Have they not realised that WoW is the only MMO that appeals to casuals? WoW has something about it that makes casuals go crazy. It's like the iPhone.
Blizzard has proven again that it's not easy to please the casuals! Why do companies try to copy Blizzard? Have they not realised that only Blizzard can do this because they are just the superior company?
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
I never said, "You", in regards to the game's failure, though it seems implied in my post. It is a recurring theme in this thread and others that SWToR has somehow failed or is a fail game. This whole thread is dedicated to that idea.
SWToR sold more than 1.7 million boxes. That exceeded their expectations. Their expectation was 'a million subs', but there was never any time limit given. 500,000 was the profitable point. But I never mentioned their expectations, I'm just saying, they're making money and SWToR is making money. It's a profitable game.
They've kept more than half their player base after 6 months. If they've watched the industry at all the past several years, this in itself is exceptional compared to the industry at large. They've made money off the game, which they've put in their pockets. This wouldn't be happening if the game was as bad as it's supposed to be based on posts in this thread, and on these forums.
** edit **
Guesses and XFire. I wanted to work that in there somewhere, but it just didn't happen. Presented by EA, documentation. Presented on these forums, guesses and XFire numbers.
Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though....
Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here.
...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Have they not realised that WoW is the only MMO that appeals to casuals? WoW has something about it that makes casuals go crazy. It's like the iPhone.
Blizzard has proven again that it's not easy to please the casuals! Why do companies try to copy Blizzard? Have they not realised that only Blizzard can do this because they are just the superior company?
I think game game devs need to realise that if people wanted to play WoW, they'd play WoW. Cloning a game poorly and expecting people to stick with thier game is unrealistic.Instead they will stick with/or go back to the more established (original), better playing game with all the bells and whistles.
"When questioned about the game's performance, EA CEO John Riccitiello responded that The Old Republic was not as important as its "top five" flagship franchises, such as Battlefield, FIFA and Mass Effect."
So many extremely dated and poor design decisions and even worse implementation. I can see why they post inflated numbers and give free time to everyone including their dog and house cat. If I was a corporate spin man or a decision maker - I guess I'd have to do that to keep my family fed too.
Sov you are 100% correct, this guy is a complete IDIOT. I am a casual- soft core (he he) player and I have about 6 alts that I am running up throught the system, but my most advanced alt is lvl 33, it is people like me who keep swtor going not the hardcore who zoom through and than say what next. That guy should apologize or all of us will leave
but its very obvious u dont like the game much so u keep making alts instead of leveling up ur char to max first. Too boring at high level? same grinding quest past 30s? u c my point.
err have you played mmo's before? Part of the fun is playing alts, especially in a game like swtor where the story line is different for each character or even a game like WOW where each starting area is different. I am commenting on the original posters questions and comments so I dont see your point unless your point is to be a troll in which case you have succeded
Err, haven't you posted an "I Quit" thread?
glad you are reading my posts, want me to send you up dates LOL, you are right I did quit because it was getting to easy, but was convinced to come back by friends who swear it gets harder in later levels. we will see, I still like the game but like any objective person I can see the good and the bad unlike many forum posters.
Originally posted by Wickedjelly Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though.... Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here. ...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Sov you are 100% correct, this guy is a complete IDIOT. I am a casual- soft core (he he) player and I have about 6 alts that I am running up throught the system, but my most advanced alt is lvl 33, it is people like me who keep swtor going not the hardcore who zoom through and than say what next. That guy should apologize or all of us will leave
but its very obvious u dont like the game much so u keep making alts instead of leveling up ur char to max first. Too boring at high level? same grinding quest past 30s? u c my point.
err have you played mmo's before? Part of the fun is playing alts, especially in a game like swtor where the story line is different for each character or even a game like WOW where each starting area is different. I am commenting on the original posters questions and comments so I dont see your point unless your point is to be a troll in which case you have succeded
Err isn't the different story only 10% and the rest is the same side quest as all other classes in the same faction? I can level a toon on both factions and then use YouTube for a few minutes of class stories to save myself a lot of time.
LOL why would you use YouTube to see the story line before you actually play the story line. You have just ruined the great story quests for yourself! Oh well to each his own
It's not the casuals or the hardcored fault. The fault is with BW/EA, first off they lied to the players. I remember their very first interviews were they were saying that the game was going to have a casual focus from lvl 1 to endgame. Raiding and instance grinding wasnt suppose to be the sole focus of the endgame, but guess what they bowed to all those raiders and groupers that cried foul over this.
Next they said their endgame was suppose to be something new and different, something never before seen in an MMO. Newsflash I have done raiding in WoW and Rift, I have grinded heriocs in WoW and Rift, and I have done instance pvp in WoW and Rift. The solo/pvp planet turned into an unfun daily grind, so basically we are still doing the same stuff at endgame that was did before ToR. Where is this new and exciting never seen before endgame, I still have yet to discover it.
The herioc quests are like those elite quests in WoW that people never did, so that was a fail there. Because people just skip those quests altogether or they roll a Sorc/Sage or Merc/Commando and solo them. Updates focus more on adding more raids and flashpoints, and nothing for casuals at endgame: nothing but more daily grinding. Yeah the leveling game is very casual friendly, but what about the endgame there is nothing casual about it. Unless you like rolling alts and some classes really are not worth it, since some of the voice acting is just horrible im looking at you JK/JC male voiceovers.
Oh and the crafting idea was just terrible spending several minutes to an hour just to craft one item, by the time you finish the whole process. You'll probably been done out leveled what you started crafting. Honestly I was a hardcore supporter of this game, but they just went in a whole different direction from what was intended. But I guess I should have expected that when they said WoW was the model that they where going with. So no it is not the casuals or the hardcores to blame, it is EA/BW to blame for this whole mess of a game. Sorry for the essay, but I had to get that off of my chest.
"When questioned about the game's performance, EA CEO John Riccitiello responded that The Old Republic was not as important as its "top five" flagship franchises, such as Battlefield, FIFA and Mass Effect."
Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though....
Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here.
...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
Based on how retail sales work, I find it unlikely that they have recouped their initial investment at this point. I would not disagree that the current subscription revenue exceeds operating costs of SWTOR, but I do not believe for a second that all of the costs that went into the development and marketing of the game have been recovered within 4 months of release. If the financial reports specifically state that the initial investment has been recovered, I will admit I am wrong. Don't really have time to read them.
When a company has lost touch this much with what the consumer really wants, they deserve to loose money. They can blame it on the consumer all they want to appease their investors but hopefully the investors will loose confidence in their ability to deliver games that people want to and will continue to play forcing some changes at EA. Sure it's important to have people that are good a business but is it to much to have actual gamers working at EA? And I'm not just talking about their dev studios. EA itself needs gamers that understand gamers and investors. Not just investors.
I bought the game and they had a great chance at keeping me. They just needed to deliver at max level.
I love star wars, the original trilogy, but I also love lots of other things as well. A game needs to be well designed. I won't pay you every month just because it has Star Wars attached to it.
Sov you are 100% correct, this guy is a complete IDIOT. I am a casual- soft core (he he) player and I have about 6 alts that I am running up throught the system, but my most advanced alt is lvl 33, it is people like me who keep swtor going not the hardcore who zoom through and than say what next. That guy should apologize or all of us will leave
but its very obvious u dont like the game much so u keep making alts instead of leveling up ur char to max first. Too boring at high level? same grinding quest past 30s? u c my point.
err have you played mmo's before? Part of the fun is playing alts, especially in a game like swtor where the story line is different for each character or even a game like WOW where each starting area is different. I am commenting on the original posters questions and comments so I dont see your point unless your point is to be a troll in which case you have succeded
Err isn't the different story only 10% and the rest is the same side quest as all other classes in the same faction? I can level a toon on both factions and then use YouTube for a few minutes of class stories to save myself a lot of time.
LOL why would you use YouTube to see the story line before you actually play the story line. You have just ruined the great story quests for yourself! Oh well to each his own
To save myself the same go fetch missions over and over again? Maybe? Yeah I bet that's it.
I'm still looking for that 200 hours of unique story per class as advertised.
Originally posted by Wickedjelly Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall.
Would you mind to back up some of your claims?
I would like to know the source of your claim " "approach break-even" at 1 million paying subscribers" as well as from where you pull out overall box sales and sales expectations.
You talk all the time what EA expectations are but you never provide a source.
Regarding how much subscribers EA was "expecting", you can check the link here:
"When questioned about the game's performance, EA CEO John Riccitiello responded that The Old Republic was not as important as its "top five" flagship franchises, such as Battlefield, FIFA and Mass Effect."
They keep digging the hole don't they? I bet they don't even have the sense to use explosives instead of a spoon for a hole this large.
The next quarter report for ea is not going to be so good. I would supsect investors are not going to be too happy with the dirrection that swtor has taken.
Well, I pretty much agreee with them. Look, the game has it's short comings. No doubt about it but a large number of the people who have left the game probably are casual players. So, I don't find their statement untruthful. And I'm sure they had looked at the players who had subscribed and the number of hours they've logged and came to the conclusion that the majority of the players who left just weren't, in general, players who logged on for large number of hours but... I know... it's fashinonable to hate on EA for...well... everything.
Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though....
Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here.
...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
This little part here is funny to me since just 2 months ago investors recieved a statement from EA stating that SW:TOR had underperformed in both box sales, and retention. Also anyone who believes this game has held more then 50% of its subscriptions is wearing some rose tinted glasses. As of April 1st they are claiming a 30% drop in subscriptions with their inflated numbers and that includes counting all trial accounts, and accounts that keep getting gifted free game time even though they were closed months ago, and all accounts who purchased 6 months of game time initially and are no longer actively participating in the game.
Originally posted by killion81 Originally posted by lizardbones
Originally posted by Wickedjelly
Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though.... Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here. ...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
Based on how retail sales work, I find it unlikely that they have recouped their initial investment at this point. I would not disagree that the current subscription revenue exceeds operating costs of SWTOR, but I do not believe for a second that all of the costs that went into the development and marketing of the game have been recovered within 4 months of release. If the financial reports specifically state that the initial investment has been recovered, I will admit I am wrong. Don't really have time to read them.
Financial reports say that they are currently making money and compared to the same time last year, they are making a lot of money. I haven't seen anything specific on recouping their investment or paying the game off.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Comments
Again the developer blames the consumer for not sticking with something they don't like... HOW DARE YOU!
Have they not realised that WoW is the only MMO that appeals to casuals? WoW has something about it that makes casuals go crazy. It's like the iPhone.
Blizzard has proven again that it's not easy to please the casuals! Why do companies try to copy Blizzard? Have they not realised that only Blizzard can do this because they are just the superior company?
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Their box sales have not exceeded their expectations overall. Initial sales obviously did. Believe it even broke records did it not? Since that time it has dropped off dramatically. They did incredibly well initially. Anyones saying different is simply being ignorant. The question is now though....
Sales are dropping off. The subs are going down. Over a million at this point but on the same token they lost over 24% of their player base within the last quarter. Is this going to continue or is this where it levels off? Really a big question for this game considering their investment and where things go from here.
...and this is all happening before some games come on the market that could very easily bite into the same market SWTOR is fighting for.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I think game game devs need to realise that if people wanted to play WoW, they'd play WoW. Cloning a game poorly and expecting people to stick with thier game is unrealistic.Instead they will stick with/or go back to the more established (original), better playing game with all the bells and whistles.
What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot
I think this actually speaks for itself, and where they, themselves know how the game is doing/going.
SWTOR is no longer a top 5 game for Arts of Electronica:
http://www.shacknews.com/article/73691/star-wars-the-old-republic-not-a-top-5-game
"When questioned about the game's performance, EA CEO John Riccitiello responded that The Old Republic was not as important as its "top five" flagship franchises, such as Battlefield, FIFA and Mass Effect."
Last Quarter
http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/ERTS/1855246619x0x539144/d895626f-e715-4f00-bd50-31bf095027fd/Q3_Script_-_20_2112_1251pm.pdf
"Star Wars: The Old Republic is going to be an important factor in next year’s results, and
there could be a wide range of outcomes. We will be able to provide more informed total
company guidance once we have better insight on the trajectory of Star Wars"
What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot
So many extremely dated and poor design decisions and even worse implementation. I can see why they post inflated numbers and give free time to everyone including their dog and house cat. If I was a corporate spin man or a decision maker - I guess I'd have to do that to keep my family fed too.
I give their design decisions 1/10.
I give their execution 1/10
I give their game 1/10
I give Bioware a 1/10
I give EA a 1/10
This is just insulting
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
glad you are reading my posts, want me to send you up dates LOL, you are right I did quit because it was getting to easy, but was convinced to come back by friends who swear it gets harder in later levels. we will see, I still like the game but like any objective person I can see the good and the bad unlike many forum posters.
Too bad you can all jump to Jita and shoot the monuments.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
LOL why would you use YouTube to see the story line before you actually play the story line. You have just ruined the great story quests for yourself! Oh well to each his own
It's not the casuals or the hardcored fault. The fault is with BW/EA, first off they lied to the players. I remember their very first interviews were they were saying that the game was going to have a casual focus from lvl 1 to endgame. Raiding and instance grinding wasnt suppose to be the sole focus of the endgame, but guess what they bowed to all those raiders and groupers that cried foul over this.
Next they said their endgame was suppose to be something new and different, something never before seen in an MMO. Newsflash I have done raiding in WoW and Rift, I have grinded heriocs in WoW and Rift, and I have done instance pvp in WoW and Rift. The solo/pvp planet turned into an unfun daily grind, so basically we are still doing the same stuff at endgame that was did before ToR. Where is this new and exciting never seen before endgame, I still have yet to discover it.
The herioc quests are like those elite quests in WoW that people never did, so that was a fail there. Because people just skip those quests altogether or they roll a Sorc/Sage or Merc/Commando and solo them. Updates focus more on adding more raids and flashpoints, and nothing for casuals at endgame: nothing but more daily grinding. Yeah the leveling game is very casual friendly, but what about the endgame there is nothing casual about it. Unless you like rolling alts and some classes really are not worth it, since some of the voice acting is just horrible im looking at you JK/JC male voiceovers.
Oh and the crafting idea was just terrible spending several minutes to an hour just to craft one item, by the time you finish the whole process. You'll probably been done out leveled what you started crafting. Honestly I was a hardcore supporter of this game, but they just went in a whole different direction from what was intended. But I guess I should have expected that when they said WoW was the model that they where going with. So no it is not the casuals or the hardcores to blame, it is EA/BW to blame for this whole mess of a game. Sorry for the essay, but I had to get that off of my chest.
LOL yeah and if it wasn't so important then why are they pulling devs from other games to fix it?
http://www.develop-online.net/news/40736/Pachter-Dragon-Age-3-devs-loaned-to-SWTOR
They keep digging the hole don't they? I bet they don't even have the sense to use explosives instead of a spoon for a hole this large.
Based on how retail sales work, I find it unlikely that they have recouped their initial investment at this point. I would not disagree that the current subscription revenue exceeds operating costs of SWTOR, but I do not believe for a second that all of the costs that went into the development and marketing of the game have been recovered within 4 months of release. If the financial reports specifically state that the initial investment has been recovered, I will admit I am wrong. Don't really have time to read them.
When a company has lost touch this much with what the consumer really wants, they deserve to loose money. They can blame it on the consumer all they want to appease their investors but hopefully the investors will loose confidence in their ability to deliver games that people want to and will continue to play forcing some changes at EA. Sure it's important to have people that are good a business but is it to much to have actual gamers working at EA? And I'm not just talking about their dev studios. EA itself needs gamers that understand gamers and investors. Not just investors.
Build a game catered for casuals, then blame them as the main reason for failing.
lol.
I bought the game and they had a great chance at keeping me. They just needed to deliver at max level.
I love star wars, the original trilogy, but I also love lots of other things as well. A game needs to be well designed. I won't pay you every month just because it has Star Wars attached to it.
I find his comments quite insulting.
To save myself the same go fetch missions over and over again? Maybe? Yeah I bet that's it.
I'm still looking for that 200 hours of unique story per class as advertised.
lol @ casuals.
players that got lvl 50 in 1 or 2 weeks called casuals
Would you mind to back up some of your claims?
I would like to know the source of your claim " "approach break-even" at 1 million paying subscribers" as well as from where you pull out overall box sales and sales expectations.
You talk all the time what EA expectations are but you never provide a source.
Regarding how much subscribers EA was "expecting", you can check the link here:
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/32784/EA_Old_Republic_MMO_To_Show_Profit_With_500000_Subscribers.php
The next quarter report for ea is not going to be so good. I would supsect investors are not going to be too happy with the dirrection that swtor has taken.
Well, I pretty much agreee with them. Look, the game has it's short comings. No doubt about it but a large number of the people who have left the game probably are casual players. So, I don't find their statement untruthful. And I'm sure they had looked at the players who had subscribed and the number of hours they've logged and came to the conclusion that the majority of the players who left just weren't, in general, players who logged on for large number of hours but... I know... it's fashinonable to hate on EA for...well... everything.
This little part here is funny to me since just 2 months ago investors recieved a statement from EA stating that SW:TOR had underperformed in both box sales, and retention. Also anyone who believes this game has held more then 50% of its subscriptions is wearing some rose tinted glasses. As of April 1st they are claiming a 30% drop in subscriptions with their inflated numbers and that includes counting all trial accounts, and accounts that keep getting gifted free game time even though they were closed months ago, and all accounts who purchased 6 months of game time initially and are no longer actively participating in the game.
i think eas tryin 2 kill off th game they wanted th money but not th game
since it "competes" w uo if its still running guess they avnt learnt yet tht tht scifi mmops usually attracts diffrent group o players thn fantasy.
Box sales or digital sales doesn't matter. The game sold a lot more than they expected. More than anyone expected.
Of course sales are dropping off and subs are going down. There does not exist a game released since WoW where this hasn't happened. A rational person would look at every single game that's released since WoW, watched the pattern and then realized they have a finite period of time to make money off of a game. This pattern hasn't changed and there's no reason to think SWToR will be any different.
I say the fact that they can wipe their butts with money means they've succeeded. The fact that most games by the 6 month mark have 50% or less of their initial subscriptions means they've succeeded. They didn't make the game I wanted (I wanted the story to remain the focus of the game, but they wandered), but that doesn't mean they've failed or that any doom and gloom prediction is anything other than wishful thinking.
Based on how retail sales work, I find it unlikely that they have recouped their initial investment at this point. I would not disagree that the current subscription revenue exceeds operating costs of SWTOR, but I do not believe for a second that all of the costs that went into the development and marketing of the game have been recovered within 4 months of release. If the financial reports specifically state that the initial investment has been recovered, I will admit I am wrong. Don't really have time to read them.
Financial reports say that they are currently making money and compared to the same time last year, they are making a lot of money. I haven't seen anything specific on recouping their investment or paying the game off.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.