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1$ = 1Euro = 0.85 pound

IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

Greetings!

In the lastest stress test, i decided i'd finally buy some gems to experiment with gem shop. I quickly found out that for some odd reason, prices in $ are equal to prices in euro. 800 gems would cost 10$ (if i chose China as my country), 10E (if i chose Russia) and 8.5 pound (if i chose UK).

Forum moderator @ ArenaNet forums quickly closed my thread, so i'm posting here.

Isnt this wierd? And what are they going to do, ban people who provide wrong country, so like, i chose China as my country, pay 10$, get 800 gems, then i'm banned for "selecting wrong country in the buy gems screen"? And if they arent going to ban, then what is the point to pay up in euro or pounds if you can pay less in dollars? Why pay extra?

Comments

  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    I was told the same @Anet before mod closed my topic. Tell me, how does China come into picture here? US does pay taxtes after, but does China too? My point being, yes for US, UK and EU it is correct, because US pay taxes later an UK/EU immediately when they buy. But i am sure China has nothing to do with it! Russia isnt EU either, you know, why doesnt russia get to pay 10$ like China?

  • HrimnirHrimnir Qeynos, COPosts: 1,597Member Uncommon
    Wow, has the british pound nosedived that badly?  I remember less than a year ago a british pound was worth something like $1.80 US.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • XAPKenXAPKen Northwest, INPosts: 4,927Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Wow, has the british pound nosedived that badly?  I remember less than a year ago a british pound was worth something like $1.80 US.

    $1.56  It hasn't been $1.80 for a few years (2008).


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now turned Amateur Game Developer.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  Realm Lords 2 on MMORPG.com
  • DOGMA1138DOGMA1138 none of your buidnessPosts: 476Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    I was told the same @Anet before mod closed my topic. Tell me, how does China come into picture here? US does pay taxtes after, but does China too? My point being, yes for US, UK and EU it is correct, because US pay taxes later an UK/EU immediately when they buy. But i am sure China has nothing to do with it! Russia isnt EU either, you know, why doesnt russia get to pay 10$ like China?

    No they don't Sale Tax in the US is charged based on the Sate, and even City you are in, as with most internet services(services, not products) the vendor rarely passes the tax to the costumer since unlike VAT which is payed on every transaction(From import/manufacturing, trough the entire destribution, and even resale) Sale Tax is only charged once at the inital point of sale and is charged from the party which sold the product or provided the service(altough parties are allowed to transfer the tax to the consumer).

     

  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    Yes yes i get it about US and EU taxes.

    Tell me why do those who are in China get to pay 10$, and those who are in Russia have to pay 10Euro?

  • AethaerynAethaeryn Kitchener, ONPosts: 1,977Member Uncommon

    There can be a lot of reasons for this. . but the main reason is -because they can- or they don't want to deal with future fluctuation in the currency values.

     

    Here is an example.  I live in Canada.. the Canadian dollar was the butt of a lot of jokes on TV (of course we watch US TV). etc for years and years. . it was worth a lot less.  Companies priced things accodingly.  Books are the best example. . they have a US and Canadian price listed usually right on them. . not a sticker.  Let me grab a book here.  My wife has a novel that says US 9.99 / 12.99 CAN.  These prices made sense before when the CND dollar was always lower and currencies were more stable. Our dollar has been close to equal for a long time now. . but guess what. . the book prices haven't changed.  

    We still pay around 30% more for books.  . . . there are some great excuses for it but they are pretty flimsy and my guess is because we have always payed those prices . . and they don't want to bother changing the prices as our currency fluctuates.

    The world economy is bouncing around quite a bit.  If they base it off of one currency they could get hosed. . and if they increase the cost to you as your currency devalues you will get mad.  My guess still is the same as the book thing.  Because they can.

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    Wait, but you can go, exchange CAN for $ and then buy that book for $ and you'd still be in profit (even after service charge for currency xchange)?

    I know that they "can" and if that'd be the honest answer i'd accept it and deal with it (either cheat by saying im' from china, or not buy gems altogether). But they try to argue a point, which seems valid, that its about VAT.

  • DOGMA1138DOGMA1138 none of your buidnessPosts: 476Member Uncommon

    Because it depends on how the game is distributed and which billing provider they use in every area.

    Steam was much more affordable when i could choose if i want to pay in USD, EUR, or GBP sadly since they restructured their billing im stuck in Zone 2 EURO which means i pay more than i should or atleast used too(this is why except for sales im using Amazon / Direct 2 Drive for my Digital Download games).

    I think that the gems are extremly overpriced in any zone, the smallest boost would cost you 3-4 Dollars, and some of them only last for an hour. The comsetic items are also way too expensive(same goes to TSW).

    This is what you get when you have or want to dump the old sub model behind, if you expect only 30-20% of your player base to actually use the store you need to make them pay 3-4 times more than they would normaly for a sub.

    League of Legends so far has the best and most fair cash store i've seen, nothing except for skins/boosts is offlimits to normal players, and even then the skin and boosts are somewhat fairly priced, even tho european players are getting screwed again with higher prices(tho as allways you have to take into account, that the average VAT in the EU is allmost twice the average sale tax in the US, and unlike the US they have to charge you for it - no exemptions).

  • AethaerynAethaeryn Kitchener, ONPosts: 1,977Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    Wait, but you can go, exchange CAN for $ and then buy that book for $ and you'd still be in profit (even after service charge for currency xchange)?

    I know that they "can" and if that'd be the honest answer i'd accept it and deal with it (either cheat by saying im' from china, or not buy gems altogether). But they try to argue a point, which seems valid, that its about VAT.

    No. the currency would be taken at par and even if you pay with US money you still pay the CAN price here.  I have heard a few people yell at chashiers about this. . because it is their fault of course :)  No way around it . . although sometimes it is cheaper to buy online from the US and pay shipping.

     

    I suppose I could run across the border. buy books and then sell them here :)

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    I was told the same @Anet before mod closed my topic. Tell me, how does China come into picture here? US does pay taxtes after, but does China too? My point being, yes for US, UK and EU it is correct, because US pay taxes later an UK/EU immediately when they buy. But i am sure China has nothing to do with it! Russia isnt EU either, you know, why doesnt russia get to pay 10$ like China?

    We can stop the whole tax discussion for digital content in EU.  If i buy a digital copy of the game and digital contents from a US company, they or me dont pay any taxes in the EU.

     

    The taxes part only goes for Boxes and physical things sold in the EU but not for digital content.

     

    So basically all europeans allways get  scre....

     

     

     

    I can just as easilly pay in Dollars with my CC as in EU, and the CC company just converts the prices for me.

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member
    Lord Bachus, but they do have an office in EU so thats why you pay them tax in EU. However, it still doesnt explain separate prices for russia and china, where china pays less and russia pays more.
  • ConnmacartConnmacart OsloPosts: 681Member Uncommon
    Did you really think you'd get an answer to that even if the official forum had been open for normal use and not just bug reports? Go call Anet lawyers and accountants for that answer, because the developers will not have a clue why that is. Neither does anyone here. Seems more like stirring a hornets nest justfor the sake of stirring it if you ask me.
  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    Well, i made an officlal ticket. If i dont get direct answer, i will make a direct question: is there a point in EULA that forbids me from specifying wrong country in "get gems" screen?

    I'll happily select China as my country and pay in $, no problem!

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    I was told the same @Anet before mod closed my topic. Tell me, how does China come into picture here? US does pay taxtes after, but does China too? My point being, yes for US, UK and EU it is correct, because US pay taxes later an UK/EU immediately when they buy. But i am sure China has nothing to do with it! Russia isnt EU either, you know, why doesnt russia get to pay 10$ like China?

    We can stop the whole tax discussion for digital content in EU.  If i buy a digital copy of the game and digital contents from a US company, they or me dont pay any taxes in the EU.

     

    The taxes part only goes for Boxes and physical things sold in the EU but not for digital content.

     

    So basically all europeans allways get  scre....

     

     

     

    I can just as easilly pay in Dollars with my CC as in EU, and the CC company just converts the prices for me.

    Actually digital goods do pay vat in EU.

    Any company to sell digital goods in EU needs an office in a EU country - Anet is in the UK.

     

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,464Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    Greetings!

    In the lastest stress test, i decided i'd finally buy some gems to experiment with gem shop. I quickly found out that for some odd reason, prices in $ are equal to prices in euro. 800 gems would cost 10$ (if i chose China as my country), 10E (if i chose Russia) and 8.5 pound (if i chose UK).

    Forum moderator @ ArenaNet forums quickly closed my thread, so i'm posting here.

    Isnt this wierd? And what are they going to do, ban people who provide wrong country, so like, i chose China as my country, pay 10$, get 800 gems, then i'm banned for "selecting wrong country in the buy gems screen"? And if they arent going to ban, then what is the point to pay up in euro or pounds if you can pay less in dollars? Why pay extra?

    By you doing so you are breaking the law and avoiding taxes. ANet makes almost the same amount of money no matter what country you pick and ANet will charge the taxes by the laws of the country you have selected as your home. So lie and save a few bucks but if you get caught its your butt not ANets. 


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    2 Nanfoodle

    Erm... Please explain me what laws do i violate as a Russian citizen if i type "C" and press down 2 times and enter once in some computer program?

    By the way do you know that in Russia, EULA's and TOS'es digitally confirmed do not have any legal strength? Only signed ones? I can press "I ACCEPT EULA" and stuff in any kind of programs and violate that and its not a violation of any law and isnt accepted in court of order as a legal acceptance of said terms. But thats another story...

    Also, I dont have to pay taxes of a country I dont live in (so EU taxes dot not apply to me). Or do i? Could you explain this to me, why am I, Russian citizen, having to pay european VAT?

    PS: Also, my country's analog of VAT is unavoidable. You cannot "avoid paying taxes" - they are alraedy included in the price of purchase. If i pay 100 roubles for something it doesnt matter wether it is detailed (18 tax 82 price of goods) or not (100 for goods) tax is paid anyway, by the company who sells. Basically citizens pay no taxes at all, its the vendor who pays them. You can "avoid paying taxes" in russia only if you dont declare income, but not from purchases.

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,464Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    2 Nanfoodle

    Erm... Please explain me what laws do i violate as a Russian citizen if i type "C" and press down 2 times and enter once in some computer program?

    By the way do you know that in Russia, EULA's and TOS'es digitally confirmed do not have any legal strength? Only signed ones? I can press "I ACCEPT EULA" and stuff in any kind of programs and violate that and its not a violation of any law and isnt accepted in court of order as a legal acceptance of said terms. But thats another story...

    Also, I dont have to pay taxes of a country I dont live in (so EU taxes dot not apply to me). Or do i? Could you explain this to me, why am I, Russian citizen, having to pay european VAT?

    If what you say is true then go for it. Fact is NCsoft has to pay taxes for the digital sales in the country the customer lives. If they are charging you VAT that you should not be paying. Then what am I to say. IMO pay Caesar things to Caesar and ANet to ANet. My point is you can pick any country and ANet is not breaking the law but you should ask your self if you are and if its worth it to save a couple bucks.


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    2 Nanfoodle

    So basically you are saying that ANet are paying taxes for the money i pay them in any country? I have two questiosn for you then:

    1) When i chose Russia, what taxes do ANet pay in Russia? I dont recall them registering an office in Russia (basically its a SHITLOAD of problems so usually foreign companies dont bother). I doube they are. If they are not paying taxes in Russia, why do they charge us the bigger (tax-inclusive) price, in euro, then?

    2) So, from what you are saying, if i chose China, money (legally) goes to NCSoft's or ANet's office there? Now, we all know official statement from ANet is that 10$ price does not include taxes because in US you pay taxes separately to your own state. Now, in case of China, i dont believe policy is the same, is it? Last i heard, China doesnt have states.

    My ultimate question is "Why in case of money coming from Russia they have to charge me a tax, and in case of money coming from China they dont charge a tax?"

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,464Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI

    2 Nanfoodle

    So basically you are saying that ANet are paying taxes for the money i pay them in any country? I have two questiosn for you then:

    1) When i chose Russia, what taxes do ANet pay in Russia? I dont recall them registering an office in Russia (basically its a SHITLOAD of problems so usually foreign companies dont bother). I doube they are. If they are not paying taxes in Russia, why do they charge us the bigger (tax-inclusive) price, in euro, then?

    2) So, from what you are saying, if i chose China, money (legally) goes to NCSoft's or ANet's office there? Now, we all know official statement from ANet is that 10$ price does not include taxes because in US you pay taxes separately to your own state. Now, in case of China, i dont believe policy is the same, is it? Last i heard, China doesnt have states.

    My ultimate question is "Why in case of money coming from Russia they have to charge me a tax, and in case of money coming from China they dont charge a tax?"

    I tell you what, sounds like you think you have this all figured out and you dont sound like a total nut. So why dont you go ask NCSoft? Or if you think your butt is so covered, so do what you think you can get away with. But I know this, no money comes from a citizen of a country without it being taxed somehow. The goverment of every country always wants their cut and they almost always get it. Or are you saying NCSoft is just charging one group of their customers more just because they can? 


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member

    2 Nanfoodle

    As stated, i already sent a ticket to ANet, but as those take some time and i have bad experience talking with support, i made this thread so maybe someone can explain to me. Previousy on Reddit, explanation was given by ANet official but it only covers situation in US and EU union.

    I am indeed looking for only one thing: a sound explanation as to why Russian people have to pay 10 euro, while Chinese have to pay 10 dollar.

    If "everything is taxed" as you say (even though obviously not every transaction is taxed, i wont argue here because its irrelevant) then why arent Chinese paying 10 euro (tax included) as well?

    As a side interest, i'm looking for information on what happens if i specify wrong country. Because maybe someone had an experience or studied EULA and knows something i dont.

  • DanitaKusorDanitaKusor AdelaidePosts: 549Member Uncommon
    It could be worse you could get the "Australia Tax" where retailers charge you 50% more than the game is available for online.

    The Enlightened take things Lightly

  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member
    Yes i know it could be worse but i'm interested in this exact situation. Knowing that someone is screwed more than me doesnt give me any comfort or explain my situation.
  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,464Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IstrebiteI
    Yes i know it could be worse but i'm interested in this exact situation. Knowing that someone is screwed more than me doesnt give me any comfort or explain my situation.

    How much do you think you are over paying? 1-2 bucks?


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • IstrebiteIIstrebiteI SpbPosts: 266Member
    I'm overpaying exactly the difference between 1 euro and 1 dollar, multiplied by the amount of euro i'm going to spend on gems. Based on what's in the game, it seems 4000 gems is like minimum required to unlock all useful stuff like inventory/bank/char slots. So yes, i'm overpaying around 10 dollars or more.
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