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This game looks very interesting.

SyrusSyiSyrusSyi Asheville, NCPosts: 366Member

This game looks like it is a great game but why does everyone always talk about its low player base and if it is so bad why is it like the seconded top rated game on the website?

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Comments

  • KanesterKanester WalesPosts: 375Member Uncommon

    Played the Beta, It was an awful game. Slow and boring not to mention a complete EVE (With Robots) Rip off.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member Common


    Originally posted by syrusmag3
    This game looks like it is a great game but why does everyone always talk about its low player base and if it is so bad why is it like the seconded top rated game on the website?

    The game is well done. However, you have to be into pretty slow sandbox style play or FFA PvP to enjoy the game. If you enjoy Eve, you might enjoy Perpetuum. I have heard that the combat is more fun than in Eve, but the other stuff (mining, watching the market, etc.) are not any more exciting.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • mithossmithoss Sankt AugustinPosts: 210Member Uncommon

    its basically excel. with 3d graphics.

  • SraikSraik Olympia, WAPosts: 23Member

    I play the game and like it just fine.  That said, sandbox games are not for everyone (a lot of folks don't like EvE); comes down to personal preference to a large degree.  Which leads me to...

    Sandox games (especially those with player-based economies) require a critical number of players to truly thrive.  I think that this is because a significant part of the game "content" is interaction between the players.  I think that this is why you see a lot of discussion about the number of players in the game (atm 260 toons).

    That said, I have not found the game to be unenjoyable due to low player numbers.  It would, however be significantly better with more.  Hopefully the work of the devs (plus some much needed advertisement) increases the player base and therefore increases the "content". 

    Time will tell, but for the moment, I find the game enjoyable even with the low player base number.  I think part of the reason is that the world is relatively small (compared to how massive EvE is) so it takes less folks to be a presence.  A second factor is that the number of players online, even though low, is relatively consistent throughout the day.  Doesn't tend to fluctuate as extremely as EvE.

    Only way to know if you like it is to check it out.  Doesn't mater if I like it or not...personal preference is a huge part in game selection, so you will need to form your own opinion.

  • kakasakikakasaki Lockhart, TXPosts: 1,205Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Sraik

    I play the game and like it just fine.  That said, sandbox games are not for everyone (a lot of folks don't like EvE); comes down to personal preference to a large degree.  Which leads me to...
    Sandox games (especially those with player-based economies) require a critical number of players to truly thrive.  I think that this is because a significant part of the game "content" is interaction between the players.  I think that this is why you see a lot of discussion about the number of players in the game (atm 260 toons).
    That said, I have not found the game to be unenjoyable due to low player numbers.  It would, however be significantly better with more.  Hopefully the work of the devs (plus some much needed advertisement) increases the player base and therefore increases the "content". 
    Time will tell, but for the moment, I find the game enjoyable even with the low player base number.  I think part of the reason is that the world is relatively small (compared to how massive EvE is) so it takes less folks to be a presence.  A second factor is that the number of players online, even though low, is relatively consistent throughout the day.  Doesn't tend to fluctuate as extremely as EvE.
    Only way to know if you like it is to check it out.  Doesn't mater if I like it or not...personal preference is a huge part in game selection, so you will need to form your own opinion.

    Correct, but not all sandbox games are the same. I enjoy sandbox games over themepark games but I found Perpetuum to  be a bit dull, slow paced and lacking in much to do. But like you said, it does come down to preferences... image

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • freejackmackfreejackmack feeport, MSPosts: 378Member

    It is not a fantasy dungeon raiding lvling kind of game that WoW has made popular.

    Perpetuum is, imo, the best of it's type. Eve of coarse is close in that econ and trade + crop structures are pretty much the end game content with pvp and some difficult pve here and there.

    Perpetuum and games like it (Eve) do not have quick pvp matches that you can jump into for a bit of simple fun or class based dungeon raiding from what I have seen even though you can repair others and get tank skills sort of; there are no dungeons with bosses that drop gear for progression to the next higher dungeon; you would lose everything the next time you get blown up anyway. That imo is what it lacks; not because it is less of a game with out that type of pve but I simply miss it sometimes when I'm mindlessly grinding for cash to fund my pvp adventures.

    Games like this tend to forget that you, at some point need to do pve for cash and loot for your industry and getting money for pvp; and the pve content feels more of a means to an end rather than a fun part of the total game experience; and that to me is a shame; it's like saying look at all the cool new features we brought to mmo's but you can't have these features that millions already like; or you have to do this content that really is not that fun, to get to the cool new features. Sorry, to bad:(

    To me it is frustrating because I think with a little better forethought you could have a no brainer successor to the old generations of mmo's; the game to go to for the next ten years. Simply because you did not turn your back on a good game mechanic when you wanted to be different but had no better idea in that area; but instead you just let it be a sort of annoyance; and no one wants to be in an unpleasent mental state when they are playing a game.

    I don't think I am the only one that feels this way. Some of the games that I feel need work in pve areas are Darkfall Eve and Perpetuum; there are probably more but i have not played them and I have to say that Peretuum stands out as the better of the three. Darkfall has fps combat style but imo lacks in other areas that are needed for my enjoyment that Perpetuum excells at like the skill system which Eve also lacks in.

    Perpetuum is awesome for the improvments over Eve in combat and skill systems.

    But the reason I like Perpetuum most is the strategy that the combat system allows for. There is no warp to zero like in Eve there is a thrill you get from the chase and intell plays an enjoyable roll in the combat.

    The dancing you do in Perpetuums' combat you will never get in Eve type combat systems and for the most part Perpetuums combat just works really well compared to any other mmo I have played. Maybe world of tanks has a better combat system but World of Tanks is a FPS game; Perpetuum has the open world experience benifit that draws you in. You can't chase someone very far in World of Tanks; but if Perpetuum was a FPS game it would do well to adopt the type of mechanics World of Tanks has. However for an open world mmo Perpetuum has really great combat.

    I recomend you give Perpetuum a try for sure.

     

  • RobsolfRobsolf Grand Rapids, MIPosts: 4,312Member Uncommon

    I tried the demo and couldn't get into it, and I'm actually a fan of Eve.  Pretty sure they still have the trial, if so you should give it a shot.  I don't remember the download taking very long.

    I certainly wouldn't UN-recommend trying it, if you have some time to kill.

  • GreenzorGreenzor otilioPosts: 165Member

    Originally posted by freejackmack

    for the most part Perpetuums combat just works really well compared to any other mmo I have played. 
     

    Both EVE and Perpetuum's combat system don't stand out mostly because of their auto-attack. EVE involves a different kind of "thinking" (ship speed, ammunition size & speed, sig radius, angle) than PO (WASD). So it's a matter of personal taste.


     

  • freejackmackfreejackmack feeport, MSPosts: 378Member



    Originally posted by Greenzor

    Originally posted by freejackmack

    for the most part Perpetuums combat just works really well compared to any other mmo I have played. 
     
    Both EVE and Perpetuum's combat system don't stand out mostly because of their auto-attack. EVE involves a different kind of "thinking" (ship speed, ammunition size & speed, sig radius, angle) than PO (WASD). So it's a matter of personal taste.

     

    The auto attack even shows up in FPS games that is no issue. You also are generally limited to 1 or 2 attack types which is true for a lot of games so not an issue, but encourages grouping and team work and diversity is a plus; It's not always your dps that wins a battle.

    Eve involves a LOT of spread sheet type of prep but Perpetuum is more organic. Hit dispersion replaces the need to be always moving to reduce damage but if you are fast it is much more fun to dodge in and out of targets range than to try to have greater relative transverse speed all the time. It works better and you have greater control over your vehicles direction and speed and that allows for some interesting tactics like jukeing so your opponent steps to far into your lock range.

    But that is not all. Perpetuum adds line of sight which every other mmo has except for Eve and that alone makes Perpetuum combat work better. There is more to the battle than a bigger blob and mastering your sense of map awareness alone can win you battles in Perpetuum. It makes for a more enjoyable less frustrating experience compared to Eve's 2 dimensional tactic combat style. Paper beats rock and rock re-spawns to find all his expensive implants are toast simply because he did not know there was going to be a paper at the battle. It's a kind of pointless uninteresting combat system that leaves much to be desired.

    But if you like it that is great. I simply am not so easily amused by Eve's paper, scissor, rock combat.

  • GreenzorGreenzor otilioPosts: 165Member

    Originally posted by freejackmack

     




    Originally posted by Greenzor






    Originally posted by freejackmack



    for the most part Perpetuums combat just works really well compared to any other mmo I have played. 

     





    Both EVE and Perpetuum's combat system don't stand out mostly because of their auto-attack. EVE involves a different kind of "thinking" (ship speed, ammunition size & speed, sig radius, angle) than PO (WASD). So it's a matter of personal taste.



     




     

    The auto attack even shows up in FPS games that is no issue. You also are generally limited to 1 or 2 attack types which is true for a lot of games so not an issue, but encourages grouping and team work and diversity is a plus; It's not always your dps that wins a battle.

    Eve involves a LOT of spread sheet type of prep but Perpetuum is more organic. Hit dispersion replaces the need to be always moving to reduce damage but if you are fast it is much more fun to dodge in and out of targets range than to try to have greater relative transverse speed all the time. It works better and you have greater control over your vehicles direction and speed and that allows for some interesting tactics like jukeing so your opponent steps to far into your lock range.

    But that is not all. Perpetuum adds line of sight which every other mmo has except for Eve and that alone makes Perpetuum combat work better. There is more to the battle than a bigger blob and mastering your sense of map awareness alone can win you battles in Perpetuum. It makes for a more enjoyable less frustrating experience compared to Eve's 2 dimensional tactic combat style. Paper beats rock and rock re-spawns to find all his expensive implants are toast simply because he did not know there was going to be a paper at the battle. It's a kind of pointless uninteresting combat system that leaves much to be desired.

    But if you like it that is great. I simply am not so easily amused by Eve's paper, scissor, rock combat.

    FPS stands for First Person Shooter, I think you're a little confused here.

    In Perpetuum you move your mech within a 2-dimensional xy axis plane. In EVE you approach, quite, Orbit, reach your optimal range, fly away etc within a 3-dimensional axis plane. Tacklers and speed tankers use to pilot their ship with their mouse in EVE, other ships are about looking for their optimal range using shortcuts. Each kind of ship fulfill its own role which by all means sounds more fun to me than "the bigger the better".


     

  • freejackmackfreejackmack feeport, MSPosts: 378Member



    Originally posted by Greenzor

    Originally posted by freejackmack

     



    Originally posted by Greenzor




    Originally posted by freejackmack

    for the most part Perpetuums combat just works really well compared to any other mmo I have played. 
     



    Both EVE and Perpetuum's combat system don't stand out mostly because of their auto-attack. EVE involves a different kind of "thinking" (ship speed, ammunition size & speed, sig radius, angle) than PO (WASD). So it's a matter of personal taste.

     




     
    The auto attack even shows up in FPS games that is no issue. You also are generally limited to 1 or 2 attack types which is true for a lot of games so not an issue, but encourages grouping and team work and diversity is a plus; It's not always your dps that wins a battle.
    Eve involves a LOT of spread sheet type of prep but Perpetuum is more organic. Hit dispersion replaces the need to be always moving to reduce damage but if you are fast it is much more fun to dodge in and out of targets range than to try to have greater relative transverse speed all the time. It works better and you have greater control over your vehicles direction and speed and that allows for some interesting tactics like jukeing so your opponent steps to far into your lock range.
    But that is not all. Perpetuum adds line of sight which every other mmo has except for Eve and that alone makes Perpetuum combat work better. There is more to the battle than a bigger blob and mastering your sense of map awareness alone can win you battles in Perpetuum. It makes for a more enjoyable less frustrating experience compared to Eve's 2 dimensional tactic combat style. Paper beats rock and rock re-spawns to find all his expensive implants are toast simply because he did not know there was going to be a paper at the battle. It's a kind of pointless uninteresting combat system that leaves much to be desired.
    But if you like it that is great. I simply am not so easily amused by Eve's paper, scissor, rock combat.


    FPS stands for First Person Shooter, I think you're a little confused here.
    In Perpetuum you move your mech within a 2-dimensional xy axis plane. In EVE you approach, quite, Orbit, reach your optimal range, fly away etc within a 3-dimensional axis plane. Tacklers and speed tankers use to pilot their ship with their mouse in EVE, other ships are about looking for their optimal range using shortcuts. Each kind of ship fulfill its own role which by all means sounds more fun to me than "the bigger the better".

     


     
    I consider FPS games to have the best combat but you rarely see FPS mmo's and even more rare is a FPS Sci-Fi mmo.

    However Perpetuum has the best combat and open world mechanics of the "point & click" mmo's buy far.

    And yes Eve has ships that fill different rolls and no bigger is not better in Perpetuum but really you can use more than what is equipped on your vehicle to win a battle in Perpetuum. And piloting in Eve is way more frustrating than piloting a mech in Perpetuum simply because of the better control options.

    "In EVE you approach, quite, Orbit, reach your optimal range, fly away etc within a 3-dimensional axis plane." Yeah that's all you can do and in an awkward physics engine with bad control options and no line of sight mechanics. Eve combat is 1 dimensional imo, 2 dimensional at best even though you can move in three dimensions it does little good in combat. You either have the stats and equipment to beat someone or you don't. It's not any more complicated than that in Eve when you really examine it. Just like the millions of fantasy games except with boring pve.

    Perpetuum has more to it than just orbiting at optimal range and flying away. It has more depth that allows for style of play flavors and tactics that you will not find in Eve's combat system. Bigger is better is in fact what Eve combat amounts to as well as paper, scissor, rock combat. You understand this the first time your alliance gets hot-droped by 2 motherships and all your alliance can only stare cloaked as they wipe out your outposts.

    It's not to say Eve is not a good game with good features but Eve combat which arguably is the most important part is lame.

  • QuesaQuesa Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,432Member Uncommon

    Eve's combat is more advanced and evolving than PO.  I don't even know what reality you are coming from if you are trying to state PO > EveO as far as combat.  There is no contest.

    There aren't nearly any combat systems which require so much focus and adaptation as Eve does.  It may seem like it's a simple numbers game but that nausiatingly inept theory gets beaten down time and time again as people come up with strategies and adaptations to beat out larger fleets.  PO is more strategic than most but to say it's more "organic" than Eve is just naivity.

    You can't look at isolated engagements as proof positive that EO is all about rock>paper>scissors for ships because that's so far from the truth you're being absurd.  I can't count how many times I was fleeted with people who knew what they were doing and wiped out a fleet 3x it's size using superior tactics and strategy.

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  • Mors.MagneMors.Magne LondonPosts: 1,530Member Uncommon

    I used to be a fan of Perpetuum, but to be honest, it's not a patch on Eve Online.

     

    Perpetuum is initially ok. However, the massive dissapointment is when you go from light robots to mechs. Basically, mechs really suck - I didn't get any feeling of power at all. In fact, they seem REALLY wimpy and expensive

     

    As a game, Perpetuum is an interesting experiment, but Eve is just so much more varied (there is much more to do - especially with incursions) - and you really do get a feeling of power with the ships you fly.

     

    Also, Eve is evolving faster and being added to at a rapid rate at the moment (because CCP have seen the light).

     

     

     

     

  • freejackmackfreejackmack feeport, MSPosts: 378Member

    Originally posted by Jack_Target

    I used to be a fan of Perpetuum, but to be honest, it's not a patch on Eve Online.
     
    Perpetuum is initially ok. However, the massive dissapointment is when you go from light robots to mechs. Basically, mechs really suck - I didn't get any feeling of power at all. In fact, they seem REALLY wimpy and expensive
     
    As a game, Perpetuum is an interesting experiment, but Eve is just so much more varied (there is much more to do - especially with incursions) - and you really do get a feeling of power with the ships you fly.
     
    Also, Eve is evolving faster and being added to at a rapid rate at the moment (because CCP have seen the light).
     
     
     
     



    Well you need high skills to pilot a mech effectivly.

    I do hope ccp makes Eve more fun than it is.

  • QuesaQuesa Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,432Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by freejackmack


    Originally posted by Jack_Target


    I used to be a fan of Perpetuum, but to be honest, it's not a patch on Eve Online.
     
    Perpetuum is initially ok. However, the massive dissapointment is when you go from light robots to mechs. Basically, mechs really suck - I didn't get any feeling of power at all. In fact, they seem REALLY wimpy and expensive
     
    As a game, Perpetuum is an interesting experiment, but Eve is just so much more varied (there is much more to do - especially with incursions) - and you really do get a feeling of power with the ships you fly.
     
    Also, Eve is evolving faster and being added to at a rapid rate at the moment (because CCP have seen the light).
     
     
     
     



    Well you need high skills to pilot a mech effectivly.

    I do hope ccp makes Eve more fun than it is.

    Eve is more of a sandbox MMO.  Sandbox MMO's push the player to "make his own fun".  If you can't do that then Eve Online will probably never be fun for you.

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  • GreenzorGreenzor otilioPosts: 165Member

    Originally posted by Jack_Target

    I used to be a fan of Perpetuum, but to be honest, it's not a patch on Eve Online. 

    I agree. It's like PO was released a few years late.

     


     


     

  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member Uncommon

    So I download the game, there's a 15 day trial - etc.  Generally speaking, I'm doing fine in the game (had played EVE on and off since 2005)  - so yeah, the obvious EVE similarities made most of it...well, easy to get into.

    Two things stood out to me:


    1. Nausea - yep, motion sickness.  Something that I never experienced in EVE, and something that I have only experienced in some FPS games.  But yep, I had to be extremely careful in playing to avoid feeling like throwing up and wanting to curl up in a fetal position to die.  If it were not a case that I've experienced the issue in FPS games previously, I may not have known what I could do to try to make it better and I would have walked away.

    2. So I made the first Agent.  I was having fun.  I decided that I wanted to try something different though.  As I click to delete the character, a pop-up tells me that I'm going to lose any EP spent on that character - that it will not be refunded - as well as being charged 2800 EP for the deletion.  WTF?  Um...seriously?  Really?

    I'm going to research that second thing to see if it is true (my complete disbelief that it is true even though that is what it says on the screen compels me to do so)...and if it is, well yeah - I'm not logging back in.


     


    Otherwise, I found it to be a pretty nifty game.  No doubt it was dead at the time I was playing, but it was the middle of the night - there were not even 70 people showing in the largest of my chat channels.  But I was having fun.  Much like EVE is not for everybody (much like most games are not for everybody), I could see where some would not like Perpetuum... but those that like EVE (or liked it) may very well enjoy it if they can get past calling it a secondrate clone.

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

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  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member Uncommon

    Okay, so yeah - that #2 thing is very annoying - brutally annoying - one of the oddest things that I've ever seen in a game before.

    So not only do you lose however much EP you had, but you also get dinged for 2800 EP.

    You start with 20169 EP on a new toon.  Say you decide to delete the guy after 2 days (even if you only played for several hours) - your guy could have spent up to 23k or so EP.  You lose that.  Then you also get hit with the 2800 EP penalty.

    You gain 1 EP per minute.  You can go negative because of the deletion.  So that 23k EP character you deleted - you've lost 16 days worth of EP.  You also lose the 2 days worth of EP because of the penalty.  It will take 18 days of the account being active, to be able to create a toon as if you were a fresh account.  Not only that, but because you went negative - you're looking at not being able to improve the new toon you created after the deletion for up to 2 days.  You know - those early days, where you're just starting to build up your character.

    Like I said... one of the oddest things that I've ever seen in a game and a definite turn-off here during the initial trial period.

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

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  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member Uncommon

    It is kind of curious how they went with targeting multiple mobs but only being able to attack a single mob.  I read some of the stuff in the forums about it being about facing (Perpetuum does not have the 2:1 deal on turrets to cover facing like EVE).

    Yet, I can target multiple things to mine and mine from multiple targets.

    It's just a case that I cannot do that in combat.

    Heck, I can even target two different tiles to mine while firing at a third target...heh.

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

    Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%

  • freejackmackfreejackmack feeport, MSPosts: 378Member

    Originally posted by Quesa


    Originally posted by freejackmack



    Originally posted by Jack_Target


    I used to be a fan of Perpetuum, but to be honest, it's not a patch on Eve Online.
     
    Perpetuum is initially ok. However, the massive dissapointment is when you go from light robots to mechs. Basically, mechs really suck - I didn't get any feeling of power at all. In fact, they seem REALLY wimpy and expensive
     
    As a game, Perpetuum is an interesting experiment, but Eve is just so much more varied (there is much more to do - especially with incursions) - and you really do get a feeling of power with the ships you fly.
     
    Also, Eve is evolving faster and being added to at a rapid rate at the moment (because CCP have seen the light).
     
     
     
     



    Well you need high skills to pilot a mech effectivly.

    I do hope ccp makes Eve more fun than it is.

    Eve is more of a sandbox MMO.  Sandbox MMO's push the player to "make his own fun".  If you can't do that then Eve Online will probably never be fun for you.



    Making your own fun only goes so far when the combat is crappy imo. It's like trying to make pinto look like a mustang, what's the point. Just go get a mustang.

    I strongly believe that the game is only as good as the combat system. You can start with the best econ in the world but if you can not make combat interesting and fun then you don't have much more than a econ simulation. And econ is not the focus of my game play in any mmo. It never should be imo.

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