Ok i just want to point out that in GW u could unlock EVERY SINGLE SKILL for pvp and EVERY MOD FOR WEAPONS for pvp in the cash shop, and i never heard anyone saying that GW is p2w in 6 years of playing. It didn't even crossed my mind.
So i don`t see the problem with GW2 cash shop. Im sure Anet will hanndle it correctly.
Chinese RMT were selling unlocked accounts to people before this. Arenanet banned people and said it was against EULA. Then they start selling it.
I do not think you can unlock the mods for weapons. That must be new because that was not in when I was playing. And I played for a long time. Also you unlock the skills quite easily just by playing the game, buying or learning them unlocks them. Or you can get balth faction to get it.
To answer the OP's question, I hate it. GW1 was supposed to be the saviour of the MMO industry because they made a online game without subscriptions. This was BEFORE the microtransactions were even a common payment model in the US and Europe. Everyone who plays GW1 knows the things to do were either PvP or get COOL LOOKING ARMOUR through hard work. That is, 15k sets and FOW armour.
Thanks for the great posts and for sticking on topic (except for a few!)
Really looking for someone who played a long time and spent a lot and why they did.
Any GW1 vets like that on MMORPG.com?
Otherwise, the trend continues to be going one direction.
I spent alot but only on costumes, and bonus mission pack. Just for the skins and a bit of lore from the mission pack.
Ya, I could only see someone speding money on skills to start playing the game recently and trying to catch up to a buddy or something. But I find it hard a vet of the game would have spent any money on anything aside from cosmetics or account service items.
Ok i just want to point out that in GW u could unlock EVERY SINGLE SKILL for pvp and EVERY MOD FOR WEAPONS for pvp in the cash shop, and i never heard anyone saying that GW is p2w in 6 years of playing. It didn't even crossed my mind.
So i don`t see the problem with GW2 cash shop. Im sure Anet will hanndle it correctly.
Chinese RMT were selling unlocked accounts to people before this. Arenanet banned people and said it was against EULA. Then they start selling it.
I do not think you can unlock the mods for weapons.
No you can't buy the mods. But making a PVP only character will automatically unlock all mods for you (only for that particular character).
Everyone seems to be either over-hyping or over-hating on GW2 announced microtransaction system.
Pay 2 Win many call it.
So, I ask you this - Guild Wars 1 veterans/current players ONLY:
How have you felt about the GW1 business model?
*Note - anyone trying to turn this into yet ANOTHER p2win or f2p etc. etc. debate/debacle will be reported for off-topic violation.
Only looking for the experiences, thoughts, and impressions of current/former Guild Wars 1 players in regards to the B2P + microtransactions model.
Let's see.
Played Proph. Never got past the first area in post searing.
Played Factions, couldn't get to Kaineing (sp?).
Nightfall pulled me in but I had something going on.
EoTN was meh because I hadn't gotten to 20.
I at SOME point bought the animals pack and the fire imp.
No clue when.
I did purchase some bank slots recently. I did buy a merc slot.
The core skills, I dunno if I could really buy them. Not my thing. But the costumes are certainly nice and some of the limited ones still make me stop and look.
I'm playing and having a blast right nowbut it's by far not a MMO. I compete against me. Unless I'm trying to score money, then it's more... well it's a dog eat dog market buying and selling for a profit.
6 year player, all expansions, 32 points in HOM. I've purchased max storage slots, 1 makeover, and 1 or 2 skill packs. Storage was for me, the others were more my way of tipping Anet for appreciated service.
My feelings are that if it works for them, I'm more than fine with it. I don't see a problem at all.
I've been playing since 2005 off and on. I was actually rather indifferent with the business model as I wasn't familiar with the whole Pay2Win issue that's often prevalent in today's F2P game. I came to enjoy the model because around this time I was in college, so the would be subscription fee was nice to have in my own pocket.
Originally posted by BadSpock
Did you feel preasured to make purchases after the initial box price in order to keep playing?
To play competitively in either PvE or PvP?
etc.
I never once felt pressured to make cash shop purchases. Everything in the store either fell into the category of convience or cosmetics. I did end up buying stuff from the store over the years mainly to support A-net when I was able. There is a lot of raging regarding the cash shop in GW2 and P2W crap. I'm honestly not worried as that's not how A-Net does things.
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast, And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed: And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill, And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!" ~Lord George Gordon Byron
Bought gw1 few months after release, didnt liked it that much but returned after EOTN and loved it, 30/50 hom and gwamm.
The only thing from their item shop that is imo wrong are mercenary slots. Some ppl might feel preasured to buy them becouse it allows you to make party compositions with your heroes which are not otherwise possible, these kind of things are imo wrong and i hope they will avoid them in gw2.
It's still far too early to call a consensus on this thread.
Any other GW1 veterans out there?
What are your experiences?
Do you know anyone who bought their way into the game versus played their way over time?
Like someone who joined late for PvP or something and bought all the skills to PvP with their friends instead of unlock them?
I'm trying to make sure we see both sides of the coin, get experiences from a wide range of GW1 veterans.
So far everyone is saying the same thing about the GW1 business model.
It's a difficult thing to explain without actually seeing/trying it. Unlocking the PvP skills only gave you more build options and more skills to choose from. Many of the skills you get at the start of the game are used in PvP ALL the time and are completely viable. Skills are situational in GW1, there are no clear winners except elite skills and you are limited to only 1 of them at a time, so which of those you choose is a situational matter as well and depends on the other skills you have chosen.
Basically, skill choice is a matter of taste, not a matter of stats. Every skill can be useful when supported by certain other skills. Having all the skills doesn't mean you have an advantage, if you don't know how to compliment those skills then you will be terrible at the game.
Also, having all the skills from the start can be very overwhelming. Gaining new skills as you progressed let you learn them, remember them, find the ones you like and find combinations that work well together. Even with all the skills from the get go you still have to go through that process.
Did unlocking all the skills give you a clear advavage in PvP? No, the only issue you might have is if the ones you started with didn't suit your playstyle and you couldn't adapt for the time being.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Been a long time guild wars 1 player. When guild wars 1 was launch it doesn't have a lot of the more "significant" cash shop item compare to now(gw1). It doesn't have cosmetic fluff stuff and extra inventory page to be precise. The former is significant in gw1 cos the whole economy and gear system in gw1 is base around cosmetic equipment while the later is significant for obvious reason.
While many people try to debate that gw1 skill unlock pack is the most controversial and p2w item in the cash shop, i beg to disagree. The reason is because skill collecting and unlocking is imo the one of the 2 major end game content for pve, the other being gear hunting (for cosmetic purpose). Even while i was competing in top 25 GvG, there wasn't any need for me to purchase the skill unlock pack as helping guild mate hunt down specific skill is a fun and guild oriented task for us back then. Unlocking skill is also one of the 2 major reason people participate in pvp, esspecially the alliance battle, the other reason being hunting for zaishen keys.
TLDR ver : GW1 started out very promising and true to their b2p bussiness model
Currently with the latest announcement from anet and the reveal of the pre order bonus, i'm quite dissapointed by how the cash shop is shaping up to be. Seeing anet making so many contradictory statement in the same blog post kinda feels like being fed manure with your cereal. Conversion of gem to in game gold is the new trend in eastern f2p games nowadays and from a few that i've expericence, it's even more p2w that previous model cos its now the dev themself selling gold instead of gold farmer. Overall this whole PR bs is leaving me no choice but to hold back my pre order intention and dampen my hype from 10 to 8.
Played since launch, own all expansions, 15 in HOM (I know, I suck), and not really bothered. It's far less p2w than the first one is with pvp unlocks, and that doesn't stop me from going on occassionally to do Jade Quarry (PvP). It never really impacted the PVE play for me, although it is a vastly different style of game. What keeps me interested is the unique combat style and class mechanics. My only hope, after doing war in kryta entirely with NPC's, is that the next one will be more protected against OP builds. Spirit lord, anyone?
This thread is very heavily trending in one direction.
Any hardcore GW1 PvP'ers?
Was there anything you could purchase for real $ that effected your chance to win in PvP?
I played gvg for 7 years. GVG, HA, RA, TA, and so forth. I've done all that.
I don't even have the PVE game of GW1. I only bought the pvp skillsets in the beginning to play pvp. There's nothing you can buy in GW1 that is P2W. Cash shop leak is being blown out of portion.
This thread is very heavily trending in one direction.
Any hardcore GW1 PvP'ers?
Was there anything you could purchase for real $ that effected your chance to win in PvP?
Well i may not be a hard PvPer, but i played that game A LOT and i can tell you that the pvp packs were selling weapon modifiers and skills, lets explain it:
-Weapons: every weapon tipe had fixed stats like damage, range (for bows) speed, etc. This weapons could be modified so for example you can modify a staff to get a 20% cooldown reduction or a 20% chance to cast the spell on a higer lvl (i dont remember, correct me if wrong). This upgrades were unloked in 3 ways:
1) Playing PvE and discovering them on the items you find.
2) Playing PvP, earning Balthazar points (like PvP money) and unloking them on a npc.
3) Paying for a pack in the store.
So no matter how you unlock them once they are avaible they are free to use and unlimited ONLY for your pvp characters.
-Skills: there are a lot of skills in GW and were every one diferent from the others, there were no better skills, there was a time for every one, the point of skills management was to make good builds. The skill unloking is the same as for weapons.
So geting to the point, there was no way to be more powerfull by buying stuff in the store, you get more versatile in the lower ranks but a player who likes to play and spend a lot of time on it would unlock them, works much like Tribes Ascend.
And about the topic, given how the game is designed i dont see problems about what was leaked from the GW2 cash shop, also i only bought 4 character slots in order to have one of each profesion so 4 x 10€ = 40€, much like 3 months of a suscription based game (i played GW for like 5 years).
Edit: ninjaed quite hard, my bad for being that slow...
i've betatested GW1, my account shown 78 months. long awaited for GW2
but i had to say i'm really dispappointed. and it's the cash shop things. i dont mind if they selling cosmetic or thing to make people look nice.
but i'm again selling "items that help player save time" and the gold trade for gem. if i want to save time, i'll study and get rich instead of playing video game. they help other players get high lvl fast and have all the end game stuff while us, the one who dont pay $$ have to go from bottom up. that's not fair and definetly not " an equal start."
i was sure 80% that i'll buy GW2 but now when the cash shop exist it down to 50% now, i think i might stick with Diablo 3 or maybe waiting for a new game instead of GW2. i dont see the awsomeness from GW2 as i see it in GW1 which made me stick with GW1 instead of World of warcraft
i've betatested GW1, my account shown 78 months. long awaited for GW2
but i had to say i'm really dispappointed. and it's the cash shop things. i dont mind if they selling cosmetic or thing to make people look nice.
but i'm again selling "items that help player save time" and the gold trade for gem. if i want to save time, i'll study and get rich instead of playing video game. they help other players get high lvl fast and have all the end game stuff while us, the one who dont pay $$ have to go from bottom up. that's not fair and definetly not " an equal start."
i was sure 80% that i'll buy GW2 but now when the cash shop exist it down to 50% now, i think i might stick with Diablo 3 or maybe waiting for a new game instead of GW2. i dont see the awsomeness from GW2 as i see it in GW1 which made me stick with GW1 instead of World of warcraft
Hard to believe you, to be honest.
Worried about GW2 cash shop and say you may prefer Diablo 3?
Do you... know anything about the D3 business model?
And apparently there is no real end game and level doesn't really matter, not in GW1 either which you should have known playing for 78 months?
i've betatested GW1, my account shown 78 months. long awaited for GW2
but i had to say i'm really dispappointed. and it's the cash shop things. i dont mind if they selling cosmetic or thing to make people look nice.
but i'm again selling "items that help player save time" and the gold trade for gem. if i want to save time, i'll study and get rich instead of playing video game. they help other players get high lvl fast and have all the end game stuff while us, the one who dont pay $$ have to go from bottom up. that's not fair and definetly not " an equal start."
i was sure 80% that i'll buy GW2 but now when the cash shop exist it down to 50% now, i think i might stick with Diablo 3 or maybe waiting for a new game instead of GW2. i dont see the awsomeness from GW2 as i see it in GW1 which made me stick with GW1 instead of World of warcraft
You talk about buying end game gear then say you will play Diablo 3 instead, a game that is completely based off gear which you will be able to purchase for real life money? You do realize levels/gear really don't matter in GW2 and theres about a billion videos out there that show level 4's actively competing in WvWvW? Who cares if someone gets to 80 before you, in the end it doesnt matter, unless you are one of those people who wants to get there first.
i was sure 80% that i'll buy GW2 but now when the cash shop exist it down to 50% now, i think i might stick with Diablo 3 or maybe waiting for a new game instead of GW2. i dont see the awsomeness from GW2 as i see it in GW1 which made me stick with GW1 instead of World of warcraft
Have been playing GW1 since it was in beta, love the game and have not had an issue with any of there shop items. There is nothing that gives you an advantage over another player, it is all cosmetic for the most part, with some extra character slots and bank space. I don't have an issue with the GW2 shop either it is not going to provide an advantage at all, though people seem to think it will, it won't. I don't begrudge Anet making extra cash to help pay for future updates and such. I definatley perfer the way this game is subscription free and cash shop optional! Keep up the good work Anet!
Comments
Chinese RMT were selling unlocked accounts to people before this. Arenanet banned people and said it was against EULA. Then they start selling it.
I do not think you can unlock the mods for weapons. That must be new because that was not in when I was playing. And I played for a long time. Also you unlock the skills quite easily just by playing the game, buying or learning them unlocks them. Or you can get balth faction to get it.
To answer the OP's question, I hate it. GW1 was supposed to be the saviour of the MMO industry because they made a online game without subscriptions. This was BEFORE the microtransactions were even a common payment model in the US and Europe. Everyone who plays GW1 knows the things to do were either PvP or get COOL LOOKING ARMOUR through hard work. That is, 15k sets and FOW armour.
Ya, I could only see someone speding money on skills to start playing the game recently and trying to catch up to a buddy or something. But I find it hard a vet of the game would have spent any money on anything aside from cosmetics or account service items.
No you can't buy the mods. But making a PVP only character will automatically unlock all mods for you (only for that particular character).
It's still far too early to call a consensus on this thread.
Any other GW1 veterans out there?
What are your experiences?
Do you know anyone who bought their way into the game versus played their way over time?
Like someone who joined late for PvP or something and bought all the skills to PvP with their friends instead of unlock them?
I'm trying to make sure we see both sides of the coin, get experiences from a wide range of GW1 veterans.
So far everyone is saying the same thing about the GW1 business model.
Let's see.
Played Proph. Never got past the first area in post searing.
Played Factions, couldn't get to Kaineing (sp?).
Nightfall pulled me in but I had something going on.
EoTN was meh because I hadn't gotten to 20.
I at SOME point bought the animals pack and the fire imp.
No clue when.
I did purchase some bank slots recently. I did buy a merc slot.
The core skills, I dunno if I could really buy them. Not my thing. But the costumes are certainly nice and some of the limited ones still make me stop and look.
I'm playing and having a blast right nowbut it's by far not a MMO. I compete against me. Unless I'm trying to score money, then it's more... well it's a dog eat dog market buying and selling for a profit.
6 year player, all expansions, 32 points in HOM. I've purchased max storage slots, 1 makeover, and 1 or 2 skill packs. Storage was for me, the others were more my way of tipping Anet for appreciated service.
My feelings are that if it works for them, I'm more than fine with it. I don't see a problem at all.
Ok let's see...
This thread is very heavily trending in one direction.
Any hardcore GW1 PvP'ers?
Was there anything you could purchase for real $ that effected your chance to win in PvP?
I've been playing since 2005 off and on. I was actually rather indifferent with the business model as I wasn't familiar with the whole Pay2Win issue that's often prevalent in today's F2P game. I came to enjoy the model because around this time I was in college, so the would be subscription fee was nice to have in my own pocket.
I never once felt pressured to make cash shop purchases. Everything in the store either fell into the category of convience or cosmetics. I did end up buying stuff from the store over the years mainly to support A-net when I was able. There is a lot of raging regarding the cash shop in GW2 and P2W crap. I'm honestly not worried as that's not how A-Net does things.
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:
And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"
~Lord George Gordon Byron
This was me after playing GW1 for about 3 years; "I can buy extra character slots???..... Who knew!"
I really didn't know the shop even existed until my sister mentioned it.
This is not a game.
Bought gw1 few months after release, didnt liked it that much but returned after EOTN and loved it, 30/50 hom and gwamm.
The only thing from their item shop that is imo wrong are mercenary slots. Some ppl might feel preasured to buy them becouse it allows you to make party compositions with your heroes which are not otherwise possible, these kind of things are imo wrong and i hope they will avoid them in gw2.
No.
It's a difficult thing to explain without actually seeing/trying it. Unlocking the PvP skills only gave you more build options and more skills to choose from. Many of the skills you get at the start of the game are used in PvP ALL the time and are completely viable. Skills are situational in GW1, there are no clear winners except elite skills and you are limited to only 1 of them at a time, so which of those you choose is a situational matter as well and depends on the other skills you have chosen.
Basically, skill choice is a matter of taste, not a matter of stats. Every skill can be useful when supported by certain other skills. Having all the skills doesn't mean you have an advantage, if you don't know how to compliment those skills then you will be terrible at the game.
Also, having all the skills from the start can be very overwhelming. Gaining new skills as you progressed let you learn them, remember them, find the ones you like and find combinations that work well together. Even with all the skills from the get go you still have to go through that process.
Did unlocking all the skills give you a clear advavage in PvP? No, the only issue you might have is if the ones you started with didn't suit your playstyle and you couldn't adapt for the time being.
Been a long time guild wars 1 player. When guild wars 1 was launch it doesn't have a lot of the more "significant" cash shop item compare to now(gw1). It doesn't have cosmetic fluff stuff and extra inventory page to be precise. The former is significant in gw1 cos the whole economy and gear system in gw1 is base around cosmetic equipment while the later is significant for obvious reason.
While many people try to debate that gw1 skill unlock pack is the most controversial and p2w item in the cash shop, i beg to disagree. The reason is because skill collecting and unlocking is imo the one of the 2 major end game content for pve, the other being gear hunting (for cosmetic purpose). Even while i was competing in top 25 GvG, there wasn't any need for me to purchase the skill unlock pack as helping guild mate hunt down specific skill is a fun and guild oriented task for us back then. Unlocking skill is also one of the 2 major reason people participate in pvp, esspecially the alliance battle, the other reason being hunting for zaishen keys.
TLDR ver : GW1 started out very promising and true to their b2p bussiness model
Currently with the latest announcement from anet and the reveal of the pre order bonus, i'm quite dissapointed by how the cash shop is shaping up to be. Seeing anet making so many contradictory statement in the same blog post kinda feels like being fed manure with your cereal. Conversion of gem to in game gold is the new trend in eastern f2p games nowadays and from a few that i've expericence, it's even more p2w that previous model cos its now the dev themself selling gold instead of gold farmer. Overall this whole PR bs is leaving me no choice but to hold back my pre order intention and dampen my hype from 10 to 8.
I was rank 5 and my gf was rank 7 or 8, there was nothing in the shop to give you an edge.
My Guild Wars 2 Vids
Played since launch, own all expansions, 15 in HOM (I know, I suck), and not really bothered. It's far less p2w than the first one is with pvp unlocks, and that doesn't stop me from going on occassionally to do Jade Quarry (PvP). It never really impacted the PVE play for me, although it is a vastly different style of game. What keeps me interested is the unique combat style and class mechanics. My only hope, after doing war in kryta entirely with NPC's, is that the next one will be more protected against OP builds. Spirit lord, anyone?
I played gvg for 7 years. GVG, HA, RA, TA, and so forth. I've done all that.
I don't even have the PVE game of GW1. I only bought the pvp skillsets in the beginning to play pvp. There's nothing you can buy in GW1 that is P2W. Cash shop leak is being blown out of portion.
So the people with the most experience with Guild Wars 1 are all saying the same thing.
Interesting...
Well i may not be a hard PvPer, but i played that game A LOT and i can tell you that the pvp packs were selling weapon modifiers and skills, lets explain it:
-Weapons: every weapon tipe had fixed stats like damage, range (for bows) speed, etc. This weapons could be modified so for example you can modify a staff to get a 20% cooldown reduction or a 20% chance to cast the spell on a higer lvl (i dont remember, correct me if wrong). This upgrades were unloked in 3 ways:
1) Playing PvE and discovering them on the items you find.
2) Playing PvP, earning Balthazar points (like PvP money) and unloking them on a npc.
3) Paying for a pack in the store.
So no matter how you unlock them once they are avaible they are free to use and unlimited ONLY for your pvp characters.
-Skills: there are a lot of skills in GW and were every one diferent from the others, there were no better skills, there was a time for every one, the point of skills management was to make good builds. The skill unloking is the same as for weapons.
So geting to the point, there was no way to be more powerfull by buying stuff in the store, you get more versatile in the lower ranks but a player who likes to play and spend a lot of time on it would unlock them, works much like Tribes Ascend.
And about the topic, given how the game is designed i dont see problems about what was leaked from the GW2 cash shop, also i only bought 4 character slots in order to have one of each profesion so 4 x 10€ = 40€, much like 3 months of a suscription based game (i played GW for like 5 years).
Edit: ninjaed quite hard, my bad for being that slow...
Payed the boxes once. Never used cash shop, only one time to get 4 bonus missions to learn more about lore.
I've played for 3 years and I own 50/50 HoM points and God Walking Amongst Mere Mortals.
Payment model? Perfect!
Guild Wars 2 Youtube Croatian Maniacs
My Guild Wars titles
Disappointed.
i've betatested GW1, my account shown 78 months. long awaited for GW2
but i had to say i'm really dispappointed. and it's the cash shop things. i dont mind if they selling cosmetic or thing to make people look nice.
but i'm again selling "items that help player save time" and the gold trade for gem. if i want to save time, i'll study and get rich instead of playing video game. they help other players get high lvl fast and have all the end game stuff while us, the one who dont pay $$ have to go from bottom up. that's not fair and definetly not " an equal start."
i was sure 80% that i'll buy GW2 but now when the cash shop exist it down to 50% now, i think i might stick with Diablo 3 or maybe waiting for a new game instead of GW2. i dont see the awsomeness from GW2 as i see it in GW1 which made me stick with GW1 instead of World of warcraft
Hard to believe you, to be honest.
Worried about GW2 cash shop and say you may prefer Diablo 3?
Do you... know anything about the D3 business model?
And apparently there is no real end game and level doesn't really matter, not in GW1 either which you should have known playing for 78 months?
I just doubt your credibility sir.
You talk about buying end game gear then say you will play Diablo 3 instead, a game that is completely based off gear which you will be able to purchase for real life money? You do realize levels/gear really don't matter in GW2 and theres about a billion videos out there that show level 4's actively competing in WvWvW? Who cares if someone gets to 80 before you, in the end it doesnt matter, unless you are one of those people who wants to get there first.
My Guild Wars 2 Vids
It's fine.
But i don't doubt a loud minority are overreacting
Diablo 3 has RMT unless they changed that.
Have been playing GW1 since it was in beta, love the game and have not had an issue with any of there shop items. There is nothing that gives you an advantage over another player, it is all cosmetic for the most part, with some extra character slots and bank space. I don't have an issue with the GW2 shop either it is not going to provide an advantage at all, though people seem to think it will, it won't. I don't begrudge Anet making extra cash to help pay for future updates and such. I definatley perfer the way this game is subscription free and cash shop optional! Keep up the good work Anet!