It's kinda weird how people here still don't realize what they are doing when trying to offer friendly advice. I'll try to make it a little clearer how some of us see it:
OP: Man, this dude just scammed me and Anet told me they can't do anything about it.
Post1: Aww that sucks bro, that scammer was a tool, but bro you should know better!
Post2: I hate scammers but duuuuude! You're so freakin naive, you should have used TP!
Post3: STBY, but you know how the saying goes: A fool and his money...
Post4: Anet cannot do anything for you, move on and learn from it.
Post5: You got scammed?! Well you shouldn't trade with people you don't know!
Post6: Sucks you got scammed, but duuuude, DUUUUDE! Why you hatin on Anet!
Post7: Hey man Anet cannot be babysitting you and holding your hand. Don't be so trusting.
Post8: How long you've been playing mmos? No wonder you got scammed!
Post9: Hey spam his name in genchat. You may look like a fool, but hey at least the scammer can't scam again.
Post10: Why are you whining to us? It ani't like we can do anything about it.
And how some of us would like to see it:
Post1: Sorry for your lost man. What was this dude's name so I can blacklist him.
Post2: How can Anet think this is ok? I mean do they not want civility in this game?
Post3: Hey man post his name on the forums since Anet is not willing to.
Post4: Why can't people like this scammer understand this reflects bad on the whole community.
Post5: Bro you gotta be careful when playing a non-sub mmo. It attracts all kinds of scum.
Post6: Sorry to hear that man. Next time you're on look me up and I'll offer you a good deal to help you out.
Post7: We all understand that scammer will scam, but for Anet to not even bother taking your screenshots?
Post8: Hey I can't replace all your gold (of course) but I can donate a few coin your way. Hit me up.
Post9: Post his info here man. I want to make sure I don't associate with this idiot.
Post10: Hey things like this happen to all of us sometime or another, you just have to carry on.
I know I'm in my sparkly rainbow pony mode with that last bit. But in both examples advice is offered. Just in the first example posters have a very condensating focus on the victim. In the second example, the focus is placed more on the scammer and Anet's action of not taking any action. I mean it really just goes to show you the unconscious negative mentality that plays out in these forums and mmos nowadays.
Nicely summarised, shame more posters here won't read it.
"It's a sandbox, if you are not willing to create a castle then all you have is sand" - jtcgs
You guys make me sick. Talk about blame the victim. So if you all walk down an alley one night after you got drunk at a bar, and get mugged, I guess the cops should just say, " it's your own fault for walking through a dark alley at night."
People and developers should always be striving to do the right thing. The right thing for the developers to do is to suspend that person and give this guy his gold back. GW2, nor does any other game, need people like that in their games.
At least one person as a bit of humanity in here. So rare I guess.
Originally posted by Ramonski7
It's kinda weird how people here still don't realize what they are doing when trying to offer friendly advice. I'll try to make it a little clearer how some of us see it:
OP: Man, this dude just scammed me and Anet told me they can't do anything about it.
Post1: Aww that sucks bro, that scammer was a tool, but bro you should know better!
Post2: I hate scammers but duuuuude! You're so freakin naive, you should have used TP!
Post3: STBY, but you know how the saying goes: A fool and his money...
Post4: Anet cannot do anything for you, move on and learn from it.
Post5: You got scammed?! Well you shouldn't trade with people you don't know!
Post6: Sucks you got scammed, but duuuude, DUUUUDE! Why you hatin on Anet!
Post7: Hey man Anet cannot be babysitting you and holding your hand. Don't be so trusting.
Post8: How long you've been playing mmos? No wonder you got scammed!
Post9: Hey spam his name in genchat. You may look like a fool, but hey at least the scammer can't scam again.
Post10: Why are you whining to us? It ani't like we can do anything about it.
And how some of us would like to see it:
Post1: Sorry for your lost man. What was this dude's name so I can blacklist him.
Post2: How can Anet think this is ok? I mean do they not want civility in this game?
Post3: Hey man post his name on the forums since Anet is not willing to.
Post4: Why can't people like this scammer understand this reflects bad on the whole community.
Post5: Bro you gotta be careful when playing a non-sub mmo. It attracts all kinds of scum.
Post6: Sorry to hear that man. Next time you're on look me up and I'll offer you a good deal to help you out.
Post7: We all understand that scammer will scam, but for Anet to not even bother taking your screenshots?
Post8: Hey I can't replace all your gold (of course) but I can donate a few coin your way. Hit me up.
Post9: Post his info here man. I want to make sure I don't associate with this idiot.
Post10: Hey things like this happen to all of us sometime or another, you just have to carry on.
I know I'm in my sparkly rainbow pony mode with that last bit. But in both examples advice is offered. Just in the first example posters have a very condensating focus on the victim. In the second example, the focus is placed more on the scammer and Anet's action of not taking any action. I mean it really just goes to show you the unconscious negative mentality that plays out in these forums and mmos nowadays.
Nice post. I wonder why people here act the way they do. I wonder if they're also like that in real life?
Are people really still arguing the point that the OP was in the wrong?
I'm sorry he was not the terms state that this should not happen and that the other player should be punished, now if he was indeed punished that would be something else, but "Such acts are matters over which we have no control of and cannot take corrective measures." would lead me to believe they just did nothing, they just steped aside allowed it and don't care, which was the OP's point I assume, which was true. You can bend the truth try to change the facts but ArenaNet did not keep their end of the terms.
I think the OP did get scammed and it was 60/40 guilt, he should have been more weary of people on the internet.
That does not change the fact that ArenaNet did allow scamming even though they said they did not.
A person shouldn't get flung from the vehicle in an accident, but if they decide to not wear their seatbelt and it happens, is it the car manufacturers fault?
The problem isn't that the OP decided not to wear the seatbelt the problem is there was no seatbelt. See? That's what my argument is. How can this company call themselves gamer developers and leave out something as essential as a COD system in the mail? It's not the only thing left out of the game either. Like the fact that you have to log off the game to go to the website to post a support ticket? Or how the RNG loot system has failed miserably because no one's ever hired a mathematician that can actually read the character's class before distributing loot, or is so completely random people have to run 1000 runs in a dungeon to receive their armor piece (which is why armor currency was invented in the first place).Or how about the knowledge that every mmo that has ever tried to implement a DR system to stop bots has failed miserably, some to the point where they lost so many players they had to close shop? That's part of my argument how could they not know these things if they were gamers? And how is it this players fault if they A: never played mmo's before and didn't know this was a problem B: didn't have the proper tools to protect themselves in this case COD mails.
Or here's an idea, player shops. Every game that has had those has had the best economy any game has ever had. Who needs the op manipulated AH prices, I'll sell mine for less in the major cities and get my gold right now. see how that works? the proper tools are missing and people can argue till they are blue but it's not the OP's fault.
Im surprised no one has posted this yet but, how do we really know you got scammed? It's easy to get a friend to make a char named Deadmaumau and send you that ingame mail posting all the stuff he was selling, and then to claim that you sent him 50g for the ecto's that you never received. Hell, you could do it yourself if you had 2 accounts.
Truly i just do not see why so many people come to mmorpg.com to post stupid crap like this all the time. 90% of the time, the games they're posting crap about has booming forums of their own. Why then do you come to a general mmorpg site like this to post this stuff? And what exactly do you wish to accomplish by doing so? You didnt even tell us the name of the person who 'scammed' you until the 10th page of this thread. So really what is it that you wish to accomplish by posting all this? I truly want to know. Do you want advice? Pity? Do you think this will open GW2's GM's eyes even though you're not posting on the official GW2 forums? What?
We've seen the results of people trying to create a "better world"... It almost always ends up the same way. One of the reasons (of many...) for that, is they tend to take an ends justifies the means used to achieve their ends approach. Look at US foreign policy as an example of how that turns out...
Instead of focusing on the world, how about focus on the individual people? The player in question made a bad judgement call. They got scammed as a result. I've never excused the action of the scammer. They committed fraud. Hopefully, unlike some ideologues, the player in question will learn from their experience.
Trust, like respect is earned. Strangers have done nothing to earn that, thus they should be granted minimal trust. Unlike the belief of some, strangers aren't just friends we've not met yet... ^^
*Reads post and looks out window.... Hmm. No wonder the world is the way it is. Noted*
And they don't even realize it.
Then againg I luckily knew about the MMORPG forums reputation before hand and amazingly got pleasantly surprised with some of the posts.
Slowly slowly maybe things will get better with the gaming comunity.
Maybe another 15 or 20 years.
We didn't create this world, but we're smart enough to recoginize what it is and understand we are responsible for minimizing the risks we take. (or be willing to accept the consequences for our choices, especially the more risky ones)
Should the world be better? Yes? Should the scammer the OP ran into to be punished? Yes. Does the OP share part of the responsibilty for the entire situation? Yes. Is Anet to blame for creating this situation in the first place with no direct player trading? Yes.
So what exactly are we disagreeing over?
Pretty much the usual... ^^ Some expect their (and other peoples) actions to have no consequence. Some of us expect people to be responsible for their own actions. But thats totally un PC, in this day and age. People shouldn't be held responsible for their own bad judgement, in some peoples minds.
Of course, if you take the position of expecting people to take responsibility for their own actions (and the consequences that result) you are "blaming the victim"... Even though the victim wouldn't have been a victim if they had used better judgement.
Scam artists and other such are not good people. But such types will alwsys be with us (just like Goonies... ^^) . That being the case, wise people take basic precautions. Unwise people fall prey to them, and then expect either the Dev's or the government to "do something!"... The cycle never ends.
I already got punished, no compassion my punishment
1. it damaged my holidays (my actions right?) 2. i wont get refund.
Now the scammer must be punished too.. but im smelling he wont even get a minimal 3 days ban, he still in game playing.
What i would had wished to happen:
My account rollback (yes we do have one time rollback card)
The player banned and punished so he learn you cannot rob or behave bad in this game.
(Now i know why he wasnt even afraid when im telling him ill report him)
To the people that support me, thank you very much sincerely. To the people who support the scammer, shame on you and i hope this dont happen to you.
"Smelling"?... Ah, you are guessing. None of us will likely ever know what Anet did (or didn't do) about the scammer.
But YOU should have used better judgement. Because of your bad judgement, you are out 50 gold. Think of it as a tax on bad judgement... ^^ But seriously, I hope you learned not to do this again. If so, it was a cheap lesson. Life seldom lets people off that easy out in the real world.
Yes, I hope that Anet did something about the scammer. But at this point, what you do is up to you. As the old saying goes "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me".
Originally posted by lathaan naive people make me sick. i mean it. the world isnt a bad place because of bad people, but because of naive people that fall for bad people. its far easier to handle bad people than naive people.
LOL???? Do you mean you prefer to deal with criminals as it easy for you (I avoid to imagine the reason for it) rather then with honest people you call here naive? BRAVO! I guess it's explain a lot why we should not trust each other.
Still nothing explains why ANET not repair their miss (as not adding trade options and/or "pay to receive" option at mail box, made them authors of dramas OP was victim of).
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises. Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2
The OP and the scammer could have done just what you described. The OP could have place an order for x number of ectos on the BLTC for a set amount. The scammer could have then gone to the BLTC and sold ectos for that price. Two people wanted to skirt the system and one got burned. News at 11.
Like seriously dont you know what happens if you post things like this in the official forums? simple = ban
For less than this people get ban in those forums, those forums i dont go there, theres no freedom of speech.
Check my screenshot before you try to damage others intregrity...
Btw that summary with the numbers is pretty funny lols. The guy is from Maguuma server im from Sanctum of Rall, theres many overflows i been trying to see if i see him shouting again, ill say something.
* Today is sunday will see the answer of the GM tomorrow. BTWE im not saying anet sucks, im just stating what they said about my case, the desition they made, i still have hopes they fix this situation, ill post here the result.
I bought 240 ectos for 50g, on the tp was almost 70g i didnt had that ammount if not i would had bought it from the TP. Took me 3 months to get that 50g, i dont gamble the TP buying low selling high like some thieves.
OP I feel sorry for you, my advise never send anything by mail unless you are dealing with guildmates and only after a while of getting to know them. I feel sorry and I apologize for all the kerks, jack asses and imbecils who posted here to berate you, sadly this is what our society and our world is becoming more and more.
You are living in a world where is hard to trust in people and when you mention anything you get inmediately attacked. This topic is the best proof.
I suggest to learn from this bad experience and to not expect simpathy from the majority of players out there.
OP I feel sorry for you, my advise never send anything by mail unless you are dealing with guildmates and only after a while of getting to know them. I feel sorry and I apologize for all the kerks, jack asses and imbecils who posted here to berate you, sadly this is what our society and our world is becoming more and more.
You are living in a world where is hard to trust in people and when you mention anything you get inmediately attacked. This topic is the best proof.
I suggest to learn from this bad experience and to not expect simpathy from the majority of players out there.
Well, if he came here and posted how his dog just got ran over, I'd sympathize, that would be horrible.
But the dude sent 50g to a stranger, and expected to get a mail back.. I mean, come oon!
It's not right, and it's not fun to be the victim, but it's close to -asking for it.
You guys make me sick. Talk about blame the victim. So if you all walk down an alley one night after you got drunk at a bar, and get mugged, I guess the cops should just say, " it's your own fault for walking through a dark alley at night."
People and developers should always be striving to do the right thing. The right thing for the developers to do is to suspend that person and give this guy his gold back. GW2, nor does any other game, need people like that in their games.
You are missing the point. There are always scams - in GW1 it was pretty easy to scam players on trades, hence why they went to the Black Lion traders - yoou sell there and then you get the money - no muss no fuss.
Yah right, do the right thing. People are anonymous in the game and it is easy to use that to an advantage.
We've seen the results of people trying to create a "better world"... It almost always ends up the same way. One of the reasons (of many...) for that, is they tend to take an ends justifies the means used to achieve their ends approach. Look at US foreign policy as an example of how that turns out...
Instead of focusing on the world, how about focus on the individual people? The player in question made a bad judgement call. They got scammed as a result. I've never excused the action of the scammer. They committed fraud. Hopefully, unlike some ideologues, the player in question will learn from their experience.
Trust, like respect is earned. Strangers have done nothing to earn that, thus they should be granted minimal trust. Unlike the belief of some, strangers aren't just friends we've not met yet... ^^
*Reads post and looks out window.... Hmm. No wonder the world is the way it is. Noted*
"Liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them." -Lenny Bruce
Comments
Nicely summarised, shame more posters here won't read it.
"It's a sandbox, if you are not willing to create a castle then all you have is sand" - jtcgs
At least one person as a bit of humanity in here. So rare I guess.
Nice post. I wonder why people here act the way they do. I wonder if they're also like that in real life?
The problem isn't that the OP decided not to wear the seatbelt the problem is there was no seatbelt. See? That's what my argument is. How can this company call themselves gamer developers and leave out something as essential as a COD system in the mail? It's not the only thing left out of the game either. Like the fact that you have to log off the game to go to the website to post a support ticket? Or how the RNG loot system has failed miserably because no one's ever hired a mathematician that can actually read the character's class before distributing loot, or is so completely random people have to run 1000 runs in a dungeon to receive their armor piece (which is why armor currency was invented in the first place).Or how about the knowledge that every mmo that has ever tried to implement a DR system to stop bots has failed miserably, some to the point where they lost so many players they had to close shop? That's part of my argument how could they not know these things if they were gamers? And how is it this players fault if they A: never played mmo's before and didn't know this was a problem B: didn't have the proper tools to protect themselves in this case COD mails.
Or here's an idea, player shops. Every game that has had those has had the best economy any game has ever had. Who needs the op manipulated AH prices, I'll sell mine for less in the major cities and get my gold right now. see how that works? the proper tools are missing and people can argue till they are blue but it's not the OP's fault.
Im surprised no one has posted this yet but, how do we really know you got scammed? It's easy to get a friend to make a char named Deadmaumau and send you that ingame mail posting all the stuff he was selling, and then to claim that you sent him 50g for the ecto's that you never received. Hell, you could do it yourself if you had 2 accounts.
Truly i just do not see why so many people come to mmorpg.com to post stupid crap like this all the time. 90% of the time, the games they're posting crap about has booming forums of their own. Why then do you come to a general mmorpg site like this to post this stuff? And what exactly do you wish to accomplish by doing so? You didnt even tell us the name of the person who 'scammed' you until the 10th page of this thread. So really what is it that you wish to accomplish by posting all this? I truly want to know. Do you want advice? Pity? Do you think this will open GW2's GM's eyes even though you're not posting on the official GW2 forums? What?
Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!
Pretty much the usual... ^^ Some expect their (and other peoples) actions to have no consequence. Some of us expect people to be responsible for their own actions. But thats totally un PC, in this day and age. People shouldn't be held responsible for their own bad judgement, in some peoples minds.
Of course, if you take the position of expecting people to take responsibility for their own actions (and the consequences that result) you are "blaming the victim"... Even though the victim wouldn't have been a victim if they had used better judgement.
Scam artists and other such are not good people. But such types will alwsys be with us (just like Goonies... ^^) . That being the case, wise people take basic precautions. Unwise people fall prey to them, and then expect either the Dev's or the government to "do something!"... The cycle never ends.
"Smelling"?... Ah, you are guessing. None of us will likely ever know what Anet did (or didn't do) about the scammer.
But YOU should have used better judgement. Because of your bad judgement, you are out 50 gold. Think of it as a tax on bad judgement... ^^ But seriously, I hope you learned not to do this again. If so, it was a cheap lesson. Life seldom lets people off that easy out in the real world.
Yes, I hope that Anet did something about the scammer. But at this point, what you do is up to you. As the old saying goes "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me".
LOL????
Do you mean you prefer to deal with criminals as it easy for you (I avoid to imagine the reason for it) rather then with honest people you call here naive?
BRAVO!
I guess it's explain a lot why we should not trust each other.
Still nothing explains why ANET not repair their miss (as not adding trade options and/or "pay to receive" option at mail box, made them authors of dramas OP was victim of).
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2
/the end
Like seriously dont you know what happens if you post things like this in the official forums? simple = ban
For less than this people get ban in those forums, those forums i dont go there, theres no freedom of speech.
Check my screenshot before you try to damage others intregrity...
Btw that summary with the numbers is pretty funny lols. The guy is from Maguuma server im from Sanctum of Rall, theres many overflows i been trying to see if i see him shouting again, ill say something.
* Today is sunday will see the answer of the GM tomorrow. BTWE im not saying anet sucks, im just stating what they said about my case, the desition they made, i still have hopes they fix this situation, ill post here the result.
I bought 240 ectos for 50g, on the tp was almost 70g i didnt had that ammount if not i would had bought it from the TP. Took me 3 months to get that 50g, i dont gamble the TP buying low selling high like some thieves.
<a href="http://s526.photobucket.com/albums/cc344/zori4/Guild Wars 2 Beta/?action=view&current=zoyita.png" target="_blank"><img src="http://i526.photobucket.com/albums/cc344/zori4/Guild Wars 2 Beta/zoyita.png" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
OP I feel sorry for you, my advise never send anything by mail unless you are dealing with guildmates and only after a while of getting to know them. I feel sorry and I apologize for all the kerks, jack asses and imbecils who posted here to berate you, sadly this is what our society and our world is becoming more and more.
You are living in a world where is hard to trust in people and when you mention anything you get inmediately attacked. This topic is the best proof.
I suggest to learn from this bad experience and to not expect simpathy from the majority of players out there.
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
Well, if he came here and posted how his dog just got ran over, I'd sympathize, that would be horrible.
But the dude sent 50g to a stranger, and expected to get a mail back.. I mean, come oon!
It's not right, and it's not fun to be the victim, but it's close to -asking for it.
Edit: Actually, not close, it is asking for it.
You are missing the point. There are always scams - in GW1 it was pretty easy to scam players on trades, hence why they went to the Black Lion traders - yoou sell there and then you get the money - no muss no fuss.
Yah right, do the right thing. People are anonymous in the game and it is easy to use that to an advantage.
"Liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them." -Lenny Bruce
Oh it won't, I can assure you of that.
Apparently I have a lot more common sense.