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1.2 the beginning of the end.

lilwinslilwins Miami, FLPosts: 114Member
I knew 1.2 class balance changes were going to be the end of this game, it usually always is the beginning of the end when developers do massive class balance changes in one patch. I didn't know they were going to be this severe, Bioware managed to actually completely gut over half the classes in this game, seriously *** do you guys play your own game? I suspect massive drops in subscriptions. This has seriously got to be the most retarded decision I have ever seen a developer take so early in an MMO's stage. Classes like scrapper specced scoundrels getting nerfed even more, basically nerfed into oblivion.. Does anyone understand the logic behind those class changes, because I am completely baffled by them.. Some healers getting nerfed (Sorc/sage healing.), for no reason when healers were fine.
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Comments

  • ElsaboltsElsabolts Greencastle, INPosts: 2,594Member Uncommon

    I would say alot of folks complained enough that some classes were op'ed and in come the nerf's. Happens every game some sooner then later.

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  • mav1234mav1234 Bennington, VTPosts: 81Member Uncommon

    sorc/sage healing was not fine relevant to the others imo.  it was quite a bit stronger.

     

    I am glad tracer missile is getting nerfed though.

     

    I thought some people were saying these changes were a buff to scoundrels?

  • indojabijinindojabijin Posts: 88Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by mav1234

    sorc/sage healing was not fine relevant to the others imo.  it was quite a bit stronger.

     

    I am glad tracer missile is getting nerfed though.

     

    I thought some people were saying these changes were a buff to scoundrels?

    It's a buff to healing via better energy management. Everyone is freaking out about scoundrels/operatives DPS being nerfed but it has yet to be determined. Some skills have better energy managed but got reduced damage. Other skills got a 5% damage buff but the cooldown increased by over 30%.

    In the patch notes it also says that back stab (which is the skill that got a 5% buff with +30% cooldown) damage is increased with certain talents. The amount of the damage increase has yet to be determined and I hope it's enough to offset the increased cooldown.

    If it's not then it's a nerf and the playstyle of scoundrel/operative will have been slowed down as well.

  • nikoliathnikoliath YPosts: 1,154Member

    Originally posted by Elsabolts

    I would say alot of folks complained enough that some classes were op'ed and in come the nerf's. Happens every game some sooner then later.

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    I would say most of the data comes from metrics within the game rather than forum whining. As to the OP, it's their game and they know what they intended each class to do.

  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,614Member Uncommon

    Nerfs happen cause developer does research and feels one or more classes are either over powered or under- Nothing strange or unusual there. People get upset because they are used to their character being over powered and want to keep it that way

  • YalexyYalexy BerlinPosts: 1,053Member Uncommon

    Mercenary healers get hit the hardest with the 1.2 patch. All boni get cut in half basically and heat costs are increased massively. This will be total death for Merc healers.

    Juggernaut tanks get screwed aswell and you can't do a 50/50 talenttree-spec anymore. 50/50 is necessary tho as Juggs don't do enough damage in their tanking-tree to see any aggro at all against the DDs.

    Alot of the other classes get stealth-nerfs that aren't that obvious from the patchnotes alone, but having a Merc/Sniper/Assassin at LvL 50 all T2/T3 equipped I can absolutely see them.

    All around damage gets reduced throughout all DD-specs and healers will do less healing aswell.

    This patch will make it even harder for the casual players to do the hardmode FPs/OPs.

    We'll see where this is going, but with TSW around the corner in June I couldn't care less actually what BW is doing with SWTOR. I'll play for another two month just because of the people I'm playing with, but then it's goodbye.

  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member Common

    Originally posted by Elsabolts

    I would say alot of folks complained enough that some classes were op'ed and in come the nerf's. Happens every game some sooner then later.

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    Yes and it's a shame that devs don't stand their ground against the PVP whiners. That or make skills that are PVP specific so that the nerf hammer doesn't affect players who don't PVP.

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • hikaru77hikaru77 buenos airesPosts: 1,035Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by lilwins

    I knew 1.2 class balance changes were going to be the end of this game, it usually always is the beginning of the end when developers do massive class balance changes in one patch. I didn't know they were going to be this severe, Bioware managed to actually completely gut over half the classes in this game, seriously *** do you guys play your own game? I suspect massive drops in subscriptions. This has seriously got to be the most retarded decision I have ever seen a developer take so early in an MMO's stage. Classes like scrapper specced scoundrels getting nerfed even more, basically nerfed into oblivion.. Does anyone understand the logic behind those class changes, because I am completely baffled by them.. Some healers getting nerfed (Sorc/sage healing.), for no reason when healers were fine.

    You was playing the game? really because you have no idea.  Sorc and sage was fine? just lol.  I saw the patch notes, they are nerfing OP classes and making a lil better others, like the Gunslinger, !Good bye! Tracer missile spam!, The beginning of the end? you have no idea, or you are playing some of these Op classes. 1.2 looks awesome, and is a great step forward in the pvp balance of the game, OP you are just wrong. 

  • AntariousAntarious Greenville, SCPosts: 2,802Member

    Originally posted by mrshroom89

    [mod edit]

     

    Well at least they aren't a "hater" right?

     

    Quite a few posters here wouldn't even believe enough people still play TOR to have massive drops in subscribers.

     

    Just sayin' ...

    Moderator's on this site allow certain posters to create endless troll threads. Yet "warn" people for giving recommendations... account *pending* deletion because.. why bother.

  • BreitbartBreitbart Seattle, WAPosts: 22Member

    1.2, as the OP eludes to, is not really the begining of the end, but just pushes more mature mmo enthusiasts away.   Bioware should have been focusing on delivering more diverse and challenging game-play in which ones' role is important and meaningful as opposed to homoginizing the game-play.

    So again, not really the beginning of the end as that began immediately following its' launch, which showed this game with a 6.1 meta-score, but I see 1.2 a continuation of that bad impression supporting today's 5.7 meta-score. http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/star-wars-the-old-republic

     

  • hikaru77hikaru77 buenos airesPosts: 1,035Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Breitbart

    1.2, as the OP eludes to, is not really the begining of the end, but just pushes more mature mmo enthusiasts away.   Bioware should have been focusing on delivering more diverse and challenging game-play in which ones' role is important and meaningful as opposed to homoginizing the game-play.

    So again, not really the beginning of the end as that began immediately following its' launch, which showed this game with a 6.1 meta-score, but I see 1.2 a continuation of that bad impression supporting today's 5.7 meta-score. http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/star-wars-the-old-republic

     

    Just NO. 1.2 looks greats. 

  • VassagoMaelVassagoMael Covington, LAPosts: 555Member

    Have you seen the 1.2 smuggler armor? It is HORRIBLE! Oh well I unsubbed a weekish ago.

    Free to play = content updates for the cash shop. Buy to play = content updates for the cash shop.
    Subscription = Actual content updates!

  • jeremyjodesjeremyjodes antioch, ORPosts: 679Member

    It's a casual solo sometimes get a group for hard stuff themepark. nerfs are being planned almost daily. same with Wow and all the others. balance is the utopian dream developers seem to forget that can never be had in an online world. you have to allow players to become powerful. you don't play imaginary characters in a fantasy universe in the hope's you wont be able to be something more then you can be in real life.

    You want to become a menace or a hero.

    Something blizzard has never learned really. no such thing as balance.the term is used by developers to stop the whiners who want their class to be OP because some other class 1-shotted him in a battleground or arena.

    I know for sure when a dev talks about the nerf, he's using it as a smoke screen for 100+ little stealth nerfs that they want to push through.

    it;s like me getting in to a fight with you and I start shaking my left fist the minute you look away i'm gonna pile drive you with my right. same with all nerfs.

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  • tixylixtixylix gfff, TNPosts: 1,208Member Uncommon

    I don't play SWTOR anymore but it is the most balanced MMO I've ever played, there were only a few things that needed to be tweaked. Just a shame the whiners got their way like they did with WoW and SWG and now they'll ruin SWTORS balance and cause even more complaints.

  • lilwinslilwins Miami, FLPosts: 114Member
    Originally posted by Alboro

    Sounds like the OP's class got nerfed imo.
     
    Can't nerf skill bro, anyone complaining about it should L2P their class.

     

    Skill will only get you so far when your class keeps getting nerfed into oblivion every patch, I play a 50 Sawbones (Healing Scoundrel) but like to switch to scrapper dps spec at times, which I enjoy a lot. Scrappers have been completely gutted in 1.2, how is skill supposed to get you by? If you played the class, you would know how bad the nerfs are..
  • lilwinslilwins Miami, FLPosts: 114Member

    Originally posted by mrshroom89

    [mod edit]

     

    [mod edit]  I have been playing MMOs since 1997 UO pre-trammel. I have never seen a developer do such a massive class balance patch where they nerf at least half of the classes/specs in the game without giving something in return (Especially this early in the game development cycle.), now that's just bad development and beyond retarded.. Blizzard nerfs but gives something in return, Bioware is just completely gutting some classes into oblivion without giving them anything in return. I have played nearly every MMO since UO, even the ones some of you probably despise (AION, Warhammer, AOC, etc. are the more recent ones.). [mod edit]

  • DeeweDeewe Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,965Member

    Originally posted by lilwins

    Originally posted by mrshroom89

    Sooo judging by your OP SWTOR is your first mmo?

     

    [mod edit]  I have been playing MMOs since 1997 UO pre-trammel. I have never seen a developer do such a massive class balance patch where they nerf at least half of the classes/specs in the game without giving something in return (Especially this early in the game development cycle.), now that's just bad development and beyond retarded.. Blizzard nerfs but gives something in return, Bioware is just completely gutting some classes into oblivion without giving them anything in return. I have played nearly every MMO since UO, even the ones some of you probably despise (AION, Warhammer, AOC, etc. are the more recent ones.)

    There's one way to mitigate the issue: allow all players to at least respec into the other AC would they want to, for free.

  • hikaru77hikaru77 buenos airesPosts: 1,035Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by lilwins

    Originally posted by mrshroom89

    [mod edit]

     

    [mod edit] I have been playing MMOs since 1997 UO pre-trammel. I have never seen a developer do such a massive class balance patch where they nerf at least half of the classes/specs in the game without giving something in return (Especially this early in the game development cycle.), now that's just bad development and beyond retarded.. Blizzard nerfs but gives something in return, Bioware is just completely gutting some classes into oblivion without giving them anything in return. I have played nearly every MMO since UO, even the ones some of you probably despise (AION, Warhammer, AOC, etc. are the more recent ones.).[mod edit]

    You are just wrong, I think it will be probably better if all the nerds qqing for the nerf just quit. everyone playing swtor know than a nerf will come for some classes, commandos/BH, sorc/sage, Scoun/operatives, they know it. 1.2 is a great step forward in the pvp balance of the game, easy like that. 

  • PainlezzPainlezz Laguna Hills, CAPosts: 616Member Uncommon

    Another prime example of why PvP needs to be REMOVED from MMO's...  Or at least ignored when it comes to game Balance.

     

    The PvP in this game is/was a joke from the beginning and it is beyond my understanding why they would bother to balance the game around it....

     

    Glad I quit months and months ago!

  • Sora2810Sora2810 New Columbia, PAPosts: 567Member

    At least some day the haters will be right. Some day TOR will drop in subscriptions.

    Played - M59, EQOA, EQ, EQ2, PS, SWG[Favorite], DAoC, UO, RS, MXO, CoH/CoV, TR, FFXI, FoM, WoW, Eve, Rift, SWTOR, TSW.
    Playing - PS2, AoW, GW2

  • TeknoBugTeknoBug Calgary, ABPosts: 2,156Member

    Overall I'm not particularly happy with the 1.2 patch notes, they basically drove an already low populated class further into the ground by hurting sustained dps- you won't see dps scounderal/operatives in hardmodes, raids and operations anymore. Commando/mercenary sustained dps has been hurt too, not just tracer/grav, but increasing the cast time on power shot/charged bolt (an already crappy attack) and lowering its damage, who the hell is going to use that now? And procs will only occur once every 6 seconds now, so no more back to back railshot procs, which is pyrotech is built around and designed to be burst dps.


    Worst one that affects my main, the juggernaut, threatening scream will be stuck at 45 seconds instead of going down to 30 seconds via talent which is needed to handle AOE aggro in some hardmodes, and force charge will now affect the resolve bar, oh god.


    Good thing I have an assassin, that class according to the patch notes, is working as intended and can be brutally powerful.


    However, my sub runs out on monday, doubt I'll be renewing for a while.

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  • WorstluckWorstluck the valley, CAPosts: 1,269Member

    Originally posted by mav1234

    sorc/sage healing was not fine relevant to the others imo.  it was quite a bit stronger.

     

    I am glad tracer missile is getting nerfed though.

     

    I thought some people were saying these changes were a buff to scoundrels?

     

     

    Hmm I have not read the patch notes, but my main was a sorc, and they did feel a bit OP.  That shield coupled with the heals made me pretty damn hard to kill..although I haven't played in a month or so. 

     

    OP, Blizzard has been nerfing/buffing classes to all hell for years, we whould be used this to by now :D

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  • AG-VukAG-Vuk Phoenix, AZPosts: 823Member Uncommon

    If you want to see if a class is overpowered , survey the classes played in PvP . The most prevailant classes are 9/10 ones people flock to,  due to some advantage .  They will be adjusted to what was intended by the designers. Alot of times the intention and implementation are two different things and adjustments are needed. Will they get it right with this patch doubtful .  PvP is a very fickle animal and people will flow to the build that grants them the advantage . Will it be the end of the game highly unlikely , will people be unhappy , sure. You take away their favorite toy that they were terrorizing people with and they will pout. will they find something else sure.

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  • Toto020Toto020 Cleveland, OHPosts: 43Member

    To the OP, unfortunately all BW/EA was concerned with during beta was:

    1. Hyping their product via word of mouth.

    2. Testing server strees.

    This leads to the fact that they thought they could fix everything after the fact, a common assumption and a cost effective one.  Unfortuately it appears they will be "Nerfing" classes to:

    1. Force players to group more.

    2. Make PvP more strategic/competitive.

    3. Make soloing take longer.  Which means a longer time to endgame...

    Usually a Dev decides these things during Alpha and Beta testing, but BW is new to MMO's so like many things ingame obvioulsy didn't do much research...

  • VidirVidir GothenburgPosts: 944Member Uncommon

    Nerfs comes couse pvp'ers whine loud.

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