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I cannot believe how critical gamers are these days

epiyonrpgepiyonrpg colorado springs, COPosts: 5Member

     I spend some time every day looking at the posts on this website. I have played tons and tons of games, in the past to present, from d2 to eq to swg to wow up all the way to d3 and PoE. The difference I'm noticing is that people are getting so critical lately about games and how they are made, instead of simply trying them when they come out.. The concept of mincing the game with little inspection knives and critical judgements before they are even in beta or released is just absurd to me. I am the gamer, they are the developers, just try what they wish to give out before telling them what is wrong with the game, or what has to be changed to fit the type of gamer that you represent.

    It seems bias is the name of the forum game. I hardly ever see any posts on how Great a game is, let alone when you do see this you also see 50 trolls bashing the OP underneath about what they hate in the game. Since examples are always being thrown out, nay, demanded by people reading these posts, I'll give you a few.

   Diablo 3 - RMAH IS RUINED IT. Diablo 3 dev's listened to d2 fanboys and made a reformated d2, boring. Diablo 3 gave me 125 hours of gameplay and now I am officially bored.

   SWTOR - This game has nothing in comparison to the old SWG. Endgame is lacking terribly, needs more content to be fun. Going free to play is basically saying "we give up"

   ESO - OMG why are they instancing all this instead of making it a sandbox full..... and truly, this seems to be the ONLY complaint on this game, but it seems ridiculously heavy.

  These statements, are not wrong or right, they are just biased assumptions from what people expect compared to what they get. They read ahead to get info on it before it's even released, or they play the game and are over critical on how to make it. Some say, how else are they going to know how to make the game better, or to save it if the player doesn't inform them of issues? .... Oh I don't know, by assuming they are even making the game itself, I'm sure they at least have a slight inclination of what they expect out of their own game compared to what you expect. Maybe just let them try? My point? I'll get to it -

  Take a risk. You'd be amazed at how enjoyable a game can be when you hear nothing of it. I am not a fan of betas, or a fan of looking up every facet of the game before it comes out to be "ready to play". Do I inspect the game a little before buying? Of course, cautious never hurts, but I only read what the dev's want me to read, I do not enjoy reading fanbase players who either pro or con it. That generates bias in your own very mind before even playing the game. Why terrorize yourself over a video game, on whether it will be popular, innovative or a piece of crap.

  I went against my own rules, and heard the bad details about d3 and gw2.  I did not play either, until feb/march of this year, because I myself proclaimed to others that D3 is a piece of crap that never stood a chance, and gw2 was a fail game that immitated WoW and their only possible Pro is that it's non subscription. Wow was I wrong. I tried D# with my wife, we are having the most fun we've ever had since d2 playing together. We didn't, and don't care, one bit about how many people are playing it, because the population doesn't drive us, the fun value does. GW2 - What a beautiful game. We call the maps "Dora the Explorer" and have a blast just finding every little nook and cranny in every zone. The cons to both? Why would I possibly say them? To deter others the same way they tried to deter me in the posts? No thanks, we got PLENTY of time played in both games, well worth our 60 bucks paid on each, so there should be no value in complaining about what it is missing considering it already gave us what we wanted - Fun.

  Do some games just completely fall ahead of time and we wished we would've seen warning signs? Not really, because I tried the game, spent hours on it giving it the just try it deserves, and if it fails, no need to bash it. That is what the dev's wanted me to experience, and experiencing it was the true reason to even playing it.

  So many people expect so much out of games nowadays. I remember buying n64 games and crapping my little pants over how awesome the graphics were, not considering any of the play value. There we not betas on consoles, and the only hype you could get was from Nintendo Power. Now though, you have so many websites, so many forums and posts telling you what to HATE about upcoming games that it's disgusting. This is what I tell everyone nowadays when I see incessant ranting about how boring they find it

                  - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

[mod edit]
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Comments

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

    you have so many websites, so many forums and posts telling you what to HATE about upcoming games that it's disgusting. This is what I tell everyone nowadays when I see incessant ranting about how boring they find it

    - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

    i think boring is too strong a word - people have different gaming desires

     

    i enjoyed Free Realms (as a 50 year old) because I liked all the exploring it encouraged - i love to explore

    but none of my friends liked it and thought i was nuts

  • vgamervgamer Texas, IAPosts: 195Member
    Guess what? Money is harder to earn now. People have to work harder and get paid less. So it is only logical that people care more about value for money. Unless...
  • GravargGravarg Harker Heights, TXPosts: 3,332Member Uncommon
    The same reason I don't read reviews of games is the same reason I don't read players QQing over things.  It's all a matter of opinion.  As long as the game works and isn't like AoC when it launched (were nothing worked and was buggy), then it's probably a decent game.  Take Eve for example, alot of people on these forums love Eve.  I can't stand to play that menu-based clickity click click game.  All you do is click on menus for hours on end.  Does that make it a bad game? No.  It's just a bad game for me.  I think people tend to forget when posting on forums what is fact and what is opinion.  The majority of gaming is based on opinions.  It's what makes us want to play the game.  If you get down to the facts, almost all MMOs are extremely similar.
  • azmundaiazmundai St Louis, MOPosts: 1,417Member

    there wasn't nearly as many accessible forms of critiquing when Ultima Online, or pong was released. the critiques were all there before, there was just no way to access 99% of them.

    LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
    I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  • DamonVileDamonVile Vancouver, BCPosts: 4,818Member

    It probabyl has to do more with the amount of experience people have and how much they talk to eachother about it. People know what they hate.

    Back in the old days people didn't know what these games were like. It was all pretty new. So you went in and played and discovered. Now that people have played for 10+ years and been talking about it just as long they know what these games are and what they can be. They just have no tollerance for the easy way out so many games try and pull.

  • PsychowPsychow SF Giants Territory, CAPosts: 1,784Member
    Originally posted by azmundai

    there wasn't nearly as many accessible forms of critiquing when Ultima Online, or pong was released. the critiques were all there before, there was just no way to access 99% of them.

     

    Oh I'm sure...like someone would say that Pong-soccer and Pong-air hockey are just Pong clones...oh wait...lol

  • XAPKenXAPKen Northwest, INPosts: 4,908Member Uncommon

    Missed a few.  Allow me to add one.

     

    "But this is 2013, and those graphics are so 2011."

     


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now turned Amateur Game Developer.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  Realm Lords 2 on MMORPG.com
  • ClaumClaum AarhusPosts: 63Member

    First of all don't write excuses because you will have even more longer text that makes peps not to read it.

    Btw how old are you because peps  over 30 like me   played  over 15 years bro and the truth is that all the game making company's turned into soulles moneymakers.

    If a game not coming from heart  it will never be good. ANd yes Rmah ruined D3 and it will ruin more.

    We have played many great games there was a time when we had problems to choose witch one we should play because all of them are great and we didnt have time for all of them. 

    WoW was great kido , but I cant play 10 years the same shit because it's booring.

    But right now bro there are noo good game maybe a few but those are not MMos.

    If u say you have great games go play it and dont cry about the thing that we are crying about having no games because it just shows that you also dont have any games to play  and you are just trolling out.

  • curacura WarsawPosts: 950Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

                         - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

     .

    Strange becouse i dont have this problem with books. I dont remember when i read a book that bore me to death like most games. 

    The problem i see is your low standards. You said games criticism disgusts you. I say people like you who accept medicority disugust me.

  • LawlmonsterLawlmonster Dallas, TXPosts: 953Member Uncommon

    I really don't agree with the OP, but I also didn't read the whole message. Some people are capable of turning off intellectually when being entertained, some enjoy the analyzation and critiquing, while others are capable of doing both. There's really no right or wrong approach to how you digest whatever medium you use for enjoyment, and I think you'll often find that people who are critical on forums don't view their time spent playing games in the same manner as someone who's just looking for "fun", of which there are about as many variations as individuals who consume it.

     

    I enjoy debate, and I like approaching games as an art form. Under these circumstances, just as an example, I'm probably going to be more critical of products made in a market that approaches itself as a business, rather than a means of expression, just as much as an individual who was raised playing sandboxes is probably going to be more critical in a market full of themeparks.

     

    TL;DR: People bitch. Welcome to the human race.

    "This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  • Attend4455Attend4455 BirminghamPosts: 161Member
    Originally posted by vgamer
    Guess what? Money is harder to earn now. People have to work harder and get paid less. So it is only logical that people care more about value for money. Unless...

    There are alot of people complaining about F2P MMOs as well so I guess that invalidates your point.

    I sometimes make spelling and grammar errors but I don't pretend it's because I'm using a phone

  • GreenHellGreenHell ludlow, MAPosts: 1,322Member Uncommon
    There is a big difference between discussing a game ( even if it is complaining) and what you get on these forums most of the time.  "THIS GAME SUCKS TEH BALLZ BECAUSE ITS GONNA BE CAREBEAR AND IM UBER LEET PVPZOR"  is pretty much what you get here. Discussion is great. Even complaining can be ok. What we get here is something totally different most of the time. It happens just laugh and roll with it.
  • atuerstaratuerstar melbournePosts: 234Member

    I cannot believe you just open your wallet and let the wind blow your money away with zero critical process.

     

    You are the problem with gaming. No matter what steaming pile of feces they decide to shovel onto a disk you, and the consumer base your ideal represents, guarantees them a certain profit margin. If you change our minds they get away with worse more often. If we can change your mind they are forced to bring more quality and quantity to their releases.

     

    I am a gamer - not a worshipper.

  • TuchakaTuchaka san diego, CAPosts: 468Member

      Less than 20% of any game population even posts on any game forum, we are not hearing from the majority of the community at all for starters, and secondly you only need to be around the gaming industry a little while to realize they often lie to us, make false promisses years in advance they have no intentions on ever keeping. Release half done games and try and dupe us into paying for it anyway, imagine going to a movie that is half done and paying full price.

     Yes sometimes a small but vocal portion of the gaming community can act like spoiled entitled brats, and yes we have a small portion of the community that has no compulsion about treating someone like dirt over a 1st world leasure product that is supposed to be fun and a break from drama.  ( i have lost count how many people have threatend to kill me  online because of something i did totally within the rule set and EUALA of that game)

      But they are not totally off base for being pissed in the first place they often have legit reasons they handle poorly, but come on how many gaming companies release games solely for profit and don't give a care one bit if its a good game or not.

  • tokinitokini third hut on the leftPosts: 341Member Common
    Originally posted by cura
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

                         - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

     .

    Strange becouse i dont have this problem with books. I dont remember when i read a book that bore me to death like most games. 

    The problem i see is your low standards. You said games criticism disgusts you. I say people like you who accept medicority disugust me.

    may i shake your hand?

  • alkarionlogalkarionlog SPosts: 1,124Member Uncommon
    if gamers was really like that, lame games we are seeing wouldn't be still alive and CS gargage and dlc would never become commom

    FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.
    image

  • TheodwulfTheodwulf Brockton, MAPosts: 231Member Uncommon

    and if it fails, no need to bash it. That is what the dev's wanted me to experience, and experiencing it was the true reason to even playing it.

     

     Realy, I am paying to "experience"  a badly made product?  Blaming the mindset of the customer for a bad job seems to be the defence of badly managed/ over-hyped games. The industry has plenty of long winded apologists, they do not need any more. I am a plumber and I rightfully expect that leaking pipes will be considered  unacceptable to a customer.  So many Devs are hacks and should be serving fries somewhere. I don't care about their "vision", I care if the game is fun and well built. If  you wish to pay for crap , feel free. I will continue to have high expectations and even higher standards and will not be shy about calling a spade a spade even if it offends your sensibilities.

     

     

     

     

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    constructive criticism is a lost art on most internet forums...

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • DamonVileDamonVile Vancouver, BCPosts: 4,818Member
    Originally posted by cura
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

                         - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

     .

    Strange becouse i dont have this problem with books. I dont remember when i read a book that bore me to death like most games. 

    The problem i see is your low standards. You said games criticism disgusts you. I say people like you who accept medicority disugust me.

    Are you kidding...there are 100000s of medicore fantasy books that have the same lame plots rehashed over and over. I can't count the number of times I've put one down part way through and just not bothered finishing it.

    So should your low standards for books sicken me ? or is the problem my standards for books have become too high ? Who's the one getting more enjoyment out of reading these books ?

    When it comes to entertainment do higher standards really get you anything in the long run ? If you're entertained and have fun isn't that the point ?

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,980Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

         I spend some time every day looking at the posts on this website. I have played tons and tons of games, in the past to present, from d2 to eq to swg to wow up all the way to d3 and PoE. The difference I'm noticing is that people are getting so critical lately about games and how they are made, instead of simply trying them when they come out.. The concept of mincing the game with little inspection knives and critical judgements before they are even in beta or released is just absurd to me. I am the gamer, they are the developers, just try what they wish to give out before telling them what is wrong with the game, or what has to be changed to fit the type of gamer that you represent.

        It seems bias is the name of the forum game. I hardly ever see any posts on how Great a game is, let alone when you do see this you also see 50 trolls bashing the OP underneath about what they hate in the game. Since examples are always being thrown out, nay, demanded by people reading these posts, I'll give you a few.

       Diablo 3 - RMAH IS RUINED IT. Diablo 3 dev's listened to d2 fanboys and made a reformated d2, boring. Diablo 3 gave me 125 hours of gameplay and now I am officially bored.

       SWTOR - This game has nothing in comparison to the old SWG. Endgame is lacking terribly, needs more content to be fun. Going free to play is basically saying "we give up"

       ESO - OMG why are they instancing all this instead of making it a sandbox full..... and truly, this seems to be the ONLY complaint on this game, but it seems ridiculously heavy.

      These statements, are not wrong or right, they are just biased assumptions from what people expect compared to what they get. They read ahead to get info on it before it's even released, or they play the game and are over critical on how to make it. Some say, how else are they going to know how to make the game better, or to save it if the player doesn't inform them of issues? .... Oh I don't know, by assuming they are even making the game itself, I'm sure they at least have a slight inclination of what they expect out of their own game compared to what you expect. Maybe just let them try? My point? I'll get to it -

      Take a risk. You'd be amazed at how enjoyable a game can be when you hear nothing of it. I am not a fan of betas, or a fan of looking up every facet of the game before it comes out to be "ready to play". Do I inspect the game a little before buying? Of course, cautious never hurts, but I only read what the dev's want me to read, I do not enjoy reading fanbase players who either pro or con it. That generates bias in your own very mind before even playing the game. Why terrorize yourself over a video game, on whether it will be popular, innovative or a piece of crap.

      I went against my own rules, and heard the bad details about d3 and gw2.  I did not play either, until feb/march of this year, because I myself proclaimed to others that D3 is a piece of crap that never stood a chance, and gw2 was a fail game that immitated WoW and their only possible Pro is that it's non subscription. Wow was I wrong. I tried D# with my wife, we are having the most fun we've ever had since d2 playing together. We didn't, and don't care, one bit about how many people are playing it, because the population doesn't drive us, the fun value does. GW2 - What a beautiful game. We call the maps "Dora the Explorer" and have a blast just finding every little nook and cranny in every zone. The cons to both? Why would I possibly say them? To deter others the same way they tried to deter me in the posts? No thanks, we got PLENTY of time played in both games, well worth our 60 bucks paid on each, so there should be no value in complaining about what it is missing considering it already gave us what we wanted - Fun.

      Do some games just completely fall ahead of time and we wished we would've seen warning signs? Not really, because I tried the game, spent hours on it giving it the just try it deserves, and if it fails, no need to bash it. That is what the dev's wanted me to experience, and experiencing it was the true reason to even playing it.

      So many people expect so much out of games nowadays. I remember buying n64 games and crapping my little pants over how awesome the graphics were, not considering any of the play value. There we not betas on consoles, and the only hype you could get was from Nintendo Power. Now though, you have so many websites, so many forums and posts telling you what to HATE about upcoming games that it's disgusting. This is what I tell everyone nowadays when I see incessant ranting about how boring they find it

                      - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

     

      On a final note, I'm sure some will say "I wanted to read this gigantic post, but it seems drawn out and too many words for me to read" I typed this in under 8 minutes, so I hope you're not serious. And if you do not have the attention span to simply read a few paragraphs, then don't, but don't bother giving your shitty two cents on the subject unless it's constructive about what I posted, not about the length of the rant. Thanks.

    I read your long post, was pretty boring (there is a reason why Twitter is 140 chars you know) unfortunately and didn't say anything that hasn't been discussed here before.  You've been around these forums a while, and none of this is really new, forum PVP is a hobby for some folks and they are going to be quite critical of almost every game.

    You like D3 and GW2, I tried them both and found them not to be to my liking.  Nothing wrong with me or them actually, but doesn't mean I haven't spent some time being critical of both titles on these forums.

    I value the opinions of other people, I compare them against my own and enjoy discussing disagreements between them.  Sure, sometimes I get carried away, but overall I think I keep it pretty above board and don't fall into angry troll mode too often. (now, BitterVet mode, that's a totally different story) image

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • RefMinorRefMinor MyTownPosts: 3,452Member
    Originally posted by DamonVile
    Originally posted by cura
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

                         - It's truly not the game that is boring, it is yourself. You could have an infinite amount of fun in a video game, doesn't matter how bad it is, it just depends on how you interpret it yourself. Boring game is not boring, gamer is bored.

     .

    Strange becouse i dont have this problem with books. I dont remember when i read a book that bore me to death like most games. 

    The problem i see is your low standards. You said games criticism disgusts you. I say people like you who accept medicority disugust me.

    Are you kidding...there are 100000s of medicore fantasy books that have the same lame plots rehashed over and over. I can't count the number of times I've put one down part way through and just not bothered finishing it.

    So should your low standards for books sicken me ? or is the problem my standards for books have become too high ? Who's the one getting more enjoyment out of reading these books ?

    When it comes to entertainment do higher standards really get you anything in the long run ? If you're entertained and have fun isn't that the point ?

    Or possibly he reads about the books, or talks to others about them before he reads them, maybe some he hears about don't suit what he thinks is a good book so he doesn't read it, when others are discussing the book he tells them it's not his kind of book for certain reasons. Of course if the OP was part of that discussion he would go off on a rant about how you should buy any book you see and if you don't enjoy it it is because of a personality defect and how dare you criticise it.

  • nbtscannbtscan Phoenix, AZPosts: 774Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by epiyonrpg

       Take a risk. You'd be amazed at how enjoyable a game can be when you hear nothing of it. I am not a fan of betas, or a fan of looking up every facet of the game before it comes out to be "ready to play". Do I inspect the game a little before buying? Of course, cautious never hurts, but I only read what the dev's want me to read, I do not enjoy reading fanbase players who either pro or con it. That generates bias in your own very mind before even playing the game. Why terrorize yourself over a video game, on whether it will be popular, innovative or a piece of crap.

      I went against my own rules, and heard the bad details about d3 and gw2.  I did not play either, until feb/march of this year, because I myself proclaimed to others that D3 is a piece of crap that never stood a chance, and gw2 was a fail game that immitated WoW and their only possible Pro is that it's non subscription. Wow was I wrong. I tried D# with my wife, we are having the most fun we've ever had since d2 playing together. We didn't, and don't care, one bit about how many people are playing it, because the population doesn't drive us, the fun value does.   

    I decided to single out the D3 comments.  I knew about D3 once the big announcement came out.  I didn't follow the game at all on forums or elsewhere.  I remembered what D2 was like and decided that I wanted to buy D3 based on that.  Well, my expectations weren't met at all.  A shallow story, boring repetitive maps and item drops several levels lower than your character didn't make for an exciting game to me.

    If you had played at launch you'd probably be like the majority of people that quit within the first couple of patches.  It's not fair to give judgment on a game newly played once it's had 6 major patches over 9 months under its belt, most of them correcting launch mistakes or adding small bits of filler content.

    I'm currently in the beta for FFXIV: ARR, and while many of the comments on the beta forums have been pretty useless, there are gems of feedback hidden in there that the developers have responded back and said that they will implement it.  Being able to give some input (and it actually being heeded) isn't always a bad thing.

  • epiyonrpgepiyonrpg colorado springs, COPosts: 5Member

      Took me a bit to even realize i was logged out so couldn't reply, only ever written two of these lol. Thanks for the feedback, both the angry and the supportive. I am 25, to the guy who asked, and I have been playing games since gameboy, so attacking me over gamer stats is irrelevant. In fact, you point out that I mentioned WoW and somehow assume I am a kido who only enjoys buying every game out there, crap or not. The only games I've bought in the past year to date are Red Dead Redemption for ps, Skyrim for PC, GW 2 and Diablo 3. I have tried a ton of f2p to give them a chance, and I found runescape to be more intellectually involved then say D3, by a long shot.

      But as for the, "I just eat games that they shove down my throat and fling dollars at them like im in a stripjoint not giving two shits" lol wut? I didn't say anything like that, and your rage is felt thoroughly. But to say that the game developer is the one that has to forcefully insert every facet of imagination into you while you are playing is complete ignorance. If this was the case, Minecraft would not be so successful. Imagination and gamer intuition is what formulates the feel good process. Do some games provide everything you would wish for, AKA Morrowind, AKA Fallout 3, AKA Ultima? Sure, but then what happens? You expect every game thereafter to have those giant expectations when some aren't even meant to touch base on filling every small gap. You sound like an elitist, one with no imagination except that of troll rage. I never said I buy every game, I did say that the games I do buy, I give them their moneys worth on my play time. I don't just level once, say this games shit, then go to a forum and complain. [mod edit]

  • azmundaiazmundai St Louis, MOPosts: 1,417Member

    i didnt detect any rage in what he posted ... maybe that is the issue you are having.

    LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
    I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  • TimothyTierlessTimothyTierless Columnist M, ORPosts: 2,163Member Uncommon

    I myself can't believe how many marks keep buying up crap games because they aren't thinking critically enough.

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