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Just curious. If GW2 was the same game it is now, but you added a trinity model to the combat system (tank, healer, DPS), would it be a better game in your opinion?
You can spec out your character to mimic the Trinity. I can make a huge difference. There are armor sets, runes, traits and so on, for this.
The problem comes with the contribition formulas so most people just go pure DPS for loot.
Another issue is that world PvE is so incredibly easy that more and more poeple are fitting magic find sets to farm out their legendary prereqs.
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Originally posted by KhinRunite If we had trinity we wouldn't have this much complaints from bewildered people who just can't grasp how to do difficult encounters without zerg ressing. Everyone would automatically become familiar with strategies and that's not as fun. Plus there's a plethora of MMOs out there that uses the Holy Trinity.
IMHO, being the Holy Trinity for the entire game is not fun either. Sometime when I raid, I don't want to stick the same duty all the time. However, I am agree that Dungeon in GW2 is too zerg, it should require more strategies to conquest the dungeon. But again, I can see ANet can improve it better without using the Holy Trinity back to the game as a solution.
No, GW2 would not be better with a trinity.
Just like other games would not be better without. This gives players a choice. I am glad GW2 is different, I am glad TSW's, progression setting are different. Good for both games.
Originally posted by amadeuz Originally posted by KhinRunite If we had trinity we wouldn't have this much complaints from bewildered people who just can't grasp how to do difficult encounters without zerg ressing. Everyone would automatically become familiar with strategies and that's not as fun. Plus there's a plethora of MMOs out there that uses the Holy Trinity.
Oh just to clarify before it gets out of hand: I'm not saying playing with a Holy Trinity in place isn't as fun. I enjoy both types. What I'm saying is that it's fun to read complaint threads from people who can't absorb the GW2 system yet.
Nope. I like the class design and combat just the way it is. If anything I would rather dodging worked more like RaiderZ, but that is about it.
There is a ton of games with very similar trinity based class and combat design. It would be boring if too many were like that.
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I am torn on the issue. To an extent I think they should have made some sort of spec tree or something to allow players to focus on specialties but at the same time I like the option to be self relient.
Tough call imo.
I really wanted to like the departure from the norm. It was refreshing to see that everyone got a heal and people were expected to actively try to avoid damage.
With the way the dungeons were designed, however, there doesn't seem to be a middle ground. There are too many mobs all trying to kill you simultaneously to avoid much damage, and the healing in the game simply isn't plentiful or reliable enough to keep up. Add an (as of yet) incomprehensible aggro system in, and you have chaos. Combo fields were interesting, but ultimately just added a bit of "stand here and spam your attacks" to the game that already is... spam your attacks.
I think a Trinity-like setup could have made the PvE experience a lot more familiar and enjoyable.
Where I personally stand right now:
I'd like to see some defensive oriented specs get 3 second "taunts," kind of the like Rammus or Shen in League of Legends, but no permanent aggro holding mechanic. This would allow players to relish the tanky aggro holding mechanic to feel like they have a place in GW2 (and yes, this is a major deterrent for some people; and no, the appropriate response isn't just "well they should go play another game then.) This would fit perfectly within GW2's combat system. I'm aware there are several pull-target-to-you spells, but half the mobs you would most want to use these on are immune. I don't think a traditional hard (brief) taunt would be out of place.
I'd like to see some harder CC, the kind that was a necessity during vanilla WoW. This would allow for more strategic trash pulls and give players a greater sense of control over what's happening. The point wouldn't be to make CC, and therefore players, stronger or for this to be a nerf to dungeons, but to allow for more complex fights, to be able to strategically reduce the chaos to a point slightly below what exists now amidst what would otherwise be even more potential chaos than there is now. This would actually increase the difficulty, raise the skill bar a little, and greatly reduce the redundancy of many of the pulls in between bosses--which I will admit tend to be few. Both of my first 2 suggestions aim at placing a bit more control in the hands of the players, because the sum of current control (slows, snares, knockbacks) = endless kiting. I think kiting is a great mechanic, but right now it's pretty much the sole technique available, and it does begin to feel redundant.
I'm pretty fine with healing right now. I play a power/toughness/healing power support based staff elementalist, and I can actually feel the effect I'm having on my group sustainability (though barely compared to healing classes in most MMOs--I can't always tell whether their health is going up as a result of my heals or their own devices). But I love that I actively DPS and CC in the mix. To not do so would be an utter waste 80% of my skills and time. I would never want to trade that for gameplay where I must stand back and heal nonstop, because if I do stop, someone dies, ensuring that I never can effectively get involved in damage or control.
After playing and clearing about 20 explorable modes, 3 things have become apparent to me. First, there's something thrilling about the chaos and perpetual state of panic involved in GW2's combat. Dodge rolling, casting while moving, resurrecting downed players, and yes, the chaos, all combine to create an exciting combat atmosphere. Second, the chaos can lead to a feeling of lack of control; and sometimes, even after you pull through and emerge victorious, you can't always identify what it was that made you succeed. The player is left feeling only vaguely responsible for winning, which is less than ideal. Third, not having the trinity seems to have noticeably restricted the types of possible encounters. While I couldn't accurately call GW2 encounters "tank and spank," I would say that more than a good handfull of fights can be classified as "kite, dodge and spank." But actually yes, there are in fact some bosses that are so weak and seemingly broken that they do become good ol' fashion tank 'n spank.
Originally posted by Size-Twelve Just curious. If GW2 was the same game it is now, but you added a trinity model to the combat system (tank, healer, DPS), would it be a better game in your opinion?
Only for retards that need to be told what to do. For everyone else it should be fine since you can pick up any role you want.
People just need to remember two things:
1. Tank in this game is not a punching bag that stand between monsters and get hit over and over while healer heal him. You must do active tanking. So take aggro, put up all shields, css and whatever else you have, kit a little and dodge. So it's not something for retards because their idea of tanking is to stay still, taunt mobs and let healer heal him.
2. Healers are not freaking miracle makers that can heal instantly a guy who just got hit by a broadsword size of small building. You can help but you are not someone who can keep alive entire team while eating snacks and drinking coffe.
The Trinity exists, just with all elements within each character and the inability to stick to one all the time. Once you start balancing your ability to kill, control and grant the right boons it feels quite natural. Oh, and only evade on the big attacks instead of blowing on every little hit.
Although like that guy further up the page, while I'd opposed to pure tanks I wouldn't say no to snap taunts that can attract the enemy for a very brief period - enough to allow the player they were targeting a second ago to reposition or get a couple of ticks of endurance so they can dodge again. So not an actual tanking mechanic as much as a control mechanic.
Yeah I love the lack of trinity.
It's the best innovation in the gaming industry, and the best innovation ever (second only to Sarcastaball).