The ONE Major con of open world PvP: Greifers...I think EVERYBODY who has EVER played a open world PvP game SOLO can attest to this. Greifing when you play as a solo player (I.E. Aren't grandfathered in with guilds/clans from other MMOs and people who do not have RL friends who play) is the worst experience ever. If you're always outnumbered 1 to X, you will always lose, 99.9% of the time. This is my major turn-off for MMO's with open PvP these days.
The ONE major con of NO open world PvP: It get BLOODY BORING, my god!!! "Oh look, I got this item, now that item, now this item, now that item! I am now a god of the digital world in which I reside and I'm so proud of the 200 hours it took me to achieve all these items!" Seriously? Spending countless hours of your RL time to obtain ditigal items, which I guarantee you will care less about within 3-4 years, MAYBE 10 years, when you quit, is FUN!?!? That sounds boring as all hell to me!!!!
People who do not want open world PvP simply want a chat room with the distraction of pressing buttons, casting pretty spells, and hoarding items - which feels rewards, I guess? This seems COMPLETELY lame.
I think the ultimate answer to "World PvP vs No World PvP" is quite simple in concept, though maybe a bit tougher to code because it considers multiple things:
New players who start out are given ONE, SINGLE chance to keep their Anti-PvP tag on as long as they wish (forever, if they choose), until they revoke it. The only way to revoke the tag is to type in a command and be prompted for assurance in their decision.
Players with "No-PvP" tags need to be easily distinguishable, even from a distance. However, a simple title could do, I guess?
When NOT in a group, solo players have the ability to turn on/off a "PvP Flag / Tag," this will give solo players the ability to play without being victims of small gank groups who simply want to get off by greifing others. There will need to be adjustments, like how often the tag can be turned on/off and so forth. (I.E. no turning the flag off if you had engaged in PvP combat within, say, the last 5 minutes, or 10 minutes) Problem #1 solved: Solo players can play in peace and in the way they choose.
When engaging in PvP combat, say a group of 5 attacks a group of 3, the group of 3 is given significant "hit point handicaps." This will keep teams relatively even, instead of seeing "ganking," you would see more fair fights that depend on the skills of the players and the skills/spells in which they choose.
These are some quick ideas I came up with in the past 20 minutes but I think it's a great start with little risk to ruining ANYBODY's gameplay, PvPer or not.
I must admit that when I played WoW, back in the day, I had a hard time choosing between PvP and Regular servers...I played with my wife and she couldn't handle PvP...Yet PvE servers would bore the crap out of me by level 40. We were torn, chose a PvP server, and getting ganked while trying to relax, level, and have fun was complete misery. It completely turned my wife off the game and we didn't play much beyond level 60.
Both open-world PvP and PvE servers have major problems. There needs to be a new, innovative way to combine the two into onw to keep people happy and keep servers fully populated IMHO!
PvE is not really that boring in a good game, as long as it becomes challenging. And almost no MMOs incorperate no PvP function at all.
As for your ideas, it would be very challenging to code, but a valid solution. I don't like the idea of buffing a group attacked by a larger group, but I see your reasoning there. Also, I always play in a group of 2-4 with good friends of mine, I am never alone. I like the ability to disable PvP tags, but I don't see issue with being able to leave PvP off for your group if its less than 4. I also think that if in PvP, it could force 1v1 fights, like in Runescape with the non multicombat areas. Meaning even though the fights will be stacked against small groups, it still gives them a fighting chance.
And I don't think they need to be easily distingushable, because I want PvPers to get confused. Adds to the calamity of a PvP world. Especially for setting traps and ambushes.
And I don't think they need to be easily distingushable, because I want PvPers to get confused. Adds to the calamity of a PvP world. Especially for setting traps and ambushes.
I think it's rather annoying when setting up ambushes, come to find out you jump out and they are invulnaerable.
The ONE Major con of open world PvP: Greifers...I think EVERYBODY who has EVER played a open world PvP game SOLO can attest to this. Greifing when you play as a solo player (I.E. Aren't grandfathered in with guilds/clans from other MMOs and people who do not have RL friends who play) is the worst experience ever. If you're always outnumbered 1 to X, you will always lose, 99.9% of the time. This is my major turn-off for MMO's with open PvP these days.
The ONE major con of NO open world PvP: It get BLOODY BORING, my god!!! "Oh look, I got this item, now that item, now this item, now that item! I am now a god of the digital world in which I reside and I'm so proud of the 200 hours it took me to achieve all these items!" Seriously? Spending countless hours of your RL time to obtain ditigal items, which I guarantee you will care less about within 3-4 years, MAYBE 10 years, when you quit, is FUN!?!? That sounds boring as all hell to me!!!!
People who do not want open world PvP simply want a chat room with the distraction of pressing buttons, casting pretty spells, and hoarding items - which feels rewards, I guess? This seems COMPLETELY lame.
I think the ultimate answer to "World PvP vs No World PvP" is quite simple in concept, though maybe a bit tougher to code because it considers multiple things:
New players who start out are given ONE, SINGLE chance to keep their Anti-PvP tag on as long as they wish (forever, if they choose), until they revoke it. The only way to revoke the tag is to type in a command and be prompted for assurance in their decision.
Players with "No-PvP" tags need to be easily distinguishable, even from a distance. However, a simple title could do, I guess?
When NOT in a group, solo players have the ability to turn on/off a "PvP Flag / Tag," this will give solo players the ability to play without being victims of small gank groups who simply want to get off by greifing others. There will need to be adjustments, like how often the tag can be turned on/off and so forth. (I.E. no turning the flag off if you had engaged in PvP combat within, say, the last 5 minutes, or 10 minutes) Problem #1 solved: Solo players can play in peace and in the way they choose.
When engaging in PvP combat, say a group of 5 attacks a group of 3, the group of 3 is given significant "hit point handicaps." This will keep teams relatively even, instead of seeing "ganking," you would see more fair fights that depend on the skills of the players and the skills/spells in which they choose.
These are some quick ideas I came up with in the past 20 minutes but I think it's a great start with little risk to ruining ANYBODY's gameplay, PvPer or not.
I must admit that when I played WoW, back in the day, I had a hard time choosing between PvP and Regular servers...I played with my wife and she couldn't handle PvP...Yet PvE servers would bore the crap out of me by level 40. We were torn, chose a PvP server, and getting ganked while trying to relax, level, and have fun was complete misery. It completely turned my wife off the game and we didn't play much beyond level 60.
Both open-world PvP and PvE servers have major problems. There needs to be a new, innovative way to combine the two into onw to keep people happy and keep servers fully populated IMHO!
I like this idea. It might be hard to code and have multiple exploit opportunities, I don't know. But a version of this exist already, PvE version, in an open world where you have the opportunity to do said quest with a group, if you don't have one then you get inspired they call it, bonus damage, armor, HP, etc. to complete quest.
The ONE Major con of open world PvP: Greifers...I think EVERYBODY who has EVER played a open world PvP game SOLO can attest to this. Greifing when you play as a solo player (I.E. Aren't grandfathered in with guilds/clans from other MMOs and people who do not have RL friends who play) is the worst experience ever. If you're always outnumbered 1 to X, you will always lose, 99.9% of the time. This is my major turn-off for MMO's with open PvP these days.
The ONE major con of NO open world PvP: It get BLOODY BORING, my god!!! "Oh look, I got this item, now that item, now this item, now that item! I am now a god of the digital world in which I reside and I'm so proud of the 200 hours it took me to achieve all these items!" Seriously? Spending countless hours of your RL time to obtain ditigal items, which I guarantee you will care less about within 3-4 years, MAYBE 10 years, when you quit, is FUN!?!? That sounds boring as all hell to me!!!!
People who do not want open world PvP simply want a chat room with the distraction of pressing buttons, casting pretty spells, and hoarding items - which feels rewards, I guess? This seems COMPLETELY lame.
I think the ultimate answer to "World PvP vs No World PvP" is quite simple in concept, though maybe a bit tougher to code because it considers multiple things:
New players who start out are given ONE, SINGLE chance to keep their Anti-PvP tag on as long as they wish (forever, if they choose), until they revoke it. The only way to revoke the tag is to type in a command and be prompted for assurance in their decision.
Players with "No-PvP" tags need to be easily distinguishable, even from a distance. However, a simple title could do, I guess?
When NOT in a group, solo players have the ability to turn on/off a "PvP Flag / Tag," this will give solo players the ability to play without being victims of small gank groups who simply want to get off by greifing others. There will need to be adjustments, like how often the tag can be turned on/off and so forth. (I.E. no turning the flag off if you had engaged in PvP combat within, say, the last 5 minutes, or 10 minutes) Problem #1 solved: Solo players can play in peace and in the way they choose.
When engaging in PvP combat, say a group of 5 attacks a group of 3, the group of 3 is given significant "hit point handicaps." This will keep teams relatively even, instead of seeing "ganking," you would see more fair fights that depend on the skills of the players and the skills/spells in which they choose.
These are some quick ideas I came up with in the past 20 minutes but I think it's a great start with little risk to ruining ANYBODY's gameplay, PvPer or not.
I must admit that when I played WoW, back in the day, I had a hard time choosing between PvP and Regular servers...I played with my wife and she couldn't handle PvP...Yet PvE servers would bore the crap out of me by level 40. We were torn, chose a PvP server, and getting ganked while trying to relax, level, and have fun was complete misery. It completely turned my wife off the game and we didn't play much beyond level 60.
Both open-world PvP and PvE servers have major problems. There needs to be a new, innovative way to combine the two into onw to keep people happy and keep servers fully populated IMHO!
Use channels instead of just PvP flags?
So players can jump into the PvE channel, where you enjoy the game and such. But when you want to PvP, jump to the PvP channel. One problem I feel with PvP flags is that, it feels bad when you see a group and cannot PvP because they don't have their PvP flags up. Now with channels everyone you see will participate in PvP, yet no one is forced to PvP all the time, You aren't separated with PvP players into different servers and unable to play with each other forever or until server change.
ps: on the fair play note, open world pvp will never be fair, unless you asked them for a duel or something, it will never be fair, nothing is stopping the others from calling up help from guilds and unbalance the groups, unless more rules is applied to the pvp, but that will take freedom away from open world pvp
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW? As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Did you, as a developer, learn the lesson UO learned 10+ years ago by creating seperate PvE and PvP servers?
If yes - profit
If no - fail
It's that simple.
There will never be a game with only one server type that will appeal to a mass audience. Fact.
Well let's see.. UO came out in 1997. That I'm aware of its never merged any servers. It still releases expansions and has still been expanding into new markets. There are not a lot of MMO's that have been around 14 years... and EA has never been shy about closing games that aren't making money.
So probably not the best example to use in the MMO world. When you consider how many big budget MMO's have been dead 30 days from live.. or within the first year (pvp servers or not).
I think there are more creative ways to include PvP in a virtual world. From the business perspective running a seperate server type that has a history of "first to be merged" due to population issues. Might be a sign to be more creative with the solution.
But then, I like open world PvP. It's a virtual world ... you won'r really die. I promise.
Christ, make it a little exciting and suspenseful anyway. If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month.
What is wrong with giving people a choice? I have to admit being little disapointed to find they are a full pvp mmo, I was really looking forward to this...now not so much.
One would think having PVP and PVE servers would be a win win for everyone?
Disagree. The market is already saturated with PVE and PVP-lite MMO's... the dev's shouldn't be waisting their time and resources trying to cater to a crowd which is already well catered for, and which the game was never designed for.
And for a thread that's supposedly a 'NON carebear vs PK debate', you sure spent a lot of time debating it.
UO, AC1, EVE.
Wrong the market is saturated with Themepark MMO's. I assure you the western market is ripe for a PvE Sandbox game, a spiritual successor of Asheron's Call, if you will. The best way to do AA for the western market is to have full loot, huge death penalty type PvP servers like in Asia, and games like Mortal Online and Darkfall Online. But the majority of servers should be PvE centric with consensual PvP with a system similar to AC's White servers. PvP flagging like AC is the best way to appeal to the western markets.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Open world PVP is a gateway for griefing. that has been made very clear by every game in recent history that does it. i think to the level that archage is doing open world pvp, there will definitely be griefing. having a jail system will not stop the fact that someone has lost invested time and items from getting griefed in the first place...... To some this is not a big deal... but i will put money on it that most gamers dont like open world pvp for griefing reasons. Overall PVP is always best when it can be controlled. There are too many people in the mmo world who love making other gamers miserable.... and thats a fact!
im definitely interested in this game but after playing AOC and Darkfall, i can say that the cons of open world pvp can decrease a games population very fast.
How does open world PVP ruin Darkfall? That is the main focus of Darkfall open world pvp and clan warfare...
I think a lot of the people who bitch about open world pvp ruining Darkfall have probably never actually played Darkfall. I do mainly PVE on Darkfall and have only been griefed once in 3 weeks while doing some PVE. Darkfall's world is massive and there is a huge selection of npc monster spawns to farm so you can find a spot that not a ton of people travel on if you are not in to pvp.
instead its the main reason why people don't play Darkfall, and why the game continues to be unpopular.. its fairly simple. Open world pvp isnt what most players actually are interested in.. having contested area's is one thing.. but even games like Eve, recognise that if the pvp is unrestricted, the playerbase will inevitably suffer - which means if they want a decent sized playerbase, then unrestricted open world pvp is out... and the only reason you can actually pve in DFO is because there are so few actual players... not exactly a good advertisement in either sense...
Open world PVP is a gateway for griefing. that has been made very clear by every game in recent history that does it. i think to the level that archage is doing open world pvp, there will definitely be griefing. having a jail system will not stop the fact that someone has lost invested time and items from getting griefed in the first place...... To some this is not a big deal... but i will put money on it that most gamers dont like open world pvp for griefing reasons. Overall PVP is always best when it can be controlled. There are too many people in the mmo world who love making other gamers miserable.... and thats a fact!
im definitely interested in this game but after playing AOC and Darkfall, i can say that the cons of open world pvp can decrease a games population very fast.
How does open world PVP ruin Darkfall? That is the main focus of Darkfall open world pvp and clan warfare...
I think a lot of the people who bitch about open world pvp ruining Darkfall have probably never actually played Darkfall. I do mainly PVE on Darkfall and have only been griefed once in 3 weeks while doing some PVE. Darkfall's world is massive and there is a huge selection of npc monster spawns to farm so you can find a spot that not a ton of people travel on if you are not in to pvp.
instead its the main reason why people don't play Darkfall, and why the game continues to be unpopular.. its fairly simple. Open world pvp isnt what most players actually are interested in.. having contested area's is one thing.. but even games like Eve, recognise that if the pvp is unrestricted, the playerbase will inevitably suffer - which means if they want a decent sized playerbase, then unrestricted open world pvp is out... and the only reason you can actually pve in DFO is because there are so few actual players... not exactly a good advertisement in either sense...
What a load of nonsense, Darkfall had loads of players, people lost interest because of its exploitable levelling mechanics and buggy state with terrible support, the pvp was huge the first few months. Players created alliances to fight for their side of the map, they took control into their own hands rather than be restricted by the game. Your logic fails.
Open world PVP is a gateway for griefing. that has been made very clear by every game in recent history that does it. i think to the level that archage is doing open world pvp, there will definitely be griefing. having a jail system will not stop the fact that someone has lost invested time and items from getting griefed in the first place...... To some this is not a big deal... but i will put money on it that most gamers dont like open world pvp for griefing reasons. Overall PVP is always best when it can be controlled. There are too many people in the mmo world who love making other gamers miserable.... and thats a fact!
im definitely interested in this game but after playing AOC and Darkfall, i can say that the cons of open world pvp can decrease a games population very fast.
How does open world PVP ruin Darkfall? That is the main focus of Darkfall open world pvp and clan warfare...
I think a lot of the people who bitch about open world pvp ruining Darkfall have probably never actually played Darkfall. I do mainly PVE on Darkfall and have only been griefed once in 3 weeks while doing some PVE. Darkfall's world is massive and there is a huge selection of npc monster spawns to farm so you can find a spot that not a ton of people travel on if you are not in to pvp.
instead its the main reason why people don't play Darkfall, and why the game continues to be unpopular.. its fairly simple. Open world pvp isnt what most players actually are interested in.. having contested area's is one thing.. but even games like Eve, recognise that if the pvp is unrestricted, the playerbase will inevitably suffer - which means if they want a decent sized playerbase, then unrestricted open world pvp is out... and the only reason you can actually pve in DFO is because there are so few actual players... not exactly a good advertisement in either sense...
What a load of nonsense, Darkfall had loads of players, people lost interest because of its exploitable levelling mechanics and buggy state with terrible support, the pvp was huge the first few months. Players created alliances to fight for their side of the map, they took control into their own hands rather than be restricted by the game. Your logic fails.
loads
as in between 1,000 and 10,000 ... yes, DFO's outrageous popularity is why its the premier PvP fantasy game .... or not..
imo.. DFO is still a 'work in progress' it has potential.. but its as yet unrealised..
Open world PVP is a gateway for griefing. that has been made very clear by every game in recent history that does it. i think to the level that archage is doing open world pvp, there will definitely be griefing. having a jail system will not stop the fact that someone has lost invested time and items from getting griefed in the first place...... To some this is not a big deal... but i will put money on it that most gamers dont like open world pvp for griefing reasons. Overall PVP is always best when it can be controlled. There are too many people in the mmo world who love making other gamers miserable.... and thats a fact!
im definitely interested in this game but after playing AOC and Darkfall, i can say that the cons of open world pvp can decrease a games population very fast.
How does open world PVP ruin Darkfall? That is the main focus of Darkfall open world pvp and clan warfare...
I think a lot of the people who bitch about open world pvp ruining Darkfall have probably never actually played Darkfall. I do mainly PVE on Darkfall and have only been griefed once in 3 weeks while doing some PVE. Darkfall's world is massive and there is a huge selection of npc monster spawns to farm so you can find a spot that not a ton of people travel on if you are not in to pvp.
instead its the main reason why people don't play Darkfall, and why the game continues to be unpopular.. its fairly simple. Open world pvp isnt what most players actually are interested in.. having contested area's is one thing.. but even games like Eve, recognise that if the pvp is unrestricted, the playerbase will inevitably suffer - which means if they want a decent sized playerbase, then unrestricted open world pvp is out... and the only reason you can actually pve in DFO is because there are so few actual players... not exactly a good advertisement in either sense...
What a load of nonsense, Darkfall had loads of players, people lost interest because of its exploitable levelling mechanics and buggy state with terrible support, the pvp was huge the first few months. Players created alliances to fight for their side of the map, they took control into their own hands rather than be restricted by the game. Your logic fails.
loads
as in between 1,000 and 10,000 ... yes, DFO's outrageous popularity is why its the premier PvP fantasy game .... or not..
imo.. DFO is still a 'work in progress' it has potential.. but its as yet unrealised..
I don't think you've ever played the game as you have no idea why people don't play Darkfall. It's certainly not because it has open pvp. You might be afraid of open world pvp as you're one of the impatient carbear types who demands instanced pvp, in which case stay clear from ArcheAge.
I would prefer a PvE option. Not fond of PvP, never have been. I also wonder why PvP fans are so adamantly against a game releasing with PvE servers? Is it because they are afraid the PvP server population will be lower? If there are so many PvP players out there, a PvE server should not impact their game experience. What's wrong with a player wanting to play with optional PvP? To each his own.
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
But then, I like open world PvP. It's a virtual world ... you won'r really die. I promise.
Christ, make it a little exciting and suspenseful anyway. If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month.
Heh , and explain to me how players will keep wasting their time playing a game where they get ganked every 5 minutes? Yes yes it's just a virtual world , you won't die irl , i get that nonsense BS , the real issue is playability. How the hell are you going to keep people playing your game if they get killed just by checking their freaking corn field? Where is the fun in getting killed every 10 minutes?
You seriously going to make me believe that "If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month"? Seriously?
Open PvP world is a lame asian excuse of being a bad ass , being a gamer over there apparently gives you the right to rape under age girls. Here in the west , we're abit more civilized , we might bitch alot , but for good reasons.
Open PvP world is a lame asian excuse of being a bad ass , being a gamer over there apparently gives you the right to rape under age girls. Here in the west , we're abit more civilized , we might bitch alot , but for good reasons.
Aion went the same open world pvp path and in the end they made their game much much more PvE oriented. They've actually gained subs and the game is breathing because of that decision. From a western perspective, nothing "good" in terms of MMO's came from Asia anyway, just the same old "enhance your items with 0,02% chance" and "open world ganking", along with some stupid and usually useless pet system.
It's simple: most players do not like to gank others, they find it no fun, they find it stupid. Only the words "open world pvp" will keep a very big chunk of western players away from the game. Why would someone like being abused by some "bad ass" 12-years-old who has nothing to do but grind all day?
But then, I like open world PvP. It's a virtual world ... you won'r really die. I promise.
Christ, make it a little exciting and suspenseful anyway. If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month.
Heh , and explain to me how players will keep wasting their time playing a game where they get ganked every 5 minutes? Yes yes it's just a virtual world , you won't die irl , i get that nonsense BS , the real issue is playability. How the hell are you going to keep people playing your game if they get killed just by checking their freaking corn field? Where is the fun in getting killed every 10 minutes?
You seriously going to make me believe that "If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month"? Seriously?
Open PvP world is a lame asian excuse of being a bad ass , being a gamer over there apparently gives you the right to rape under age girls. Here in the west , we're abit more civilized , we might bitch alot , but for good reasons.
There are already plenty of games out there not designed with open world pvp in mind (pvp servers for pve games don't really count imo). Can't there be just a few games that other people like, too? It does add a level of excitement, especially when we're not talking permadeath consequences. Besides that, not every open world pvp game turns into an insane killfest.
Also, too .. open world pvp = raping underage girls? LOL, what did I miss?
Full PvP doesn't equal griefing, in fact is the opposite
Fake PvP creates griefing. Without consequences everyone will attack everything that moves, because there is no consequence in losing a PvP match
Fact is that in a Full PvP game, the "griefer" has something to lose, and he will be very carefull who to attack.
In a game like WoW instead, these people simply keep attacking people for "fun" because the worse it can happen is to die and respown with no penalty.
A Full PvP game needs strict rules to work, in games like Darkfall the rules are half baked and do not completely work as intended
EvE pvp is slightly better, but it can be improved that too.
I am a PvE player but I enjoyed Darkfall Full PvP (even in its imperfection), what drove me away from the game was the lack of meaningful PvE and a fucked up economy (I like crafting too)
Full PvP was the last of my problem in Darkfall, in fact I rather enjoyed it, and I am looking forward to Darkfall 2.0
There are already plenty of games out there not designed with open world pvp in mind (pvp servers for pve games don't really count imo). Can't there be just a few games that other people like, too? It does add a level of excitement, especially when we're not talking permadeath consequences. Besides that, not every open world pvp game turns into an insane killfest.
Also, too .. open world pvp = raping underage girls? LOL, what did I miss?
Why don't PvP servers for PvE games count? If PvP is so popular, there should be no issues getting people to play on the PvP server. Why can't a game developer offer both types of servers? Btw, there are already a few games out there that cater to PvP, maybe you've heard of a few, Lineage 2, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Eve, just to name a few.
I hope they do include a PvE server for those of us who want to experience the game without having to worry about someone elses fun infringing upon mine. With both types of servers, you do your thing, I'll go do mine.
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
Open PvP world is a lame asian excuse of being a bad ass , being a gamer over there apparently gives you the right to rape under age girls. Here in the west , we're abit more civilized , we might bitch alot , but for good reasons.
Aion went the same open world pvp path and in the end they made their game much much more PvE oriented. They've actually gained subs and the game is breathing because of that decision. From a western perspective, nothing "good" in terms of MMO's came from Asia anyway, just the same old "enhance your items with 0,02% chance" and "open world ganking", along with some stupid and usually useless pet system.
It's simple: most players do not like to gank others, they find it no fun, they find it stupid. Only the words "open world pvp" will keep a very big chunk of western players away from the game. Why would someone like being abused by some "bad ass" 12-years-old who has nothing to do but grind all day?
add to this that the other faction PK can loot you of all your farm harvests that you spent so long working on.
It's a system as it stands that actually rewards ganking it seems, because the only people that will generate 'bloods' are your own faction. Say goodbye toall the social builders in this game, the ones that form the 'soul' of a game by investing in the community and world.
This game is looking so far like an ugly gankfest in a pretty world, and if anyone thinks that wont restrict this game to a tiny niche then they arnt thinking clearly, for whatever reason.
IMO, if they dont go live with optional PvP servers for this the game will reduced to a tiny hardcore of bitter self hating gankers by the 3rd month.
Carebears have 900 WoW-Clones to go raid in and be all passive aggressive in chat with one another.
Give me an open pvp world any day of the week.
I agree.
Griefing comes from carebear PvPers.............griefers usually shit their pants in a Full loot MMO because losing their stuff is not an option, they won't like that a bit
In Darkfall there are very few griefers and the few ones are actually quite famous , because they make an ass of themself.........you know like losing from naked noobies and then crying in the forums for losing their precious Dragon Armor...........because of the lag (yeah right)
Comments
PvE is not really that boring in a good game, as long as it becomes challenging. And almost no MMOs incorperate no PvP function at all.
As for your ideas, it would be very challenging to code, but a valid solution. I don't like the idea of buffing a group attacked by a larger group, but I see your reasoning there. Also, I always play in a group of 2-4 with good friends of mine, I am never alone. I like the ability to disable PvP tags, but I don't see issue with being able to leave PvP off for your group if its less than 4. I also think that if in PvP, it could force 1v1 fights, like in Runescape with the non multicombat areas. Meaning even though the fights will be stacked against small groups, it still gives them a fighting chance.
And I don't think they need to be easily distingushable, because I want PvPers to get confused. Adds to the calamity of a PvP world. Especially for setting traps and ambushes.
Newb= Newly Enrolled Wannabe Badass.
I think it's rather annoying when setting up ambushes, come to find out you jump out and they are invulnaerable.
I like this idea.
It might be hard to code and have multiple exploit opportunities, I don't know. But a version of this exist already, PvE version, in an open world where you have the opportunity to do said quest with a group, if you don't have one then you get inspired they call it, bonus damage, armor, HP, etc. to complete quest.
Balance, after all, is what most MMOs strive for.
It's the UO litmus test -
Did you, as a developer, learn the lesson UO learned 10+ years ago by creating seperate PvE and PvP servers?
If yes - profit
If no - fail
It's that simple.
There will never be a game with only one server type that will appeal to a mass audience. Fact.
Use channels instead of just PvP flags?
So players can jump into the PvE channel, where you enjoy the game and such. But when you want to PvP, jump to the PvP channel. One problem I feel with PvP flags is that, it feels bad when you see a group and cannot PvP because they don't have their PvP flags up. Now with channels everyone you see will participate in PvP, yet no one is forced to PvP all the time, You aren't separated with PvP players into different servers and unable to play with each other forever or until server change.
ps: on the fair play note, open world pvp will never be fair, unless you asked them for a duel or something, it will never be fair, nothing is stopping the others from calling up help from guilds and unbalance the groups, unless more rules is applied to the pvp, but that will take freedom away from open world pvp
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Well let's see.. UO came out in 1997. That I'm aware of its never merged any servers. It still releases expansions and has still been expanding into new markets. There are not a lot of MMO's that have been around 14 years... and EA has never been shy about closing games that aren't making money.
So probably not the best example to use in the MMO world. When you consider how many big budget MMO's have been dead 30 days from live.. or within the first year (pvp servers or not).
I think there are more creative ways to include PvP in a virtual world. From the business perspective running a seperate server type that has a history of "first to be merged" due to population issues. Might be a sign to be more creative with the solution.
What is wrong with giving people a choice? I have to admit being little disapointed to find they are a full pvp mmo, I was really looking forward to this...now not so much.
One would think having PVP and PVE servers would be a win win for everyone?
Wrong the market is saturated with Themepark MMO's. I assure you the western market is ripe for a PvE Sandbox game, a spiritual successor of Asheron's Call, if you will. The best way to do AA for the western market is to have full loot, huge death penalty type PvP servers like in Asia, and games like Mortal Online and Darkfall Online. But the majority of servers should be PvE centric with consensual PvP with a system similar to AC's White servers. PvP flagging like AC is the best way to appeal to the western markets.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
instead its the main reason why people don't play Darkfall, and why the game continues to be unpopular.. its fairly simple. Open world pvp isnt what most players actually are interested in.. having contested area's is one thing.. but even games like Eve, recognise that if the pvp is unrestricted, the playerbase will inevitably suffer - which means if they want a decent sized playerbase, then unrestricted open world pvp is out... and the only reason you can actually pve in DFO is because there are so few actual players... not exactly a good advertisement in either sense...
What a load of nonsense, Darkfall had loads of players, people lost interest because of its exploitable levelling mechanics and buggy state with terrible support, the pvp was huge the first few months. Players created alliances to fight for their side of the map, they took control into their own hands rather than be restricted by the game. Your logic fails.
loads
as in between 1,000 and 10,000 ... yes, DFO's outrageous popularity is why its the premier PvP fantasy game .... or not..
imo.. DFO is still a 'work in progress' it has potential.. but its as yet unrealised..
I don't think you've ever played the game as you have no idea why people don't play Darkfall. It's certainly not because it has open pvp. You might be afraid of open world pvp as you're one of the impatient carbear types who demands instanced pvp, in which case stay clear from ArcheAge.
I would prefer a PvE option. Not fond of PvP, never have been. I also wonder why PvP fans are so adamantly against a game releasing with PvE servers? Is it because they are afraid the PvP server population will be lower? If there are so many PvP players out there, a PvE server should not impact their game experience. What's wrong with a player wanting to play with optional PvP? To each his own.
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
Heh , and explain to me how players will keep wasting their time playing a game where they get ganked every 5 minutes? Yes yes it's just a virtual world , you won't die irl , i get that nonsense BS , the real issue is playability. How the hell are you going to keep people playing your game if they get killed just by checking their freaking corn field? Where is the fun in getting killed every 10 minutes?
You seriously going to make me believe that "If I'm not looking over my shoulder for a PK I'll be bored and quit in a month"? Seriously?
Open PvP world is a lame asian excuse of being a bad ass , being a gamer over there apparently gives you the right to rape under age girls. Here in the west , we're abit more civilized , we might bitch alot , but for good reasons.
Aion went the same open world pvp path and in the end they made their game much much more PvE oriented. They've actually gained subs and the game is breathing because of that decision. From a western perspective, nothing "good" in terms of MMO's came from Asia anyway, just the same old "enhance your items with 0,02% chance" and "open world ganking", along with some stupid and usually useless pet system.
It's simple: most players do not like to gank others, they find it no fun, they find it stupid. Only the words "open world pvp" will keep a very big chunk of western players away from the game. Why would someone like being abused by some "bad ass" 12-years-old who has nothing to do but grind all day?
There are already plenty of games out there not designed with open world pvp in mind (pvp servers for pve games don't really count imo). Can't there be just a few games that other people like, too? It does add a level of excitement, especially when we're not talking permadeath consequences. Besides that, not every open world pvp game turns into an insane killfest.
Also, too .. open world pvp = raping underage girls? LOL, what did I miss?
Full PvP doesn't equal griefing, in fact is the opposite
Fake PvP creates griefing. Without consequences everyone will attack everything that moves, because there is no consequence in losing a PvP match
Fact is that in a Full PvP game, the "griefer" has something to lose, and he will be very carefull who to attack.
In a game like WoW instead, these people simply keep attacking people for "fun" because the worse it can happen is to die and respown with no penalty.
A Full PvP game needs strict rules to work, in games like Darkfall the rules are half baked and do not completely work as intended
EvE pvp is slightly better, but it can be improved that too.
I am a PvE player but I enjoyed Darkfall Full PvP (even in its imperfection), what drove me away from the game was the lack of meaningful PvE and a fucked up economy (I like crafting too)
Full PvP was the last of my problem in Darkfall, in fact I rather enjoyed it, and I am looking forward to Darkfall 2.0
Why don't PvP servers for PvE games count? If PvP is so popular, there should be no issues getting people to play on the PvP server. Why can't a game developer offer both types of servers? Btw, there are already a few games out there that cater to PvP, maybe you've heard of a few, Lineage 2, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Eve, just to name a few.
I hope they do include a PvE server for those of us who want to experience the game without having to worry about someone elses fun infringing upon mine. With both types of servers, you do your thing, I'll go do mine.
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
add to this that the other faction PK can loot you of all your farm harvests that you spent so long working on.
It's a system as it stands that actually rewards ganking it seems, because the only people that will generate 'bloods' are your own faction. Say goodbye toall the social builders in this game, the ones that form the 'soul' of a game by investing in the community and world.
This game is looking so far like an ugly gankfest in a pretty world, and if anyone thinks that wont restrict this game to a tiny niche then they arnt thinking clearly, for whatever reason.
IMO, if they dont go live with optional PvP servers for this the game will reduced to a tiny hardcore of bitter self hating gankers by the 3rd month.
This IS a carebear attack thread.
Carebears have 900 WoW-Clones to go raid in and be all passive aggressive in chat with one another.
Give me an open pvp world any day of the week.
can I ask what open world PvP game you are playing right now?
and also, what is wrong with it that you want a new one?
I still agree with the Op. Would prefer a PVE server made available. If there is none, I won't waste my money on this.
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
You didnt answer why you are looking for a new one, don't they suit you?
Two words my friend, "Anger - Management"
(My son speaking to his Japanese Grandmother) " Sorry Obaba, I don't speak Japanese, I only speak human."
I agree.
Griefing comes from carebear PvPers.............griefers usually shit their pants in a Full loot MMO because losing their stuff is not an option, they won't like that a bit
In Darkfall there are very few griefers and the few ones are actually quite famous , because they make an ass of themself.........you know like losing from naked noobies and then crying in the forums for losing their precious Dragon Armor...........because of the lag (yeah right)