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Isn't this guy the same guy that hyped up Warhammer Online?

MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,257Member Uncommon

Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

 

You all should be careful. This should be a big Red Flag. But I am just pointing this out, so that maybe people who are interested in this game would look at it more realistically and no get exploited once again by a MMO developer/publisher....

:-/ 

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Comments

  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member

    should probably give him a chance. maybe he's learned lessons and perhaps taking people's money to directly fund the game helps. also being free of EA's heavy hand has to cout for something.

    although i DO recall Mythic's games and practices before DAOC shipped when they would release games on AOL and not support them and close them down abruptly.

  • Lore84Lore84 NorthamptonPosts: 69Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

    To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

     

    You all should be careful. This should be a big Red Flag. But I am just pointing this out, so that maybe people who are interested in this game would look at it more realistically and no get exploited once again by a MMO developer/publisher....

    :-/ 

    I think he has already discussed this several times to be honest : Most of the target audience for this game are old-school DAOC and also WAR players. We all know who he is. Though, I admit theres likely going to be a few interested in the game who do not.

    Believe it or not, people are capable of learning and moving on and it sounds like this game is going in the right direction.

    Ex-DAOC, Excalibur

  • meddyckmeddyck Athens, GAPosts: 1,140Member Uncommon
    I think the particular person you have in mind who hyped WAR all over the place was Paul Barnett (sp). But yes Mark Jacobs was also involved in the production of that game. Clearly there's room for a lot of skepticism and reservations until we get our hands on the game itself. OTOH you won't ever get the chance to try the game yourself unless some of us take a leap of faith and back the game's kickstarter. If your past experience with Mark leaves too bitter a taste in your mouth, feel free to sit out the kickstarter, watch the game's development, and decide whether to buy it or not when it starts having public beta events.

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLPosts: 4,523Member Uncommon

    I think that was Paul Barnett...

     

    ...greatest hype job ever.  Will never believe a word he says again, but he did a GREAT job whipping up excitement for WAR.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • BetakodoBetakodo Poor land, FLPosts: 338Member
    Good catch. Another red flag I'm seeing is no in game screen shots and no gameplay. Yet they're talking about RvR this and that. Kind of like Guild Wars 2 barely showed anything and they were talking about how our game does this while others do this. All this was 1-2 years before release.
  • SatariousSatarious Kansas City, MOPosts: 1,075Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

    To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

     

    You all should be careful. This should be a big Red Flag. But I am just pointing this out, so that maybe people who are interested in this game would look at it more realistically and no get exploited once again by a MMO developer/publisher....

    :-/ 

    He's also the legend behind Dark Age of Camelot, which many consider the best pvp mmo.  You can't completely condemn  a man for mistakes he's made, especially when he's upfront and honest about it all and seeking to redeem himself.  Nobody is perfect.  The greats at anything have made mistakes.

  • ragz45ragz45 rochester hills, MIPosts: 688Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188

    I think that was Paul Barnett...

     

    ...greatest hype job ever.  Will never believe a word he says again, but he did a GREAT job whipping up excitement for WAR.

    Was just about to say Mark wasn't a huge hype bringer with WAR.  That was more Paul Barnett, who was the mouthpiece for EA & Games Workshop.  Mark generally just repeated things that his team had told him would be in the game or would work.  He really ended up getting stabbed in the back by a lot of his development team because of this, when things went south.

    Thus EA hung him out to dry, used him as a patsy, made him the sacraficial goat.... you get the idea.

  • Storm_FirebladeStorm_Fireblade FlensburgPosts: 156Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

    To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

    The difference is, that this time Mark isn´t creating any hype. In fact he is communicating in an honest way, stating facts that are contra-productive if you wanted to hype the game and get as many people as possible into the kickstart.

    Camelot Unchained Fanpage
    https://simply-gaming.com/camelot/

  • ragz45ragz45 rochester hills, MIPosts: 688Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Betakodo
    Good catch. Another red flag I'm seeing is no in game screen shots and no gameplay. Yet they're talking about RvR this and that. Kind of like Guild Wars 2 barely showed anything and they were talking about how our game does this while others do this. All this was 1-2 years before release.

    Screen shots of what?  If you knew what you were talking about, you would know everything he is talking about atm is storyboarding and theory.  There isn't even an engine let alone code written for one to show off at this point.  He is talking about his ideas behind his vision, simply that.

  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member
    Originally posted by Betakodo
    Good catch. Another red flag I'm seeing is no in game screen shots and no gameplay. Yet they're talking about RvR this and that. Kind of like Guild Wars 2 barely showed anything and they were talking about how our game does this while others do this. All this was 1-2 years before release.

    they showed raw gameplay of the game in 2010. also it was playable at game conventions in 2010, i first played it at PAX. as for CU, it's 3 years out.

  • General_Dru-ZodGeneral_Dru-Zod Unknown, CAPosts: 136Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

    To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

     

    You all should be careful. This should be a big Red Flag. But I am just pointing this out, so that maybe people who are interested in this game would look at it more realistically and no get exploited once again by a MMO developer/publisher....

    :-/ 

    This is what happens when you disappear for weeks then come back to ask questions already answered in your absence

    image

  • Laughing-manLaughing-man Dublin, OHPosts: 3,415Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    Hi, not trying to bash the game, but isn't this guy that is speaking for the game to the community, the same exact person that did the massive hyping of Warhammrr Online?

    To me, that indicates that he is somebody that knows how to use and exploit hype, to mislead the masses, and paint them a false image of a product based on hype, and exploit many people.

     

    You all should be careful. This should be a big Red Flag. But I am just pointing this out, so that maybe people who are interested in this game would look at it more realistically and no get exploited once again by a MMO developer/publisher....

    :-/ 

    Seems like you are trying to 'bash' the game, many people have already discussed these topics adnauseum, and you sir should know better about who this man is since you've been around here for more than a week.

    I'm seriously wondering if you are just trying to bait people into an arguement over this considering again, how very slanted your statements are and how the topic has already been discussed.

     

    Edit:  I notice OP hasn't replied in 30 minutes since posting, makes me wonder even more about his intent.

  • ArglebargleArglebargle Austin, TXPosts: 1,418Member Uncommon

    Be wary of these associations of designer and game.   Their actual role may be vastly different from what you think it is.   Stan Lee may be an 'Executive Producer' on The Avengers, but he probably had precious little to do with the movie.   Sid Meiers name gets attached to products, but he hasn't done deep work on any of those games in a long time.   Etc.

     

    Name-on-the-box could mean most anything.

     

    From what I gather, this guy was not a nuts and bolts game designer anyway.

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • RyowulfRyowulf Greensburg, PAPosts: 668Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lore84

    I think he has already discussed this several times to be honest : Most of the target audience for this game are old-school DAOC and also WAR players. We all know who he is. Though, I admit theres likely going to be a few interested in the game who do not.

    Believe it or not, people are capable of learning and moving on and it sounds like this game is going in the right direction.

    It might not be the case this time, but it seems to me most people just keep repeating the same mistakes.

    or there is also the idea of a one hit wonder.  Lost was great the first few seasons, then it went to seed. The first 3 Star Wars were the top of the top, but would you want George Lucas making another Star Wars?

  • SatariousSatarious Kansas City, MOPosts: 1,075Member
    Originally posted by Ryowulf
    Originally posted by Lore84

    I think he has already discussed this several times to be honest : Most of the target audience for this game are old-school DAOC and also WAR players. We all know who he is. Though, I admit theres likely going to be a few interested in the game who do not.

    Believe it or not, people are capable of learning and moving on and it sounds like this game is going in the right direction.

    It might not be the case this time, but it seems to me most people just keep repeating the same mistakes.

    or there is also the idea of a one hit wonder.  Lost was great the first few seasons, then it went to seed. The first 3 Star Wars were the top of the top, but would you want George Lucas making another Star Wars?

    I think the difference here, though, is that Mark will be completely unconstrained in how he designs this (hence the "unchained" in the title).  This is his first chance to prove that he can get it right after a big mistake (WAR, in my opinion).  Lucas, on the other hand, proved that he could give a crap about what the fans thought and just kept dishing out the same crap over and over again.  He's a stuborn old bastard.

  • BetakodoBetakodo Poor land, FLPosts: 338Member
    Originally posted by ragz45
    Originally posted by Betakodo
    Good catch. Another red flag I'm seeing is no in game screen shots and no gameplay. Yet they're talking about RvR this and that. Kind of like Guild Wars 2 barely showed anything and they were talking about how our game does this while others do this. All this was 1-2 years before release.

    Screen shots of what?  If you knew what you were talking about, you would know everything he is talking about atm is storyboarding and theory.  There isn't even an engine let alone code written for one to show off at this point.  He is talking about his ideas behind his vision, simply that.

    Boy, flashback to Warhammer online and other overhyped games that flopped. My point was they can hype up a game like it's the next biggest thing and talk about how it'll be so awesome, then fool people into buying an unfinished game like Age of Conan on release. Go around the block a few more times and it'll be more apparent that this hype up of junk happens a lot. Let me talk about my idea and vision of a game where it feels like you're in a game and you swing and block and you fly to the moon and back. Oh yeah, it's the best game ever. Not like these games that are out right now.

  • TimothyTierlessTimothyTierless Columnist M, ORPosts: 2,163Member Uncommon

    How many game heads have come here to get direct feedback from the most bitter MMO place on the net? That says a lot about him and his mindset right their.

    If you also look at his project goals, he isn't trying to generate a million subs, he wants a small niche old school MMO.

    Lastly, if you listen to his talk, or read his posts, I can't tell you how many times he has said he is trying NOT to hype it. Naturally this being the net, and most of us desperate for any remotely old school MMO we all went crazy at the notion, despite his efforts ;)

  • RyowulfRyowulf Greensburg, PAPosts: 668Member Uncommon

    In defense of Mr. Jacobs. I don't feel like Unchained has been hyped.  He's being open and honest by saying "This is what I want to make. If it appeals to you, help me."

     

  • audizmannaudizmann AalborgPosts: 24Member

    He was behind a game I played for less than a month, and he was behind a game I have played for more than ten years (and counting). In my book, you can't get any more qualified than that. Unless you can point me to a person who is behind *two* games that I would enjoy playing for 10+ years each?... No? :-)

  • RoxtarrRoxtarr Freeland, MI, MIPosts: 1,122Member

    Good grief, talk about overstating how Warhammer Online went. 

    Jacobs was the man behind the company, sure.  He's the same guy behind DAOC which is still beloved to this day.  In Jacob's defense, he's avoiding the big corporate monster that arguably swallowed WAR whole.

    If in 1982 we played with the current mentality, we would have burned down all the pac man games since the red ghost was clearly OP. Instead we just got better at the game.
    image

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member

    WAR certainly didn't live up to the hype or what was expected from it, but it was still probably the best fantasy MMO PvP game released in the last 8 years.

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  • PeculiarJohnPeculiarJohn Lakewood, COPosts: 8Member

    Not sure if OP is trolling or genuinely concerned.  But...

     

    1) Every new game needs to be promoted.  Otherwise, there would be like 2 subscribers at launch.  For god's sake, mmorpg.com has a "hype meter."

     

    2) Transparency is a HUGE priority in all of this.  The starry-eyed hype is mostly being generated by how incredibly hopeful we all are to see this game launch without a hitch.  We're all going to be more invested in this at launch (assuming that we are the ones who will back the kickstarter effort) than we would be with other games.  Fault the supporters more than City State for any undue hype.

     

  • craftseekercraftseeker kynetonPosts: 845Member Uncommon

    Having been motivated into doing some looking around about this project I wonder how City State Entertainment LLC went from being:

    "a brand-focused studio creating intellectual property for the mobile, tablet and social networking spaces."

    press release published on Business wire 30 Sept 2011.

    and a partner of GigaMedia who said on the 22 Nov 2011:

    “We are proud to be working with him and thrilled to have him and his newly formed team develop new games and brands with us. By expanding our product offerings to games for Internet-enabled mobile devices, we are positioning ourselves to benefit from the ongoing shift from PCs to mobile computing and the continued strong popularity and growth of social gaming."

    To working on his own and about to start a Kickstarter funding project for a (presumably) PC based MMO focussed on RvR PvP?

    Also who was the Singapore based partner (hence the city state name) and why was that partnership disolved? (GigaMedia is based in Taipei)

    Finally when did he and his team start working on the concept of Camelot Unleashed? 
     
    I have seen the video so at least some work has been done in fleshing out the concept and we have a month or so on this forum.  But it probably did not start before this time last year and may be much more recent than that.
  • GaoxinGaoxin BluhPosts: 196Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Satarious

    He's also the legend behind Dark Age of Camelot, which many consider the best pvp mmo.

    And by many you mean the DAOC community?^^

  • JetrpgJetrpg Whitehouse, OHPosts: 2,376Member
    Originally posted by Xobdnas

    ...

    If you also look at his project goals, he isn't trying to generate a million subs, he wants a small niche old school MMO. ...

    Noi he is not, it has no pve, its a new age mmo where all advancement is rvr or for rvr, w/e.

    Lastly, if you listen to his talk, or read his posts, I can't tell you how many times he has said he is trying NOT to hype it. Naturally this being the net, and most of us desperate for any remotely old school MMO we all went crazy at the notion, despite his efforts ;)

    I would agree he seems to be candid with us.

     

    "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine

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