To be honest, not alot of game in the past few years were really succesful. Some had a good succes, but not as near the one they really wanted.
Like Rift, I didn't play it, but it might be a really good game. They announced themself as the new WoW Killer. And didn't even touched it.
Final Fantasy XI ? I remember looking for that game, and saying to myself... Wait for the review and to actually watch that game. It ended up beeing a total fail.
Most game that had potential all went free to play because they weren't as good as they think to compete with the other subscription game.
I don't think any game can kill WoW. If something can kill WoW, it's blizzard themself. And WoW won't "die" so easily like this. They might lose like what.. another 1M or 2M sub ? But even if they did lost that amount, they will still be at the top and most popular mmorpg.
I'm just tired of everyone using WoW-Killer expression. I don't play WoW anymore, but that's just over-hyping a game for no reason, and wasting your money on a game that might be good, but will never be a wow killer.
It will never kill WoW. And I bet that around ~40%-50% of the peopele will stop playing after 1-3 months.
SWTOR isn't inovative. It's for the "Real fan" of star wars, period. And too many people think of themself beeing real fan of the serie, when they aren't.
Most people talking about SWTOR and "hoping" for a huge succes are more WoW haters than Star wars fan, which will not end-up well for the game. So I would say SWTOR will be a Aion/Rift/Insert high-hype game that aren't that good in end and were overhyped.
I really don't believe they are trying to kill WoW. Why would they try and kill the game that they have modeled their game after? I think it has been proven already that you can not kill WoW with a game that plays like WoW. BW and EA are just trying to do what Trion did with Rift. Cash in on the huge success that is WoW. Why be innovative when innovative is risky?
I think the people that are blindly devoted to this game are just as bad as the haters. Different sides oif the same coin. This game is what it is. There is not any kind of ground breaking or innovative thing going on here. Im not saying that is bad .. it just is what it is. If you like Star Wars and like WoW this game is for you.
/agreed
Besides, WoW keeps openning up new markets for other MMOs to follow into later. They spend the money, they bring the hype. All the other developers just wait for Blizzard to do all the work and profit on it later.
"The online gaming sector made 8.9 billion yen ($79.4 million) in sales and 2.3 billion yen ($20.5 million) in operation profits, with its massively multiplayer online role-playing game Final Fantasy XI responsible for most of that figure. FFXI currently has about 500,000 subscribers, and the figure continues to grow."
I think it will be highly succesful and what doesnt make it into launch will be patched in very soon with many expansions on the way its bioware they are always fast with new content look and DAO and DA2 for examples and after their 1st year of extream succes they will prolly anounce a Mass effect or Dragon age mmo in the works. i do not care for WOW comparisons wow is withering away atleast everyone i know has left or leaving it for either TOR,GW2,and tera well anyways have fun
And I bet that around ~40%-50% of the peopele will stop playing after 1-3 months.
SWTOR isn't inovative.
It's for the "Real fan" of star wars, period. And too many people think of themself beeing real fan of the serie, when they aren't.
Most people talking about SWTOR and "hoping" for a huge succes are more WoW haters than Star wars fan, which will not end-up well for the game. So I would say SWTOR will be a Aion/Rift/Insert high-hype game that aren't that good in end and were overhyped.
OK.. where to begin...
-I bet that around 10-90% of the statistics people make up are falsely true and false.
-SWTOR is very innovative. You can easily list out 10 features/systems in the game that have been done before, many that have been done for a decade, like any hater will do - but you can also easily list out 10 features/systems in the game that have never been done before in a MMORPG, like any fanboi will do - point is, both are right.
This game is innovative in that it brings new ideas/concepts to the genre while continuing to refine and correct/build on the ideas/concepts of those that came before.
Innovative is by definition to innovate which is to create something new and/or change something established. DONE.
-There is no such thing as a "Real fan" for anything... not games, not sports, nothing. While I understand you are probably trying to make some reference to SWG being for "Real fans" and TOR being for prequel fans etc. I can tell you I have read many if not most of the extended universe books and many comics and played every SW game ever made and even used to play the PnP RPG and I am still a very big FAN of TOR.
-All the WoW hater stuff is pretty much unique to this website as the rest of the internet actually likes WoW and the vast, vast, vast majority of TOR fans are not WoW haters. Most are probably WoW players, Bioware fans, Star Wars fans, etc.
But we already talked about fans didn't we?
-Comparing SWTOR to Aion/Rift/Warhammer/AoC is a joke!
Combine all of the fans of Warhammer and Conan IPs and you might get 10% of the Star Wars fans. Combine the budget and staff that made Aion/Rift/Warhammer/AoC and you might get close to the production value of TOR.
Combine the talent of those companies.. who have released.... what now? Shitty Asian grinder MMOs, a single game that is actually very well polished just boring (RIFT), Daoc (apparently was awesome, never played it) and the guys who made Anarchy Online...
Bioware is in a whole different league son. Mass Effect 2 probably out sold every game ever made by those companies, combined. Throw in Mass Effect 1, pre-orders for ME3, DA1 and 2, Bulders Gate, KOTOR, Neverwinter...
You're trying to compare one of the premiere AAA game studios on the planet with.. Funcom? Trion?
Bioware is nothing like Funcom -- but we've all seen hype like this before
True--but betting on failure because of "hype" is just as likely to be wrong as betting on success because of "hype".
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I put mediocre success. I just don't think story can keep ya' hooked when you're raiding at max level, AGAIN.
I agree and have been saying the same thing for awhile now. The VO will be great until you get to end game. The "choose your own adventure" style of decision making will be great until you realise that it all takes you to the same place or end game whatever comes first for you. BW is great at creating the illusion that what you are doing matters in Single player games. I just don't think it is going to work as well in an MMO.
That being said though I believe that this game will make leveling a lot more fun than any of the other current MMO's out there..after that I believe it will be just more of the same that we have seen in WoW.
To be honest, not alot of game in the past few years were really succesful. Some had a good succes, but not as near the one they really wanted.
Like Rift, I didn't play it, but it might be a really good game. They announced themself as the new WoW Killer. And didn't even touched it.
Want to know why that campaign worked so well? 6 months later on a Star Wars the old republic forum you just brought up Rift. A lottttt of people missed the point of that advertising lol
I can tell you ToR will not fail out right. It plays like a mmorpg. This is not ff14 where you can not even figure out the map. Does it look old to me? yes, but that is me and I am not a fan of the art syle. We will have to see how it is accepted after release.
This game won't fail at all !! They got unlimited things they can do story,planets,races and classes !! This game is going to be here for a very very long time !
on the simple fact that theres more mmo players than ever before in history
That logic only works with guaranteed beta access on pre-order . From what I've read you get early access meaning a week before official launch (but not guaranteed beta access ). If you activate your account that week early you've brought the game . So this means not one of the units sold has been thus far to try the game and every single person thats brought it means to play it in its initial month at least . This kind of makes your arguement redundant .
this will be one huge baddass mother-truckin' game!
with EA/Bioware/LucasArts on this, i can only imagine the advertisement will be cool (imagine one of their cinematic trailers (or part of it) being released on TV during Christmas shopping season!) you got to admit those cinematic traielrs are goreous, so box sales will be super high. Already the Star Wars ads are out there: that one with the cute darth vader kid starting the car with the force, and the commercial publicizing the upcoming/recent release of the blue ray box set...well, it looks like the idea of star wars is already coming back into our homes again. not to mention the rumor of a star wars tv series in the works......star wars is going to be big this christmas, and will be big over the next few years
at least that is my hope
may the force be strong with EA, Bioware, and LucasArts!
Mediocre success after a few months or so.I was ready to preorder but the end game being again raiding and even worse - crafting items depending on raiding changed my mind.Also the combat seems slower than Wow ,which maybe a good thing for some but not for me since i was hoping for something like AoC melee combat at least.
Big sub drop off after 3-4 months when people realize that endgame is the same as WoW. The choice will be to play TOR and run the same few poorly designed operations over and over, or go back to WoW and have a wider choice of content that's more polished.
Basically see Warhammer, Aion, Rift, etc, etc for how this will play out.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
GW2 and The Secret World are going to rock TOR like a hurricane when they launch. They'll be coming out a few months after TOR releases, right around the time the novelty will be wearing off and people start looking for a real next gen mmo.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
GW2 and The Secret World are going to rock TOR like a hurricane when they launch. They'll be coming out a few months after TOR releases, right around the time the novelty will be wearing off and people start looking for a real next gen mmo.
Really? Says who? Secret World has a April 2012 place holder and given the little footage that has been released, I am betting that they are going to push it back. GW2 doesn't even have an official release date. Secondly, you know how many people have heard of Guild Wars or Secret World. You can probably reduce the number to something like 3 times the people who visiting these forums. You know how many people have heard of Star Wars, or how many will learn of it in the next 12 weeks. I'm betting at least 50 times the amount who subscribe to GW2 and Secret World on release day combined.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
GW2 and The Secret World are going to rock TOR like a hurricane when they launch. They'll be coming out a few months after TOR releases, right around the time the novelty will be wearing off and people start looking for a real next gen mmo.
Really? Says who? Secret World has a April 2012 place holder and given the little footage that has been released, I am betting that they are going to push it back. GW2 doesn't even have an official release date. Secondly, you know how many people have heard of Guild Wars or Secret World. You can probably reduce the number to something like 3 times the people who visiting these forums. You know how many people have heard of Star Wars, or how many will learn of it in the next 12 weeks. I'm betting at least 50 times the amount who subscribe to GW2 and Secret World on release day combined.
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
GW2 and The Secret World are going to rock TOR like a hurricane when they launch. They'll be coming out a few months after TOR releases, right around the time the novelty will be wearing off and people start looking for a real next gen mmo.
Really? Says who? Secret World has a April 2012 place holder and given the little footage that has been released, I am betting that they are going to push it back. GW2 doesn't even have an official release date. Secondly, you know how many people have heard of Guild Wars or Secret World. You can probably reduce the number to something like 3 times the people who visiting these forums. You know how many people have heard of Star Wars, or how many will learn of it in the next 12 weeks. I'm betting at least 50 times the amount who subscribe to GW2 and Secret World on release day combined.
Comments
To be honest, not alot of game in the past few years were really succesful. Some had a good succes, but not as near the one they really wanted.
Like Rift, I didn't play it, but it might be a really good game. They announced themself as the new WoW Killer. And didn't even touched it.
Final Fantasy XI ? I remember looking for that game, and saying to myself... Wait for the review and to actually watch that game. It ended up beeing a total fail.
Most game that had potential all went free to play because they weren't as good as they think to compete with the other subscription game.
I don't think any game can kill WoW. If something can kill WoW, it's blizzard themself. And WoW won't "die" so easily like this. They might lose like what.. another 1M or 2M sub ? But even if they did lost that amount, they will still be at the top and most popular mmorpg.
I'm just tired of everyone using WoW-Killer expression. I don't play WoW anymore, but that's just over-hyping a game for no reason, and wasting your money on a game that might be good, but will never be a wow killer.
/agreed
Besides, WoW keeps openning up new markets for other MMOs to follow into later. They spend the money, they bring the hype. All the other developers just wait for Blizzard to do all the work and profit on it later.
FFXI was very successful it was FFIV that was not. FFXI hit 500 k see here
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/finalfantasy11/news/6086169/500000-milestone-for-playonline?mode=all
That may not be wow standard but 500 k in 2003-2004 was pretty good.
Here they talk profits
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/finalfantasy11/news/6098996/square-enix-announces-earnings-talks-ffxii?mode=all
....this line mentions
"The online gaming sector made 8.9 billion yen ($79.4 million) in sales and 2.3 billion yen ($20.5 million) in operation profits, with its massively multiplayer online role-playing game Final Fantasy XI responsible for most of that figure. FFXI currently has about 500,000 subscribers, and the figure continues to grow."
I think it will be highly succesful and what doesnt make it into launch will be patched in very soon with many expansions on the way its bioware they are always fast with new content look and DAO and DA2 for examples and after their 1st year of extream succes they will prolly anounce a Mass effect or Dragon age mmo in the works. i do not care for WOW comparisons wow is withering away atleast everyone i know has left or leaving it for either TOR,GW2,and tera well anyways have fun
OK.. where to begin...
-I bet that around 10-90% of the statistics people make up are falsely true and false.
-SWTOR is very innovative. You can easily list out 10 features/systems in the game that have been done before, many that have been done for a decade, like any hater will do - but you can also easily list out 10 features/systems in the game that have never been done before in a MMORPG, like any fanboi will do - point is, both are right.
This game is innovative in that it brings new ideas/concepts to the genre while continuing to refine and correct/build on the ideas/concepts of those that came before.
Innovative is by definition to innovate which is to create something new and/or change something established. DONE.
-There is no such thing as a "Real fan" for anything... not games, not sports, nothing. While I understand you are probably trying to make some reference to SWG being for "Real fans" and TOR being for prequel fans etc. I can tell you I have read many if not most of the extended universe books and many comics and played every SW game ever made and even used to play the PnP RPG and I am still a very big FAN of TOR.
-All the WoW hater stuff is pretty much unique to this website as the rest of the internet actually likes WoW and the vast, vast, vast majority of TOR fans are not WoW haters. Most are probably WoW players, Bioware fans, Star Wars fans, etc.
But we already talked about fans didn't we?
-Comparing SWTOR to Aion/Rift/Warhammer/AoC is a joke!
Combine all of the fans of Warhammer and Conan IPs and you might get 10% of the Star Wars fans. Combine the budget and staff that made Aion/Rift/Warhammer/AoC and you might get close to the production value of TOR.
Combine the talent of those companies.. who have released.... what now? Shitty Asian grinder MMOs, a single game that is actually very well polished just boring (RIFT), Daoc (apparently was awesome, never played it) and the guys who made Anarchy Online...
Bioware is in a whole different league son. Mass Effect 2 probably out sold every game ever made by those companies, combined. Throw in Mass Effect 1, pre-orders for ME3, DA1 and 2, Bulders Gate, KOTOR, Neverwinter...
You're trying to compare one of the premiere AAA game studios on the planet with.. Funcom? Trion?
Don't make me lawl
I put mediocre success. I just don't think story can keep ya' hooked when you're raiding at max level, AGAIN.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
as did Age of Conan ...
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/age-of-conan-breaks-pre-order-records
whenever i mention AOC I mean no disrepect to SWTOR
Bioware is nothing like Funcom -- but we've all seen hype like this before
the real measure wont be preorders or units sold
it will be subscriber retention after the first 2-3 months
EQ2 fan sites
True--but betting on failure because of "hype" is just as likely to be wrong as betting on success because of "hype".
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I agree with you -- personally I think SWTOR will be the 2nd most successful mmo in history, but time will tell
EQ2 fan sites
I agree and have been saying the same thing for awhile now. The VO will be great until you get to end game. The "choose your own adventure" style of decision making will be great until you realise that it all takes you to the same place or end game whatever comes first for you. BW is great at creating the illusion that what you are doing matters in Single player games. I just don't think it is going to work as well in an MMO.
That being said though I believe that this game will make leveling a lot more fun than any of the other current MMO's out there..after that I believe it will be just more of the same that we have seen in WoW.
Want to know why that campaign worked so well? 6 months later on a Star Wars the old republic forum you just brought up Rift. A lottttt of people missed the point of that advertising lol
I can tell you ToR will not fail out right. It plays like a mmorpg. This is not ff14 where you can not even figure out the map. Does it look old to me? yes, but that is me and I am not a fan of the art syle. We will have to see how it is accepted after release.
This game won't fail at all !! They got unlimited things they can do story,planets,races and classes !! This game is going to be here for a very very long time !
That logic only works with guaranteed beta access on pre-order . From what I've read you get early access meaning a week before official launch (but not guaranteed beta access ). If you activate your account that week early you've brought the game . So this means not one of the units sold has been thus far to try the game and every single person thats brought it means to play it in its initial month at least . This kind of makes your arguement redundant .
hows a retailer going to know that for preorder?
digital preorders - i agree with you
places like Gamestop? I disagree
EQ2 fan sites
this will be one huge baddass mother-truckin' game!
with EA/Bioware/LucasArts on this, i can only imagine the advertisement will be cool (imagine one of their cinematic trailers (or part of it) being released on TV during Christmas shopping season!) you got to admit those cinematic traielrs are goreous, so box sales will be super high. Already the Star Wars ads are out there: that one with the cute darth vader kid starting the car with the force, and the commercial publicizing the upcoming/recent release of the blue ray box set...well, it looks like the idea of star wars is already coming back into our homes again. not to mention the rumor of a star wars tv series in the works......star wars is going to be big this christmas, and will be big over the next few years
at least that is my hope
may the force be strong with EA, Bioware, and LucasArts!
Big sub drop off after 3-4 months when people realize that endgame is the same as WoW. The choice will be to play TOR and run the same few poorly designed operations over and over, or go back to WoW and have a wider choice of content that's more polished.
Basically see Warhammer, Aion, Rift, etc, etc for how this will play out.
Mediocre success,
happy to see that most follow that view and don't expect jesus second comming. Blizz got big not simply by being good but also due timing. SWTOR will have to compete with alot of big titles diminishing its potential buyers.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Which titles? Did I fall asleep during release date anouncements? That said, WoW wasn't the first coming, nor the second. They were a polished, well marketed title at the time of release (even with all the bugs). Their closest competitor was EQII and lots of Everquest fans were betting that WoW would fail due to lack of "innovation" and bad graphics. Turns out EQII's hardware requirements doomed the game to a mediocre start. I'm willing to bet SWTOR learned that lesson.
GW2 and The Secret World are going to rock TOR like a hurricane when they launch. They'll be coming out a few months after TOR releases, right around the time the novelty will be wearing off and people start looking for a real next gen mmo.
No doubt AOC/WAR route. Good for the first few months then subs will start falling big time.
Really? Says who? Secret World has a April 2012 place holder and given the little footage that has been released, I am betting that they are going to push it back. GW2 doesn't even have an official release date. Secondly, you know how many people have heard of Guild Wars or Secret World. You can probably reduce the number to something like 3 times the people who visiting these forums. You know how many people have heard of Star Wars, or how many will learn of it in the next 12 weeks. I'm betting at least 50 times the amount who subscribe to GW2 and Secret World on release day combined.
i agree there will be fallout - but not like AOC/WAR
the StarWars fanbase is huge and that alone will keep alot of players in game as long as its fun
for some players this will be their first mmo -- because they didnt want to play elf games
EQ2 fan sites
Uindenialbro?
No, but I have facts. You have opinion.