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GW2 wack-a-mole combat debunked here:
Lobotomist
Member EpicPosts: 5,965
in Guild Wars 2
We all read the concern of some beta testers that combat is boring, repetitive - and that it only consists of pressing any ability that came out of cooldown.
Shame they gave beta acess to such lame players that obviously have no first idea of how to play the game properly.
Here is collection of (legit - non nda breaking) vids of very skilled warrior player , giving complete combat breakdown.
Once and for all debunking the vile rumours spread by noob beta testers
http://www.guildwarsinsider.com/guild-wars-2-bam-hunter-beta-edition-day1/
Comments
Yeah I read all those NDA breaking complainers and the one thing all had in common was that they said the content was too easy, so they just used everything on cooldown. However I doubt any of them tried to do content 1 or 2 levels above their level or take on a Champion solo/duo. The various people who praised the game's combat are the ones who decided to look for a challenge in the world, or just did some PvP.
Uhhh....you should't have to engage monsters that are artificially more powerful than you just to make combat 'fun'.
That's kind of the point you're missing.
Let's take a look at...oh...I dunno, Darksiders. Not an MMO, but a combat system that could easily work in one with just a little tweaking on timing. Even while fighting normal monsters on the NORMAL difficulty setting the combat is fun.
That's what you should build UP from, not DOWN to. PvP is a beast with an infinite number of variables, so trying to balance anything around it is nearly impossible.
That wasp queen fight looked quite challenging..
If you do higher level content, and the reward is worth it, things become more fun. but keep in mind that if the players allways win every DE it gets really boring very fast.. That means that every step in a DE chain should be dynamic in nature and sometimes just throw more at the players then they should be able to handle, while in other situations the same step could be an easy walkover.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
You do realize that we are talking low-level content here. I'm talking level 1-15 (where the level cap is 80), so of course players will have to search for the really challenging stuff. This isn't the kind of game where everything is punishingly difficult right at the start, like in The Witcher 2 or Dark Soul. But there are challenges, like the videos have shown, for the players that want them even at the early levels.
This can be applie virtually to any MMO not just GW2. People level up fast and mostly out level the mobs around them. very few would engage monsters equal to their level or above them. I heard exact complaints about SWTOR because players were engaging mobs 2 to 3 levels below them. But somehow it was games fault for offering them enough content to level up comfortabely.
I hear what you say.
But there is thing you have to remember: This is MMO after all and there are trash mobs.
Many people play MMO to relax and unwind. If every trash mob was deadly challenge it would get horribly tedious soon.
(and there is no difficulty setting in MMO - so you cant choose hardcore or easy)
So what they do is that they give you easy mob for grind, and very hard elite stuff for challenge.
Plus, i am sure that game steps up in difficulty in higher lvl areas.
not just noob beta testers it's also the "don't listen to facts" hate crowd. If they dodge and stop spamming "1" they might actually learn something.
You bring up an issue in another MMORPG like SW:TOR and you'd think it holds some relevance here, but here's an example of that very same scenario in GW2. A level 30 Human Guardian goes back to a zone he has clearly out-leveled, mainly to do events he missed and to collect some skill points and then this happens. GW2 seems to offer a lot of unsuspecting surprises and it is still rewarding in this game to do content you've out-leveled (thanks to the side-kicking system). There is no such thing as a greyed mob (unless you count critters like rats & rabbits).
All I was merely talking about, regarding doing content some levels above for a challenge, was regarding the early levels, which the videos in the OP were highlighting. Various beta tester have said that the game's PvE difficulty does ramp-up.
The whole elaborate weapon swapping + changing skills looks good. Not too sure about having only access to a limited amount of circumstantial abilities at a time though. Would have to play it to see myself.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Remember though that eventually, noob beta testers are going to turn into newb paying customers. As much I as I'm looking forward to the combat system and feel it has depth, I also understand it from months and months of dissecting it. So do most of us. At launch, there will be many saucer-eyed rooks, trying to puzzle out the new mechanics the way these beta folks are. The problems being described now would make for a rough launch if it persists. Although personally, I don't see how the game can ease someone into the combat system any better than they way it does now -- aside from a giant, screen encompassing disclaimer at first log on stating "NEW COMBAT SYSTEM EMPLOYED - L2P B4 U QQ".
And while we're in the ballpark, I also noticed from many videos that world mobs do seem extremely easy. I've always chalked that up to the difficulty being tuned down for the players who were being allowed into it. If that's still the case, I do hope that when people are being asked through those pop up forms in the game, to rate the content, they are identifying it is too easy. But I don't think I've seen one vid yet where someone stopped to answer that questionnaire.
TotalBiscuit also debunked this in his podcast:
http://www.mediafire.com/?mdc663ou31s4xaw
EDIT: Made the link work properly. :P
I saw the vids, it looks boring and repetitive tbh. Is all about 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 3 1 1 1 1 and repeat while u wait for countdowns, or change weap and repeat the same system, and is not even innovative bc TSW have the same sistem but with 7 skills not 5. Fanboys cant be objetive so better if i try it for myselft next month.
It's not a terrible system, really.
Honestly, it's just a different way of creating a skill or talent build...whatever the hell you want to call it, same difference.
Six hotkeys with a limited number of points to put in to your different schools. This does make your choice of school and hotkeys more important, but it also means there's always going to be abilities that you never use.
That's poor design.
You should never make an ability or spell that a player can't always get some use out of. If you have access to a spell, you should be able to use it. At any time.
Just my opinion of course.
Yup. It's like packing your suitcase and getting on a plane with a random destination; you might end up wearing bermuda shorts and slippers on Nova Scotia. *shivers*
Much of the mastery of combat in many other games are about having access to a wide variety of skills (of which many circumstantial). Knowing when to use which one separates the skilled player from the *cough* less skilled player.
Though I think in some games (like Swtor) they went overboard with that; I'd rather have one good stun with a reasonable CD, than four crappy, very circumstantial ones. Fumbling for the right abilities is a chore in some games; I am talking 25+ hotkeyed abilities and consumables in the case of Swtor. That's a bit too much to my liking but 10 is the other end of the spectrum I guess.
My brand new bloggity blog.
GW has it with 8 skills, Gw2 with 10 not 5, but thats not the point here. I think its either to easy, which is the better variant, cus it can be adjusted or to many players make it to easy and the scaling doesnt work as intended.
All solo or small groups (up to 5-6players) videos are pretty hard. Some even very hard. The scaling system need a lot of work.
I'm sure its hard to make very good system that can predict and read the whole picture and adjust to the situation in any given time.
And i was also talking about earlier levels too since people level fast and think that killing mobs 2 or 3 level below them somehow makes game easier. So yes it is relevant for other MMOS as much as it is for GW2.
LMAO... Sorry but your new sig is priceless.
As a member of this esteemed GW2 community, I approve.
This is the best vid to watch if you wanna see how to play melee in GW2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR0-S9SQCW4
It's interesting that people are saying that it's too easy because TB doesn't find it easy.
I mean, TB... I like the guy, he's not the brightest kid on the block, but by damn he doesn't lack when it comes to skills. You can see it in some of the Tribes videos he does. He's kind of hard on himself (and I feel he shouldn't be), but when you watch him play, the man does have skills. I respect him for that.
Now, TB does find it a little difficult. One thing I've noticed about TB? He actually dodges. He uses dodge really well and he still finds it kind of difficult. I'm watching him find it difficult actively, in a video.
So I have to ask myself: Do I believe the words of people who claim to be beta testers, or do I believe what I'm seeing in front of me on Youtube with my own eyes? The answer there is kind of obvious. I mean, check out his Charrzooka video. He almost gets pretty well mauled, there. And very often he's come close to dying and actually has had to fight to survive in other videos.
And the man does not lack skill.
He's also highlighted how brilliant the contextual skills are, of which there are plenty. There are even skills which switch you into different weapon sets. For example, there's a pistol & dagger skill that switches you into dagger & dagger, and things like that. There are plenty of those and he's been showing them off.
So really? No concerns.
I can believe bloggers or I can watch TB for my facts. I do the latter.
well It might be true that in some places you need some skill for GW2, but in most videos (in the low level) it's mostly whack-a-mole combat type...hope it gets better as you level up
On second thought: While it might be true that you can distinguish yourself from the rest by being better at the game than the rest, you don't need to be better to complete the game. Catch my drift? This means its perfectly possible to complete the game in the so called "noobmode" which is a bad thing in my opinion..:(
@Darth Pony
The new signature is awesome!!! XD You do know we do love you Darth Pony?
We might not agree on some points but I hereby apologize on behalf off my fellow gw2 nerds
"Isn't a raid plundering villages in WoW or something like that?" - Robert Desable
Thanks, Master. Glad you can appreciate it
Playing around with animation in photoshop is great fun. ^_^
*coughs* On topic ... Stuff like the thief's stealing abilities and talents are pretty original too rite?
edit: and thanks Reskaillev
My brand new bloggity blog.
That said, I agree with Unlight. The man's reasonable, one of the few. He makes a lot of good points. I like him.
If the combat is too difficult in the early days, that's going to actually put a lot of people off. So I hope they balance this well. I'm not sure what they're doing in regards to this, really. I agree with what he's saying, because "L2P NEWB" is not a good business model. It's a great way to drive your business into the ground.
So this really is tricky. I do believe that the content is really hard. I've watched TB find it really hard. And I'm okay with that. Is the game going to suffer for it? Because people are more used to more tame MMO endeavours? Don't know. But it's a very interesting point.
All of the GW 2 gushing I see must seriously be from people who have never played any other video game outside of GW 1.
Everything I see and read about in the game just has me shrugging, leaning into my chin and going, "Oh? So tell me how your idea is entirely unique and original."
I mean, I've seen some pretty intense spin-doctoring and vague language used to describe game systems before, but ANet is taking the cake with GW 2. The part that REALLY makes me feel like I'm taking crazy pills is that so many people are just eating it up. Call me jaded, but every single video I've seen doesn't show me anything that fantastic.
I've seen some cool animations, but that's kind of it. Nothing else I've seen is original or new or even done better.
I think those videos are more of a demonstration of what happens when an unskilled player takes on some of the more challenging content by himself or in a smaller group and slightly underleveled.
He got hit by virtually everything the cave troll tossed at him in the 3rd video. (To see an actual skilled player take on the same trolls at an even lower level, check out this video that's been tossed around a bunch in the past month: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR0-S9SQCW4&list=PL3F7E82F16AF977E3&index=5&feature=plpp_video)
Against Oakheart, I'm not sure he ever noticed the healing pods, as he ignored them every time even though the mechanics of the fight are listed right below the bosses health bar. I wonder if he thought it was odd that the boss kept healing to full for the first 5 minutes.
Really? Did I miss the memo on your personal survey of peoples on what games they play? MMORPG had a poll of those who are very adament about the game about their gaming experiance? ANet sent out a questionire and tallied it up?
Talking about stuff based on assumptions is ignorance. The crowd that talk highly about GW2 if anything have the highest MMO experiances as a lot of issues that have been in the industry are what is addressed.