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Problem of RNG (Randomness) ruins the game

MustarastasMustarastas TurkuPosts: 78Member

So.. Why does everything in this game need to be based on randomness? I cant be bothered to play after hitting 82. I feel like that everything I do is too random. Why is this?

a) Most of all the crafting is BAD. Pay 1 exalted to get 1 random stat; well here you go take 26 evasion. Want some good base stats to your ring? Well spend few hours to get the Alterations and end up spending 2 exalted without getting a good base.

b) Loot is random. Who gets the 6l armor/weapon drop? Who gets the Mirror of Kalandra? I start feeling sick when I work hard and the reward is utter ****.

c) Maps. Dont even get me started with this. I have grinded 66 maps forever without properly getting any solid map base. Some people get tons of maps - some have to buy them from others.

 

In Short: Why has GGG copied so much from very old games when games in general have progressed far beyond these bad logics of Diablo1/2 and Guild Wars.

Comments

  • RynetRynet New Haven, CTPosts: 89Member
    Play a true FPS game.. No randomness...
  • MuppetierMuppetier SouthamptonPosts: 277Member

    Take away the randomness and the game loses its addiction.

     

    The best way to cure the RNG would be to introduce an AH. And the consequences of that have already been demonstrated.

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon

    RNG is why people play games like this. If you don't like it, find another genre.

  • PrysionerosPrysioneros wese, NJPosts: 2Member

    I've been playing mmorpgs( i know people don't consider path of exile one) starting with like NexusTK in 1999 and I have to say Path is Exile is the kind of game I've been waiting for...for years. Graphics don't mean everything. Alot of us always wanted a Diablo 2 looking game with more of a community ish style then battle.net had to offer. From the currency bartering system to the skill tree..this game is pretty darn good. I love it. I've never logged so many hours in a mmo as this in years. 

    I am lvl 82 Shadow Cold Crit Caster with 3,300 HP/ 3,000 ES Max 75 resist except chaos still -60 with 5,000x3 (i use lesser multi projectiles is where the x3 comes from) DPS tooltip on Freezing Pulse and can solo anything I choose. I hear people complaining this is an unsoloable game? Wth you talking about.

    And as far as MAPS goes. I have over 50+ maps in storage. Tons of 66's,67's,68's some 69's and few 70+'s. I usually find a few maps per Map so I just don't understand how people find no maps. Sometimes I find as much as 4-6 Maps in 1 single map....am I just crazy lucky? I don't see it.

    I didn't start playing the game until 2 days after open beta when I heard about it for first time from an interview with baseball player Hunter Pence said he plays it. I first  made a duelist because they looked like least played class and got to lvl 44 and had to reroll because I had no clue what i was doing with skill tree points.

    My advice is go to path of exile class forums of your choosing and check out some guides on how to build a character. I followed a Shadow guide from a gentlemen named Aimlessgun and now a month later I have built the character I very much enjoy playing.

     

  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,533Member Uncommon

    sounds like these type of games are not for you..

     

    RPGs and MMORPGS have always had some form of randomness in them...removing that part of the game would be a bad thing...

    RPGS and MMORPGs that remove this are just not fun anymore..
  • HeroEvermoreHeroEvermore salem, ORPosts: 672Member
    I agree with 1 thing.

    Map drop rate is a joke and if it doesn't get an increase this game will become much more casual for me.

    I get a map drop every 16 hours of killing. Doesn't matter where I farm. I literally get to do a map once every 3 days. In fact Until last night I had played over 50 hours and not got 1 map that week. it's really stupid.

    Hero Evermore
    Guild Master of Dragonspine since 1982.
    Playing Path of Exile and deeply in love with it.

  • DisdenaDisdena Troy, NYPosts: 1,093Member
    Originally posted by Scalpless

    RNG is why people play games like this. If you don't like it, find another genre.

    Pretty much this.

    There are games where you are guaranteed that a certain amount of time and effort will guarantee a certain amount of progression—no more, no less. This isn't one of them. So if you like those kinds of games, maybe go play one?

    image
  • OmaliOmali MMO Business Correspondent Orchard Park, NYPosts: 1,114Member Uncommon
    Hating the random number generator in a game like Path of Exile especially, or really in RPGs period, is probably a sign that the game isn't for you. You aren't going to come across any MMORPG that doesn't have that factor where you could spend two hundred hours and never get a rare drop, while the guy next to you walks in and saunters out three hours later with two of those same level 58934 Swords of Ball Busting. 

    Check out my monthly column on MMORPG.com.

    image

  • truthformtruthform Clifton, NJPosts: 1Member

    I've spent 500 hours in D3...randomness in loot disgusts me, lacking depth and wholly unrewarding...this is true for life in general come to think of it.

     

    OP is correct on all of his points and then I skimmed through a bunch of broken minded troll thoughtless replies then wrote this.

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    RNG is pretty much the staple of why people play ARPGs.. i don't like them anymore but honestly you might as well be asking for  shooters to stop having guns

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member Common
    Originally posted by Scalpless

    RNG is why people play games like this. If you don't like it, find another genre.

    /thread

     

    RNG is what makes the ARPG genre what it is.

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member Common
    Originally posted by truthform

    I've spent 500 hours in D3...randomness in loot disgusts me, lacking depth and wholly unrewarding...this is true for life in general come to think of it.

     

    OP is correct on all of his points and then I skimmed through a bunch of broken minded troll thoughtless replies then wrote this.....as an alt of the OP

     

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • DisdenaDisdena Troy, NYPosts: 1,093Member
    Originally posted by Omali
    Hating the random number generator in a game like Path of Exile especially, or really in RPGs period, is probably a sign that the game isn't for you. You aren't going to come across any MMORPG that doesn't have that factor where you could spend two hundred hours and never get a rare drop, while the guy next to you walks in and saunters out three hours later with two of those same level 58934 Swords of Ball Busting. 

    But there are games that don't have that factor. Repeatable content that gives you credit towards an eventual prize takes the RNG out of games. That way, players can run some quest/dungeon and know "7 more times til I have enough tokens for the Flamehell Axe of Uberheat". If they prefer that to "Flamehell Axe of Uberheat has a 1/30 drop rate and I'm 0 for 23 so hopefully I get it in the next 7 runs... *siiiiigh*", I'm fine with that. They're two different ways to enjoy progressing through a game. POE happens to use one method, OP enjoys the other.

    image
  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Disdena
    Originally posted by Omali
    Hating the random number generator in a game like Path of Exile especially, or really in RPGs period, is probably a sign that the game isn't for you. You aren't going to come across any MMORPG that doesn't have that factor where you could spend two hundred hours and never get a rare drop, while the guy next to you walks in and saunters out three hours later with two of those same level 58934 Swords of Ball Busting. 

    But there are games that don't have that factor. Repeatable content that gives you credit towards an eventual prize takes the RNG out of games. That way, players can run some quest/dungeon and know "7 more times til I have enough tokens for the Flamehell Axe of Uberheat". If they prefer that to "Flamehell Axe of Uberheat has a 1/30 drop rate and I'm 0 for 23 so hopefully I get it in the next 7 runs... *siiiiigh*", I'm fine with that. They're two different ways to enjoy progressing through a game. POE happens to use one method, OP enjoys the other.

    which arpgs have this though? all the ones I have played have been heavy on the RNG.. having that "chance" to get a cool drop has always been a staple of these games

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • DisdenaDisdena Troy, NYPosts: 1,093Member
    Originally posted by Aerowyn

    which arpgs have this though? all the ones I have played have been heavy on the RNG.. having that "chance" to get a cool drop has always been a staple of these games

    ARPGs are always like this. Omali was saying that all MMORPGs were like that too, to which I said no.

    image
  • Slappy1Slappy1 columbus, OHPosts: 458Member

    The randomness is one thing I really like about the game.Having item's with perfect stat's fall into your lap on a regular basis would be quite boring.I watched a guy on Twitch burn over 150 chaos orb's yesterday and still didn't have the stat's he wanted on a couple piece's.

    It's just part of the rng game.

    Some day I'm going to put a sword through your eye and out the back of your skull!

    Arya Stark

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member
    Originally posted by Slappy1
    It's just part of the rng game.

    The moral of our story: "A binomial probability foo and his orbs are soon parted?"

    In college I would watch Tom's-A-Twit rolling dice for hours, seeking the Perfect Set of Stats for his latest Assassin (life expectancy: typically 20 min).

    But it is half the fun of the random drop lottery. Something-for-nothing and the one armed bandit.

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,747Member Uncommon
    I am one of those sad pathetic people who never win a thing. Really horrible where luck is concerned . I have spent months in Everquest trying for a drop and losing each time to the fellow that walked in half an hour ago. So yes I basically hate RNG.

    image

  • xiptonxipton repentigny, QCPosts: 4Member

    ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ 

    | | | | | | | | | | | | | 

     

    Looks like me yeah!!! :D

    in every games i play i am the unluckiest player there is,still i continue to play LOL,but with PoE i must say that the algorythm is pretty pretty far from being generous,exeption of a few bastards who plays 2 mins and gets a good unique or map the rest of the player base might get fed up if really nothing pops-up in a while sadly ...

    PoE: Adavel LVL.48(C.A2) Xipton LVL.51(C.A3) <>D3 5x60(P1-15)<>T2 Xip=88 ng++

  • GoldenArrowGoldenArrow TurkuPosts: 1,187Member Uncommon

    This is exactly why games should introduce mechanics that eventually balance out your streak of bad luck.

    For example,

    Everytime a player runs an instance without getting a drop (rolling & winning) their "bonus luck" increases by X amount.
    For example's sake let's use 2%.

    Basically the odds would constantly get better as the player spends time with the unrewarding game. Eventually reaching 20% or 40% or 60% bonus luck. Until he/she finally get the drop and causes his/her "bonus luck" drops back to 0%.

    In PoE for example player could get 0.00001% "bonus luck" for any monster they kill, getting higher "bonus luck" from elites and such. What this "bonus luck" would do is to increase their chance of getting a map. Once the player gets a map the "bonus luck" would reset to 0%.

    To sum it up:

    A) You would still have the possiblity of getting "OWMYGOSH" luck streaks like getting 3 maps in a row.

    B) You would get rewarded for spending a lot of time in the game, even if you are having shitty luck

    C) The drop you'd get wouldn't probably be exactly what you wanted but you'd actually get something with quality.

     

    Bottom line is that RNG shouldn't only punish the player for bad luck, RNG should reward and encourage the player.

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member

    Mmm, so true believers in gambler's fallacy. :rub palms together, eyes greedily twinkling:

    Hey boys, do you play Poker?

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • sketocafesketocafe StoupaPosts: 805Member Uncommon

    Good luck is meaningless without bad luck to balance it out. The fun in these games was always in finding upgrades or  the super-awesome item for you to use, not in grinding towards it slowly and steadily. The second you add something like an auction house or loot tables to bosses, you eliminate the joy of finding and replace it with the drudgery of farming.

    Sort your karma out, also relax.

  • potacopotaco Hoffman Estates, ILPosts: 82Member

    My two biggest issues with the game are:

     

    1) Desync (not going to get into it, but it's more frustrating than any RNG could ever be)

    2) How being unlucky in one regard penalizes you in so many ways.

     

    To expand on the second, there are a few mechanics/systems that are important to know: currency drop rates decrease as you overlevel an area, as does experience gain.

     

    So essentially, if you are unlucky with loot, you end up further and further behind. You can very easily get stuck grinding an area for gear (or currency to buy gear), likely overleveling the area and receiving a decreasing amount of "reward" for your effort. What currency you do get will likely be spent on gear upgrades. On the other hand, getting lucky with loot means that you are progressing through the game faster, you receive more XP since you are able to keep your character level and zone level very close, you are receiving the normal amount of currency, and you don't need to spend that currency because you were already lucky before (meaning you're able to stockpile it for the future instead of spending it immediately to try to get back on track).

     

    I don't have a good solution (which is a reason I'm not a game designer), but it can be awfully demoralizing, especially for those who are really unlucky and consistently end up drawing the short straw. Telling someone that they should keep playing and that it all eventually evens out is just as much a fallacy as any other argument here. RNG is random and it's possible (however unlikely) for someone to literally be "permanently" unlucky when it comes to this game.

     

    The game is great overall and I will keep playing it (though less so until desync issues are fixed), but GGG will need to evaluate some of their systems to determine what type of player retention they are really looking for.

  • TheHavokTheHavok San Jose, CAPosts: 2,399Member Uncommon
    Damn numbers they foil me again!
  • ProsonProson MandalPosts: 544Member

    RNG is a BIG part of the game, if you could max out your gear in a week of playing then there wouldnt be any reason to play at all.. This thread is stupid as hell. 

    Also, you know that you can use your exalteds and other orbs to buy stuff from other players right? no RNG involved then. thats mostly what people do because everyone knows that crafting is risky as hell.. and you only use exalteds if you have an INSANE item with like 4-5 perfect stats. Its not to hard to figure out, basic game knowledge you know.

     

    And about the map thing, its VERY easy to get a good base of maps, but i assume your rolling shitty maps all the time, so ofc your not gonna get anything then.. I played through 3 wipes in Path of Exile now, and everytime once i get to maps i build a good base in no time. Sure there is some RNG involved in getting a big base of high lvl maps, but sustaining lvl 68+ maps is easy as hell if you roll some decent maps. Just go for high quantity with maze/larger area, pack size and magic monsters then you will get on average 2 maps per map easily.

    Currently Playing Path of Exile

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