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So, I want to make an MMO But have no clue how to...

TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon

I think the thread title says it all.

I love games, and I love MMO's and I have always had a desire to 'make' something. Now, I have, in the past made my share of games using in-house systems such as RPGmaker but never really entertained (until recently) putting a concept together from scratch. 

Now I know a lot of technical people view these forums and I was wondering, what would I need to 'learn' in order to make an MMO. I am not talking something like WoW, but something that is a bit differen't. Any assistance, or guidance people can give on this matter would be wonderful. 

 

I suppose I should also share my concept so people know what I am planning. I also made some quick paint based pictures so you would have a general idea what I want to achieve. 

[Concept]

The concept is a Card based PvE and PvP MMORPG which has a simular style to that of Tetra Master (back when you used to be able to play it, I loved that game so much). 

 

[My Vision]

[PvE]

There would be a massive map system that you would navigate, I am talking huge and it would have random battles to which you face monster cards. You use your cards to defeat the monsters. Your cards, do damage based on the statistics of your avatar. Defeating the monster gives you 'random' loot based on the monster or monsters your defeated. So they might drop, resrouces cards, monster cards, item cards or gear cards. 

There would also be quests you can pick up which also reward you with new more powerful cards. 

Combat will simular like how Tetra master worked, but rather than the cards dealing damage based on their own set of variables, their damage and abilities scales with your avatar and the equipment they have equipped. There will also be a doll of your avatar on screen wearing the equipment so other people can see when you group pve or pvp. 

Monster fights will determine how many cards you can play. You will be able to place x amount of cards depending on how big the battle field is. You will be able to make decks of up to 52 cards and have several decks for several purposes. Some for example might be magic, resist, dps, tanking, healing etc the effectiveness of which are dependant on your avatars equipped gear. 

PvE will be a singular experience for th emost part, forging your own destiny. There will be quests, but nothing defined on what you should and shouldnt do. I want a map with plenty of secrets and challenges to explore which reward dutiful people. 

There will be grouping however, special missions, dungeons and raids which you can either pre-form or queue into and depending on the size of the challenege determines how many cards each player can use. Some might be very open 52 cards each on some raids, some might be as restrictive as 5 each. 

Cards will also take damage and require repair to which gold will be a currency, you can obtain gold by selling cards to vendors and to other players. 

Crafting will also exist to which their will be crafting and resource based cards. 

 

[PvP]

Would be a lobby based system and cut-throat. The winner of a PvP battle will get to choose a card from their opponent. It would be a balanced system based on people 'deck stength'. Decks are made and stored to which can hold up to 52 cards each. Consumable cards are depleted when used.  Players will be able to set lobbies up with battlefield restrictions (like 10 cards, 20 cards or an all in 52 card deck).

I would also like to make battlefields with objectives which rewarded the victors with unique cards for hitting those objectives. 

 

Please feel free to ask any questions, I know my writting skills are not my 'stong' point. But I am a man, with no experience in this industry with a vision I would like to see realised. So, any pointers on what I should take as the first step, what I need to learn, what coding etc etc would go a LONG way. 

 

Thanking you. 

 

Tsu

«134

Comments

  • birdycephonbirdycephon Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 1,314Member
    Woah, dont get ahead of yourself. Start small, make a simple RPG first, get a feel for game design and learn the limitations of your game engine you are planning on using. Trust me, MMOs are some of the most complex software imaginable.
  • jimdandy26jimdandy26 salem, ORPosts: 527Member

    I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.

    To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 16,598Member Epic

    If you want your game to ever exist, you basically have two options:

    1)  Make it yourself.

    2)  Get rich and then hire other people to make it for you.

    -----

    So let's see if (1) is an option for you.  What's your background?  What do you know as far as computer programming?  And how much mathematics do you know?  If you've got the technical aptitude, then you can pick up a computer language on your own.  Learning the necessary mathematics on a self-taught basis is also possible, though much harder.

    If you want to make a 3D game, then an excellent understanding of linear algebra and a pretty good understanding of multivariable calculus is basically the introductory "you can't do anything without this" stuff.  Well, you don't need everything from those courses, but you'd better be comfortable with doing explicit computations with change-of-basis matrices and able to set up Stokes' Theorem problems.  Doing the actual integration to finish a Stokes' Theorem problem is irrelevant, but that's the easy part of such problems, anyway.  And that's just the entry level stuff; ideally, you'd like a much stronger math background.

    If you want to make a purely 2D game, then the math requirements are much lighter, and you really only need a solid high school background in order to handle the graphics.  You're still going to have to make a ton of artwork for your game, though.

    Regardless of the graphical side of things, I'd expect you to need a strong background in probability to be able to do the underlying game mechanics for your particular game.  Actually, that's true of most games that are potentially interesting.  You don't need the advanced measure space and sigma algebra stuff, but you do need a very good understanding of the introductory level probability such as you'd see in an upper level undergraduate math course.

    -----

    If (1) isn't an option, then that leaves (2):  get rich and hire others to make the game.  Sorry, but I can't help you there.  Still, (2) isn't guaranteed to work, as Curt Schilling learned the hard way.

    -----

    If you had ideas about getting other people to make your game for you for free, then there's no chance of that.  Everyone who is capable of making a game has ideas of his own that he likes better than your ideas.  That's why they're his ideas and your ideas are not his ideas.  At an absolute minimum, if you want to assemble a team to make your game, you'd better have the technical skills to do a good chunk of the hard work yourself.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Can you make pong?  If you can't do that without a tutorial, don't bother.

    You make me like charity

  • GishgeronGishgeron Princeton, KYPosts: 1,287Member

      This is a really broad thing to ask my friend.  I'm going to assume you have never made a game before, MMO or not.  The first thing you need is to understand how games are even made, and what costs are associated with them.  An MMO is an extremely large scale thing, so much so that it drives even the smallest of projects into the millions of dollars to produce.  You CAN cut those costs by being able to do most of the work alone, but that means taking the years needed to learn programming, digital art, networking, and a myriad of other things that all go into making these games.  Then you have to build each part yourself, when each part could take years of your time apiece.  This basically means accepting that you'll need to sink about 20 years into this project without having to work a full time job because you'll most of your time free to really educate yourself AND develop the game AND learn what systems and methods make good games.

      Otherwise you gotta hire people.  These people will not be cheap.  Consider that a factory worker, GED only, probably makes aroun 25-30K a year.  To hire just a team of 10 of THOSE people, you've already spent 300,000 dollars each year you develop the game.  Programmers and artists and managers and techs to make your servers and networking are all gonna cost much more than that.  Then you have to decide on what platform you want to launch the game.  If its gonna be a PC only, without help from things like steam or the like, then you'll need to invest in advertising and marketing.  Those things aren't as easy to do as they sound, and cost a ton to boot.  Most professional studios have employees for those jobs.  Those cats make way more than 30K a year too.

      Now that you've accepted that making an MMO is gonna ruin your financial viability without help, you come to the next headache.  Investment funds.  You're gonna need capital, and its gotta come from somewhere.  A kickstarter doesn't work for you, all you have is a forum post with a few, extremely vague and untested, ideals.  People actually getting successful kickstarters have work already done, a game already sort of there.  They come from the industry already and have a professional understanding of what a game is.  You'll have to get a publisher to pick you up or investors to buy in to you  Each of these comes with some associated evil.  Publishers are going to OWN you.  They will take over the rights to your game and its property.  Investors are going to want solid data regarding the profitability of your game and examples in the current market that showcase that potential.  Both sides will want some prototype of the game already done.  The don't WANT ideals.  They already have large staffs of people who are just BURSTING with ideals AND the skills to make them happen.

     This is a long way of saying you are not going to be making an MMO.  You CAN start by learning how to make games, and taking the time to study games and psychology to see what makes everything work and remain engaging and interesting to a human being.  Game Maker 8 is a wonderful starter tool for this, it will get your feet wet without overwhelming you and will help you start to understand how games are made.  It has a free version and the free one has plenty of tools to work with.  The things it doesn't have, like 3-D models and such, are thing that will be outside your ability for awhile anyway.

      So start MUCH smaller.  Take a really simple, barebones, game concept and try to make it on GM 8.  Really refine it and see what you can do to improve it.  Get into some college for programming, and play lots of games while paying attention to all the details that made it work.  Google "Extra Credits" as that webshow has some pretty good food for thought on the world of game design.

    image

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 20,534Member Epic
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    If you want your game to ever exist, you basically have two options: 1)  Make it yourself. 2)  Get rich and then hire other people to make it for you.

    Coulnd't he just be the artist/writer  and make it work that way?

     

    AND get all the programmers, animators etc.

  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by birdycephon
    Woah, dont get ahead of yourself. Start small, make a simple RPG first, get a feel for game design and learn the limitations of your game engine you are planning on using. Trust me, MMOs are some of the most complex software imaginable.

    Firstly, thank you for taking the time to respond. To each of you infact. I have made an RPG before using already built systems such as RPG maker, which was very simplistic to use and required very minimal additional input from me other than a bit of a chop shop coding grab given by other RPGmaker fans. Although that was a very long time ago. I wouldn't know where to begin with making an RPG, say, from scratch. Not even a 2D one, unless flash was involved which I have dabbled in before. 

    But the sentiment rings true, to begin small. I have also wanted to create an episodic RPG series before, which plenty of tools are available to use. I might, give it that a go as well. 

    Originally posted by jimdandy26
    Here is a start http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_221/6582-Why-Your-Game-Idea-Sucks

    Very interesting read, although not so much applicable to what I am trying to achieve. I am not looking to recruit nor enlist, although I would imagine that would come later to make things more efficent and managable. 

     

    Originally posted by Quizzical

    If you want your game to ever exist, you basically have two options: 1)  Make it yourself. 2)  Get rich and then hire other people to make it for you. ----- So let's see if (1) is an option for you.  What's your background?  What do you know as far as computer programming?  And how much mathematics do you know?  If you've got the technical aptitude, then you can pick up a computer language on your own.  Learning the necessary mathematics on a self-taught basis is also possible, though much harder. If you want to make a 3D game, then an excellent understanding of linear algebra and a pretty good understanding of multivariable calculus is basically the introductory "you can't do anything without this" stuff.  Well, you don't need everything from those courses, but you'd better be comfortable with doing explicit computations with change-of-basis matrices and able to set up Stokes' Theorem problems.  Doing the actual integration to finish a Stokes' Theorem problem is irrelevant, but that's the easy part of such problems, anyway.  And that's just the entry level stuff; ideally, you'd like a much stronger math background. If you want to make a purely 2D game, then the math requirements are much lighter, and you really only need a solid high school background in order to handle the graphics.  You're still going to have to make a ton of artwork for your game, though. Regardless of the graphical side of things, I'd expect you to need a strong background in probability to be able to do the underlying game mechanics for your particular game.  Actually, that's true of most games that are potentially interesting.  You don't need the advanced measure space and sigma algebra stuff, but you do need a very good understanding of the introductory level probability such as you'd see in an upper level undergraduate math course. ----- If (1) isn't an option, then that leaves (2):  get rich and hire others to make the game.  Sorry, but I can't help you there.  Still, (2) isn't guaranteed to work, as Curt Schilling learned the hard way. ----- If you had ideas about getting other people to make your game for you for free, then there's no chance of that.  Everyone who is capable of making a game has ideas of his own that he likes better than your ideas.  That's why they're his ideas and your ideas are not his ideas.  At an absolute minimum, if you want to assemble a team to make your game, you'd better have the technical skills to do a good chunk of the hard work yourself.

    I would be making a game very much like Tetra master, so I would say it would be 2D in it's entirity. So nothing like WoW or Rift or any of that, but simular to what you would expect from html based games like 'Pockie Ninja' or that which you can play on facebook. 

    The way I normally tackle things are like puzzles, breaking them down to smaller parts and then getting the pieces to fit correctly so the bigger picture can be seen. I understand a lot of math would be involved, although that part does not concern me too much as I have resources (friends) that can help in that regards. The artwork is not a concern either, although, for what I wish to achieve there would indeed be a LOT of art, but being an artist its more time resource than artistic expertese for me. 

     

    What I really need to understand really, to get my 'foot' out the door is if I was to make this a website based game, (you played it from an in-web browser) what kinda coding language would I need to learn, what would be required in handling resources of allowing many individuals all interacting with each other like something such as pockie ninja or neopets. 

    I will be essentially be working from the ground up, and although, a pipe dream per se, I would consider it to be a challenging hobby which continues until I either achieve... or die. Whatever comes first haha. 

     

    Tsu

  • KenFisherKenFisher Northwest, INPosts: 5,035Member Uncommon

    Assuming you are not going to write your own engine, in general the game you make is largely dictated by what the engine can provide.  Desired features are not always possible features.

     

    You can think of it as engine + script coding + compatible artwork = MMORPG

     

    There are at least 3 or 4 engines available to micro budget Indies.  One I know of is Hero.  Maybe other posters can name the others.  I don't know for sure which ones have become popular or have appropriate pricing models for solo / small team developed games.

     

    EDIT: I just saw that the OP mentioned 2D.  That changes the engine list completely.

     


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  When I don't understand, I ask.  Such is not intended as criticism.
  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by asmkm22
    Can you make pong?  If you can't do that without a tutorial, don't bother.

    Oddly, I did make 'pong' or a variation of it as well as other very 'basic' puzzle based games using PASCAL back in my college days. I would have to dig out the notes on how I would replicate something like that from the loft to be honest. I have had no need to use the knowledge since I left college and being that I am a 30 year old man the old grey matter does not have it retained. But, if memory serves I remember it not being very difficult,  just a fair bit of tinkering with the code. 

    Originally posted by Gishgeron

      This is a really broad thing to ask my friend.  I'm going to assume you have never made a game before, MMO or not.  The first thing you need is to understand how games are even made, and what costs are associated with them.  An MMO is an extremely large scale thing, so much so that it drives even the smallest of projects into the millions of dollars to produce.  You CAN cut those costs by being able to do most of the work alone, but that means taking the years needed to learn programming, digital art, networking, and a myriad of other things that all go into making these games.  Then you have to build each part yourself, when each part could take years of your time apiece.  This basically means accepting that you'll need to sink about 20 years into this project without having to work a full time job because you'll most of your time free to really educate yourself AND develop the game AND learn what systems and methods make good games.   Otherwise you gotta hire people.  These people will not be cheap.  Consider that a factory worker, GED only, probably makes aroun 25-30K a year.  To hire just a team of 10 of THOSE people, you've already spent 300,000 dollars each year you develop the game.  Programmers and artists and managers and techs to make your servers and networking are all gonna cost much more than that.  Then you have to decide on what platform you want to launch the game.  If its gonna be a PC only, without help from things like steam or the like, then you'll need to invest in advertising and marketing.  Those things aren't as easy to do as they sound, and cost a ton to boot.  Most professional studios have employees for those jobs.  Those cats make way more than 30K a year too.   Now that you've accepted that making an MMO is gonna ruin your financial viability without help, you come to the next headache.  Investment funds.  You're gonna need capital, and its gotta come from somewhere.  A kickstarter doesn't work for you, all you have is a forum post with a few, extremely vague and untested, ideals.  People actually getting successful kickstarters have work already done, a game already sort of there.  They come from the industry already and have a professional understanding of what a game is.  You'll have to get a publisher to pick you up or investors to buy in to you  Each of these comes with some associated evil.  Publishers are going to OWN you.  They will take over the rights to your game and its property.  Investors are going to want solid data regarding the profitability of your game and examples in the current market that showcase that potential.  Both sides will want some prototype of the game already done.  The don't WANT ideals.  They already have large staffs of people who are just BURSTING with ideals AND the skills to make them happen.  This is a long way of saying you are not going to be making an MMO.  You CAN start by learning how to make games, and taking the time to study games and psychology to see what makes everything work and remain engaging and interesting to a human being.  Game Maker 8 is a wonderful starter tool for this, it will get your feet wet without overwhelming you and will help you start to understand how games are made.  It has a free version and the free one has plenty of tools to work with.  The things it doesn't have, like 3-D models and such, are thing that will be outside your ability for awhile anyway.   So start MUCH smaller.  Take a really simple, barebones, game concept and try to make it on GM 8.  Really refine it and see what you can do to improve it.  Get into some college for programming, and play lots of games while paying attention to all the details that made it work.  Google "Extra Credits" as that webshow has some pretty good food for thought on the world of game design.

    This was VERY useful, thanking you very very much. You mentioning gamemaker 8 made me recall a very early game making programe called Gamefactory to which a friend and I made a very 'basic' Southpark adventure game. We are talking 15 years ago mind you so times have changed since then. But, because I want to keep this a very 2D based game I would imagine I might be spared the headache of 3D work. 

    But yes, I shall look into Gamemaker 8 and see what I can rustle up. Perhaps I shall make a few fun things, basic in general and post here and see how far I can get. 

     

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Quizzical
    If you want your game to ever exist, you basically have two options: 1)  Make it yourself. 2)  Get rich and then hire other people to make it for you.

    Coulnd't he just be the artist/writer  and make it work that way?

     

    AND get all the programmers, animators etc.

    Viable and would be worth it, but requires a level of income and investment simply not available to me. But yes, the art and the wrting is pretty much covered. Although I am not a master of the writing craft I do know someone who is and they would be keen to be involved in an endeavour such as this. 

     

    Thanking you to all who have continued to post. It has been VERY helpful. 

  • ReskaillevReskaillev mechelenPosts: 157Member Common

    Get a team...

     

    You can't do this alone in any decent amount of time, you are NOT a one man army.

    Get some intrested ppl with skills together and start working :)

     

    Where to find these people? If you know this, please tell me ASAP :)

    "Isn't a raid plundering villages in WoW or something like that?" - Robert Desable

  • tman5tman5 mesa, ALPosts: 604Member
    Well, you've come to the right place because these forums are absolutely bursting with knowledgable experts in all aspects of MMO concept, development, and operation.  You should have no trouble obtaining invaluable information from here
  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by XAPKen
    Assuming you are not going to write your own engine, in general the game you make is largely dictated by what the engine can provide.  Desired features are not always possible features.   You can think of it as engine + script coding + compatible artwork = MMORPG   There are at least 3 or 4 engines available to micro budget Indies.  One I know of is Hero.  Maybe other posters can name the others.  I don't know for sure which ones have become popular or have appropriate pricing models for solo / small team developed games.  

    I believe I am going to go forth with a web based game which should hopefully make things a bit more realistic with a man with my limited capabilities. But, you never know and I will most likely look into the Hero engine you mentioned so I can see what it allows me to do and work with. 

    Thanking you. :)

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 20,534Member Epic
    Originally posted by Reskaillev
    Get a team...   You can't do this alone in any decent amount of time, you are NOT a one man army. Get some intrested ppl with skills together and start working :)   Where to find these people? If you know this, please tell me ASAP :)

    Though, if one has the talent and ability one "could" do it alone...

    http://www.1up.com/news/indie-mmo-love

    but this is the exception rather than the rule.

  • ReskaillevReskaillev mechelenPosts: 157Member Common
    Originally posted by tman5
    Well, you've come to the right place because these forums are absolutely bursting with knowledgable experts in all aspects of MMO concept, development, and operation.  You should have no trouble obtaining invaluable information from here

    "Isn't a raid plundering villages in WoW or something like that?" - Robert Desable

  • ReskaillevReskaillev mechelenPosts: 157Member Common
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Reskaillev
    Get a team...   You can't do this alone in any decent amount of time, you are NOT a one man army. Get some intrested ppl with skills together and start working :)   Where to find these people? If you know this, please tell me ASAP :)

    Though, if one has the talent, ability and time one "could" do it alone...

    http://www.1up.com/news/indie-mmo-love

    but this is the exception rather than the rule.

    Fixed something there :)

    Talent and ability mostly aren't the primary problem.

    "Isn't a raid plundering villages in WoW or something like that?" - Robert Desable

  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Reskaillev
    Get a team...   You can't do this alone in any decent amount of time, you are NOT a one man army. Get some intrested ppl with skills together and start working :)   Where to find these people? If you know this, please tell me ASAP :)

    Well I think with money or friends if I am honest haha. 

    In honest I do need to learn as much as posisble myself, I wont be able to 'direct' my vision if I have no earthly idea how to communicate it to other people and what resources I need in order to achieve. 

    Granted, as a one man army my expectation of completing a project of this scope would take a very long time and I will need others. Thankfully I have quite a diverse amount of friends I have met over the years, both irl and online. My ex-girlfriend who now lives in singapore is pretty much god-damned gifted in computer sciene, language and math. I can 'perk' her interest I gather when I need to as she is a hardcore gamer such as myself. 

    Another friend I have is a English language professer who writes a lot of fiction for himself, never been keen to publish his work mind you, just likes to create worlds much like how Tolkein did. 

    I also have a LOT of professional artist friends as I am also an artist. Although, not what I do for a living I could never seem to make money of it haha. 

     

    As for hiring people at the moment, I know there is a recession going on and people are out of work. Perhaps I could get the Job Centre to get some of them to work for me for a period of time for free. If they can rustle old age pensioners to work in super markets for free (for skilling up purposes they say) then this can't be too much of a stretch!

    I kid off course. I find the whole 'free' labour practice an abomination. 

  • KenFisherKenFisher Northwest, INPosts: 5,035Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tsumoro
    Originally posted by XAPKen
    Assuming you are not going to write your own engine, in general the game you make is largely dictated by what the engine can provide.  Desired features are not always possible features.   You can think of it as engine + script coding + compatible artwork = MMORPG   There are at least 3 or 4 engines available to micro budget Indies.  One I know of is Hero.  Maybe other posters can name the others.  I don't know for sure which ones have become popular or have appropriate pricing models for solo / small team developed games.  

    I believe I am going to go forth with a web based game which should hopefully make things a bit more realistic with a man with my limited capabilities. But, you never know and I will most likely look into the Hero engine you mentioned so I can see what it allows me to do and work with. 

    Thanking you. :)

     

    Browser based and 2D is way out of my league.  I know Hero won't do that for you, nor would any others I was thinking of.

     

    Going 2D has several advantages.  You'll be working with sprites rather than models, and there is much less rendering math involved.

     

    I've seen 2D game frameworks, but nothing I recall that's MMO specific.  I'm sure there are some out there.

     

    If browser based, perhaps you can cross-platform to iPad and Android tablets.  You could make a serious killing on these because the playerbase is much larger.

     


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  When I don't understand, I ask.  Such is not intended as criticism.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 16,598Member Epic
    Originally posted by Tsumoro What I really need to understand really, to get my 'foot' out the door is if I was to make this a website based game, (you played it from an in-web browser) what kinda coding language would I need to learn, what would be required in handling resources of allowing many individuals all interacting with each other like something such as pockie ninja or neopets.  I will be essentially be working from the ground up, and although, a pipe dream per se, I would consider it to be a challenging hobby which continues until I either achieve... or die. Whatever comes first haha. 

    Trying to make a browser-based game will make things harder on you.  For security reasons, there are a number of things that a browser-based program is not allowed to do, even though an ordinary standalone program would have no problem.  That's not to say that a browser-based game would be impossible; it's not, especially if you're going the 2D route.  (Modern 3D graphics, on the other hand, would be completely out of the question.)  But if you had the idea of making your game browser-based thinking that would be easier, then you shouldn't.

    Provided that you pick a language that has the needed capabilities (e.g., trying to make an MMORPG in a language with no Internet capabilities isn't going to end well), it's less about the language you pick than what you do with it.

  • SabbathSMCSabbathSMC Katy, TXPosts: 226Member

    http://www.yoyogames.com/

     

    this is one of the easiet game makers i have ever seen. Tons of tutorials to get you started.

    played M59,UO,lineage,EQ,Daoc,Entropia,SWG,Horizons,Lineage2.EQ2,Vangaurd,Irth online, DarkFall,Star Trek
    and many others that did not make the cut or i just plain forgetting about.

  • CyborWolfTKCyborWolfTK anywhere, AKPosts: 77Member

     

     

       @OP:

     

      Learn a few programming languages. C#, C++, Java, Python, and even HTML would all be useful to you.

     Next, Learn to use some 3d Modeling programs. Blender is free, and is my favorite, your mileage may vary.

     Learn to use Imiage manipulation program. I.E. Photoshop, or my favorite(because it's free) is GIMP.

     

    Network with other people who are like yourself. Work on other people's projects, until you have a firm grasp of what is going to be required.

     Make your first projects VERY VERY SMALL.  Add content to them, or progressivly build larger projects.

     

    At this point you won't need much advice, because your going to know the stark truth.

     

    Making a RPG, stand alone card game, side scroller, or really any kind of simple game is HARD.

    Making an MMO adds x50 the difficulty even for the most basic kind.

     

    SIr, I wish luck with your project. This type of undertaking consumed nearly 6 years of my life, and I eventually gave up once i understood just how massive an undertaking it is.

  • mmoskimmoski plymouthPosts: 282Member

    If your truely looking to make a browser based game, you could use html5/jscript for your front end, mysql/sql, and websockets for browser based streamed networking.

    Or you could go the unity route, which i believe their web container is browser based.

    Or travel down the java route.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 16,598Member Epic
    Originally posted by XAPKen
    Assuming you are not going to write your own engine, in general the game you make is largely dictated by what the engine can provide.  Desired features are not always possible features.   You can think of it as engine + script coding + compatible artwork = MMORPG   There are at least 3 or 4 engines available to micro budget Indies.  One I know of is Hero.  Maybe other posters can name the others.  I don't know for sure which ones have become popular or have appropriate pricing models for solo / small team developed games.   EDIT: I just saw that the OP mentioned 2D.  That changes the engine list completely.

    That brings up the question of whether to license a game engine or create your own.  Licensing a game engine further breaks into paying to get access to modify the source code arbitrarily or just using the engine as-is.

    If you license a game engine and get full access to the source code, then you have to pay a lot of money for that.  That might rule it out for you immediately.  Even if you can go this route, then you're going to have to take an incredibly complex program that isn't built to do what you want and make a bunch of little modifications all over the place to change it to do what you want.  If a game engine is already built to do most of what you want, then this can save you a fair bit of time and effort, but if you're trying to go too far off the beaten path, trying to license a game engine and change it all around could well make things harder for you than building your own from scratch.

    If you license a game engine but don't get access to modify it, then you can't do anything that the engine isn't built to handle.  That may force you to scrap many of the distinctive features that you wanted your game to have.

    If you make your own game engine, then you can make it do whatever you want.  It won't be nearly as good of a general-purpose game engine as the ones that you could license, but it might well be better for your particular game.  A game engine that you could license will have a ton of capabilities built in that you have no use for, so you don't need to implement them in your own game engine.

    Licensing a game engine lets you get started on your project and have something to show a lot faster, but can easily lose its advantages by the time your game is ready to launch.  Licensing a game engine increases the chances that you will successfully finish a game.  If you finish a game, then having made your own game engine greatly increases the chances that your game will be something along the lines of what you had in mind--and that it will be good.

  • ReskaillevReskaillev mechelenPosts: 157Member Common
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by Tsumoro What I really need to understand really, to get my 'foot' out the door is if I was to make this a website based game, (you played it from an in-web browser) what kinda coding language would I need to learn, what would be required in handling resources of allowing many individuals all interacting with each other like something such as pockie ninja or neopets.  I will be essentially be working from the ground up, and although, a pipe dream per se, I would consider it to be a challenging hobby which continues until I either achieve... or die. Whatever comes first haha. 

    Trying to make a browser-based game will make things harder on you.  For security reasons, there are a number of things that a browser-based program is not allowed to do, even though an ordinary standalone program would have no problem.  That's not to say that a browser-based game would be impossible; it's not, especially if you're going the 2D route.  (Modern 3D graphics, on the other hand, would be completely out of the question.)  But if you had the idea of making your game browser-based thinking that would be easier, then you shouldn't.

    Provided that you pick a language that has the needed capabilities (e.g., trying to make an MMORPG in a language with no Internet capabilities isn't going to end well), it's less about the language you pick than what you do with it.

    I would actually think that Java Applets would be perfect for this, no worry about cross platform compability and very easy to get a server up and running using java sockets.

     

    This also keeps it limited to one language instead of the juggernaut mmos that we have now, that generally use more than one coding language to get their game running. 

    "Isn't a raid plundering villages in WoW or something like that?" - Robert Desable

  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 426Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by XAPKen

    Originally posted by Tsumoro
    Originally posted by XAPKen
    Assuming you are not going to write your own engine, in general the game you make is largely dictated by what the engine can provide.  Desired features are not always possible features.   You can think of it as engine + script coding + compatible artwork = MMORPG   There are at least 3 or 4 engines available to micro budget Indies.  One I know of is Hero.  Maybe other posters can name the others.  I don't know for sure which ones have become popular or have appropriate pricing models for solo / small team developed games.  

    I believe I am going to go forth with a web based game which should hopefully make things a bit more realistic with a man with my limited capabilities. But, you never know and I will most likely look into the Hero engine you mentioned so I can see what it allows me to do and work with. 

    Thanking you. :)

     

    Browser based and 2D is way out of my league.  I know Hero won't do that for you, nor would any others I was thinking of.

     

    Going 2D has several advantages.  You'll be working with sprites rather than models, and there is much less rendering math involved.

     

    I've seen 2D game frameworks, but nothing I recall that's MMO specific.  I'm sure there are some out there.

     

    If browser based, perhaps you can cross-platform to iPad and Android tablets.  You could make a serious killing on these because the playerbase is much larger.

     

    Not 100% decided yet, I do not know enough about either/or to make an absolute about the avenue I would want to take it. I am still going to look into the engine because it couldnt hurt and I need to expand upon my horizons.  I would say, because I hadn't initially thought of it, that the allure of making a game that could be played by a tablet would be wonderful!

    As for making a killing, not really thought about that side of things to be honest. There is a LOT of work I need to do before I even get into the monetisation side of things. I mean, that side is a pinhole in the curtain of night kind of distance away. 

    I think, for me I will aim to make a single player game (an RPG) first and expand from there improving my knowledge leading all the way up to this goal. 

    After all I need to learn how to paint the fence and sand the floor before I get into the karate of it. 

    Originally posted by Quizzical

    Originally posted by Tsumoro What I really need to understand really, to get my 'foot' out the door is if I was to make this a website based game, (you played it from an in-web browser) what kinda coding language would I need to learn, what would be required in handling resources of allowing many individuals all interacting with each other like something such as pockie ninja or neopets.  I will be essentially be working from the ground up, and although, a pipe dream per se, I would consider it to be a challenging hobby which continues until I either achieve... or die. Whatever comes first haha. 

    Trying to make a browser-based game will make things harder on you.  For security reasons, there are a number of things that a browser-based program is not allowed to do, even though an ordinary standalone program would have no problem.  That's not to say that a browser-based game would be impossible; it's not, especially if you're going the 2D route.  (Modern 3D graphics, on the other hand, would be completely out of the question.)  But if you had the idea of making your game browser-based thinking that would be easier, then you shouldn't.

    Provided that you pick a language that has the needed capabilities (e.g., trying to make an MMORPG in a language with no Internet capabilities isn't going to end well), it's less about the language you pick than what you do with it.

    Oh lordy, I expect it to be an ungodly amount of work. But, I was more talking about the 3D aspect of things. if I am making 2D based games, then the 3D element of things won't be too much of a hinderance in moving forward. 

    Originally posted by SabbathSMC

    http://www.yoyogames.com/   this is one of the easiet game makers i have ever seen. Tons of tutorials to get you started.

    That is wonderful! Thank you very much. 

     

    I am now building up quite a bookmark of potential reading and experimentation to get the ball rolling. :)

  • birdycephonbirdycephon Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 1,314Member
    If you are thinking of using Fash to code an MMO, I can tell you right now it wont work. Flash is too slow and uses too much memory. For movies, its great, but not for complex calculations. Ive tried to do a simple top-down shoot-em-up game, and ive run into lag issues when I had too many objects flying around.
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