Darkfall is all about what you do OUTSIDE of PvE and leveling.
You level and PvE in order to enable you to do things like:
Duel
Cap village control points
Sieges
Naval battles
City raids/defense
End game PvE
Crafting and Trade
Politics
Anyone who seriously thinkgs that requiring 20 hours of grinding instead of 400 is a bad thing is simply stupid. People don't play MMO's to sit attacking a monster alone for 400 hours, they play MMO's to interact with other people.
Darkfall is all about what you do OUTSIDE of PvE and leveling.
You level and PvE in order to enable you to do things like:
Duel
Cap village control points
Sieges
Naval battles
City raids/defense
End game PvE
Crafting and Trade
Politics
Anyone who seriously thinkgs that requiring 20 hours of grinding instead of 400 is a bad thing is simply stupid. People don't play MMO's to sit attacking a monster alone for 400 hours, they play MMO's to interact with other people.
NO OTHER MMO comes close to Darkfall in terms of:
Twitch based manual aiming PvP
Full loot open PvP
Large scale player driven sieges
Sandbox clan politics
You know what i did when lvling my first character...
I played and enjoyed the game, i joined in on all those things and didnt find it a grind at all.. i enjoyed my time in the game.
I guess back then not everyone was maxed out there was a good mix of players.. well that was until the first XP weekend then everyone was maxed out so yeah i guess for new starters now the stuff you listed is really only available for maxed out people..
What they need to do with DF2.0 is set the skill gain to what it was before today and reset everyone.. but they alo need to think about putting some kind of skill cap in otherwise it will just end up like it is now..
Darkfall is all about what you do OUTSIDE of PvE and leveling.
You level and PvE in order to enable you to do things like:
Duel
Cap village control points
Sieges
Naval battles
City raids/defense
End game PvE
Crafting and Trade
Politics
Anyone who seriously thinkgs that requiring 20 hours of grinding instead of 400 is a bad thing is simply stupid. People don't play MMO's to sit attacking a monster alone for 400 hours, they play MMO's to interact with other people.
NO OTHER MMO comes close to Darkfall in terms of:
Twitch based manual aiming PvP
Full loot open PvP
Large scale player driven sieges
Sandbox clan politics
You know what i did when lvling my first character...
I played and enjoyed the game, i joined in on all those things and didnt find it a grind at all.. i enjoyed my time in the game.
I guess back then not everyone was maxed out there was a good mix of players.. well that was until the first XP weekend then everyone was maxed out so yeah i guess for new starters now the stuff you listed is really only available for maxed out people..
What they need to do with DF2.0 is set the skill gain to what it was before today and reset everyone.. but they alo need to think about putting some kind of skill cap in otherwise it will just end up like it is now..
Soft skill caps are a main feature. While your able to learn every skill/spell in the game, you can only have some active. eg. You can have max fire and water magic, but can only have one of those sets of spells active at a time. They have also touched on armor playing a larger role into what spec you decide on.
I still say they should instamax everyone to 100 and be done with it. The game will be just as fun without having to skill grind. Instead youll be out doing stuff.
perosnally i think the 20x modifier should of been the speed at which you level from the start. The grind is way to hardcore and its counter productive to the style of the game. for darkfall 2.0 i hope leveling is super fast so we can all get onto an even pvp level after a couple of months of play.
NAh character development is part of the fun of an MMORPG without character development people get bored fast...
Maxed my main character out in the last XP weekend and played for a month after before i realised i now had nothnig to play for and quit..
I hope DF2.0 goes back to standard skill speeds otherwise they may as well start everyone maxed out..
Saying that Darkfall is great fun to play and with a populated server tis noe fo the best MMORPGs out there.
In a skill based game (vs a stat and tab target) character development comes from accumualtion of items, personal skill at aiming, experience and expertise at knowing who and how to fight, and the social interactions you build that are neccesary for survival.
I have just as much fun playing Battlefield 3 without unlocking everything, as I do with everythign unlocked. This is because the actual action is fun. I dont rely on carrots to keep me playing.
The thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.
DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.
Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
The thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.
DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.
Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
I disagree. I played this game for months.
Skill points/gear had everyything to do with. That's why it became the most macro invested game to have ever existed....
The thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.
DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.
Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
very true. grind to the top if you like it still takes a lot of skill and the difference between a mid and a top player is often just one extra hit. I know it takes skill because to be honest I am not all that good.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
The thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.
DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.
Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
I disagree. I played this game for months.
Skill points/gear had everyything to do with. That's why it became the most macro invested game to have ever existed....
it really doesnt, at least compared to other games. The difference between a mid level player and a top player is often just one hit over the entire battle. Yes there is a spread, but not nearly as wide as in other MMOs and the combat itself at high levels takes a f*ck ton of skill.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
This game need a skill cap. From the beginning. That is what ruined it. And you cannot go back and fix that.
First everyone macro'd up 2 handers. Then they started the magic schools. Then it was like fighting the same person over and over because everyone was the same lol. And if you fell behind on any of it you were fuct.
This game need a skill cap. From the beginning. That is what ruined it. And you cannot go back and fix that.
First everyone macro'd up 2 handers. Then they started the magic schools. Then it was like fighting the same person over and over because everyone was the same lol. And if you fell behind on any of it you were fuct.
what they should have done to fix it is to do what all MMOs do.
Once most of the server is close to max, make the skill gain crazy fast, then introduce new material new progression and as you say skill cap. New players will be able to 'max' out the 'old system' in lets say a week and then they wok on the new material and progreesion.
This is basically exactly what the mainstream MMOs did. When I first played EQ2. Level 20 was a long road. now its like 1/2 a day or something.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
It is still better PvP than any other MMO on the market. No other MMO out there can you have a group of 15 people wipe a group of 40 evenly geared and leveled people with ease.
With the 20x increases we will see a lot of new players and a lot of people becoming vet characters, and that will mean a lot more PvP. Will be interesting!
Only got to play a couple of hours today but man was it fun. You get spammed with skill gains for pretty much everything you do.
If the grind was holding you back before, definitely check it out now. The chat was buzzing with people, saw more people roaming around than I had ever seen. Clans declaring wars on each other etc.
I would say it's worth it. I'm surprised there isn't mention of this on the main page here on mmorpg.com. It's definitely one of the more exciting going on at the moment outside of TSW release.
Well I reinstalled and played for hours yesterday. I rerolled just to get a feeling for just how fast progression is, and was pleasantly surprised; I had almost forgotten that Darkfall actually is a really fun game. The combat system is great and the world is huge and atmospheric. Just running around doing PvE and exploring is a lot more fun than in most MMOs.
What used to cripple my fun in DF was the knowledge that I had months upon months, maybe even years, of grind ahead of me - it just didnt make sense to spend such ridiculous amounts of time just to be able to survive a PvP encounter. With the grind gone, it's like the core aspects of the game really start to shine. Now you'll level your char just by doing different stuff at a normal pace - like it should have been from the start.
Of course it's still not for everyone. FFA PvP with full loot will never be for everyone. But for those who like a challenge and some risk vs reward gameplay, it's well worth a shot. It will probably never be a perfect game, but given the state of current MMOs I'm glad that it's still around and that the servers might be a little more populated again, at least for a while.
I just wanted to paste something I said in another thread that I think is very true about why Darkfall is still the best MMO out there:
Keep telling yourself that the grind didn't kill the population.
No one wants to play a game where:
Vets constantly rape them and steal their loot They know it will take months of grinding to become a vet themselves
"Character development" in Darkfall was always meant to be done through building your bank, building your individual skill at playing, and building relationships with other players.
This whole "grind to win" thing just happened when some people decided they would rather hit bugged out mobs for hours on end instead of actually playing the game, and the competitive nature of the game forced everyone else to do the same thing in order to keep pace.
Even with the current skill gains, it will still take players HUNDREDS of hours to: -Advance all their skills -Learn to PvE -Learn to PvP -Learn to craft -Develop guild relationships -Learn to PvP in a group -Learn Darkfall politics
etc.
And even if you master all those things you have to consider: -You constantly need to buy regs -You constantly need to farm enchanting mats -You constantly need to farm rares for armor -You constantly need to practice to stay competitive in PvP
And then on top of that: -The political land scape is always changing -You need to make and break alliance to protect clan interests -You need to siege and defend holdings -You need to either plan, or assist with massive clan undertakings
AND EVEN ON TOP OF THAT: -Constant PvP at VCP's -Naval battles at sea towers -Community events -Wager duels
Anyone who thinks that reducing ONE of those aspects will mean that players will have nothing left to do in game is completely insane.
I just wanted to paste something I said in another thread that I think is very true about why Darkfall is still the best MMO out there:
Keep telling yourself that the grind didn't kill the population.
No one wants to play a game where:
Vets constantly rape them and steal their loot They know it will take months of grinding to become a vet themselves
"Character development" in Darkfall was always meant to be done through building your bank, building your individual skill at playing, and building relationships with other players.
This whole "grind to win" thing just happened when some people decided they would rather hit bugged out mobs for hours on end instead of actually playing the game, and the competitive nature of the game forced everyone else to do the same thing in order to keep pace.
Even with the current skill gains, it will still take players HUNDREDS of hours to: -Advance all their skills -Learn to PvE -Learn to PvP -Learn to craft -Develop guild relationships -Learn to PvP in a group -Learn Darkfall politics
etc.
And even if you master all those things you have to consider: -You constantly need to buy regs -You constantly need to farm enchanting mats -You constantly need to farm rares for armor -You constantly need to practice to stay competitive in PvP
And then on top of that: -The political land scape is always changing -You need to make and break alliance to protect clan interests -You need to siege and defend holdings -You need to either plan, or assist with massive clan undertakings
AND EVEN ON TOP OF THAT: -Constant PvP at VCP's -Naval battles at sea towers -Community events -Wager duels
Anyone who thinks that reducing ONE of those aspects will mean that players will have nothing left to do in game is completely insane.
this is all only part true.
1. its not true that vets will constantly gank you and take your stuff HOWEVER, you do have to be clever about where and how you plant yourself.
2. IF AND ONLY IF you want to compete with the people who play tons of hours then you will have to go thru all the ropes to be in that category of player. That is going to be true for every single solitary competitive anything worth competing for.
3. many people flat out do not have the stomach for defeat. They take it far to personal and then start to blame the game. The trick is to know your limits and be realistic. Taking me for example, I only attacked or took my pvp seriously if I had the first contact. If someone else has first contact on me its a mega HUGE advantage and I just assume I will lose in that case so I dont worry about it.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Originally posted by UzikThe thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
I disagree. I played this game for months.
Skill points/gear had everyything to do with. That's why it became the most macro invested game to have ever existed....
Look through youtube, and you will find some movies where elite players kill some maxed noobs with pretty average characters and crappy gear.
Comments
Darkfall is all about what you do OUTSIDE of PvE and leveling.
You level and PvE in order to enable you to do things like:
Duel
Cap village control points
Sieges
Naval battles
City raids/defense
End game PvE
Crafting and Trade
Politics
Anyone who seriously thinkgs that requiring 20 hours of grinding instead of 400 is a bad thing is simply stupid. People don't play MMO's to sit attacking a monster alone for 400 hours, they play MMO's to interact with other people.
NO OTHER MMO comes close to Darkfall in terms of:
Twitch based manual aiming PvP
Full loot open PvP
Large scale player driven sieges
Sandbox clan politics
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
You know what i did when lvling my first character...
I played and enjoyed the game, i joined in on all those things and didnt find it a grind at all.. i enjoyed my time in the game.
I guess back then not everyone was maxed out there was a good mix of players.. well that was until the first XP weekend then everyone was maxed out so yeah i guess for new starters now the stuff you listed is really only available for maxed out people..
What they need to do with DF2.0 is set the skill gain to what it was before today and reset everyone.. but they alo need to think about putting some kind of skill cap in otherwise it will just end up like it is now..
Soft skill caps are a main feature. While your able to learn every skill/spell in the game, you can only have some active. eg. You can have max fire and water magic, but can only have one of those sets of spells active at a time. They have also touched on armor playing a larger role into what spec you decide on.
I am trying to understand how anyone would think a change in price would actually change the game without the developers making code changes.
its not like the game is going to be any better for some of you simply because the price dropped.
I personally liked it at any price point.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
This isn't accurate.
They are changing the grind and a few other things.
Most noteable is for the free days 20x still up to vastly reduce the grind.
Grind was a big reason a lot of people left the game.
http://www.darkfallonline.com/blog/?p=3247
You will not understand it because it's not for the price but for skill gain.
I still say they should instamax everyone to 100 and be done with it. The game will be just as fun without having to skill grind. Instead youll be out doing stuff.
In a skill based game (vs a stat and tab target) character development comes from accumualtion of items, personal skill at aiming, experience and expertise at knowing who and how to fight, and the social interactions you build that are neccesary for survival.
I have just as much fun playing Battlefield 3 without unlocking everything, as I do with everythign unlocked. This is because the actual action is fun. I dont rely on carrots to keep me playing.
The thing people are forgetting is that a max character means little against a maxed character that knows how to play, and has good gear.
DF isn't WoW. You can't just mash a few keys and deal out massive damage. There is A LOT of skill required in knowing what to do, how to move, aiming spells and arrows, melee exchanges, blocking and disengaging etc.
Character development in Darkfall is about building your player skills, bank, guild and reputation. Character development through grinding is for themepark MMO's.
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
I disagree. I played this game for months.
Skill points/gear had everyything to do with. That's why it became the most macro invested game to have ever existed....
BigCountry | Head Hunters | www.wefarmpeople.com
very true. grind to the top if you like it still takes a lot of skill and the difference between a mid and a top player is often just one extra hit. I know it takes skill because to be honest I am not all that good.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
it really doesnt, at least compared to other games. The difference between a mid level player and a top player is often just one hit over the entire battle. Yes there is a spread, but not nearly as wide as in other MMOs and the combat itself at high levels takes a f*ck ton of skill.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
This game need a skill cap. From the beginning. That is what ruined it. And you cannot go back and fix that.
First everyone macro'd up 2 handers. Then they started the magic schools. Then it was like fighting the same person over and over because everyone was the same lol. And if you fell behind on any of it you were fuct.
BigCountry | Head Hunters | www.wefarmpeople.com
what they should have done to fix it is to do what all MMOs do.
Once most of the server is close to max, make the skill gain crazy fast, then introduce new material new progression and as you say skill cap. New players will be able to 'max' out the 'old system' in lets say a week and then they wok on the new material and progreesion.
This is basically exactly what the mainstream MMOs did. When I first played EQ2. Level 20 was a long road. now its like 1/2 a day or something.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I would be cool with that
Just needs somehting.
BigCountry | Head Hunters | www.wefarmpeople.com
It is still better PvP than any other MMO on the market. No other MMO out there can you have a group of 15 people wipe a group of 40 evenly geared and leveled people with ease.
With the 20x increases we will see a lot of new players and a lot of people becoming vet characters, and that will mean a lot more PvP. Will be interesting!
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
quit 2 years ago, guess I'm coming back
Only got to play a couple of hours today but man was it fun. You get spammed with skill gains for pretty much everything you do.
If the grind was holding you back before, definitely check it out now. The chat was buzzing with people, saw more people roaming around than I had ever seen. Clans declaring wars on each other etc.
I would say it's worth it. I'm surprised there isn't mention of this on the main page here on mmorpg.com. It's definitely one of the more exciting going on at the moment outside of TSW release.
Well I reinstalled and played for hours yesterday. I rerolled just to get a feeling for just how fast progression is, and was pleasantly surprised; I had almost forgotten that Darkfall actually is a really fun game. The combat system is great and the world is huge and atmospheric. Just running around doing PvE and exploring is a lot more fun than in most MMOs.
What used to cripple my fun in DF was the knowledge that I had months upon months, maybe even years, of grind ahead of me - it just didnt make sense to spend such ridiculous amounts of time just to be able to survive a PvP encounter. With the grind gone, it's like the core aspects of the game really start to shine. Now you'll level your char just by doing different stuff at a normal pace - like it should have been from the start.
Of course it's still not for everyone. FFA PvP with full loot will never be for everyone. But for those who like a challenge and some risk vs reward gameplay, it's well worth a shot. It will probably never be a perfect game, but given the state of current MMOs I'm glad that it's still around and that the servers might be a little more populated again, at least for a while.
I dont suppose they changed magic hopping over walls. That always pissed me off.
I want to play but it's just bad timing.
With DayZ, TSW, and the holiday, I am simply not going to be able to find the time....
BigCountry | Head Hunters | www.wefarmpeople.com
You can only do it with some spells, but people do it a lot less now since managing stamina is really important in fights.
Also, jumping in the air makes it extremely easy to land rays or arrows on the person's back.
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
I just wanted to paste something I said in another thread that I think is very true about why Darkfall is still the best MMO out there:
Keep telling yourself that the grind didn't kill the population.
No one wants to play a game where:
Vets constantly rape them and steal their loot
They know it will take months of grinding to become a vet themselves
"Character development" in Darkfall was always meant to be done through building your bank, building your individual skill at playing, and building relationships with other players.
This whole "grind to win" thing just happened when some people decided they would rather hit bugged out mobs for hours on end instead of actually playing the game, and the competitive nature of the game forced everyone else to do the same thing in order to keep pace.
Even with the current skill gains, it will still take players HUNDREDS of hours to:
-Advance all their skills
-Learn to PvE
-Learn to PvP
-Learn to craft
-Develop guild relationships
-Learn to PvP in a group
-Learn Darkfall politics
etc.
And even if you master all those things you have to consider:
-You constantly need to buy regs
-You constantly need to farm enchanting mats
-You constantly need to farm rares for armor
-You constantly need to practice to stay competitive in PvP
And then on top of that:
-The political land scape is always changing
-You need to make and break alliance to protect clan interests
-You need to siege and defend holdings
-You need to either plan, or assist with massive clan undertakings
AND EVEN ON TOP OF THAT:
-Constant PvP at VCP's
-Naval battles at sea towers
-Community events
-Wager duels
Anyone who thinks that reducing ONE of those aspects will mean that players will have nothing left to do in game is completely insane.
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
this is all only part true.
1. its not true that vets will constantly gank you and take your stuff HOWEVER, you do have to be clever about where and how you plant yourself.
2. IF AND ONLY IF you want to compete with the people who play tons of hours then you will have to go thru all the ropes to be in that category of player. That is going to be true for every single solitary competitive anything worth competing for.
3. many people flat out do not have the stomach for defeat. They take it far to personal and then start to blame the game. The trick is to know your limits and be realistic. Taking me for example, I only attacked or took my pvp seriously if I had the first contact. If someone else has first contact on me its a mega HUGE advantage and I just assume I will lose in that case so I dont worry about it.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Look through youtube, and you will find some movies where elite players kill some maxed noobs with pretty average characters and crappy gear.