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Flaw with Skills and Weapons?

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  • BarkamBarkam Member Posts: 33

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

    Originally posted by Mors-Subita


    Originally posted by Tacomeat

    Yeah I intended to go in with a greatsword, close the gap and then switch to axes and go nuts.  Or just go with a hammer for control.  I don't know how fast the weapon swaps are or how long the cd is... trying to find info on that now.  

    From what I've seen/heard... Instant and Instant would be my guess.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe no-CD weapon switching is one of the perks of being a warrior, isn't it?

    Currently there is a CD for weapon switching even for warriors.  There is actually a minor trait to decrease the weapon switching CD.

  • Dream_ChaserDream_Chaser Member Posts: 1,043

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

  • austriacusaustriacus Member UncommonPosts: 618

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    I loled hard. If anything you could do with a sword you could do with an axe then why invent the other one? Are you telling me warriors in the past used Axes instead of swords to look more bad ass? Jesus christ. Just because they both cut and do damage doesnt mean they do it in the same way.

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by austriacus

    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    I loled hard. If anything you could do with a sword you could do with an axe then why invent the other one? Are you telling me warriors in the past used Axes instead of swords to look more bad ass? Jesus christ. Just because they both cut and do damage doesnt mean they do it in the same way.

    I obviously expect way too much from todays youth. I'm not going to write a dissertation every time I create a post, just so all my bases are covered for people like you who will tear everything apart and nick pick things to death, and choose one part of a post to respond to instead of the gist of what the person was getting at. Because a person can't do this in every post, since it's not reasonable, a person must assume that other readers will use some common sense and benefit of the doubt.

    Obviously I know there are differences between an axe and a sword. However, in regards to the OP problems, they both sever limbs do they not? They both can cut, causing a person to bleed can they not? They both can kill and maim, right?

  • FozzikFozzik Member UncommonPosts: 539

    There are going to be a wide variety of "skins" (unique looks) for the various weapons, so it's likely that most people will be able to find a good compromise. If you like the way axes look, but you want to use sword skills...maybe there are swords that look a bit more axe-like. Same goes for any other weapons. I'm guessing you'll find ones you like if you look around in-game.


    If you find a look you like, you can use t-stones to keep that look throughout the game.


    Here's a few of the weapon sets -

    http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y126/DiuGauLi/GW2weapons2.png
    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-hs7na_kazZI/Tq7FHoueOhI/AAAAAAAAAbM/U44yK74HMXU/s1600/weapons2.jpg
    http://blawver.cghub.com/files/Image/121001-122000/121190/136_stream.jpg
    http://i1044.photobucket.com/albums/b450/nadinedraws/ShiningBladeWeapons.jpg
    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XQZi3LYnziY/Tq7FH7Ft8sI/AAAAAAAAAbY/LBfga3NsY4o/s1600/weapons1.jpg

  • austriacusaustriacus Member UncommonPosts: 618

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Originally posted by austriacus


    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    I loled hard. If anything you could do with a sword you could do with an axe then why invent the other one? Are you telling me warriors in the past used Axes instead of swords to look more bad ass? Jesus christ. Just because they both cut and do damage doesnt mean they do it in the same way.

    I obviously expect way too much from todays youth. I'm not going to write a dissertation every time I create a post, just so all my bases are covered for people like you who will tear everything apart and nick pick things to death, and choose one part of a post to respond to instead of the gist of what the person was getting at. Because a person can't do this in every post, since it's not reasonable, a person must assume that other readers will use some common sense and benefit of the doubt.

    Obviously I know there are differences between an axe and a sword. However, in regards to the OP problems, they both sever limbs do they not? They both can cut, causing a person to bleed can they not? They both can kill and maim, right?

    Yes they both can, but like i said they do it in different ways, thats why there are different skills. Lets say for example there is a skill that Chops.  A sword isnt used for choping, it either thrusts or slices, same aplies to the axe, it cant thrust and the way it slices is different.

    We are discussing skills here and how they make sence. Would it make sense for an axe user to be able to use a skill called lets say "royal thrust"?.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    Have you ever used either? No.

    I can use a sword and I fought with some guys with axes, it is night and day.

    Why invent the P51 when you have the DC3?

    Go down to your local ARMA or SCA and learn the basics of melee before trying to discuss it.

    And you bet that I would wear ugly clotes and shoes in a war. As for the car, gas here cost  over 2 bucks for a liter (no, not a gallon) so many people drive cheap cars because of it.

    Sorry, but realism is more important than asthetics, at least to a certain degree.

  • BaniscoBanisco Member Posts: 240

    Originally posted by austriacus

    ...

    Yes they both can, but like i said they do it in different ways, thats why there are different skills. Lets say for example there is a skill that Chops.  A sword cant chop, it either thrusts or slices, same aplies to the axe, it cant thrust and the way it slices is different.

    We are discussing skills here and how they make sence. Would it make sense for an axe user to be able to use a skill called lets say "royal thrust"?.

    Actualy its called Final Thrust, but yes you are rigth.

  • IPolygonIPolygon Member UncommonPosts: 707

    Well, the point is that weapons resemble playstyles. To a certain extent the whole system reminds of GW 1's attribute system, but it's quite different nontheless. However if you take a look at the weapon attributes in GW1, you'll see a distinct usage of axes, swords and hammers. Each weapon was built to do something better than others. This was done by changing the weapon min-max damage and by designing skills for a specific task. Axes were used for heavy spiking, swords for constant pressure, and hammers for high damage and knockdown.

    In a way, the weapons in GW2 do exactly the same, but in GW2 you can switch between different playstyles on the fly. So, you may not be able to Final Thrust somebody with an axe in GW2, but you can Eviscerate them with you favourite toy. You may not like it at first, coming from WoW and other games that use generic skills, but you will learn to love the distinct feel between two weapon sets.

    Disclaimer: I am not using generic to paraphrase boring or simple or anything alike, but to describe the independence of the skills from weapons.

  • ZodanZodan Member Posts: 564

    There is cooldown after weapon swap, think it's 30 seconds, it's there for not to abuse the cooldowns of both weapon sets constantly.

    Wonder how the warrior no CD weapon swap will be balanced though...

  • austriacusaustriacus Member UncommonPosts: 618

    Originally posted by Zodan

    There is cooldown after weapon swap, think it's 30 seconds, it's there for not to abuse the cooldowns of both weapon sets constantly.

    Wonder how the warrior no CD weapon swap will be balanced though...

    There is no way in hell that the weapon swap is 30 seconds, i havent payed attention  to weapon swaps cooldown  because well, the press sucks and they rarely swap. But ive seen the elemental atunement swap and the cooldown is  roughly 8 seconds so if the weapon swap is indeed 30 seconds for non elementalist then i fear for them to be overpowered not warriors.

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by austriacus

    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by austriacus


    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    I'm confused. I see two possible cases for this thread, in one the OP is misinformed and I can help clear that up. The other... uh, wow... people looking for things to complain about are really scraping the barrel, now.

    Benefit of the doubt...

    Okay, assuming you're talking about what I think you are.

    No, each weapon you get allows you to unlock the skills for that weapon. If you unlock a set of skills for your first weapon, you're not stuck with those skills. Each weapon has five skills for you to unlock, and then you can switch back and forth freely. The skills you learn first won't impede you in any way. So if you learn sword skills first, but then you decide you want to use a mace, you can switch to a mace and not be penalised for that.

    If you were thinking that learning how to use a sword first would penalise you/lock you into using a sword, then no, it won't. I'm glad I could help clear that up.

    Scraping the barrel...

    I'm... I'm sorry... let me know if I'm understanding this right...

    I want a dagger to be purely cosmetic. I want it to be so that I can use any weapon skills with any weapon. So that if I want to use a mace skill like 'clobber,' I can use that with daggers! Because, uh... I'd be using the flat of my blade! Yeah! And... I want to be able to use greatsword skills whilst dual-wielding, because my swords can click together like Kratos, yo.

    Really?

    ...I mean, ...really? ...really?

    You're having me on. Honestly, pull the other one.

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    I loled hard. If anything you could do with a sword you could do with an axe then why invent the other one? Are you telling me warriors in the past used Axes instead of swords to look more bad ass? Jesus christ. Just because they both cut and do damage doesnt mean they do it in the same way.

    I obviously expect way too much from todays youth. I'm not going to write a dissertation every time I create a post, just so all my bases are covered for people like you who will tear everything apart and nick pick things to death, and choose one part of a post to respond to instead of the gist of what the person was getting at. Because a person can't do this in every post, since it's not reasonable, a person must assume that other readers will use some common sense and benefit of the doubt.

    Obviously I know there are differences between an axe and a sword. However, in regards to the OP problems, they both sever limbs do they not? They both can cut, causing a person to bleed can they not? They both can kill and maim, right?

    Yes they both can, but like i said they do it in different ways, thats why there are different skills. Lets say for example there is a skill that Chops.  A sword isnt used for choping, it either thrusts or slices, same aplies to the axe, it cant thrust and the way it slices is different.

    We are discussing skills here and how they make sence. Would it make sense for an axe user to be able to use a skill called lets say "royal thrust"?.

    Describe the act of chopping. Now envision it. Why can't a person "chop" with a sword? Can a person not use a downward swing with a sword to chop a guys arm off? Why can't an axe thrust? Haven't you seen axes with those spikes on the end of them? Sure, they're not as effective as a sword thrust, since they don't go as deep, but you probably get my point.

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by Loke666

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    Have you ever used either? No.

    I can use a sword and I fought with some guys with axes, it is night and day.

    Why invent the P51 when you have the DC3?

    Go down to your local ARMA or SCA and learn the basics of melee before trying to discuss it.

    And you bet that I would wear ugly clotes and shoes in a war. As for the car, gas here cost  over 2 bucks for a liter (no, not a gallon) so many people drive cheap cars because of it.

    Sorry, but realism is more important than asthetics, at least to a certain degree.

    Being that I've read some of your posts, I've always had some respect for you. Apparently it was misplaced, since you ask the question of whether or not I've used either weapon and then answered the question for me, saying "no." The truth is that you don't know me or what I've done in my life. In fact, I have had training with the use of swords while taking martial arts. I trained in other weapons while in the infantry in the Marine Corps. I've never trained with an axe, but that doesn't stop a smart person from being able to theorize about how they're used, especially with the technology around today that simulates it.

    To be clear, you've never fought a person with axes. If so, you'd be in jail right now for assaulting, possibly killing another person. Just like me, you may know how to swing a weapon and use some technique, but you've never actually hit someone with an axe to see the end result. So you theorize what would happen if you did make contact with one.

    I agree that realism should take prescedence, which is why I stand by my viewpoint. Swing an axe from one side to another. Would it not slash that person causing bleeding? Swing an axe and a sword in the same ways, and they'll do similar things. Axes have more weight, so they'll do more crushing damage when contact is made, but an axe can still slash a target.

    I wore a uniform in the war, so I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about in everyday life where aesthetics and individuality matter.

    I plan on playing GW2, but that doesn't stop me from having a rational discussion. It just seems to me that you're another one of these fanbois that attack whoever offers criticism on a game you like. It is okay to take the middle road and consider other peoples viewpoints. Walk a mile in their shoes, as they say.

  • headphonesheadphones Member Posts: 611

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Originally posted by Loke666


    Originally posted by nate1980

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    Have you ever used either? No.

    I can use a sword and I fought with some guys with axes, it is night and day.

    Why invent the P51 when you have the DC3?

    Go down to your local ARMA or SCA and learn the basics of melee before trying to discuss it.

    And you bet that I would wear ugly clotes and shoes in a war. As for the car, gas here cost  over 2 bucks for a liter (no, not a gallon) so many people drive cheap cars because of it.

    Sorry, but realism is more important than asthetics, at least to a certain degree.

    Being that I've read some of your posts, I've always had some respect for you. Apparently it was misplaced, since you ask the question of whether or not I've used either weapon and then answered the question for me, saying "no." The truth is that you don't know me or what I've done in my life. In fact, I have had training with the use of swords while taking martial arts. I trained in other weapons while in the infantry in the Marine Corps. I've never trained with an axe, but that doesn't stop a smart person from being able to theorize about how they're used, especially with the technology around today that simulates it.

    To be clear, you've never fought a person with axes. If so, you'd be in jail right now for assaulting, possibly killing another person. Just like me, you may know how to swing a weapon and use some technique, but you've never actually hit someone with an axe to see the end result. So you theorize what would happen if you did make contact with one.

    I agree that realism should take prescedence, which is why I stand by my viewpoint. Swing an axe from one side to another. Would it not slash that person causing bleeding? Swing an axe and a sword in the same ways, and they'll do similar things. Axes have more weight, so they'll do more crushing damage when contact is made, but an axe can still slash a target.

    I wore a uniform in the war, so I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about in everyday life where aesthetics and individuality matter.

    I plan on playing GW2, but that doesn't stop me from having a rational discussion. It just seems to me that you're another one of these fanbois that attack whoever offers criticism on a game you like. It is okay to take the middle road and consider other peoples viewpoints. Walk a mile in their shoes, as they say.

    all that stuff you just wrote and you DISAGREE with him that swords and axes are different beasties?

    wow.

    i finally get to say something i always wanted to say here: for realz?

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by headphones

    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by Loke666


    Originally posted by nate1980

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    Have you ever used either? No.

    I can use a sword and I fought with some guys with axes, it is night and day.

    Why invent the P51 when you have the DC3?

    Go down to your local ARMA or SCA and learn the basics of melee before trying to discuss it.

    And you bet that I would wear ugly clotes and shoes in a war. As for the car, gas here cost  over 2 bucks for a liter (no, not a gallon) so many people drive cheap cars because of it.

    Sorry, but realism is more important than asthetics, at least to a certain degree.

    Being that I've read some of your posts, I've always had some respect for you. Apparently it was misplaced, since you ask the question of whether or not I've used either weapon and then answered the question for me, saying "no." The truth is that you don't know me or what I've done in my life. In fact, I have had training with the use of swords while taking martial arts. I trained in other weapons while in the infantry in the Marine Corps. I've never trained with an axe, but that doesn't stop a smart person from being able to theorize about how they're used, especially with the technology around today that simulates it.

    To be clear, you've never fought a person with axes. If so, you'd be in jail right now for assaulting, possibly killing another person. Just like me, you may know how to swing a weapon and use some technique, but you've never actually hit someone with an axe to see the end result. So you theorize what would happen if you did make contact with one.

    I agree that realism should take prescedence, which is why I stand by my viewpoint. Swing an axe from one side to another. Would it not slash that person causing bleeding? Swing an axe and a sword in the same ways, and they'll do similar things. Axes have more weight, so they'll do more crushing damage when contact is made, but an axe can still slash a target.

    I wore a uniform in the war, so I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about in everyday life where aesthetics and individuality matter.

    I plan on playing GW2, but that doesn't stop me from having a rational discussion. It just seems to me that you're another one of these fanbois that attack whoever offers criticism on a game you like. It is okay to take the middle road and consider other peoples viewpoints. Walk a mile in their shoes, as they say.

    all that stuff you just wrote and you DISAGREE with him that swords and axes are different beasties?

    wow.

    i finally get to say something i always wanted to say here: for realz?

    Do you want to know why people chose an axe over a sword in real world fighting? Aside from axes being a simple weapon, meaning they were easier to make, but also because the weight of an axe gave the weilder the ability to cut through plate armor. Both can cleave and puncture flesh, thus lending credibility to the OP's argument that an axe should be able to have skills that cause bleeding damage. So in game terms, both should deal the same type of damage, while a sword should have a faster swing speed and less armor penetration and the axe a lower swing speed with higher armor penetration.

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Originally posted by headphones


    Originally posted by nate1980


    Originally posted by Loke666


    Originally posted by nate1980

    Why are you taking it to extremes? Realistically, anything you can do with a sword you can do with an axe, because both have bladed edges. What he was asking for is not unreasonable. Aesthetics are very important to people. Would you wear ugly clothes and shoes in real life, just because they were more practical? Or drive a car that has the best gas mileage even though it's ugly, when you prefer driving a sports car, SUV, or truck?

    These games are RPG's, thus they attract people who get into their character. Part of that is appreciating how your character looks, the gear they wear, and the weapons they use. If you can't understand his point-of-view, and instead want to attack him for it, it just makes you look like a fanboi.

    Have you ever used either? No.

    I can use a sword and I fought with some guys with axes, it is night and day.

    Why invent the P51 when you have the DC3?

    Go down to your local ARMA or SCA and learn the basics of melee before trying to discuss it.

    And you bet that I would wear ugly clotes and shoes in a war. As for the car, gas here cost  over 2 bucks for a liter (no, not a gallon) so many people drive cheap cars because of it.

    Sorry, but realism is more important than asthetics, at least to a certain degree.

    Being that I've read some of your posts, I've always had some respect for you. Apparently it was misplaced, since you ask the question of whether or not I've used either weapon and then answered the question for me, saying "no." The truth is that you don't know me or what I've done in my life. In fact, I have had training with the use of swords while taking martial arts. I trained in other weapons while in the infantry in the Marine Corps. I've never trained with an axe, but that doesn't stop a smart person from being able to theorize about how they're used, especially with the technology around today that simulates it.

    To be clear, you've never fought a person with axes. If so, you'd be in jail right now for assaulting, possibly killing another person. Just like me, you may know how to swing a weapon and use some technique, but you've never actually hit someone with an axe to see the end result. So you theorize what would happen if you did make contact with one.

    I agree that realism should take prescedence, which is why I stand by my viewpoint. Swing an axe from one side to another. Would it not slash that person causing bleeding? Swing an axe and a sword in the same ways, and they'll do similar things. Axes have more weight, so they'll do more crushing damage when contact is made, but an axe can still slash a target.

    I wore a uniform in the war, so I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about in everyday life where aesthetics and individuality matter.

    I plan on playing GW2, but that doesn't stop me from having a rational discussion. It just seems to me that you're another one of these fanbois that attack whoever offers criticism on a game you like. It is okay to take the middle road and consider other peoples viewpoints. Walk a mile in their shoes, as they say.

    all that stuff you just wrote and you DISAGREE with him that swords and axes are different beasties?

    wow.

    i finally get to say something i always wanted to say here: for realz?

    Do you want to know why people chose an axe over a sword in real world fighting? Aside from axes being a simple weapon, meaning they were easier to make, but also because the weight of an axe gave the weilder the ability to cut through plate armor. Both can cleave and puncture flesh, thus lending credibility to the OP's argument that an axe should be able to have skills that cause bleeding damage. So in game terms, both should deal the same type of damage, while a sword should have a faster swing speed and less armor penetration and the axe a lower swing speed with higher armor penetration.

    Axes could also be used to catch and break sword blades, their good for destroying shields, and as already mentioned their pretty good at carving into armour, swords tended to be either stabbing or slashing variety, relying more often on speed than skill or strength.... the 2h or greatsword was really pretty useless in combat, except against a heavily armoured opponent, not to mention they were hideously slow, heavy.. and you didnt swing them very often, and they were absolutely rubbish in close quarter combat with someone who wasnt wearing heavy armour. Even a battleaxe didnt suffer that kind of drawback image

    even a guy using a dagger could take out a 2h sword wielder, probably by just stepping in close and sticking it into the armpit of the guy with the 2h sword. image

  • PurplehazzPurplehazz Member Posts: 27

    Here we go again.  The game can't satisfy everyone.  You could "what if" every weapon to death and it would get you no where.  The game is designed to be balanced in all aspects of the game and yes that includes weapons.  Besides its a FANTASY game.  Who said that an Axe has to act like an Axe in a make believe fantasy world?  That is the point isnt it, to fantasize!

    image

  • AdalwulffAdalwulff Member, Newbie CommonPosts: 1,152

    Originally posted by Tacomeat

     


    Ok I’m just trying to get some clarfication and see if I’m comprehending this correctly, because if what I see in the skill tool is all that is offered in terms of weapon skills, then I will seriously be contemplating whether I purchase this game or not.  


     


    If the following is false you don't have to read the below past the line and I’ll eat my hat and humbly ask for a lecture and links:  Skills are assigned by weapons.  There is no bigger pool of offensive skills that can be used with all weapons (like utility skills) meaning that the skills that are pre-assigned to the weapons you wield will be what you have to play with for the rest of the game excluding utility/elite skills.


     


    Ex:  In wow the weapon you use doesn’t matter, you get your skills from a trainer and they remain the same.  But in Gw2, your skills are determined by your weapon forcing you to possibly play say with swords when that person may actually want to play with axes (me). 



     


    I noticed on the skills tool and Totalhalibut’s warrior video, that each weapon does something the other weapons cannot or are better at. 


     


    Ex:  Swords are obviously a bleeding type weapon.  Sever artery (1 slot), Impale (offhand 4th slot), Riposte (5th slot).  3 of the 5 skills you “have to use” are for bleeding.  “If you wanna make guys bleed, then this is the way to do so.—Totalbiscuit" 



     


     


    If the above is true, I'll just have to chalk it up as a valid negative and adapt.  


     

    I think where he's coming from, is in some games where weapons are mostly just stat sticks, you get to choose your weapon for it's aesthetics quite a bit more than you will in a system like w/ GW2.

    For example, if you like some of the skills a certain weapon has (it's playstyle), but you don't like the look of swinging that weapon, you are kinda screwed.

    For example, there are certain weapons I will probably not use as much when I make my warrior, because I don't like the look of them, even if their playstyle seems interesting. Now, lucky for me I actually enjoy playing different playstyles quite frequently, so it's not as much of an issue; but if someone has a playstyle that fit's dual axes, but they like the look of a warrior w/ 2 swords, or a sword & shield, then they are kinda SOL.

    Again, it's kind of a minor issue for most people, and is almost purely an aesthetics issue, but it is still a con to the system put in place. Personally I think the pros far outway the cons, but for some that may not be the case.



     


    This post sums up what I'm getting at.  I also hope in the future that weapons get more options to choose from than just what they have now in an expansion or something.  I like having options, and I hate being told what to wield. That was all really...and yes I quite frankly did want to chop down a forest and stab someone with a hammer... 


    ------------


     


     


     


    Point is you have to choose a weapon based on its skills, not on what you actually want to fight with which imo sucks. 


     


    My dilemma: (Warrior) I want to go into pvp with dual axes because I love axes, but the dual axes don't have enough mobility compared to the greatsword with 2 mobility skills plus the utility skill Bull’s Charge equaling 3 gap closers vs 1 gap closer with Bull’s Charge with dual axes.  So if I don’t pick the greatsword, then I can’t be as mobile as I wish to be which means if I decided to play the way I wanted anyway, I would be kited to death (depending on if my opponents has more than one gap opener or knock backs and other variables like terrain).


     


    So in order to play the way you want, you have to be lucky and hope the skills that are assigned to the weapons are the ones you like and want to work with. 


     


    The argument of switching:  “You can have 2 weapons at a time and switch between them during combat.” Doesn’t change the fact that I am being forced or rather I “have” to bring along that weapon as my choice if I want to do what I want to do…which actually defeats the purpose of this action because if I bring the weapon that has the skills I need but don’t particularly want to use, I give up my second weapon slot which I intended for another weapon,  (Again I haven't read anywhere yet that you can carry as many weapons as you wish, you just have to equip 2 and only 2 in-combat weapons so if that's the case that relieves me a bit)


     


    Other gripes: 


     


    Why the hell are there no 2h Axes!?  If they don’t add them in by the next expansion I’m going game developer hunting with a battleaxe!


     


    I’m a little annoyed that the amount of skills you have at your disposal seems small and limiting.  I haven' t played Gw but I read somewhere that they have something like 1000 skills to pick and choose from which sounds like oodles of fun.  I assumed the same for GW2 but the skill choices, according to the skill tool, looks very limiting.  


     


    Looking at the skills in total sure you have a lot, but they are actually situational and divided up, under water skills can’t be used on land vise versa, downed skills obviously only available when downed…well you get the point. 

     

    I dont see a flaw, not at all.

    The vast amount of weapon combos and character skills is a good thing, making you pick a greatsword over duel axes shouldnt be a gamebreaker, because your getting the skills you wanted.

    image
  • Dream_ChaserDream_Chaser Member Posts: 1,043

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Describe the act of chopping. Now envision it. Why can't a person "chop" with a sword? Can a person not use a downward swing with a sword to chop a guys arm off? Why can't an axe thrust? Haven't you seen axes with those spikes on the end of them? Sure, they're not as effective as a sword thrust, since they don't go as deep, but you probably get my point.

    So, we're past the point of scraping the barrel, and now it comes down to this.

    Oh my. So I was right and this is just going to induce space-shattering degrees of facepalm, isn't it?

    No, a sword can't be used to chop off an armoured arm like that. This isn't Monty Python. Swords aren't light sabres that cut through everything like butter. It's the weight of an axe that allows for the kind of chopping that you describe, it's that an axe can provide blunt force along with a blade edge that allows it to chop into armour.

    A blade, however, can't provide enough blunt force to do that.

    So no, you can't use the skills of an axe on a sword. That's patently ridiculous. I'm sorry, this thread is just completely pointless if that's what we're talking about. It's so pointless that it's funny. And as I pointed out, more ridiculous things can happen. I mean... what, people expect to be able to shoot bullets from daggers? How does that work?

    The skills are tied to weapons for good reason. That you don't understand this yet is baffling.

    Sigh. Some people.

  • Dream_ChaserDream_Chaser Member Posts: 1,043

    Originally posted by Purplehazz

    Who said that an Axe has to act like an Axe in a make believe fantasy world?  That is the point isnt it, to fantasize!

    It's internal consistency. Even fantasy worlds have their own physics, and if you say that all weapons actually behave the same way despite appearances, if you say that daggers can shoot bullets, then you have to provide a damned good lore basis for this. You basically have to rewrite physics for that world.

    Some authors can, but often, for the smaller things (like weapons use), they remain the same. The reasons for this are as I just explained, which I felt was painfully obvious. You can't have a dagger shooting bullets without someone asking how does that work? And you'd better be ready to tell them.

    Any fantasy work that has the balls to be that crazy needs to explain how it works, and for that they'd need to make fundamental changes to the almost earth-like (but with differences) reality of Tyria. In other words, it would take development time. And they're totally going to delay the game's release for that.

  • nate1980nate1980 Member UncommonPosts: 2,063

    Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

    Originally posted by nate1980

    Describe the act of chopping. Now envision it. Why can't a person "chop" with a sword? Can a person not use a downward swing with a sword to chop a guys arm off? Why can't an axe thrust? Haven't you seen axes with those spikes on the end of them? Sure, they're not as effective as a sword thrust, since they don't go as deep, but you probably get my point.

    So, we're past the point of scraping the barrel, and now it comes down to this.

    Oh my. So I was right and this is just going to induce space-shattering degrees of facepalm, isn't it?

    No, a sword can't be used to chop off an armoured arm like that. This isn't Monty Python. Swords aren't light sabres that cut through everything like butter. It's the weight of an axe that allows for the kind of chopping that you describe, it's that an axe can provide blunt force along with a blade edge that allows it to chop into armour.

    A blade, however, can't provide enough blunt force to do that.

    So no, you can't use the skills of an axe on a sword. That's patently ridiculous. I'm sorry, this thread is just completely pointless if that's what we're talking about. It's so pointless that it's funny. And as I pointed out, more ridiculous things can happen. I mean... what, people expect to be able to shoot bullets from daggers? How does that work?

    The skills are tied to weapons for good reason. That you don't understand this yet is baffling.

    Sigh. Some people.

    If you read my other posts, you'd of seen that I already acknowledged an axe advantage versus armored opponents and I agree with you.

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