vs. PvE, crafting, towns, economy, etc.)
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Comments

  • DeaconXDeaconX Toronto, ONPosts: 3,067Member
    Are there sandbox elements to the game at all?

    image

    Why do I write, create, fantasize, dream and daydream about other worlds? Because I hate what humanity does with this one.

    BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.

  • jdlamson75jdlamson75 Jacksonville, FLPosts: 984Member Uncommon
    I feel so outnumbered right now...
  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Sioux City, IAPosts: 3,828Member


    Originally posted by DeaconX
    Are there sandbox elements to the game at all?
    I often wonder about this, too. I have never really thought of TES games as "sandboxes."

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR

  • DeaconXDeaconX Toronto, ONPosts: 3,067Member
    Originally posted by AlBQuirky

     


    Originally posted by DeaconX
    Are there sandbox elements to the game at all?

    I often wonder about this, too. I have never really thought of TES games as "sandboxes."

     

    They did add that expansion which allowed you to build your own house and have a family and all that jazz.

    Personally, I would LOVE to see a focus on stuff like building homes, owning shops, possibly building small villages/guild towns, building ships you can actually sail, etc.

    Those features all create ownership in a game and also, if there are people doing it together, forges communities. Once you have communities working together in a game, people are far more attached to the game world and each other and thus are more likely to stay playing that game for a longer time.

    image

    Why do I write, create, fantasize, dream and daydream about other worlds? Because I hate what humanity does with this one.

    BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.

  • jmcdermottukjmcdermottuk LiverpoolPosts: 976Member Uncommon

    I think the problem with this poll is that it's too exclusive. I voted yes because I would prefer a more sandbox game, less restrictions on factions, no locks, no fixed clases and the limitations that implies. If it was PvE only that wouldn't worry me too much.

    Here's the BUT. Why does it need to be PvE only? I don't see any reason why you couldn't make a TES MMO like the series, where players were free to start as any race they wanted, move freely to any region they wanted, and to be free to join any faction they wanted. They could also use a class template if they wished or alternatively, pick their own skills and still be free to develop other if they choose. All of this is good sandboxy type game design, allowing players freedom to play where and how they want.

     

    The PvP could still be tied to those factions, it could still be a 3 faction RvR system. The big difference is that players would be free to choose if they a) want to join a faction and b) which faction to join. The current system is too much DAoC with it's 3 realms and the races etc locked in, including the PvE. I don't object to the 3 way RvR so much as the restrictions. If it was a player choice it would be more TES and less DAoC.

    I think this is why you're seeing a lot of opposition to the current design, it's that lack of choice, something that was always very open in the TES games. Choices both for race/faction and class/skills and the choice to venture out and travel if you want. It's the main reason I've posted and voiced my negative opinions about the game.

  • khameleonkhameleon Miami, FLPosts: 372Member

    Why would I want a PVE sandbox? That is what the offline Elder Scrolls games are for.

     

    I want to let them make an onlinegame with PVP and how they want and see how it plays out.

     

    Why would I make a decision also about this ESO being bad if i have not played it yet myself?

     

     

    GAME TIL YOU DIE!!!!

  • LanceCLanceC Boston, MAPosts: 55Member
    Why not both?
  • TokenaruTokenaru Austin, TXPosts: 58Member
    The problem is when you make a game primarily about pvp you have to sacrifice so much that the pve suffers as well as the graphics so that the engine can render all the crap going on.  PVP was fine as call of duty and battlefield no clue why they felt it had to be brought the the mmorpg's very sad indeed.
  • metal0xmetal0x pizza, ILPosts: 30Member

    I've alway liked PvE(+sandbox) while leveling to max and PvP as a reward at max level till new content comes out.

     

    PvP is over rated if you ask me. Some people like it an many others do not. I've always thought of pvp in an mmorpg as an end game time killer till new content comes out. Since at max level their is usualy nothing to do besides pvp or raids/instances.

  • acidbloodacidblood melbournePosts: 266Member Uncommon

    I wouldn't want PvP removed completely (you get jumped by bandits in the SP games so..) but I do want:

    1. Completely open world, even if I'm not welcome in some places due to race / faction, it should be up to me, not some invisible wall.

    2. Freedom of faction choice, including being a free agent, becoming a bandit, etc. I don't mind starting off aligned to a certain faction, but I want to shape my character my way, not be locked into a faction by preordination.

    3. A much larger focus on crafting. I know it hasn't always been a stong point of ES games, but the heart has always been there, now is the chance to do it well.

  • TokenaruTokenaru Austin, TXPosts: 58Member
    I mean dont get me wrong I appreciate DAOC, and warhammer(what happened to this game?)  WoW has been the only Developer to imho succesffuly integrate pve and pvp but even thats a fine line at times with them.
  • PAL-18PAL-18 AnachronoxPosts: 802Member

    When i read a book,characters on those are very real.

    When i play Elder Scrolls game,i can only wish that those NPCs were player controlled but still they are like characters on books.

    Now when it goes online and those characters becomes player controlled,then they are far from real.

    What is this sorcery.

    Why cant i attack them anymore? Why this game tells me that i must join RvR and live in different zones.

    dang you sorcerers.

     

     

     

     

    So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.
    By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
    **On the radar:http://cyberpunk.net/**

  • TokkenTokken Portland, ORPosts: 1,154Member Uncommon

    I like the game the way it is but YES I would want more of a PvE sandbox mmo .

    Brad McQuaid Quote:  So, God-willing, the Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen team and I will be able to make or allow that magic to happen a third time, and it too will be not just a great game, but also that catalyst again that brings people together, sometimes out of their comfort zone, learning how to work together not just tactically in a virtual world but also socially in the real world.
  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,066Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Margulis
    A lot of fans of the series seem to be unhappy with the game having a large pvp focus and not really staying true to the previous games in quite a few ways.  Others have argued there would be no point to an Elder Scrolls mmo without pvp since it would basically be just another of the same game.  So I figured I would make a poll to see waht the results looked like.  If ESO was made into a purely PvE mmo much in the vein of the series (sandboxy), with all of the free choice of exploration and so forth, would you prefer that over the game they are currently making?  Basically the same game as Morrowind - Skyrim, just developed for an online community (so group play vs. PvE, crafting, towns, economy, etc.)

    While I want a PvE ONLY Sandbox game, I want it in either an original IP or in Asheron's Call 3.  Elder Scrolls RPG's are not sandbox they are open-ended themeparks and as such the MMO needs to remain that way as well.  I am happy with the RvR or Alliance versus Alliance (AvA) setup because you still have the best open ended PvE experience during the leveling up portion of the game but then can transition to an open-ended multi-faction PvP game at endgame.  IMO the best of both worlds.  So leave it as it stands (as far as major elements are concerned).

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,838Member Uncommon

    if this game was a sandbox, it wouldn't be like TES single player games.

    i absolutely cannot stand when people say the single player games were sandbox games, its just complete ignorance to the subject.

    again, just because you can explore at will in a game and decide what quests to do in what order you want to do them, doesn't make it a sandbox game.

    it still is a quest driven game at its core, which makes it not a sandbox game and more of a theme park (if you want to use those labels for single player rpg's)

    there is a main quest that you follow just like the single player games and there is also side quests that you stumble upon if you explore or talk to certain people, just like the single player games.

    people assume many things with this game when we actually do not know exactly how it will be.

    yet act like TES games were these sandbox games where you could build most of the content of the game void of any kind of questing element, which is standard in any sandbox game.

    TES single player games did have some sandbox elements to them, just like the mmo will as well.

    so honestly, i don't know what many of you expect, other than faction lock and being able to explore the entire world from level 1, what sandbox elements do you expect TESO to not have that the single player games did?


  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,838Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by azzamasin
    Originally posted by Margulis A lot of fans of the series seem to be unhappy with the game having a large pvp focus and not really staying true to the previous games in quite a few ways.  Others have argued there would be no point to an Elder Scrolls mmo without pvp since it would basically be just another of the same game.  So I figured I would make a poll to see waht the results looked like.  If ESO was made into a purely PvE mmo much in the vein of the series (sandboxy), with all of the free choice of exploration and so forth, would you prefer that over the game they are currently making?  Basically the same game as Morrowind - Skyrim, just developed for an online community (so group play vs. PvE, crafting, towns, economy, etc.)
    While I want a PvE ONLY Sandbox game, I want it in either an original IP or in Asheron's Call 3.  Elder Scrolls RPG's are not sandbox they are open-ended themeparks and as such the MMO needs to remain that way as well.  I am happy with the RvR or Alliance versus Alliance (AvA) setup because you still have the best open ended PvE experience during the leveling up portion of the game but then can transition to an open-ended multi-faction PvP game at endgame.  IMO the best of both worlds.  So leave it as it stands (as far as major elements are concerned).

    *swish*

    totally agree.

  • Vunak23Vunak23 In your house eatin'' your cookies, FLPosts: 635Member

    I dont like any of the choices in the poll. 

    I like PvP and I like sandbox. I like RvR, but I like sandbox more. So. A Sandbox with PvP. 

     

    I guess if I had to choose though. I would choose the RvR. 

    "In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  • Punk999Punk999 Baytown, TXPosts: 874Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by baphamet

    if this game was a sandbox, it wouldn't be like TES single player games.

    i absolutely cannot stand when people say the single player games were sandbox games, its just complete ignorance to the subject.

    again, just because you can explore at will in a game and decide what quests to do in what order you want to do them, doesn't make it a sandbox game.

    it still is a quest driven game at its core, which makes it not a sandbox game and more of a theme park (if you want to use those labels for single player rpg's)

    there is a main quest that you follow just like the single player games and there is also side quests that you stumble upon if you explore or talk to certain people, just like the single player games.

    people assume many things with this game when we actually do not know exactly how it will be.

    yet act like TES games were these sandbox games where you could build most of the content of the game void of any kind of questing element, which is standard in any sandbox game.

    TES single player games did have some sandbox elements to them, just like the mmo will as well.

    so honestly, i don't know what many of you expect, other than faction lock and being able to explore the entire world from level 1, what sandbox elements do you expect TESO to not have that the single player games did?

     

    +1 and I voted that the game stays with the whole rvr thing.

    "Negaholics are people who become addicted to negativity and self-doubt, they find fault in most things and never seem to be satisfied."
    ^MMORPG.com

  • Vunak23Vunak23 In your house eatin'' your cookies, FLPosts: 635Member

    Also as other have said. The ES games weren't sandboxes. 

    Free roaming =/= sandbox. 

    Minecraft is a sandbox

    "In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  • KinchyleKinchyle Hugo, ORPosts: 309Member

    Honeslty asking....what MMO has ever been a widely played and popular "real" sandbox? I can't remember one that hasn't been a disappointment.

    Also, what about the ESO single player series falls out of the sandbox category? Isn't a sandbox where you can go anywhere at any time? Skyrim very much allowed this. Sure it had a storyline to follow, but you didn't have to follow it to explore the world.

    As far as the PvP goes...there again. What game has ever done it so the majority loved it (DAoC maybe)? All I ever see is whining about how a certain game or another failed at it. If DAoC did it right, is ESO going along the same lines with RvR? I actually only ever did PvP in DAoC a lot, so I kinda would like to know. Loved DAoC!  :D

    Just questions...cause I guess I don't get everyone elses opnion of "sandbox" really.

  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,838Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Kinchyle
    Honeslty asking....what MMO has ever been a widely played and popular "real" sandbox? I can't remember one that hasn't been a disappointment.

    Also, what about the ESO single player series falls out of the sandbox category? Isn't a sandbox where you can go anywhere at any time? Skyrim very much allowed this. Sure it had a storyline to follow, but you didn't have to follow it to explore the world.

    As far as the PvP goes...there again. What game has ever done it so the majority loved it (DAoC maybe)? All I ever see is whining about how a certain game or another failed at it. If DAoC did it right, is ESO going along the same lines with RvR? I actually only ever did PvP in DAoC a lot, so I kinda would like to know. Loved DAoC!  :D

    Just questions...cause I guess I don't get everyone elses opnion of "sandbox" really.


    TES games are quest driven. you can choose not to do them but you would be missing out on a huge portion of the game.

    in a sandbox game, there isn't quests like that, almost all the content is created by the players.

    that is why its been coined "sandbox" because you create the content, much like a sand castle in a sandbox.

    could you do that in TES games? other than crafting gear and potions no you could not (standard in any sandbox and themepark alike).

    does that answer your first question?

    as far as pvp goes, i am in the same boat. i loved Daoc pvp but its hard to say how long the pvp will keep me interested in TESO.

    if there is no way to advance your character like you could in Daoc (realm points) then i would assume it wont last long for me.

    i know there will be alliance points similar to realm points but i am concerned that it will just be cosmetic upgrades or other things that don't actually advance your character.

    that was my main issue with GW2...well that and the fact that it was just a huge zerg fest and nothing more.

    i like the fact that in cyrodiil, it acts as a full fledged pve zone as well.

    that way people can hopefully still get the open world pvp feeling, even though it is still segregated from the rest of the world.

    the area will be huge as well.


  • KinchyleKinchyle Hugo, ORPosts: 309Member

     


    Originally posted by baphamet  

    Originally posted by Kinchyle Honeslty asking....what MMO has ever been a widely played and popular "real" sandbox? I can't remember one that hasn't been a disappointment.   Also, what about the ESO single player series falls out of the sandbox category? Isn't a sandbox where you can go anywhere at any time? Skyrim very much allowed this. Sure it had a storyline to follow, but you didn't have to follow it to explore the world. As far as the PvP goes...there again. What game has ever done it so the majority loved it (DAoC maybe)? All I ever see is whining about how a certain game or another failed at it. If DAoC did it right, is ESO going along the same lines with RvR? I actually only ever did PvP in DAoC a lot, so I kinda would like to know. Loved DAoC!  :D Just questions...cause I guess I don't get everyone elses opnion of "sandbox" really.
      TES games are quest driven. you can choose not to do them but you would be missing out on a huge portion of the game. in a sandbox game, there isn't quests like that, almost all the content is created by the players. that is why its been coined "sandbox" because you create the content, much like a sand castle in a sandbox. could you do that in TES games? other than crafting gear and potions no you could not (standard in any sandbox and themepark alike). does that answer your first question?
     

     

    Yeah...I getcha. Makes sense in the full "sandbox" term. You are not just visiting another persons sandbox, you help define it.

    In that case....I really have never seen a true sandbox MMO. Really can't see how any of these top tier MMOs could ever accomplish it either. One could hope though.

    *Edit - Love how it mashed all the sentences together so I could respond to one part of your post. Awesome :D

  • meddyckmeddyck Athens, GAPosts: 1,140Member Uncommon
    AvA is the only reason I'm interested in TESO, so you can guess my answer. I can see why fans of the RPG series may not like some of the design decisions that were made to give AvA a backstory. I would love it if developers completely separated PvE and RvR so it was almost like getting 2 games for 1 price, but that isn't the path that was taken for TESO. Hopefully AvA won't be ruined by PvE gear and PvE won't be ruined by the factions created for AvA.

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,066Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by Kinchyle
    Honeslty asking....what MMO has ever been a widely played and popular "real" sandbox? I can't remember one that hasn't been a disappointment.

     

    Also, what about the ESO single player series falls out of the sandbox category? Isn't a sandbox where you can go anywhere at any time? Skyrim very much allowed this. Sure it had a storyline to follow, but you didn't have to follow it to explore the world.

    As far as the PvP goes...there again. What game has ever done it so the majority loved it (DAoC maybe)? All I ever see is whining about how a certain game or another failed at it. If DAoC did it right, is ESO going along the same lines with RvR? I actually only ever did PvP in DAoC a lot, so I kinda would like to know. Loved DAoC!  :D

    Just questions...cause I guess I don't get everyone elses opnion of "sandbox" really.


     

    TES games are quest driven. you can choose not to do them but you would be missing out on a huge portion of the game.

    in a sandbox game, there isn't quests like that, almost all the content is created by the players.

    that is why its been coined "sandbox" because you create the content, much like a sand castle in a sandbox.

    could you do that in TES games? other than crafting gear and potions no you could not (standard in any sandbox and themepark alike).

    does that answer your first question?

    as far as pvp goes, i am in the same boat. i loved Daoc pvp but its hard to say how long the pvp will keep me interested in TESO.

    if there is no way to advance your character like you could in Daoc (realm points) then i would assume it wont last long for me.

    i know there will be alliance points similar to realm points but i am concerned that it will just be cosmetic upgrades or other things that don't actually advance your character.

    that was my main issue with GW2...well that and the fact that it was just a huge zerg fest and nothing more.

    i like the fact that in cyrodiil, it acts as a full fledged pve zone as well.

    that way people can hopefully still get the open world pvp feeling, even though it is still segregated from the rest of the world.

    the area will be huge as well.

     

    I have been playing Skyrim since November the 11th 2011 when it released at least several times a week.  I have 5 characters (2 that are playable since my first 3 characters save files became corrupted)  A level 81, 2-Handed and  Destruction Magic, Light Armor Melee type and my 47'ish Sneak Thief (Archery, Light Armor, Sneak) and not once in over a year and a half playing this game religiously every week have I ever done the main storyline past Whiterun where the Dragon Quest begins.

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,838Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by azzamasin
    Originally posted by baphamet   Originally posted by Kinchyle Honeslty asking....what MMO has ever been a widely played and popular "real" sandbox? I can't remember one that hasn't been a disappointment.   Also, what about the ESO single player series falls out of the sandbox category? Isn't a sandbox where you can go anywhere at any time? Skyrim very much allowed this. Sure it had a storyline to follow, but you didn't have to follow it to explore the world. As far as the PvP goes...there again. What game has ever done it so the majority loved it (DAoC maybe)? All I ever see is whining about how a certain game or another failed at it. If DAoC did it right, is ESO going along the same lines with RvR? I actually only ever did PvP in DAoC a lot, so I kinda would like to know. Loved DAoC!  :D Just questions...cause I guess I don't get everyone elses opnion of "sandbox" really.
      TES games are quest driven. you can choose not to do them but you would be missing out on a huge portion of the game. in a sandbox game, there isn't quests like that, almost all the content is created by the players. that is why its been coined "sandbox" because you create the content, much like a sand castle in a sandbox. could you do that in TES games? other than crafting gear and potions no you could not (standard in any sandbox and themepark alike). does that answer your first question? as far as pvp goes, i am in the same boat. i loved Daoc pvp but its hard to say how long the pvp will keep me interested in TESO. if there is no way to advance your character like you could in Daoc (realm points) then i would assume it wont last long for me. i know there will be alliance points similar to realm points but i am concerned that it will just be cosmetic upgrades or other things that don't actually advance your character. that was my main issue with GW2...well that and the fact that it was just a huge zerg fest and nothing more. i like the fact that in cyrodiil, it acts as a full fledged pve zone as well. that way people can hopefully still get the open world pvp feeling, even though it is still segregated from the rest of the world. the area will be huge as well.  
    I have been playing Skyrim since November the 11th 2011 when it released at least several times a week.  I have 5 characters (2 that are playable since my first 3 characters save files became corrupted)  A level 81, 2-Handed and  Destruction Magic, Light Armor Melee type and my 47'ish Sneak Thief (Archery, Light Armor, Sneak) and not once in over a year and a half playing this game religiously every week have I ever done the main storyline past Whiterun where the Dragon Quest begins.

    so you have done no quests at all? or just the main story quest? i usually wait to do the main story until i am higher level so i know avoiding the main story quest is very possible.

    but there are a lot of other quests and quest lines in the game.

    not sure what you mean to imply, that skyrim isn't a quest driven game?

    if you refused to do any quests a gigantic portion of the game will be bypassed.

    you would then be left with crafting and exploring some of the dungeons, since you wouldn't have access to all of them due to them being locked.

    better scratch being able to go anywhere and do anything, eh?


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