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EVE Online F2P

banzai014banzai014 WellingtonPosts: 27Member

Since you can buy game time with ingame currency, I've heard that its pretty straightforward to farm enough PLEX to pay for your sub fee in EVE - so much so that people can maintain multiple alts to make the game easier and a lot of people bot. What proportion of players do you estimate actually pay a sub fee, or is EVE more F2P than P2P?

I've always wondered about this. I've been reading some EVE blogs to see whether I want to get into the game and they talk a lot about PLEX, making billions in ISK each month, the economy, botting (and CCP cracking down on bots), running a lot of alts and mining and hauling. Is the point of the game to grind PLEX to pay for your sub so that you can grind more PLEX ad inifnitum?

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Comments

  • hfztthfztt GlostrupPosts: 839Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by banzai014

    Since you can buy game time with ingame currency, I've heard that its pretty straightforward to farm enough PLEX to pay for your sub fee in EVE - so much so that people can maintain multiple alts to make the game easier and a lot of people bot. What proportion of players do you estimate actually pay a sub fee, or is EVE more F2P than P2P?

    I've always wondered about this. I've been reading some EVE blogs to see whether I want to get into the game and they talk a lot about PLEX, making billions in ISK each month, the economy, botting (and CCP cracking down on bots), running a lot of alts and mining and hauling. Is the point of the game to grind PLEX to pay for your sub so that you can grind more PLEX ad inifnitum?

    Eve is NOT f2p. Not by any interpretation. Each second of game time have been paid for. Sure there is an exchange system where this PAYED gametime can be traded, but that is not equal to free to play.

    For 50% to "play for free" the other 50% whould have to buy gametime for them to aquire ingame. In the end its all the same for CCP as they earn money on each single player.

  • ElsaboltsElsabolts Greencastle, INPosts: 2,594Member Uncommon

    I forsee " High Winds and Heavy Seas " coming for this thread. F2P or PVE servers will upset the " Hive "

    image

  • ZinzanZinzan NorthPosts: 1,351Member

    My last forray into EvE i payed my subs with plex for about 6 months but it does mean you have to be able to farm the cash necessary to buy the plex and then make your way to pick it up without getting caught in one of the MANY PLEX traps or "cons".

    PLEX availability was always down to the state of the game at the time, often the prices rocketed because corps were stockpiling and price fixing, other times it was so scarce you'd be competing with other players to get hold of one.

    PLEX is player bought with real $ and player sold for ISK.

    Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy :)

  • banzai014banzai014 WellingtonPosts: 27Member
    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market. I'm not sure then why gaming media keep reporting ISK losses as real-life PLEX $ losses.
  • wyldmagikwyldmagik SouthamptonPosts: 307Member Uncommon

    Its not really hard to grasp.

     

    You earn ISK (ingame currency) while playing, scamming, stealing peoples pos stuff lol's :P , or by anyother means to get the ISK.. Once amounted enough, you can then BUY a PLEX card through the game via the market ( like Auction house in other games, not a 'market' per se as people these days tend to think ok )

    That then can be redeemed for 30 days game time via a simple right click on the plex card and option choice to do so.

    You can also buy Plex direct from ccp with real money and convert it back to isk by selling it on the 'AH'/Market

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,863Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by banzai014

    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market.

    Don't GW2 gems come from real currency purchase only?

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,665Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by banzai014
    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market.

    Where do you think gems come from? ;)

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
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  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member

    The point of the game is to have fun.

    PLEX allows you to exchange in game currency, ISK, for the gametime item (PLEX) that someone else purchased with real money.  The price of a PLEX item is determined by players.

    You can pay for your gametime using ISK to gain PLEX from players who bought them with real money, or just subscribe with a credit card etc.

     

    On a side note, I think EVE actually being free to play would be a F'ing horrible idea.  Then anyone can have skills training all the time with no money commitment.  Alts abound, spying is easier, scouting markets in different regions is trivial... it would be awful.

    El Psy Congroo

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,994Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by banzai014
    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market. I'm not sure then why gaming media keep reporting ISK losses as real-life PLEX $ losses.

    Because there is a very clear exchange factor for PLEX, currently I believe they are trading in the neighborhood of 600M ISK for 1 PLEX. 

    A PLEX sells for roughly 19.95 US on the EVE site, (discounts for buying in quantity) so its easy to make a quick conversion and translate someone's 10B ISK loss in to an equivalent value in US Dollars.  (16.67 PLEX or roughly 332.00 US)

    If I made any math errors I'm sure someone else can correct me, busy at work atm image

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
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  • MalcanisMalcanis LondonPosts: 3,191Member
    Originally posted by banzai014
    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market. I'm not sure then why gaming media keep reporting ISK losses as real-life PLEX $ losses.

     

    Don't feel bad - plenty of EVE players make this mistake as well.

    Give me liberty or give me lasers

  • MukeMuke BredaPosts: 2,172Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by hfztt
     

    Eve is NOT f2p. Not by any interpretation. Each second of game time have been paid for. Sure there is an exchange system where this PAYED gametime can be traded, but that is not equal to free to play.

    For 50% to "play for free" the other 50% whould have to buy gametime for them to aquire ingame. In the end its all the same for CCP as they earn money on each single player.

    You're right....I paid fora few years after release, got my hand on some t2 bpos and a few titan bpos....

     

    That earns me my plexes + extra.

     

    wait a minute......I play for free.

     

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • RocketeerRocketeer NachrodtPosts: 1,304Member
    Originally posted by Muke
    Originally posted by hfztt
     

    Eve is NOT f2p. Not by any interpretation. Each second of game time have been paid for. Sure there is an exchange system where this PAYED gametime can be traded, but that is not equal to free to play.

    For 50% to "play for free" the other 50% whould have to buy gametime for them to aquire ingame. In the end its all the same for CCP as they earn money on each single player.

    You're right....I paid fora few years after release, got my hand on some t2 bpos and a few titan bpos....

     

    That earns me my plexes + extra.

     

    wait a minute......I play for free.

     

    Following that logic any game your mom pays for is also F2P. Your not F2P, its just that someone else paid for you.

  • RydesonRydeson Canton, OHPosts: 3,858Member Uncommon

         I wish there was a F2P option for people like me..  I'm just about to finish up my 14 trial time and the game played ok, BUT, I just don't see myself spending that much casual time in it to justify the monthly sub..  I might actually stay around and tinker on the game if I could just buy and "unlock" from time to time.. Oh well.. 

         In any case, the game was fun as I said for what limited access I had..  I personally like B2P methods if done right..

  • NitthNitth AustraliaPosts: 3,684Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by banzai014
    Since you can buy game time with ingame currency, I've heard that its pretty straightforward to farm enough PLEX to pay for your sub fee in EVE - so much so that people can maintain multiple alts to make the game easier and a lot of people bot. What proportion of players do you estimate actually pay a sub fee, or is EVE more F2P than P2P?I've always wondered about this. I've been reading some EVE blogs to see whether I want to get into the game and they talk a lot about PLEX, making billions in ISK each month, the economy, botting (and CCP cracking down on bots), running a lot of alts and mining and hauling. Is the point of the game to grind PLEX to pay for your sub so that you can grind more PLEX ad inifnitum?

    Gametime has to be payed for by some one.

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  • BoardwalkerBoardwalker Austin, TXPosts: 384Member Uncommon
    I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

    They can adjust a game all day, but they can't help the issue between the keyboard and the chair.
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  • JakdstripperJakdstripper logan lake, BCPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon

    keep in mind that Plex does 2 things: it lest mostly vets play for free, while letting rich kids buy Isk.

     

    for those that have been in the game for years and dont know what to do with all the Isk they have they get to play for free. for those that would rather spend some rl $ for Isk instead of farming all day can also do so.

     

    2 birds with one stone.

     

     

    It will take you a good year or more to have enough skills to make enough Isk to pay for your sub especially if you stay in the safety of high sec (the big money is in low sec).

    to give you an idea after about 4 months of sub time the best money i could make solo was mining in .05 sec with a Retriver. i calculated that if i mined 12 hours a day i would pay my subscription in 24 days of mining....that is IF i never got ganked and had never had to replace my mining ship (unlikely), AND if mining prices wouldn't fluctuate much, AND if Plex prices didn't fluctuate. if i mined 10 hours a day that would take me 29 days, exactly one month of continuous mining. Keep in mind that this is ONLY to pay for my sub, so no losing ships of buying skill books, or anything else.

    now you understand why people love alts in Eve. have your miner mining while you gank with your fighter.

     

     

    of course as you gain more skills this gets a little easier but in the end to make the big money you have to go into low sec, but then you also start incurring heavy losses.

  • YalexyYalexy BerlinPosts: 1,053Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Jakdstripper
    It will take you a good year or more to have enough skills to make enough Isk to pay for your sub especially if you stay in the safety of high sec (the big money is in low sec).

    After 4 month you'll have the skills to do LvL 4 missions with a Drake or Raven in semi-AFK-mode.
    With that skillset you can make some 10-20 million ISK per hour, depending on the missions you get. So to afford a 60 day GTC (currently selling for 1.2 billion ISK) you need to grind missions for some +/-80 hours. To break it down even more, you only need to fly two LvL 4 missions per day to pay for your GTC with ISK.

    But on the topic.

    A PLEX is nothing else then a GTC converted into an ingame item. So even if you might see yourself playing for "free" by spending ISK for your PLEX, this PLEX had to be bought by another player with real money after conversion.

    CCP isn't giving any playtime away for free, so EvE is not a F2P-title at all. The only thing they do is to not have every single player pay for their playtime on their own, but the community as a whole.

    It's a brilliant model actually and I would wish that other developers would go for such a model aswell.

  • JakdstripperJakdstripper logan lake, BCPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yalexy


    With that skillset you can make some 10-20 million ISK per hour, depending on the missions you get. So to afford a 60 day GTC (currently selling for 1.2 billion ISK)

    holly crap! they were just arround 550 mil like at the beginning of this year.....

  • RydesonRydeson Canton, OHPosts: 3,858Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Boardwalker
    I hope EVE never goes F2P. Having a sub is a great way to keep the freeloaders out, while ensuring consistent updates and free expansions from CCP.

          How is F2P freeloading?   I'm curious how and why you see it that way..  Have you heard of the saying "something is better then nothing"?  There is alot of truth in that..  There are many players such as myself that only play casually on weekends.. Paying for a sub is just careless and crazy..  I'm an advid golfer when weather permits.. Sure I would LOVE a subscription based golf course that allows me to golf all I want, whenever I want.. But should everyone, even the guy that golfs once a month pay the same monthly golf sub.?  Oh hell no..

         When a game has ONLY a subscrption option, if forces people to go  "ALL IN" or fold.. Just like poker..  If a B2P cash shop is set up properly, then both subs and pay as you go customers can co-exist..  As I said in my post, I would have no problem buying unlockables as I play..  Getting $50 out of me per year is better then nothing, which is what they are getting now from me with a manditory sub..  

  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member
    Originally posted by Jakdstripper
    Originally posted by Yalexy


    With that skillset you can make some 10-20 million ISK per hour, depending on the missions you get. So to afford a 60 day GTC (currently selling for 1.2 billion ISK)

    holly crap! they were just arround 550 mil like at the beginning of this year.....

    A PLEX is 30 days, and costs around 600 mil.  A 60 day timecode which can be converted to TWO PLEX is 1.2 bil after converting and sold.

    Glad to clear up that math :P

    El Psy Congroo

  • JakdstripperJakdstripper logan lake, BCPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    disregard my previous post, i didn't read the 60 part....was thinking 30 days....it's still the same price.
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Kitchener, ONPosts: 1,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Elsabolts

    I forsee " High Winds and Heavy Seas " coming for this thread. F2P or PVE servers will upset the " Hive "

    image

    Read the OP

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Gainesville, FLPosts: 2,000Member
    Originally posted by banzai014
    Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market. I'm not sure then why gaming media keep reporting ISK losses as real-life PLEX $ losses.

    Because they are lazy.  Also, in order to buy gems for gold someone had to buy the gems for money first and then sell them for gold, so in that way, it is exactly the same.

  • RocketeerRocketeer NachrodtPosts: 1,304Member
    The advantage for players is that everyone is a equally valuable customer. We don't have VIPs, premiums and F2P people in EvE, everyone is equal and nobody will ask you how you got your gametime. Also the grind in F2P games like LotRO to archive vaguely similar content access as paying people ... well its insane, if its even possible which it usually is not.
  • BanquettoBanquetto CityPosts: 1,037Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Loktofeit

    Originally posted by banzai014 Oh from what I read I thought PLEX was like gems in GW2 - I didn't know somebody actually had to have spent cash to get it to market. Where do you think gems come from? ;)


    Not from players spending cash.


    When you buy gems for gold in GW2, you're dropping gold into a goldsink and receiving fresh minted gems in return.


    When you sell gems for gold, the opposite is true.


    You are never exchanging gems & gold with another player - always with ArenaNet. The price is not determined by a free market, it is set by ArenaNet, presumably via an algorithm where the exchange rate rises and falls as trades are made in each direction. Certainly the gold price of gems has been steadily increasing since launch, and there is no doubt that people buying gems for gold greatly outnumber people selling gems.


    It's a completely different system to EVE's PLEX system, where every PLEX trade is between one player and another player, at a mutually accepted price; and every PLEX enters the economy from someone paying real money to CCP.



    Originally posted by niceguy3978
    Also, in order to buy gems for gold someone had to buy the gems for money first and then sell them for gold, so in that way, it is exactly the same.


    Again, no.

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