You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
History runs contrary to your assumption.
Sony opened exchange servers where RMT sales of items and characters were legitimate, safer, and easier to do. The end result? Very few players chose to play on the exchange servers or take part in the RMT exhange service. The majority of players decided they would rather play on regular servers where RMT was not allowed, the minority being the pro-RMT side.
Sony's exchange idea is a good one though. The players who want to play in an RMT environment can choose to, and those who didn't could play in an environment where it isstill against the game rules. Which is really the crux of this whole situation, in that players aren't even given the option. They all have to play in the same screwed up game economy.
While it's true that real money has changed hands for years over virtual items, many of us, perhaps even the vast majority, were perfectly happy just playing the games as they were without feeling the need to pay additional fees on our fun. This new RMT concept by Blizzard is certainly welcome by those who engaged in this activity, even when it was a banned, but those of us that who played by the rules and were content with it, now find ourselves in a sink or swim situation with everyone who is happy to throw more money at their game to get on the fast track to success.
I've heard it said "don't worry, it's optional, you don't even have to participate". This ignores the fact that because people will now be able to make real money off of quality items they find, there's little incentive for them to trade using game currency. That will leave the in-game AH with little on it beyond just trash. So if I want to trade for some better gear and goodies, where do I go? To my wallet.
If this was something truly optional, I wouldn't care. But it's not. Not in practice anyway. Those that disagree with this policy are simply going to get left behind if they don't conform to the new rules.
I'm not against RMTs. Not at all. At least not when the tradtional roles of developer/publisher and player/consumer are preserved. I don't mind companies offering stuff for sale in a cash shop, so long as it's within reason, but making other players real money vendors as well is going to change the nature of games from leisure pursuits into business endeavours. Some people are looking forward to that and are even now, going over business strategies to maximize their monetary gains from D3.
Is that supposed to herald a bright future for gaming? If yes, I certainly don't see it. All I see is the planned debasement of an industry that was once, naively, only concerned with a having fun.
This may be less the case with something like Diablo then a traditional MMO....but a large part of an online games appeal happens to be it's player community......and (IMO) a game that encourages a community that cares more about "winning" (and ultimately that's what aquisition of goods that effect play balance really comes down to) then it does in engaging in fair play is about as attractive as a game that encourages rampant greifing.
I can understand why a company that is in business to make money might have an interest in engaging in such practices to improve it's bottom line. However, as hobbiests who's interest is in preserving the spirit of what gaming is all about we should say "No Thank You" to such practices whenever someone comes along to distort our hobby with them....and we should do it loud and clear with our subscription dollars.
For me, the AH and RMT broke the game. I'm not getting D3 because of it. I dislike the idea and I don't support it, and I'm showing blizzard that by not buying the game.
You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
History runs contrary to your assumption.
Sony opened exchange servers where RMT sales of items and characters were legitimate, safer, and easier to do. The end result? Very few players chose to play on the exchange servers or take part in the RMT exhange service. The majority of players decided they would rather play on regular servers where RMT was not allowed, the minority being the pro-RMT side.
Sony's exchange idea is a good one though. The players who want to play in an RMT environment can choose to, and those who didn't could play in an environment where it isstill against the game rules. Which is really the crux of this whole situation, in that players aren't even given the option. They all have to play in the same screwed up game economy.
I try to be an advocate for freedom and am loathe to say that SOE did anything right ut you certainly have a strong point here in that players should have the right to chose if this is an environment they want to play in (hey I am still on the side of freedom) if they are that adamantly opposed to having a rmt auction house in game.
I remember when it was first announced some people brought up great points like how odds are (unless Blizz makes a blocking mechanic) the players are going to be hounded all day long by people trying to hock wares to them, who really wants to deal with that?
You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
Only going to speak for myself here.
I'm perfectly aware that people uses RMT or is willing to turn to illegal RMT. I also accept the fact it's here to stay.
Hell I even think it's cool we have a whole genre that caters to RMT gamers in the F2P cashshop section, for those that likes their gaming that way, but I don't want to play that way solo, nor do I want to play with others that way. That's why i stay clear of that section completely.
What I have a problem with is the crossover that's going to happen with the Diablo franchise. I don't play F2P cashshop games never have never will. Just becuase there is another player on the other end selling and recieving doesn't change that fact. It's not for idealistic reasons such as opposing greed by gaming companies. I simply don't like money entering the equation.
I don't care about third party sites and how unsafe they are or that they infest the game I play. If people want to take that risk I say let them. I'm more accepting of that then this Blizzard endorsed RMT shop.
I also keep hearing the excuse "well what others do shouldn't affect you, just go do your own thing". It does affect me. When I play with others I want them to have the same opportunities as me. Since I don't endorse RMT to begin with, we no longer have an equal opportunity unless I stoop to that level, which I won't.
You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
So has speed hacking, radar and a few other things I don't care for, and I still refuse to accept those.
In the case of RMT I'm not personally opposed, but I can understand why some players don't want it.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
If I play the game, I'm wasting time because I could spend a fraction of that time working to earn the money just to buy the achievement. Yet if I do that, then why the hell am I even playing the game in the first place? The options of the two create a paradoxal lose-lose situation, where I'm either wasting time or wasting money.
Which is why I prefer to just play games with only one legitimate avenue of advancement, actually playing the game.
This.
Add official RMT or item shop and I don't want to play anymore , you can rationalize , show me what are pros for it. I don't care.
I am not getting what I want with official RMT in a game , so I won't play it. Simple.
Even if it is impossible to win I want game developers to fight with RMT and themselves don't officially provide RMT platform. Is it fight that is impossile to win with illegal RMT? Sure it is.
That's no reason to legalize it and make it official
I will just do what I can. I won't spent my money and play games with RMT and I will post on blogs/ forums and tell my friends in person against this idea. Simple as that.
Diablo 3 is offficaly non-existant to me in terms of buying this game.
Well I hope you don't plan playing any games in the near future cus all games will soon have RMT of some kind. Move with it or stay behind.
But onto RMT in D3 specificly there is no item mall, there is not a vender with an unlmited number of "I win axes" that any one can buy. The auction house is player driven and player managed, a player needs to be lucky enough to find an item worth RMT and then has to decided...
use it himself,
give it to a friend,
keep it for an alt,
sell it for ingame gold on the AH
break it down for mats
Sell it for $ on the AH
Sure there will be gold/item farmers but as they need to be online to play and the realy good stuff will be at higher difficulties they wont find it easy. The D2 farming bots work cus of the offline nature and the way dungeons are generated it can read the data stored on a users computer to create a map and set of way points for bots - this wont be possible in D3. Not to say it wont ever happen ofc.
How do you pay-to-win a PvE lobby game? In D1 and D2, the only experienced cheapened by cheaters was their own. In fact, D1 taught me the virtue of playing "legit" because one-shotting diablo on hell-difficulty was just boring. It's time the next generation learned the same lesson.
"First, it is money grabbing by default regardless of the percentage..." Commie rhetoric. No one's got their hands in your pockets. They've offered you a service and a price - accept or decline.
How about declining to purchase thier entire product...or any product sold by them. I'm as big a free market guy as they come. One thing people always forget is getting a customers patronage is not a right it's a priviledge.
A business may have to engage in practices it deems profitable for it....but as consumers we also have a right to determine who we will do business with....and it's totaly within our legitimate pervue to refuse to do business with companies who engage in practices we find distasteful.
If I play the game, I'm wasting time because I could spend a fraction of that time working to earn the money just to buy the achievement. Yet if I do that, then why the hell am I even playing the game in the first place? The options of the two create a paradoxal lose-lose situation, where I'm either wasting time or wasting money.
Which is why I prefer to just play games with only one legitimate avenue of advancement, actually playing the game.
This.
Add official RMT or item shop and I don't want to play anymore , you can rationalize , show me what are pros for it. I don't care.
I am not getting what I want with official RMT in a game , so I won't play it. Simple.
Even if it is impossible to win I want game developers to fight with RMT and themselves don't officially provide RMT platform. Is it fight that is impossile to win with illegal RMT? Sure it is.
That's no reason to legalize it and make it official
I will just do what I can. I won't spent my money and play games with RMT and I will post on blogs/ forums and tell my friends in person against this idea. Simple as that.
Diablo 3 is offficaly non-existant to me in terms of buying this game.
Well I hope you don't plan playing any games in the near future cus all games will soon have RMT of some kind. Move with it or stay behind.
But onto RMT in D3 specificly there is no item mall, there is not a vender with an unlmited number of "I win axes" that any one can buy. The auction house is player driven and player managed, a player needs to be lucky enough to find an item worth RMT and then has to decided...
use it himself,
give it to a friend,
keep it for an alt,
sell it for ingame gold on the AH
break it down for mats
Sell it for $ on the AH
Sure there will be gold/item farmers but as they need to be online to play and the realy good stuff will be at higher difficulties they wont find it easy. The D2 farming bots work cus of the offline nature and the way dungeons are generated it can read the data stored on a users computer to create a map and set of way points for bots - this wont be possible in D3. Not to say it wont ever happen ofc.
With this fragile economy I wouldn't be so sure of that first statement. I for one would hope that if gaming companies learn that they are hurting themselves with the practice of rmt's they would adapt as opposed to just dying. The thing is that I know many gamers who will not play mmo's because they have subscription fee's and many times over these are people who spend hundreds on the hobbies they love including gaming they just don't like the idea of a company keeping a hand in the wallet and I can't say they won't see rmt's the same way.
I'm nomt against rmt's if people want to spend hard earned money on stuff like that nmore power to them but the industry shouldn't be taking it upon itself to indoctrinate the entire player base with these practices.
i just don't get the real cash thing and i never will
And thats the problem. People like you refuse to even try to grasp simple concepts. You spend time or you spend money, its that freaking simple. Or rather you waste time or you waste money. Open your eyes people. If your excuse for sucking at pvp is "well the other guy i fought bought his stuff and i had to earn that same stuff" then you need to have your head checked.
So how much should we charge kids to be able to "hit" a home run in Little League baseball games?
You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
History runs contrary to your assumption.
Sony opened exchange servers where RMT sales of items and characters were legitimate, safer, and easier to do. The end result? Very few players chose to play on the exchange servers or take part in the RMT exhange service. The majority of players decided they would rather play on regular servers where RMT was not allowed, the minority being the pro-RMT side.
Sony's exchange idea is a good one though. The players who want to play in an RMT environment can choose to, and those who didn't could play in an environment where it isstill against the game rules. Which is really the crux of this whole situation, in that players aren't even given the option. They all have to play in the same screwed up game economy.
You can't just have 1 server dedicated to RMT, reason being a huge playerbase will stay on the non RMT to get the items from third party sites to maintain that edge. Another deal is that people were already established on their own servers.
There were two Exchange servers for EQ2, not just one. The population of these servers was never enough to require there to be any more. You're also assuming that the majority of players were using third party RMT... they weren't. If players truly want to buy items and gold, it's cheaper to do it legitimately, because the third parties jack up the prices due to unsanctioned RMT beign riskier. And sure, people were established on the existing RMT servers, but if people wanted RMT badly enough, they could afford the transfer fee to either of the exchange servers.
But the poit remains, players had options. To get a true idea of how popular each choice is, developers should offers options for both sactioned, and unsanctioned RMT. There's nothing wrong with giving players the choice, considering there are a relevant amount of players on either side.
You know, it's funny. I remember the original Diablo and the hackers/cheaters/exploiters. Those issues made guilds actually -meaningful- by creating a whole sub-group of what were then called "100% legit" players, or those who only used equipement they found themselves. Legit guilds played together knowing they were 'safe' from duped/hacked items. If they engaged in PvP, it was amongst themselves or within an alliance of other legit guilds.
My hope? To see guilds once again have meaning for players by creating gaming environments that are comfortable for players in whatever form they take (i.e. not allowing RMT purchases on characters in the guild etc.).
Sulaa: Opinions by nature of their being are never wrong. They are simply opinions, not facts. Secondly, and as the disclaimer at the top of the article clearly states:
Please note that this article does not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of the staff of MMORPG.com, the article’s writer or any of the game companies that may be discussed. The Devil's Advocate is an opportunity for the oft-shunned and little discussed “Other Side of the Story” to be heard, promoting open discussion on a heavily contested subject.
If I play the game, I'm wasting time because I could spend a fraction of that time working to earn the money just to buy the achievement. Yet if I do that, then why the hell am I even playing the game in the first place? The options of the two create a paradoxal lose-lose situation, where I'm either wasting time or wasting money.
Which is why I prefer to just play games with only one legitimate avenue of advancement, actually playing the game.
This.
Add official RMT or item shop and I don't want to play anymore , you can rationalize , show me what are pros for it. I don't care.
I am not getting what I want with official RMT in a game , so I won't play it. Simple.
Even if it is impossible to win I want game developers to fight with RMT and themselves don't officially provide RMT platform. Is it fight that is impossile to win with illegal RMT? Sure it is.
That's no reason to legalize it and make it official.
I will just do what I can. I won't spent my money and play games with RMT and I will post on blogs/ forums and tell my friends in person against this idea. Simple as that.
i just don't get the real cash thing and i never will
And thats the problem. People like you refuse to even try to grasp simple concepts. You spend time or you spend money, its that freaking simple. Or rather you waste time or you waste money. Open your eyes people. If your excuse for sucking at pvp is "well the other guy i fought bought his stuff and i had to earn that same stuff" then you need to have your head checked.
So how much should we charge kids to be able to "hit" a home run in Little League baseball games?
Lol? are you relating a physical hobby to a virtual one? Funny thing though.. some physical hobbies even have "RMT" those pesky boosters just love to get an edge somestimes huh.
And those kinds of 'enhancements' are against the rules because they destabalize the playing field and tarnish the spirit of the game.
And how much should we charge for chess players to get a second queen on the board?
I think we should legalize cocaine. We can't prevent it. There will always be people buying it from shady dealers that employ third world peasants to pack and distribute it.
Since we can't beat it and people are going to buy it anyway. Why not profit from it. It's a win win
Let's not start the "Well RMT is here to stay arguments". So is genital herpes. It doesn't mean It's a good thing and we all should get with the program
You know companies like blizzard are damned if they do and damned if they don't, They can embrace the new trends or cater to the now minority of Anti-RMTers. It is time to face the fact that a good majority of the Online community uses RMT in some form or fashion, another large part wants to RMT but is scared, then the every slowly dying portion outright deny that it should exist.
Which side do you think a company should choose? Honestly it isn't P2W, for one it isn't an mmo, two they are items being sold by players not the company. In my opinion P2W is when the company puts an item mall into the game with items that give an edge to whomever spends in it. Usually these Item mall items are specific to the store and not available in game. So not only is blizzard not selling super items, they also are all items you can find by yourself in game.
The system being used is 100% your choice, no one is forcing anyone to use it. If over time i can make back the money i paid for the game i'm happy because ya know what this economy sucks and times are tough for alot of people.
RMT has been around for a long time, its time to just accept it.
History runs contrary to your assumption.
Sony opened exchange servers where RMT sales of items and characters were legitimate, safer, and easier to do. The end result? Very few players chose to play on the exchange servers or take part in the RMT exhange service. The majority of players decided they would rather play on regular servers where RMT was not allowed, the minority being the pro-RMT side.
Sony's exchange idea is a good one though. The players who want to play in an RMT environment can choose to, and those who didn't could play in an environment where it isstill against the game rules. Which is really the crux of this whole situation, in that players aren't even given the option. They all have to play in the same screwed up game economy.
You can't just have 1 server dedicated to RMT, reason being a huge playerbase will stay on the non RMT to get the items from third party sites to maintain that edge. Another deal is that people were already established on their own servers.
There were two Exchange servers for EQ2, not just one. The population of these servers was never enough to require there to be any more. You're also assuming that the majority of players were using third party RMT... they weren't. If players truly want to buy items and gold, it's cheaper to do it legitimately, because the third parties jack up the prices due to unsanctioned RMT beign riskier. And sure, people were established on the existing RMT servers, but if people wanted RMT badly enough, they could afford the transfer fee to either of the exchange servers.
But the poit remains, players had options. To get a true idea of how popular each choice is, developers should offers options for both sactioned, and unsanctioned RMT. There's nothing wrong with giving players the choice, considering there are a relevant amount of players on either side.
You either didn't understand what i wrote or just ignored it. Either way what i have to say is assumptions and opinions. There are no facts, though from experience over a longer period of time than most is that more often than not a player has dabbled in RMT. Most refuse or are embarassed to admit it.
I ignored it because your own statement debased your own position. You keep claiming that most people participate and encourage RMT, yet you have absolutely no evidence to back that up. If anything that is mroe evidence showing that the pro-RMT crowd is the minority in many games, which was what I was showing. And RMT users should be embaressed to admit doing so, because in many ways it's cheating so it should be taboo.
What I was trying to get at, is that I ackowledge that some people like RMT. Rather than completely giving up and giving into RMT, developers should give players the option to play in an environment that allows, or disallows, RMT. That way people who want to buy their way through the game can, and those who prefer to play in a non-RMT environment can.
I think we should legalize cocaine. We can't prevent it. There will always be people buying it from shady dealers that employ third world peasants to pack and distribute it.
Since we can't beat it and people are going to buy it anyway. Why not profit from it. It's a win win
Let's not start the "Well RMT is here to stay arguments". So is genital herpes. It doesn't mean It's a good thing and we should all get with the program
Now you're being ridiculous, last i checked RMT doesn't send people to the hospital.
The point was since you missed it
Just because something exist and you can't eliminate it. Doesn't make it a good idea to legalize and profit from it, when It clearly was a bad idea, back when it was illegal.
And before somebody starts the argument how it's a smart business move. Unless you are a shareholder.. I'm going to politely have to tell you to keep your yapper shut.
I think we should legalize cocaine. We can't prevent it. There will always be people buying it from shady dealers that employ third world peasants to pack and distribute it.
Since we can't beat it and people are going to buy it anyway. Why not profit from it. It's a win win
Let's not start the "Well RMT is here to stay arguments". So is genital herpes. It doesn't mean It's a good thing and we should all get with the program
Now you're being ridiculous, last i checked RMT doesn't send people to the hospital.
I think we should legalize cocaine. We can't prevent it. There will always be people buying it from shady dealers that employ third world peasants to pack and distribute it.
Since we can't beat it and people are going to buy it anyway. Why not profit from it. It's a win win
Let's not start the "Well RMT is here to stay arguments". So is genital herpes. It doesn't mean It's a good thing and we should all get with the program
Now you're being ridiculous, last i checked RMT doesn't send people to the hospital.
The point was since you missed it
Just because something exist and you can't eliminate it. Doesn't make it a good idea to legalize and profit from it, when It clearly was a bad idea, back when it was illegal.
Who said it was a bad idea? Last i checked RMT isn't illegal everywhere.. it kinda like gambling.
I wasn't talking 'illegal' as in going to jail. I was talking illegal as in 'you are going to get your account banned if caught'.
Just because something exist and you can't eliminate it. Doesn't make it a good idea to legalize and profit from it, when It clearly was a bad idea, back when it was illegal.
Who said it was a bad idea? Last i checked RMT isn't illegal everywhere.. it kinda like gambling.
That goes both ways. It's not legal everywhere either, and with reason. Some people tolerate it or even like it, while other people avoid or outright hate it.
Just because you like RMT doesn't mean everyone and everything should be subjected to it and 'just accept it'.
Comments
History runs contrary to your assumption.
Sony opened exchange servers where RMT sales of items and characters were legitimate, safer, and easier to do. The end result? Very few players chose to play on the exchange servers or take part in the RMT exhange service. The majority of players decided they would rather play on regular servers where RMT was not allowed, the minority being the pro-RMT side.
Sony's exchange idea is a good one though. The players who want to play in an RMT environment can choose to, and those who didn't could play in an environment where it isstill against the game rules. Which is really the crux of this whole situation, in that players aren't even given the option. They all have to play in the same screwed up game economy.
While it's true that real money has changed hands for years over virtual items, many of us, perhaps even the vast majority, were perfectly happy just playing the games as they were without feeling the need to pay additional fees on our fun. This new RMT concept by Blizzard is certainly welcome by those who engaged in this activity, even when it was a banned, but those of us that who played by the rules and were content with it, now find ourselves in a sink or swim situation with everyone who is happy to throw more money at their game to get on the fast track to success.
I've heard it said "don't worry, it's optional, you don't even have to participate". This ignores the fact that because people will now be able to make real money off of quality items they find, there's little incentive for them to trade using game currency. That will leave the in-game AH with little on it beyond just trash. So if I want to trade for some better gear and goodies, where do I go? To my wallet.
If this was something truly optional, I wouldn't care. But it's not. Not in practice anyway. Those that disagree with this policy are simply going to get left behind if they don't conform to the new rules.
I'm not against RMTs. Not at all. At least not when the tradtional roles of developer/publisher and player/consumer are preserved. I don't mind companies offering stuff for sale in a cash shop, so long as it's within reason, but making other players real money vendors as well is going to change the nature of games from leisure pursuits into business endeavours. Some people are looking forward to that and are even now, going over business strategies to maximize their monetary gains from D3.
Is that supposed to herald a bright future for gaming? If yes, I certainly don't see it. All I see is the planned debasement of an industry that was once, naively, only concerned with a having fun.
This may be less the case with something like Diablo then a traditional MMO....but a large part of an online games appeal happens to be it's player community......and (IMO) a game that encourages a community that cares more about "winning" (and ultimately that's what aquisition of goods that effect play balance really comes down to) then it does in engaging in fair play is about as attractive as a game that encourages rampant greifing.
I can understand why a company that is in business to make money might have an interest in engaging in such practices to improve it's bottom line. However, as hobbiests who's interest is in preserving the spirit of what gaming is all about we should say "No Thank You" to such practices whenever someone comes along to distort our hobby with them....and we should do it loud and clear with our subscription dollars.
For me, the AH and RMT broke the game. I'm not getting D3 because of it. I dislike the idea and I don't support it, and I'm showing blizzard that by not buying the game.
Nerf rock, paper is fine -Scissor
I try to be an advocate for freedom and am loathe to say that SOE did anything right ut you certainly have a strong point here in that players should have the right to chose if this is an environment they want to play in (hey I am still on the side of freedom) if they are that adamantly opposed to having a rmt auction house in game.
I remember when it was first announced some people brought up great points like how odds are (unless Blizz makes a blocking mechanic) the players are going to be hounded all day long by people trying to hock wares to them, who really wants to deal with that?
Only going to speak for myself here.
I'm perfectly aware that people uses RMT or is willing to turn to illegal RMT. I also accept the fact it's here to stay.
Hell I even think it's cool we have a whole genre that caters to RMT gamers in the F2P cashshop section, for those that likes their gaming that way, but I don't want to play that way solo, nor do I want to play with others that way. That's why i stay clear of that section completely.
What I have a problem with is the crossover that's going to happen with the Diablo franchise. I don't play F2P cashshop games never have never will. Just becuase there is another player on the other end selling and recieving doesn't change that fact. It's not for idealistic reasons such as opposing greed by gaming companies. I simply don't like money entering the equation.
I don't care about third party sites and how unsafe they are or that they infest the game I play. If people want to take that risk I say let them. I'm more accepting of that then this Blizzard endorsed RMT shop.
I also keep hearing the excuse "well what others do shouldn't affect you, just go do your own thing". It does affect me. When I play with others I want them to have the same opportunities as me. Since I don't endorse RMT to begin with, we no longer have an equal opportunity unless I stoop to that level, which I won't.
So has speed hacking, radar and a few other things I don't care for, and I still refuse to accept those.
In the case of RMT I'm not personally opposed, but I can understand why some players don't want it.
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Well I hope you don't plan playing any games in the near future cus all games will soon have RMT of some kind. Move with it or stay behind.
But onto RMT in D3 specificly there is no item mall, there is not a vender with an unlmited number of "I win axes" that any one can buy. The auction house is player driven and player managed, a player needs to be lucky enough to find an item worth RMT and then has to decided...
use it himself,
give it to a friend,
keep it for an alt,
sell it for ingame gold on the AH
break it down for mats
Sell it for $ on the AH
Sure there will be gold/item farmers but as they need to be online to play and the realy good stuff will be at higher difficulties they wont find it easy. The D2 farming bots work cus of the offline nature and the way dungeons are generated it can read the data stored on a users computer to create a map and set of way points for bots - this wont be possible in D3. Not to say it wont ever happen ofc.
Are you saying that people with careers are more willing to accept spending money on pixels?. I would like to challenge your theory.
How about declining to purchase thier entire product...or any product sold by them. I'm as big a free market guy as they come. One thing people always forget is getting a customers patronage is not a right it's a priviledge.
A business may have to engage in practices it deems profitable for it....but as consumers we also have a right to determine who we will do business with....and it's totaly within our legitimate pervue to refuse to do business with companies who engage in practices we find distasteful.
This topic doesn't get me in an uproar. I'm going to let my money speak for me and it's saying "skip that game." Oh well.
With this fragile economy I wouldn't be so sure of that first statement. I for one would hope that if gaming companies learn that they are hurting themselves with the practice of rmt's they would adapt as opposed to just dying. The thing is that I know many gamers who will not play mmo's because they have subscription fee's and many times over these are people who spend hundreds on the hobbies they love including gaming they just don't like the idea of a company keeping a hand in the wallet and I can't say they won't see rmt's the same way.
I'm nomt against rmt's if people want to spend hard earned money on stuff like that nmore power to them but the industry shouldn't be taking it upon itself to indoctrinate the entire player base with these practices.
So how much should we charge kids to be able to "hit" a home run in Little League baseball games?
There were two Exchange servers for EQ2, not just one. The population of these servers was never enough to require there to be any more. You're also assuming that the majority of players were using third party RMT... they weren't. If players truly want to buy items and gold, it's cheaper to do it legitimately, because the third parties jack up the prices due to unsanctioned RMT beign riskier. And sure, people were established on the existing RMT servers, but if people wanted RMT badly enough, they could afford the transfer fee to either of the exchange servers.
But the poit remains, players had options. To get a true idea of how popular each choice is, developers should offers options for both sactioned, and unsanctioned RMT. There's nothing wrong with giving players the choice, considering there are a relevant amount of players on either side.
You know, it's funny. I remember the original Diablo and the hackers/cheaters/exploiters. Those issues made guilds actually -meaningful- by creating a whole sub-group of what were then called "100% legit" players, or those who only used equipement they found themselves. Legit guilds played together knowing they were 'safe' from duped/hacked items. If they engaged in PvP, it was amongst themselves or within an alliance of other legit guilds.
My hope? To see guilds once again have meaning for players by creating gaming environments that are comfortable for players in whatever form they take (i.e. not allowing RMT purchases on characters in the guild etc.).
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+1
And those kinds of 'enhancements' are against the rules because they destabalize the playing field and tarnish the spirit of the game.
And how much should we charge for chess players to get a second queen on the board?
You realize every single pro-RMT argument you prought can be used as an argument to legalise heavy drugs or slavery?
I think we should legalize cocaine. We can't prevent it. There will always be people buying it from shady dealers that employ third world peasants to pack and distribute it.
Since we can't beat it and people are going to buy it anyway. Why not profit from it. It's a win win
Let's not start the "Well RMT is here to stay arguments". So is genital herpes. It doesn't mean It's a good thing and we all should get with the program
I ignored it because your own statement debased your own position. You keep claiming that most people participate and encourage RMT, yet you have absolutely no evidence to back that up. If anything that is mroe evidence showing that the pro-RMT crowd is the minority in many games, which was what I was showing. And RMT users should be embaressed to admit doing so, because in many ways it's cheating so it should be taboo.
What I was trying to get at, is that I ackowledge that some people like RMT. Rather than completely giving up and giving into RMT, developers should give players the option to play in an environment that allows, or disallows, RMT. That way people who want to buy their way through the game can, and those who prefer to play in a non-RMT environment can.
The point was since you missed it
Just because something exist and you can't eliminate it. Doesn't make it a good idea to legalize and profit from it, when It clearly was a bad idea, back when it was illegal.
And before somebody starts the argument how it's a smart business move. Unless you are a shareholder.. I'm going to politely have to tell you to keep your yapper shut.
On-line gamer stabbed over 'stolen' cybersword
I wasn't talking 'illegal' as in going to jail. I was talking illegal as in 'you are going to get your account banned if caught'.
I'm amazed I have to point that out.
That goes both ways. It's not legal everywhere either, and with reason. Some people tolerate it or even like it, while other people avoid or outright hate it.
Just because you like RMT doesn't mean everyone and everything should be subjected to it and 'just accept it'.
Then...
Mark each item with its source/history. So you can inspect another player's items and and item could be marked as:
Dropped by XXX creature to YYY player
Dropped by XXX creature to YYY player, bought by ZZZ player
Dropped by XXX creature to YYY player, RMT bought by ZZZ player
So players can realize if another player got its items at AH or got them by playing.