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The success of EQ advancement.

LonzoLonzo GoettingenPosts: 235Member Uncommon

Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

 

I miss those days...

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Comments

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,064Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lonzo

    Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

     

    I miss those days...

    Games evolve, most people need directions thats how life works these days. 

     

    The best part of EQ and EQ2 in current days is still their AA system.

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 389Member

    Ah, but it wasn't mindless spawn camping.  In original EQ you had to group up to survive, dungeons were contested and there was even more action if you were on a PvP server.  Plus, the main part of that game was not the AA system it was the sense of community that existed because you were a part of something bigger rather than being the solo hero.

     

    If you think EQ was nothing more than mindless dungeon grinding, you probably did not even play it.

  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Quirhid
    Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

    Grinding was fun back then, it's why you could level at a snail pace and no one thought it was a problem.

    It took the first person to max level months, someone said 9 months a while ago, I think that's likely accurate.

    Grind in Everquest was a bit like sitting in a forest with your friends, you know the situation you're in sucks, you're surrounded by monsters ready to kill you and if you die you're pretty screwed since you'll be running back naked, but you're bonding with people aroudn joke, you start to make jokes and start to get to know each other, the fact you are killing doesn't really matter anymore, it's secondary to the company you're in.

  • NikopolNikopol The ZonePosts: 626Member Uncommon

    I think there should be both. There should be both a path of questing that would take you to cap by doing nothing but quests, and there should be sufficient XP from killing mobs so that grinding is a totally viable way of levelling up.

    I remember in early WOW you generally got more XP by some smart mob grinding than you did by trying to complete quests. So quests were more for people who couldn't stand grinding and wanted to learn something about the world lore and story.

    But yeah, group grinding can be fun, especially in "elite" zones - I did it a lot. Nice way to kick back, chat, and earn some good XP.

  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by koboldfodder

    Ah, but it wasn't mindless spawn camping.  In original EQ you had to group up to survive, dungeons were contested and there was even more action if you were on a PvP server.  Plus, the main part of that game was not the AA system it was the sense of community that existed because you were a part of something bigger rather than being the solo hero.

     

    If you think EQ was nothing more than mindless dungeon grinding, you probably did not even play it.

    100% this

    The guy never played EQ.

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by Quirhid
    Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

    Grinding was fun back then, it's why you could level at a snail pace and no one thought it was a problem.

    It took the first person to max level months, someone said 9 months a while ago, I think that's likely accurate.

    Grind in Everquest was a bit like sitting in a forest with your friends, you know the situation you're in sucks, you're surrounded by monsters ready to kill you and if you die you're pretty screwed since you'll be running back naked, but you're bonding with people aroudn joke, you start to make jokes and start to get to know each other, the fact you are killing doesn't really matter anymore, it's secondary to the company you're in.

    No. Grinding has never been fun - even then. I was there. Didn't stay long.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,533Member Uncommon
    EQ was a lot more fun than the current crop of themepark games thats for sure.
  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by koboldfodder

    Ah, but it wasn't mindless spawn camping.  In original EQ you had to group up to survive, dungeons were contested and there was even more action if you were on a PvP server.  Plus, the main part of that game was not the AA system it was the sense of community that existed because you were a part of something bigger rather than being the solo hero.

     

    If you think EQ was nothing more than mindless dungeon grinding, you probably did not even play it.

    100% this

    The guy never played EQ.

    I have empirical evidence: I observed a friend return to a game where he did just that back then when he was young and naive. Now, he coulnd't stand playing the game for even 15 minutes. Again, grind is grind. Maybe you were young and naive too.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common

    anything is a grind -- if its repitious and you lack interest in the activity

     

    I've talked to many players that view questing as a mindless grind

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,849Member Uncommon
    Indeed. One of the main reasons I leave WoW, or many other games, is that I get used to its pattern and the activities aren't that varied. That's why I think a balance of activities is best and if quest rewards are the most lucrative form of advancement it will eventually become a "grind".
  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Quirhid

    No. Grinding has never been fun

    It was fun for people who played EQ.

    If grinding has never been fun then why could people tolerate taking a year to get to max level, doing hell levels at lvl 54 that lasted weeks just to get one level.

    That's only possilbe if they are enjoying themselves. Imagine if in Guild Wars 2,  it took a year to get to max level, loooooooooool, people would have QQ'd the forums with buckets of tears about the grind. However, in Everquest, no one cared.

    In GW2 the first max level was seen before the game was even launched, in Everquest the first max level took 9 months. I mean players of Everquest were way more hardcore, but not that hardcore that you can explain the difference without attributing some to the game mechanics which made grinding enjoyable with the right people.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Lonzo

    Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

     

    I miss those days...

    Leveling groups that took turns on a single respawn spot kililng the exactly same mob again, again, again, and again.

    It is boring. I am glad those days are gone, and MMOs are better games.

  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Lonzo

    Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

     

    I miss those days...

     Odd, I cannot remember the last MMO I played that did NOT have leveling groups...not one...even in guild wars 2, a game made with casuals in mind, I see a bunch of people in chat asking about grouping up.

    Perception, it varies, its something I never have to worry about because I have been in the same guild since Asherons Call 1 that is currently playing 6 different MMOs. In ventrillo RIGHT NOW there are 98 people logged in our chat in the different games with 2 raid channels going, one in WoW, the other in GW2 event zerg.

  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     Odd, I cannot remember the last MMO I played that did NOT have leveling groups...not one...even in guild wars 2, a game made with casuals in mind, I see a bunch of people in chat asking about grouping up.

    Perception, it varies, its something I never have to worry about because I have been in the same guild since Asherons Call 1 that is currently playing 6 different MMOs. In ventrillo RIGHT NOW there are 98 people logged in our chat in the different games with 2 raid channels going, one in WoW, the other in GW2 event zerg.

    Hold your horses, you think ventrillo creates a community?

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     Odd, I cannot remember the last MMO I played that did NOT have leveling groups...not one...even in guild wars 2, a game made with casuals in mind, I see a bunch of people in chat asking about grouping up.

    Perception, it varies, its something I never have to worry about because I have been in the same guild since Asherons Call 1 that is currently playing 6 different MMOs. In ventrillo RIGHT NOW there are 98 people logged in our chat in the different games with 2 raid channels going, one in WoW, the other in GW2 event zerg.

    Hold your horses, you think ventrillo creates a community?

    A bunch of people is a community. A AA meeting is a community. How is 98 people chatting online not one?

  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     Odd, I cannot remember the last MMO I played that did NOT have leveling groups...not one...even in guild wars 2, a game made with casuals in mind, I see a bunch of people in chat asking about grouping up.

    Perception, it varies, its something I never have to worry about because I have been in the same guild since Asherons Call 1 that is currently playing 6 different MMOs. In ventrillo RIGHT NOW there are 98 people logged in our chat in the different games with 2 raid channels going, one in WoW, the other in GW2 event zerg.

    Hold your horses, you think ventrillo creates a community?

    A bunch of people is a community. A AA meeting is a community. How is 98 people chatting online not one?

    Not really, a bunch of people in a chat bubble is a bunch of people in a chat bubble.

    Things like ventrillo have been very detrimental to the in-game community in games. They take people out of the game and put them inside a a bubble  that participates and communicates outside of the game world.

    You've been playing since AC and this is the first time someone explains you that ventrillo isn't a community? where have you been

  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     Odd, I cannot remember the last MMO I played that did NOT have leveling groups...not one...even in guild wars 2, a game made with casuals in mind, I see a bunch of people in chat asking about grouping up.

    Perception, it varies, its something I never have to worry about because I have been in the same guild since Asherons Call 1 that is currently playing 6 different MMOs. In ventrillo RIGHT NOW there are 98 people logged in our chat in the different games with 2 raid channels going, one in WoW, the other in GW2 event zerg.

    Hold your horses, you think ventrillo creates a community?

     Clearly that is what I said there. Clearly.

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,849Member Uncommon
    It would be great though if there was an in game voice system with proximity chat for open area discussions... Maybe one where your characters face moved with your voice?

    :)
  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Talahasee, FLPosts: 2,556Member
    Originally posted by Lonzo

    Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

     

    I miss those days...

    Just about everyone who experienced them misses them. I liked having OPTIONS of where and how to level up. And ones that encouraged socializing and felt more immersive. Quests break immersion surprisingly easily.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Waterlily
     

     

    Things like ventrillo have been very detrimental to the in-game community in games. They take people out of the game and put them inside a a bubble  that participates and communicates outside of the game world.

     

    So what if it is outside of the game world. There is no community outside of a game?

    Heck, many guilds are playing multiple games. Don't tell me you don't thnk they are small communities either.

    Personally i don't really care about a one-game-one-server community. I don't play one game. None of my relatives or friends play only one game.

    You don't mean a "community" .. you mean a "community only for one game world". There is a huge difference. The later .. i think is just irrelevant for me.

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    You don't mean a "community" .. you mean a "community only for one game world". There is a huge difference. The later .. i think is just irrelevant for me.

    [mod edit]

    You either do not know what community means, you have a definition of your own or your next comment will be along the lines of "A true community is..."

    Which is it? A, B or C?

    EDIT: Sorry, I've had these conversations before and I have a good guess where this is going.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,849Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Quirhid
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    You don't mean a "community" .. you mean a "community only for one game world". There is a huge difference. The later .. i think is just irrelevant for me.

    [mod edit]

    You either do not know what community means, you have a definition of your own or your next comment will be along the lines of "A true community is..."

    Which is it? A, B or C?

    EDIT: Sorry, I've had these conversations before and I have a good guess where this is going.

     

    How about a community in the game I am playing? Whether it's for one game or a hundred I don't think matters.  Well, it matters for those that like to argue.

  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    You don't mean a "community" .. you mean a "community only for one game world". There is a huge difference. The later .. i think is just irrelevant for me.

    [mod edit]

     Not a THING that I posted had anything to do with what you think a COMMUNITY is.

    I was pointing out that the person should join a GOOD guild, not just any guild, a GOOD one...one that stays together beyond the "current" MMO and I did so by pointing out that mine had almost 100 people on at what time was it? 11:30AM ON A THURSDAY showing that if you have a good guild, you will NEVER BE WITHOUT A LEVELING GROUP.

    [mod edit]

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    You don't mean a "community" .. you mean a "community only for one game world". There is a huge difference. The later .. i think is just irrelevant for me.

    [mod edit]

    Why i play MMO at all?

    - because they can be played like fun SP game?

    - because i can PUG easily?

    - because they are like co-op lobby games?

    And yeah .. of course i game-hop F2P MMOs a little here and there. What do you expect? I want to play classic boring time-sink like UO or EQ? If MMOs are all like that, you think i will be here?

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