I don't think ganking is really even an issue, because there are some very simple mechanics that could be added to remove them... A very basic emulation of policing, one that you see in some mmo's today. When someone begins attacking another player, they lose reputation points which will slowly regenerate over time. If your reputation is low enough, NPCs and other players will attack you at an increased frequency until you settle down on your PKing.
That would allow for freedom of PKing on occassion, but it would minimize how often it happens to new players so they do not get frustrated. Regeneration rates of reputation would be variable across servers, the most hardcore servers not having regeneration of reputation.
So instead of fixing problems with griefing by removing all combat between players we have brought a much more realistic solution about with very little additional programming needed. A point based reputation system emulates a smaller community than actually exists on a MMORPG... In a game of only 100 users, when someone PKs everyone would know and that persons LITERAL reputation would decrease. Since there are too many players for everyone to keep track of each others actual reputation, we have to designate it through game design. There may be even more realistic solutions, but I think they would playout in a similar fashion and may require more developemental detication.
I don't think ganking is really even an issue, because there are some very simple mechanics that could be added to remove them... A very basic emulation of policing, one that you see in some mmo's today. When someone begins attacking another player, they lose reputation points which will slowly regenerate over time. If your reputation is low enough, NPCs and other players will attack you at an increased frequency until you settle down on your PKing.
That would allow for freedom of PKing on occassion, but it would minimize how often it happens to new players so they do not get frustrated. Regeneration rates of reputation would be variable across servers, the most hardcore servers not having regeneration of reputation.
So instead of fixing problems with griefing by removing all combat between players we have brought a much more realistic solution about with very little additional programming needed. A point based reputation system emulates a smaller community than actually exists on a MMORPG... In a game of only 100 users, when someone PKs everyone would know and that persons LITERAL reputation would decrease. Since there are too many players for everyone to keep track of each others actual reputation, we have to designate it through game design. There may be even more realistic solutions, but I think they would playout in a similar fashion and may require more developemental detication.
That's been done in all kinds of games and it never really works. The PKers think the penalties are too hard while the people being PKed think the penalties are a slap on the wrist. Usually the PKers will find a loophole that lets them PK without suffering the consequences and the devs decline to fix the loopholes because they fear that the PKers will quit the game.
I think a lot of you missed something in the MUD Post-MUD era. A lot, and I mean a LOT of MUDs were invite only. You could apply, but you might not get in. Some of the biggest MUDs still around (200+ players) are invite only, they don't even advertise anymore on Mud Connector. Here is a solution but a hell of a gamble. Start a shard for your MMO that is invite only. Give out 100 accounts. Each account has 1000 reputation points and 5 invites. If anyone a player invited gets banned or suspended the person inviting them losses 200 points. The person getting banned loses 500 points. Anyone gets to 0 and that person (not account, person) is banned from that shard permanently. Each player gets 5 and only 5 invites. Now let us see how that community evolves. I'd gamble it would be a vast improvement for those playing on that shard, when it comes to the people they play with. (Mechanics taken from a Rom MUD from back in 93-94ish based on of all things Dune)
I actually think this is a great idea. I would start reputation at 0 and allow it to become negative, however. And there could always be additional mechanics to modify your rep as the game expands.
I may do that for my next project; I run several small online flash games. lysle.net
Unfortunately though, like any system that allows players a say in the matter - it can be subject to griefing.
Have you ever PUGged as DPS in a 5 man where the tank or the healer was being an ass? Did you grin and bear it, or say something - even politely - only to find yourself back in town?
Did you ever join a basketball game or a football game as a kid - only to find yourself out of the game, because of a clique playing?
Perhaps I have a low opinion of the species, eh? Jaded? Likely...lol.
I wanted to say, I had a similar thing happen to me in vanilla WoW. I was a paladin in a BRD pug and was dps, since we had another paladin healing and a nice geared warrior tank.
The pally was the leader. A 2hander dropped. I wanted it because it was a upgrade. I said I wanted it, but the pally said her warrior tank friend should get it. I said let's both just roll for it. I need rolled it and won, but was removed from group before getting the reward. I can remember that past event, because that was a endgame point were a player exploited the group leadership tool with unfair bias in my WoW experience.
Conscience? Knowing the difference between right and wrong?
I don't know...I'm not a religious person, but having played UO and Darkfall I understand why religion can be a good thing. Religion used to keep immoral people in check because they thought that some deity was always watching them so they would behave...apparently they are incapable of policing themselves so they need that.
Maybe we need to bring religion back.
There's no conscience involved in religion, it's just more threats. You'd better behave or an imaginary man in the sky might smite you. How is that any different than policing in MMOs, except that the mods actually exist and might actually do something to you if you're caught?
I did not know that Buddhism threatened its followers.
Conscience? Knowing the difference between right and wrong?
I don't know...I'm not a religious person, but having played UO and Darkfall I understand why religion can be a good thing. Religion used to keep immoral people in check because they thought that some deity was always watching them so they would behave...apparently they are incapable of policing themselves so they need that.
Maybe we need to bring religion back.
There's no conscience involved in religion, it's just more threats. You'd better behave or an imaginary man in the sky might smite you. How is that any different than policing in MMOs, except that the mods actually exist and might actually do something to you if you're caught?
I did not know that Buddhism threatened its followers.
Conscience? Knowing the difference between right and wrong?
I don't know...I'm not a religious person, but having played UO and Darkfall I understand why religion can be a good thing. Religion used to keep immoral people in check because they thought that some deity was always watching them so they would behave...apparently they are incapable of policing themselves so they need that.
Maybe we need to bring religion back.
There's no conscience involved in religion, it's just more threats. You'd better behave or an imaginary man in the sky might smite you. How is that any different than policing in MMOs, except that the mods actually exist and might actually do something to you if you're caught?
I did not know that Buddhism threatened its followers.
Since the ultimate goal of Buddhism is to stop reincarnating and do away with the final three fetters of the mind, sure it's a threat of sorts. Purify yourself or continue to reincarnate. Failure, or the consequences of failure, can act as a threat to act in a particular way.
Conscience? Knowing the difference between right and wrong?
I don't know...I'm not a religious person, but having played UO and Darkfall I understand why religion can be a good thing. Religion used to keep immoral people in check because they thought that some deity was always watching them so they would behave...apparently they are incapable of policing themselves so they need that.
Maybe we need to bring religion back.
There's no conscience involved in religion, it's just more threats. You'd better behave or an imaginary man in the sky might smite you. How is that any different than policing in MMOs, except that the mods actually exist and might actually do something to you if you're caught?
I did not know that Buddhism threatened its followers.
Since the ultimate goal of Buddhism is to stop reincarnating and do away with the final three fetters of the mind, sure it's a threat of sorts. Purify yourself or continue to reincarnate. Failure, or the consequences of failure, can act as a threat to act in a particular way.
If you consider it to be a threat, you will never be able to stop reincarnation, because a crucial part of the path is to not indulge in neither excessive negative nor positive thoughts.
If you consider it to be a threat, you will never be able to stop reincarnation, because a crucial part of the path is to not indulge in neither excessive negative nor positive thoughts.
Since there's no such thing as reincarnation, I'm not particularly worried.
If you consider it to be a threat, you will never be able to stop reincarnation, because a crucial part of the path is to not indulge in neither excessive negative nor positive thoughts.
Since there's no such thing as reincarnation, I'm not particularly worried.
If you consider it to be a threat, you will never be able to stop reincarnation, because a crucial part of the path is to not indulge in neither excessive negative nor positive thoughts.
Since there's no such thing as reincarnation, I'm not particularly worried.
The point being: a rational Buddhist would not consider Buddhism to be threatening. Christians may though consider their own religion to be partially threatening.
I don't think ganking is really even an issue, because there are some very simple mechanics that could be added to remove them... A very basic emulation of policing, one that you see in some mmo's today. When someone begins attacking another player, they lose reputation points which will slowly regenerate over time. If your reputation is low enough, NPCs and other players will attack you at an increased frequency until you settle down on your PKing.
That would allow for freedom of PKing on occassion, but it would minimize how often it happens to new players so they do not get frustrated. Regeneration rates of reputation would be variable across servers, the most hardcore servers not having regeneration of reputation.
So instead of fixing problems with griefing by removing all combat between players we have brought a much more realistic solution about with very little additional programming needed. A point based reputation system emulates a smaller community than actually exists on a MMORPG... In a game of only 100 users, when someone PKs everyone would know and that persons LITERAL reputation would decrease. Since there are too many players for everyone to keep track of each others actual reputation, we have to designate it through game design. There may be even more realistic solutions, but I think they would playout in a similar fashion and may require more developemental detication.
That's been done in all kinds of games and it never really works. The PKers think the penalties are too hard while the people being PKed think the penalties are a slap on the wrist. Usually the PKers will find a loophole that lets them PK without suffering the consequences and the devs decline to fix the loopholes because they fear that the PKers will quit the game.
Well those games should have offered server switching services because the PKers and the PKed are both on the wrong server. Since each server would have different reputation regeneration rates.
Comments
I don't think ganking is really even an issue, because there are some very simple mechanics that could be added to remove them... A very basic emulation of policing, one that you see in some mmo's today. When someone begins attacking another player, they lose reputation points which will slowly regenerate over time. If your reputation is low enough, NPCs and other players will attack you at an increased frequency until you settle down on your PKing.
That would allow for freedom of PKing on occassion, but it would minimize how often it happens to new players so they do not get frustrated. Regeneration rates of reputation would be variable across servers, the most hardcore servers not having regeneration of reputation.
So instead of fixing problems with griefing by removing all combat between players we have brought a much more realistic solution about with very little additional programming needed. A point based reputation system emulates a smaller community than actually exists on a MMORPG... In a game of only 100 users, when someone PKs everyone would know and that persons LITERAL reputation would decrease. Since there are too many players for everyone to keep track of each others actual reputation, we have to designate it through game design. There may be even more realistic solutions, but I think they would playout in a similar fashion and may require more developemental detication.
Play as your fav retro characters: cnd-online.net. My site: www.lysle.net. Blog: creatingaworld.blogspot.com.
That's been done in all kinds of games and it never really works. The PKers think the penalties are too hard while the people being PKed think the penalties are a slap on the wrist. Usually the PKers will find a loophole that lets them PK without suffering the consequences and the devs decline to fix the loopholes because they fear that the PKers will quit the game.
I actually think this is a great idea. I would start reputation at 0 and allow it to become negative, however. And there could always be additional mechanics to modify your rep as the game expands.
I may do that for my next project; I run several small online flash games. lysle.net
Unfortunately though, like any system that allows players a say in the matter - it can be subject to griefing.
Have you ever PUGged as DPS in a 5 man where the tank or the healer was being an ass? Did you grin and bear it, or say something - even politely - only to find yourself back in town?
Did you ever join a basketball game or a football game as a kid - only to find yourself out of the game, because of a clique playing?
Perhaps I have a low opinion of the species, eh? Jaded? Likely...lol.
I wanted to say, I had a similar thing happen to me in vanilla WoW. I was a paladin in a BRD pug and was dps, since we had another paladin healing and a nice geared warrior tank.The pally was the leader. A 2hander dropped. I wanted it because it was a upgrade. I said I wanted it, but the pally said her warrior tank friend should get it. I said let's both just roll for it. I need rolled it and won, but was removed from group before getting the reward. I can remember that past event, because that was a endgame point were a player exploited the group leadership tool with unfair bias in my WoW experience.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
I did not know that Buddhism threatened its followers.
It does. It's called karma
Now you learned something new
Since the ultimate goal of Buddhism is to stop reincarnating and do away with the final three fetters of the mind, sure it's a threat of sorts. Purify yourself or continue to reincarnate. Failure, or the consequences of failure, can act as a threat to act in a particular way.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
If you consider it to be a threat, you will never be able to stop reincarnation, because a crucial part of the path is to not indulge in neither excessive negative nor positive thoughts.
Since there's no such thing as reincarnation, I'm not particularly worried.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Source please
The point being: a rational Buddhist would not consider Buddhism to be threatening. Christians may though consider their own religion to be partially threatening.
This is going offtopic though, so I'll stop now.
*sigh*
I've watched that Koster interview before, but I had to watch it again.
I yearn for the old days that he talks about, when it was about creating virtual worlds.
I miss them too Raph!
Please get together with Garriott and create something new for us bitter sandboxers out there. Please?
Well those games should have offered server switching services because the PKers and the PKed are both on the wrong server. Since each server would have different reputation regeneration rates.
Play as your fav retro characters: cnd-online.net. My site: www.lysle.net. Blog: creatingaworld.blogspot.com.