Back when they released the "manifesto", A-net claimed that one of the things they disliked the most of standard mmo´s was the fact that no matter which quest you completed, boss you killed, or village you saved, everything resetted five minutes later and the game did not care about the player not it´s exploits.
Well, how is GW2 offering me a different experience from that?
I am a lv 32 warrior so far, and while i had a blast on most of the game´s features and i am loving exploring and crafting, i still do not see how does GW2´s world care that i am there.
I visited a lot of zones and done dozens of events, and every single one of them restarts if i just stay 5 mins afk around them, the villages are constantly under siege, those pesky centaurs keep coming for more and generally nothign seems to change or "stay saved" as i progress thru my own storyline and partecipate in the events.
Sure, some (very few and far between) events have slightly alter the npc presence in the zone, such as that lv 15-25 field where upon the completion of all the centaur questline, the lionguard "controls" most of the roads, but that´s not really all that "world changing" and even that goes away within half a hour or so.
So...what about it?
Ok. here we have a game design genius.
So, if the events didnt repeat after some time - what would happen ?
Let say you and few buddies of yours erradicate Centaur threat. Once and for all.
And thats it.
Tyria is at peace and there is nothing else to do in the game.
Well done. You just designed multimilion game that had 3 minutes of gameplay content
ROFL
When will people stop ending their posts with "ROFL" or "LOL"?
The OP has a point.
Shame GW2 ripped off Tabula Rasa' Dynamic Battlefields only partially and not entirely. If they did, you could lose a friendly town to a dynamic event along with its vendors and trainers, until it is conquered back by players. GW2 didnt rip off WAR, because Dynamic Events (Public Quests) were first introduced in Tabula Rasa - Dynamic Battlefields.
Have you ever heared of migrating mobs? How about if players wiped centaurs, something else would start spawning in that area, triggering a different set of dynamic events? That doesn't require that much coding nor budget. That would give a feeling that the world is really changing. What if they coded NPCs in towns to react to recent happenings in the area - well that would be dynamic, and still a theme park. The way it is now is just a static re-occurence of the same events.
When will people stop ending their posts with "ROFL" or "LOL"?
The OP has a point.
Shame GW2 ripped off Tabula Rasa' Dynamic Battlefields only partially and not entirely. If they did, you could lose a friendly town to a dynamic event along with its vendors and trainers, until it is conquered back by players. GW2 didnt rip off WAR, because Dynamic Events (Public Quests) were first introduced in Tabula Rasa - Dynamic Battlefields.
Have you ever heared of migrating mobs? How about if players wiped centaurs, something else would start spawning in that area, triggering a different set of dynamic events? That doesn't require that much coding nor budget. That would give a feeling that the world is really changing. What if they coded NPCs in towns to react to recent happenings in the area - well that would be dynamic, and still a theme park. The way it is now is just a static re-occurence of the same events.
Highlighted red text is speculative at best and from a developer's point of view, likely false.
Rome can be built in a day if you 'talk' about it.
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Well, if you're at all honest, you have to admit that while the game is fun and very addictive- for a number of reasons -the promises made in the "manifesto" video were only partially met. I, too, remembered Ree's words about the world not caring. That one didn't pan out the way they explained it.
Also, the lead designer (I think) mentionned something to the effect that "in other MMOs, the monsters are just standing around in a field, waiting for you to kill them". Well, apart from the many dynamic events in the game, MOST of the time you're pretty much reading thew "quest heart" text, then going into a field or cave...and killing stuff that is just standing or wandering around.
So yes, the game is still exceedingly fun...but I do believe everyone understands that the Manifesto video was a great marketing tool, and not completely, totally totally honest.
When will people stop ending their posts with "ROFL" or "LOL"?
The OP has a point.
Shame GW2 ripped off Tabula Rasa' Dynamic Battlefields only partially and not entirely. If they did, you could lose a friendly town to a dynamic event along with its vendors and trainers, until it is conquered back by players. GW2 didnt rip off WAR, because Dynamic Events (Public Quests) were first introduced in Tabula Rasa - Dynamic Battlefields.
Have you ever heared of migrating mobs? How about if players wiped centaurs, something else would start spawning in that area, triggering a different set of dynamic events? That doesn't require that much coding nor budget. That would give a feeling that the world is really changing. What if they coded NPCs in towns to react to recent happenings in the area - well that would be dynamic, and still a theme park. The way it is now is just a static re-occurence of the same events.
Highlighted red text is speculative at best and from a developer's point of view, likely false.
Rome can be built in a day if you 'talk' about it.
Yes, let's just defend the game against any ideas that would make the game better with "too complicated, too expensive, too much coding". Each company to be competitive must do an extra step.
Coding migrating mobs or placeholders triggering new events or mobs taking over bases is certainly possible, since it was used multiple times in the past.
The simple answer: developers exaggerate always about everything when they're working on a new project. Basically consider half of what them said to be not true (or rather "not implemented on launch"), and you'll be closer to the real game.
ArenaNet did say that your actions would matter in the open persistent world. If the personal story is that makes you feel like you've changed something in the world, then GW2 isn't doing anything new. GW1 had a very fleshed out instanced experience (pretty much the same as the personal story but more comprehensive) where your actions did matter.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Many events reset faster then they should. Mostly because they have a too short event chain. I don't mind it that much, it is a theme park game and it'd be extremely expensive to produce enough game content per event to give you a better illusion that you made a difference. Even the group events ( every zone seems to have one or two ) have quite short cooldown before they reset. Apart of that I yet to fail in an event to trigger a different outcome of a chain event.
Yes, let's just defend the game against any ideas that would make the game better with "too complicated, too expensive, too much coding". Each company to be competitive must do an extra step.
Coding migrating mobs or placeholders triggering new events or mobs taking over bases is certainly possible, since it was used multiple times in the past.
Don't see the 'defend' part so great diversion there.
Making it sound like 'its easy' is not something you would know unless you know GW2 codebase or a coder yourself.
No, Java 101 doesn't count.
According to your 'it is so easy' post why not attack GW2 cause it isn't virtual reality? or the Star Trek holodeck?
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
It's just too implausible for every player to have the power to effect the world in a pretty serious way. Even boss mobs not respawning etc only one group would get the chance to kill it etc it just leaves too many people out. If your really looking for the ability to influence the world RPGs might be more suited. But yeah I do see what you mean with it not mattering that your there and to tell you the truth I'm starting to feel like ANet doesn't care so much either now you have purchased their game and a rolling in cash.
Originally posted by Scalpless The effects of DEs could be a bit more prominent, but GW2 is a sandbox with a limited number of pre-made events. Making them too permanent isn't realistically possible without a huge budget and a huge budget is something ANet didn't have.
No sandbox elements in GW2 really tbh, theme park until 80 then pvp - that's it.
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
Originally posted by Scalpless The effects of DEs could be a bit more prominent, but GW2 is a sandbox with a limited number of pre-made events. Making them too permanent isn't realistically possible without a huge budget and a huge budget is something ANet didn't have.
When will people stop ending their posts with "ROFL" or "LOL"?
The OP has a point.
Shame GW2 ripped off Tabula Rasa' Dynamic Battlefields only partially and not entirely. If they did, you could lose a friendly town to a dynamic event along with its vendors and trainers, until it is conquered back by players. GW2 didnt rip off WAR, because Dynamic Events (Public Quests) were first introduced in Tabula Rasa - Dynamic Battlefields.
Have you ever heared of migrating mobs? How about if players wiped centaurs, something else would start spawning in that area, triggering a different set of dynamic events? That doesn't require that much coding nor budget. That would give a feeling that the world is really changing. What if they coded NPCs in towns to react to recent happenings in the area - well that would be dynamic, and still a theme park. The way it is now is just a static re-occurence of the same events.
Get past level 30, this happens in Harathi Hinterlands, the whole zone is about caputring centaur camps.
I'm sorry OP, but if you actually believed it, then you kind off have to blame yourself somewhat.
So it's not ANet's fault for hyping up their game as something it wouldn't be... it's the OP's fault for "believing them"?
When something like that happens with any other MMO, people blame the developers for promising something they couldn't deliver on; for over-hyping and over-promising on their product.
In GW2, however, it's your fault for holding them to it. ANet is not to blame at all. They're not accountable for their marketing, or what claims they make of their game. Nope.
Unbelievable. Can you say "unabashedly biased"?
A lot of people bought into that manifesto, and things they've said since, with 100% credulity. The only difference is, now instead of coming out and saying "gee, ANet over-promised on this game and didn't meet a lot of what they said they would do", they're making excuses for it and, in your case at least, apologetically blaming the player for "believing it".
Whatever it takes for ANet to remain the gleaming pillar of perfection in folks' eyes I guess, eh?
It's a marketing trailer made to generate hype for the game. It would require an insane, and i mean, insane amount of coding, branching paths in events, voice acting and god knows what else to make that happen and npc's remember you and the world "care for you".
Then they shouldn't have made the claim. Period. I'm sure they knew how monumental a task it would be well before making that statement. But they made it anyway, didn't they?
Oh right. They're not to blame. They can just say whatever they want. Make whatever claims they want. It's fine. It's the player who's at fault if they believe it. Right. I forgot.
While dynamic events and cool and good IMO, but it's still a questing system (with the obvious alterations of course), so you can't possibly expect that to actually happen in-game.
But ANet is flawless! Infallible! They're gods on Earth! They're capable of anything and everything! Haven't you noticed all the worship going on over them on all the gaming forums?
The adulation of ANet and GW2 is actually making what went on with TOR look like a minor show of appreciation by comparison. It's rather disturbing to see how many people are fawning all over them, hanging on every syllable of their every word as though it was spoken from the mouth of some celestial higher power themself.
And it's not even a matter of "if you don't like it, don't look at anything to do with ANet or GW2". I've tried. It's not that simple. I can't go anywhere even slightly gaming related without seeing it - even in forums on websites that have nothing to do with ANet or GW2.
A friend on Facebook is turning his page into a freaking shrine to ANet and GW2. A grown man, 34 years old, slobbering all over everything they post or say or show. I've had to turn off his updates 'cause my wall page was starting to look like a GW2 appreciation page, and none of them were even my posts. I've tried to talk some reason into him, get him to calm down a bit, but he's not having it. He's too far into the kool-aid to turn back now.
No, I think people should be holding ANet accountable for making that claim and then not living up to it. Just like they would do with any other developer, on any other MMO. No other MMO developer has gotten a "pass" in those situations, neither should ANet.
And yes I realize I'll get ripped apart for saying that. Whatever. Knock yourselves out.
I would rather be enjoying life at 34 and having a bit of fun that quite frankly ranting about some meaningless point in a forum. You know in game most are having a lot of fun in a game that is clearly well thought out and designed.
That people ranting in this forum seem lost and are arguing over subjective opinion, and have lost sight of the point of a game- to offer content that some find fun.
You should ask yourself what it is exactly that is making you so incensed, in a forum about a game don't want to play. It's really weird - misery surely does not love misery?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Re title of this post, the game doesn't care for me, it offers a great environment to care for yourself and others. If you want the best out of this game, play through it with a group of people, don't farm stuff', wander the world and do what your mood takes you.
For those that say there is no grouping beyond your guild, no the issues is that you have been accustomed with playing selfishly. Every day thus week I have grouped with new people, and usually this starts of by a simple 'say' from myself saying 'hey, what do you think of the game'. Takes 2 to make a conversation
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by RelytDnegel It's just too implausible for every player to have the power to effect the world in a pretty serious way. Even boss mobs not respawning etc only one group would get the chance to kill it etc it just leaves too many people out. If your really looking for the ability to influence the world RPGs might be more suited. But yeah I do see what you mean with it not mattering that your there and to tell you the truth I'm starting to feel like ANet doesn't care so much either now you have purchased their game and a rolling in cash.
+1 , think about it if world have rare bosses scattered around and killing them would grand you treasures now when they always spawn on same places and same timescale there is these zerking groups that goes around and kill them all systematicly leaving these oh so casula players out of glory. hows that fair then?
It is fully impossible to build a game with no end. What they meant is simple: There´s a different between going to kill the bandits while they attack the village and then run away, than, when you go to a bandit area where there´s no-limited amount of them, and just kill 20 and pretend that they have run away.
Many, if not most, DEs lead to different paths that really tells the story of the map you are playing in .. also, if yu are active and can interact enough with world and DEs you can almost, always, find new paths to take, so you won´t repeat everything by many times.
Otherwise, it is about feeling, the feeling that you are doing something, that can bring you one step further in your way to solve this puzzle or find that lost child. Is the feeling about seing the world, changing the whole time. However, in reality, this is still a game and if you go afk, as u explained it, you will see the same happen again of course. There´s basically no modern techology that can brings you a world that include perm-changes the whole time.
I'm afraid this won't be possible until it can be done procedurally. This seems to be evolving with games such as Minecraft, Terraria, A Valley Without Wind but they're indie games working on very basic graphics and storytelling. To see it done on an open world persistant MMORPG is like aiming to travel to another star when we barely make it to the Moon.
Then you have games that rely on some kind of procedural content, but they merely supplement the main gameplay such as Legasista, Disgaea series.
I agree that to have lasting impact developing a more procedure approach would be helpful but the logic and database technologies are already sitting there , not light years away. Simply not instantly respawning NPCs in town after they get killed in a DR is simple and effective.
Persistent changes based on character actions are easy to implement but you have to accept that your game can't be a Themepark, encounters and events can't be built so Everyone gets to go on the ride.
Persistence and "Sandbox" have the thrill and jealousy of opportunity. Imagine how cool it would be to have a SINGLE player deliver the killing blow to the Lich King, his name goes down in history and he is the ONLY one that has the cool LichKing Sword. Instead we are stuck in an adventures DayCare wasteland where everyone wins everything, everyone saves the Universe from the same Villiain, everyone has Excalibur, etc....
The problem isn't Tech, the problem is the ADHD masses that demand easy and plentiful victories they can gorge themselves on while watching Family Guy. They can't handle not being the center of attention or getting what everyone else has, they refuse to compete against other players for anything substantial. instead comforted in the fact that as long as they keep que'ing they will eventually get a good PUG that can carry them to victory so they too can be THE Lich Slayer.
Many older MMOs offered more persistence, they had very long respawn timers on rare Monsters, they even had special GM events that were once in a lifetime opportunitites. But as the genre expanded the player makeup changed and soon everything became instanced, solo heavy, single player Story, where any barrier to winning was complained about until we are stuck with the Mainstream MMO experience we have today.
MMOs today make alot of money but they don't make alot of real adventure.
Originally posted by Scalpless The effects of DEs could be a bit more prominent, but GW2 is a sandbox with a limited number of pre-made events. Making them too permanent isn't realistically possible without a huge budget and a huge budget is something ANet didn't have.
Comments
Too much truth in this post.
Highlighted red text is speculative at best and from a developer's point of view, likely false.
Rome can be built in a day if you 'talk' about it.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Well, if you're at all honest, you have to admit that while the game is fun and very addictive- for a number of reasons -the promises made in the "manifesto" video were only partially met. I, too, remembered Ree's words about the world not caring. That one didn't pan out the way they explained it.
Also, the lead designer (I think) mentionned something to the effect that "in other MMOs, the monsters are just standing around in a field, waiting for you to kill them". Well, apart from the many dynamic events in the game, MOST of the time you're pretty much reading thew "quest heart" text, then going into a field or cave...and killing stuff that is just standing or wandering around.
So yes, the game is still exceedingly fun...but I do believe everyone understands that the Manifesto video was a great marketing tool, and not completely, totally totally honest.
Yes, let's just defend the game against any ideas that would make the game better with "too complicated, too expensive, too much coding". Each company to be competitive must do an extra step.
Coding migrating mobs or placeholders triggering new events or mobs taking over bases is certainly possible, since it was used multiple times in the past.
REALITY CHECK
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
@OP, you have to wait for awhile when they add in more chain content.
Colin have comment that there are 100 DE human starting zone now and they aimed to make it 300 DE in 3 years time.
All zones will be updated as the game progress.
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
Many events reset faster then they should. Mostly because they have a too short event chain. I don't mind it that much, it is a theme park game and it'd be extremely expensive to produce enough game content per event to give you a better illusion that you made a difference. Even the group events ( every zone seems to have one or two ) have quite short cooldown before they reset. Apart of that I yet to fail in an event to trigger a different outcome of a chain event.
Don't see the 'defend' part so great diversion there.
Making it sound like 'its easy' is not something you would know unless you know GW2 codebase or a coder yourself.
No, Java 101 doesn't count.
According to your 'it is so easy' post why not attack GW2 cause it isn't virtual reality? or the Star Trek holodeck?
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Safehouse Gaming up and running at: http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnKd0Hk85CQ_N04Ae7v5zZg
No sandbox elements in GW2 really tbh, theme park until 80 then pvp - that's it.
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
http://www.thesecretworld.com/buy/
OR PM ME FOR A BUDDY KEY (need your email address).
yeh.. no.
Get past level 30, this happens in Harathi Hinterlands, the whole zone is about caputring centaur camps.
That people ranting in this forum seem lost and are arguing over subjective opinion, and have lost sight of the point of a game- to offer content that some find fun.
You should ask yourself what it is exactly that is making you so incensed, in a forum about a game don't want to play. It's really weird - misery surely does not love misery?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
For those that say there is no grouping beyond your guild, no the issues is that you have been accustomed with playing selfishly. Every day thus week I have grouped with new people, and usually this starts of by a simple 'say' from myself saying 'hey, what do you think of the game'. Takes 2 to make a conversation
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
my system detected one of these oh so old " let the flame begin replies "
+1 , think about it if world have rare bosses scattered around and killing them would grand you treasures now when they always spawn on same places and same timescale there is these zerking groups that goes around and kill them all systematicly leaving these oh so casula players out of glory. hows that fair then?
I agree that to have lasting impact developing a more procedure approach would be helpful but the logic and database technologies are already sitting there , not light years away. Simply not instantly respawning NPCs in town after they get killed in a DR is simple and effective.
Persistent changes based on character actions are easy to implement but you have to accept that your game can't be a Themepark, encounters and events can't be built so Everyone gets to go on the ride.
Persistence and "Sandbox" have the thrill and jealousy of opportunity. Imagine how cool it would be to have a SINGLE player deliver the killing blow to the Lich King, his name goes down in history and he is the ONLY one that has the cool LichKing Sword. Instead we are stuck in an adventures DayCare wasteland where everyone wins everything, everyone saves the Universe from the same Villiain, everyone has Excalibur, etc....
The problem isn't Tech, the problem is the ADHD masses that demand easy and plentiful victories they can gorge themselves on while watching Family Guy. They can't handle not being the center of attention or getting what everyone else has, they refuse to compete against other players for anything substantial. instead comforted in the fact that as long as they keep que'ing they will eventually get a good PUG that can carry them to victory so they too can be THE Lich Slayer.
Many older MMOs offered more persistence, they had very long respawn timers on rare Monsters, they even had special GM events that were once in a lifetime opportunitites. But as the genre expanded the player makeup changed and soon everything became instanced, solo heavy, single player Story, where any barrier to winning was complained about until we are stuck with the Mainstream MMO experience we have today.
MMOs today make alot of money but they don't make alot of real adventure.
lol srsly
@OP
arena.net lied to all of you. and it coming out slowly..just read some other gw2 post lol.