I dont see why no lifers who spend 30-40 hours a week should have a huge gear advantage on me.
Allow me to provide you a different perspective. I am employed older and stable. I can't spend 40 hours a week on a game, never have been able to really. I make more than enough money to really win in a pay 2 win type game, especially given that most of my competition would consist of teens and 20 somethings either still living at home or living on rammen noodles. I am against cash shops because you're bringing real world economic(purchasing) power into my fantasy world, you know the place I go to get away from it all. A game in my eyes is sullied by the addition of cash shops. This is just my opinion. I will get flamed for this, but this is how i feel about it.
Not flames! Respect!
You expressed your opinion w/o going all ad hominem on anyone. /goodjob
Personally if it's aesthetic items, mounts or timed xp runes etc. I can live with it.
If you cut it too short you can always nail a piece on the end.
If you cut it too long then what the hell are you gonna do?
Some people's hate for microtransactions is so irrational at times that no matter how trivial the cash shop is, the rage will continue.
What's funny is that most of these people who hate cash shop are probably pay a subscription fee to an MMO which has a cash shop as well. It's OK for Blizzard, EA, Funcom and Turbine to have one but as soon as ANet does it, GW2 is pay2win.
I've noticed that the opposite is true. Many people have bashed EA, Funcom, Turbine, PWE, Cryptic, etc relentlessly as being greedy and pay to win because of their cash shops.
Suddenly, many of those same people are now singing the praises of cash shops, and how they have no impact on the game, simply because, well, now it's GW2.
In short, the mantra here appears to be: if another game does it, it's horrible, but if GW2 does the exact same thing, it's awesome. It's plain, flat-out dishonest.
Welcome to GW2 forums where Anet gets free pass on everything. if you spend some time checking post history of these CS defenders you will find out how they bashed other companies for doing the same. Most of them are either bi polar or have very weak memories.
The difference is that ANet's cash shop does not offer any pay2win items and most of those items will be attainable just by playing the game. Personaly, I don't see any harm in a cash shop like that, especially when there is no subscription fee involved.
Now if ANet starts selling items that actually give an unfair advantage, then that would be a different story.
you can buy gems, and then use those to buy gold... so, they're selling gold. And if you're able to convince yourself that in-game gold buys nothing that gives you any kind of advantage, then how can anyone possibly prove otherwise?
XP potions are an advantage, are they not? Having better gear NOW is an advantage over having better gear later, is it not?
Maybe you're fine with the advantages, but that doesn't stop them from being just that...
Leveling doesn't mean much in GW2. If you're level 80 and visit a level 20 zone, you get scaled to level 20. You get weapon skills by fighting and other skills via skill points that are attainable by perfoming various tasks in the game and you can't buy those. In PvP, everyone get's scaled to level 80, so your XP potion means zilch.
As far as gold goes, you get the best items in the game via karma you get by completing events and quests, not gold. So you can sell the gems to other players (not NPCs) for gold but being isanely rich won't mean much, since you still can't get the best items with gold and you can't trade/sell karma.
You cannot buy gear in the cash shop.
Any other issues you have?
You can buy gems in the cash shop, which you can use to buy gold, which you can use to buy gear... which means you can buy gear in the cash shop.
Now you want to argue that only the BEST items in the game can't be bought with gold... but all of the rest can? And buying these items will help you to EARN the best gear, thus still giving you an advantage.
And if you refuse to see how an XP potion is an advantage, no amount of common sense will get through to you.
you're failing to see that your level / gear is fairly meaningless in the grand scheme of things...
Lol he really is. H e did in like every single thread, actually every single person to shout p2w, pay to get an advatange hasn't not once explain how it is with GW 2's mechanics.
*Gasp* So it doesn't work like Eve and WoW [game] wise, maybe cash shop wise, but not [game] wise lol.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
I'm ok with Guild Wars 2 having microtransactions that save busy players time... thats cool... I've played many other games like that. Except... I didn't have to PAY A SINGLE PENNY FOR THE CLIENT.
Guild Wars 2 should be downloadable for free if they are going to have a significant cash shop.
No way I'm paying for the client. Sounds like this cash shop is going to have way more then just cosmetic items. That is full blown F2P with cash shop game. Give us the client for free.
It's not a significant cash shop though. The cash shop is completely optional. That's the point. It offers certain items for cash, items that can be acquired in the game just by playing it.
This isn't exactly obvious yet, it also depends on what you mean by optional. Say the infamous "mystic key" is something you need to open a type of loot in game, is it still completely optional? Optional to me means there's nothing in-game effected by it.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
I dont see why no lifers who spend 30-40 hours a week should have a huge gear advantage on me.
Because they're actually playing the game and earning their progression?
It doesn't matter this won't exist in GW2.
GW2 is skill based not gear based.
does......... not........... compute -_- how can i be expected to be awesome without funneling my life into gear grinding... i dont understand this concept and that must mean game = pay2win
This isn't exactly obvious yet, it also depends on what you mean by optional. Say the infamous "mystic key" is something you need to open a type of loot in game, is it still completely optional? Optional to me means there's nothing in-game effected by it.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
Until this is actually confirmed by A-net, not covered under an NDA and is released that way, this is not accurate in my mind.
Besides as another poster said, an item being in game doesn't mean it's a fair implementation of that item. For all I know it could take 5 hours to grind for a key yet cost 50 cents to buy one.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
This isn't exactly obvious yet, it also depends on what you mean by optional. Say the infamous "mystic key" is something you need to open a type of loot in game, is it still completely optional? Optional to me means there's nothing in-game effected by it.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
Until this is actually confirmed by A-net, not covered under an NDA and is released that way, this is not accurate in my mind.
Besides as another poster said, and item being in game doesn't mean it's a fair implementation of taht item. For all I know it could take 5 hours to grind for a key yet cost 50 cents to buy one.
n yet the game is in beta, and gets patched multiple times daily.. guess they couldnt change drop rates if they found them to be wrong or unbalanced... not trying to troll you just saying, NDA was left on because the game is incomplete and what is in beta now could be completely different tomorrow... i'm guessing the exemptions press had was on features that couldnt possibly get an overhaul and just require tweaking.. anything under NDA is still under review / implementation, that being said.. until the end of april when "prepurchase" beta testers get to play in what they're saying will be.. well sorry at this stage they're saying prepurchase beta testers wont be under NDA, then maybe people can start to jump up and down.. but i honestly think people should wait till we have some solid / concrete information about how it's all gonna work
This isn't exactly obvious yet, it also depends on what you mean by optional. Say the infamous "mystic key" is something you need to open a type of loot in game, is it still completely optional? Optional to me means there's nothing in-game effected by it.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
Until this is actually confirmed by A-net, not covered under an NDA and is released that way, this is not accurate in my mind.
Besides as another poster said, and item being in game doesn't mean it's a fair implementation of taht item. For all I know it could take 5 hours to grind for a key yet cost 50 cents to buy one.
n yet the game is in beta, and gets patched multiple times daily.. guess they couldnt change drop rates if they found them to be wrong or unbalanced... not trying to troll you just saying, NDA was left on because the game is incomplete and what is in beta now could be completely different tomorrow... i'm guessing the exemptions press had was on features that couldnt possibly get an overhaul and just require tweaking.. anything under NDA is still under review / implementation, that being said.. until the end of april when "prepurchase" beta testers get to play in what they're saying will be.. well sorry at this stage they're saying prepurchase beta testers wont be under NDA, then maybe people can start to jump up and down.. but i honestly think people should wait till we have some solid / concrete information about how it's all gonna work
I understand the NDA aspects of this post, but I can't agree that players should wait until it's set in stone to talk about this.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
This isn't exactly obvious yet, it also depends on what you mean by optional. Say the infamous "mystic key" is something you need to open a type of loot in game, is it still completely optional? Optional to me means there's nothing in-game effected by it.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
Until this is actually confirmed by A-net, not covered under an NDA and is released that way, this is not accurate in my mind.
Besides as another poster said, and item being in game doesn't mean it's a fair implementation of taht item. For all I know it could take 5 hours to grind for a key yet cost 50 cents to buy one.
n yet the game is in beta, and gets patched multiple times daily.. guess they couldnt change drop rates if they found them to be wrong or unbalanced... not trying to troll you just saying, NDA was left on because the game is incomplete and what is in beta now could be completely different tomorrow... i'm guessing the exemptions press had was on features that couldnt possibly get an overhaul and just require tweaking.. anything under NDA is still under review / implementation, that being said.. until the end of april when "prepurchase" beta testers get to play in what they're saying will be.. well sorry at this stage they're saying prepurchase beta testers wont be under NDA, then maybe people can start to jump up and down.. but i honestly think people should wait till we have some solid / concrete information about how it's all gonna work
I understand the NDA aspects of this post, but I can't agree that players should wait until it's set in stone to talk about this.
This is the time to let Anet know what is or what is exceptable or we run into a situation like this.
"The cash shop doesn't affect me cause i'm not gonna use it so I don't care"
Two days after launch
"OMG I been playing for 2 days and I have 20 mystic chests how could ANet let this happen for every key i earn in game i end up with 2 more chests"
Its kinda like Tor and the dungeon finder, Beta testers said they didn't want one, bioware listened. Two days after release people were screaming at how an mmo could release without a simple tool like a dungeon finder.
I understand the NDA aspects of this post, but I can't agree that players should wait until it's set in stone to talk about this.
This is the time to let Anet know what is or what is exceptable or we run into a situation like this.
"The cash shop doesn't affect me cause i'm not gonna use it so I don't care"
Two days after launch
"OMG I been playing for 2 days and I have 20 mystic chests how could ANet let this happen for every key i earn in game i end up with 2 more chests"
Its kinda like Tor and the dungeon finder, Beta testers said they didn't want one, bioware listened. Two days after release people were screaming at how an mmo could release without a simple tool like a dungeon finder.
Exactly we can only expect what we as a whole accept.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I think it is funny that people bash it so hard, and yet millions bought a shiny mount on WoW time and again. Whats the difference? Cosmetic for real money..OH WAIT.. they didn't label it a "microtransaction". The fact that you can earn it in game via play is such a win, but people would rather whine than appreciate options. Blizzard and other games don't allow you to still earn their exclusive items in game. Grow up people!
I think it is funny that people bash it so hard, and yet millions bought a shiny mount on WoW time and again. Whats the difference? Cosmetic for real money..OH WAIT.. they didn't label it a "microtransaction". The fact that you can earn it in game via play is such a win, but people would rather whine than appreciate options. Blizzard and other games don't allow you to still earn their exclusive items in game. Grow up people!
New to this forum? This place went bat**** crazy over that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I think it is funny that people bash it so hard, and yet millions bought a shiny mount on WoW time and again. Whats the difference? Cosmetic for real money..OH WAIT.. they didn't label it a "microtransaction". The fact that you can earn it in game via play is such a win, but people would rather whine than appreciate options. Blizzard and other games don't allow you to still earn their exclusive items in game. Grow up people!
Who has been complaining about cosmetic items? There multiple things people have complained about in the cash shop and out of the 20 thread and prolly 100 pages maybe 2 of them were complaining about cosmetic items.
What really annoys me is that I want to support this game, I really do! I mean, even if there were no cash shop at all, I would want to just donat emoney to ANet if this game is all I hope it is. It's finally trying to evolve themepark MMORPGs, and I can definitely get behind that.
All that said though, I just don't approve of the whole idea of allow people to pay real money for gold and skip the natural progression of the game. It just goes counter to everything I think RPGs should be about (earning things).
So I really find myself at an impasse. Do I support the game I'm so excited about? Or do I completely abstain from the cash shop I don't approve of?
In the end, I really hope ANet just changes some of their cash shop policies.
What really annoys me is that I want to support this game, I really do! I mean, even if there were no cash shop at all, I would want to just donat emoney to ANet if this game is all I hope it is. It's finally trying to evolve themepark MMORPGs, and I can definitely get behind that.
All that said though, I just don't approve of the whole idea of allow people to pay real money for gold and skip the natural progression of the game. It just goes counter to everything I think RPGs should be about (earning things).
So I really find myself at an impasse. Do I support the game I'm so excited about? Or do I completely abstain from the cash shop I don't approve of?
In the end, I really hope ANet just changes some of their cash shop policies.
I don't see it as a serious issue, to be honest. You can only trade gems for gold with other players. So in order for you to become super rich with in-game currency, someone had to super rich in order to afford your gems. It's a trade off. You want the gold and the other guy wants something from the cash shop, which he can't buy with real money for whatever reason. Every one gets what they want.
Moreover, having lots of gold does mean much anyway as the best weapons and armor can be acquired through karma, which you get for completing various events and other tasks and karma can't be traded or sold. You won't be "wtfpwnt" by a someone who has lots of gold because in PvP everyone is boosted to level 80 and equipment does not have as strong of an impact in GW2 as it does in other games.
Lastly, there will always be players who will buy gold from farmers just like there will be those who purchase leveling services or by maxed out accounts. You can't stop that, just ask Blizzard. God knows, they tried. ANet did a smart thing by removing the gold farmers and the grief associated with them from the equation.
Microtransactions help people who actually got to do something with their life, to still be able to play with some of their friends whose life consist of pizzas, sodas and mmorpgs due to an unknown income source.
I definitely agree with the approach here, as long as it's well managed.
You're a Hardcore Survivor!
You not only survived the zombie apocalypse, but did it with style! Your mastery of zombie knowledge, survival tactics, and weaponry is nearly unmatched. Congratulations, for you are hardcore!
The words "microtransactions" and "holding ourselves to high standards" in the same paragraph... oh the irony.
Standards, of any (positive) form, are absolutely guaranteed to go out the window and down the drain the moment microtransactions appear.
Right now I could not be more happy to not be a fan or follower of Guild Wars 2. You guys are in for a very ..."special" treat though. Say hello to nickle and diming left right and center, plus of course BWW, Bigger Wallet Wins, aka pay to win.
New working title for the game: "Guild Wars: the online store"
What really annoys me is that I want to support this game, I really do! I mean, even if there were no cash shop at all, I would want to just donat emoney to ANet if this game is all I hope it is. It's finally trying to evolve themepark MMORPGs, and I can definitely get behind that.
All that said though, I just don't approve of the whole idea of allow people to pay real money for gold and skip the natural progression of the game. It just goes counter to everything I think RPGs should be about (earning things).
So I really find myself at an impasse. Do I support the game I'm so excited about? Or do I completely abstain from the cash shop I don't approve of?
In the end, I really hope ANet just changes some of their cash shop policies.
this, so much this.
i feel the exact same way. i don't aprove of the gem system and the fact that you can sell it in-game for in-game currency. It's just not right if you ask me.
That being said. It's the ONLY concern i have about the game so far. everything else looks fine in my boat and im going to really enjoy this game. im sure i will
Then why charge us 60 dollars for the box? other f2p titles seem to make money while not charging for the box. This is what makes it almost offensive. Somehow they've convinced you all that b2p but really they're selling you a F2P game. It is madness. How do you not get this?
Man poor people like to whine a lot. Get a friggin job and get off the welfare, geesh.
many people against the cash shop would prefer a monthly sub. truth is, a cash shop is a way to make MORE money than a monthly sub, while allowing many more people to play the game. They know eventually most people who play long enough will spend money.
The thing that's most upsetting to me is how anet said they wouldn't have to do this, that box price was all they needed. I was skeptical and was shouted down by fanboys. Now that this happens, I complain and I'm still shouted down by fanboys. Just can't win.
They never said box sales alone, they said "their method of B2P" worked and their method of B2P included a cash shop. I believe the people who shouted at you told you this repeatedly.
sorry anet you made nearly an identical model to that of Runes of Magic. Don't turn yourself into frogster. You have failed us with this design. Defend yourself all you want. We would have preffered p2p.
Last time I checked RoM kind of forced players to spend a lot of real money in their cash shop to upgrade gear. From what I understand this will not be the case in GW2, and if it is the case then I'm out.
Never saw so many whines in one thread. Don't play the game then, miss out on one of the best games released in a long while. BTW, Runes of magic is outright gambling for gear in their cash shop, comparing that to this cash shop is ludicrous.
Comments
Not flames! Respect!
You expressed your opinion w/o going all ad hominem on anyone. /goodjob
Personally if it's aesthetic items, mounts or timed xp runes etc. I can live with it.
If you cut it too short you can always nail a piece on the end.
If you cut it too long then what the hell are you gonna do?
Lol he really is. H e did in like every single thread, actually every single person to shout p2w, pay to get an advatange hasn't not once explain how it is with GW 2's mechanics.
*Gasp* So it doesn't work like Eve and WoW [game] wise, maybe cash shop wise, but not [game] wise lol.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Man, I think I would get depressed if I worked for ArenaNet making one of the biggest values for a $60 game ever and still be called greedy.
² The first thing that popped up in my mind when I read the title.
mysitc chests can be opened with a cash shop bought key.. or an item bought ingame
It doesn't matter this won't exist in GW2.
GW2 is skill based not gear based.
does......... not........... compute -_- how can i be expected to be awesome without funneling my life into gear grinding... i dont understand this concept and that must mean game = pay2win
Until this is actually confirmed by A-net, not covered under an NDA and is released that way, this is not accurate in my mind.
Besides as another poster said, an item being in game doesn't mean it's a fair implementation of that item. For all I know it could take 5 hours to grind for a key yet cost 50 cents to buy one.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
n yet the game is in beta, and gets patched multiple times daily.. guess they couldnt change drop rates if they found them to be wrong or unbalanced... not trying to troll you just saying, NDA was left on because the game is incomplete and what is in beta now could be completely different tomorrow... i'm guessing the exemptions press had was on features that couldnt possibly get an overhaul and just require tweaking.. anything under NDA is still under review / implementation, that being said.. until the end of april when "prepurchase" beta testers get to play in what they're saying will be.. well sorry at this stage they're saying prepurchase beta testers wont be under NDA, then maybe people can start to jump up and down.. but i honestly think people should wait till we have some solid / concrete information about how it's all gonna work
I understand the NDA aspects of this post, but I can't agree that players should wait until it's set in stone to talk about this.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
This is the time to let Anet know what is or what is exceptable or we run into a situation like this.
"The cash shop doesn't affect me cause i'm not gonna use it so I don't care"
Two days after launch
"OMG I been playing for 2 days and I have 20 mystic chests how could ANet let this happen for every key i earn in game i end up with 2 more chests"
Its kinda like Tor and the dungeon finder, Beta testers said they didn't want one, bioware listened. Two days after release people were screaming at how an mmo could release without a simple tool like a dungeon finder.
Exactly we can only expect what we as a whole accept.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I think it is funny that people bash it so hard, and yet millions bought a shiny mount on WoW time and again. Whats the difference? Cosmetic for real money..OH WAIT.. they didn't label it a "microtransaction". The fact that you can earn it in game via play is such a win, but people would rather whine than appreciate options. Blizzard and other games don't allow you to still earn their exclusive items in game. Grow up people!
New to this forum? This place went bat**** crazy over that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Who has been complaining about cosmetic items? There multiple things people have complained about in the cash shop and out of the 20 thread and prolly 100 pages maybe 2 of them were complaining about cosmetic items.
You didn't read this thread or the article.
What really annoys me is that I want to support this game, I really do! I mean, even if there were no cash shop at all, I would want to just donat emoney to ANet if this game is all I hope it is. It's finally trying to evolve themepark MMORPGs, and I can definitely get behind that.
All that said though, I just don't approve of the whole idea of allow people to pay real money for gold and skip the natural progression of the game. It just goes counter to everything I think RPGs should be about (earning things).
So I really find myself at an impasse. Do I support the game I'm so excited about? Or do I completely abstain from the cash shop I don't approve of?
In the end, I really hope ANet just changes some of their cash shop policies.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
I don't see it as a serious issue, to be honest. You can only trade gems for gold with other players. So in order for you to become super rich with in-game currency, someone had to super rich in order to afford your gems. It's a trade off. You want the gold and the other guy wants something from the cash shop, which he can't buy with real money for whatever reason. Every one gets what they want.
Moreover, having lots of gold does mean much anyway as the best weapons and armor can be acquired through karma, which you get for completing various events and other tasks and karma can't be traded or sold. You won't be "wtfpwnt" by a someone who has lots of gold because in PvP everyone is boosted to level 80 and equipment does not have as strong of an impact in GW2 as it does in other games.
Lastly, there will always be players who will buy gold from farmers just like there will be those who purchase leveling services or by maxed out accounts. You can't stop that, just ask Blizzard. God knows, they tried. ANet did a smart thing by removing the gold farmers and the grief associated with them from the equation.
I believe they are right if the balance is ok.
Microtransactions help people who actually got to do something with their life, to still be able to play with some of their friends whose life consist of pizzas, sodas and mmorpgs due to an unknown income source.
I definitely agree with the approach here, as long as it's well managed.
You're a Hardcore Survivor!
You not only survived the zombie apocalypse, but did it with style! Your mastery of zombie knowledge, survival tactics, and weaponry is nearly unmatched. Congratulations, for you are hardcore!
Hahahaha.
I laughed when I read his post. I LAUGHED.
+1
this, so much this.
i feel the exact same way. i don't aprove of the gem system and the fact that you can sell it in-game for in-game currency. It's just not right if you ask me.
That being said. It's the ONLY concern i have about the game so far. everything else looks fine in my boat and im going to really enjoy this game. im sure i will
This is your opinion, it is not the truth.
This is not a game.
They never said box sales alone, they said "their method of B2P" worked and their method of B2P included a cash shop. I believe the people who shouted at you told you this repeatedly.
This is not a game.
Last time I checked RoM kind of forced players to spend a lot of real money in their cash shop to upgrade gear. From what I understand this will not be the case in GW2, and if it is the case then I'm out.
Never saw so many whines in one thread. Don't play the game then, miss out on one of the best games released in a long while. BTW, Runes of magic is outright gambling for gear in their cash shop, comparing that to this cash shop is ludicrous.