Every time they release a little more information, it just seems to build my hype for this game. They are doing SO many things right. Now, we still dont know what all they're gonna do, so there's lots of room for Wrong, but so far this is heading in a very favorable direction.
I'd rather them not release any info so there is still content to "wow" us. The marketing department hopefully knows what the heck they're doing. I guess we'll see.
Only problem with the PvP part is how they would explain it through the storyline. It seems to be lumped on and doesn't have much context with the PvE game. Sounds more like a giant fragfest than anything meaningful.
Don't get me wrong though, i am totally pumped for this game, just the PvP side doesn't do anything for me since it doesn't tie in with the rest of the game.
Not true that camaraderie exists only with PVP. Everquest you had to group or be in a tight or large guild or you were at a huge disadvantge in leveling. The community was really good and making friends or at least allies happened every time you played. The main reason the communities stopped being important is because games cater to a larger, more casual player base leading to less challenging mechanics-soloing, no death penalties, easier leveling, etc. If you don't need to interact with community to succeed, then most won't. Hate to say it, but you have to force the grouping so players have to depend on each other. That builds trust and camaraderie. That is why the dynamic events model is so interesting, it encourages grouping/interaction, but doesn't force it, add open world pvp and the community should be strong and active.
I agree that Dynamic Events encourage player interaction without forcing it but your example of the EQ-style groups and guilds is exactly what GW2 is trying to avoid. From the article:
I think if you look at MMOs the really frustrating thing is that I am playing this game online with thousands of people and I don’t interact with hardly any of them. Maybe with the people on my friends list or in my guild and that’s it.In old school MMOs you didn’t want other players around you because they were kill stealing from you or they would get in the way of the stuff I was trying to do. That can drive a player nuts.
GW2 is trying to make a game where you're not limited to only wanting to interact with the few dozen (or less) people in your guild, but everyone on the server. This is a completely different level than anything that could be attained in EQ or any other previous MMO, if ArenaNet can pull it off.
Old-school guild players always accuse casual gameplay of letting people play a solo game when it's supposed to be a MASSIVELY Multiplayer game. It's time to throw that tired old argument back into their faces. What's so MASSIVE about only wanting to interact with your guildmates when they only make up a tiny fraction of the server population?
GW2 seems to be aiming to create a server-wide community that is based not only on just those players who want to be nice but actual game mechanics that support real player cooperation.
I was originally pointing out how the interview implied that this was something old-school MMOs had lost when in fact they never had something on this level simply because of their instrinc game mechancs. Heck, the orignal interview question seems to say that guild groups are responsible for the loss of the very camaraderie you talk about. I would agree with you that what camaraderie (in its limited fashion) that there has been in previous MMOs was the result of EQ-style guilds.
But ArenaNet has decided that they can make a game that can do far better than that.
I supose it's possible that people had a different experince than i did but i never only socialized within my guild and friends list, in the early years of EQ. The thing that made the community strong wasn't only forced grouping but time sinks and ease of play. You had so much downtime in EQ in the early years and even if you were killing something , combat consisted of hitting auto attack or casting 1-2 spells then sitting for 10min. You used all this extra time to socialize. Sometimes with your guild or a friend but sometimes it was zonewide conversations or just someone who was hunting near you. You actually had time to really get to know people.
This was all in the very beginning though after the first couple years things started to change. Especially when SoE took over. The game got easier, people got greedy, and then it started to lose some of that close community. So if you didn't start playing til the game was 3-4 yrs old , you never really got to experience that close knit community some of us talk about.
GW2 like everything else these days is a button mashing game. They even took it one step further , now you have to manually dodge as well as hit skill buttons. So forget about having any type of conversation while fighting unless it is on some type of voicechat. Which is a whole nother nightmare in itself. It's never been a great tool for community interaction and even works against it in some ways.
I do like that GW2 is trying to get the community together, but putting 100 people in the same place doesn't mean they are going to socialize and become a close community. It may give you more of a community feel being around many other players. In reality though everyone is still in there own little social circle. Having 100 people in the same area can also lead to a lot of fighting and bickering. There are certain types of gamers who just dont get along with each other. PvPer's dont like PvEer's , hardcore players dont like casual players , and of course everyone hates the WoW kids. There are exceptions of course but i think you get what i am trying to say.
It's a really ugly thing to think about , and i'd like nothing more than to be wrong and have them prove me wrong. I think you'd have a better chance of getting Osama bin Laden to sing the Star Spangled Banner though. =/
Not true that camaraderie exists only with PVP. Everquest you had to group or be in a tight or large guild or you were at a huge disadvantge in leveling. The community was really good and making friends or at least allies happened every time you played. The main reason the communities stopped being important is because games cater to a larger, more casual player base leading to less challenging mechanics-soloing, no death penalties, easier leveling, etc. If you don't need to interact with community to succeed, then most won't. Hate to say it, but you have to force the grouping so players have to depend on each other. That builds trust and camaraderie. That is why the dynamic events model is so interesting, it encourages grouping/interaction, but doesn't force it, add open world pvp and the community should be strong and active.
I agree that Dynamic Events encourage player interaction without forcing it but your example of the EQ-style groups and guilds is exactly what GW2 is trying to avoid. From the article:
I think if you look at MMOs the really frustrating thing is that I am playing this game online with thousands of people and I don’t interact with hardly any of them. Maybe with the people on my friends list or in my guild and that’s it.In old school MMOs you didn’t want other players around you because they were kill stealing from you or they would get in the way of the stuff I was trying to do. That can drive a player nuts.
GW2 is trying to make a game where you're not limited to only wanting to interact with the few dozen (or less) people in your guild, but everyone on the server. This is a completely different level than anything that could be attained in EQ or any other previous MMO, if ArenaNet can pull it off.
Old-school guild players always accuse casual gameplay of letting people play a solo game when it's supposed to be a MASSIVELY Multiplayer game. It's time to throw that tired old argument back into their faces. What's so MASSIVE about only wanting to interact with your guildmates when they only make up a tiny fraction of the server population?
GW2 seems to be aiming to create a server-wide community that is based not only on just those players who want to be nice but actual game mechanics that support real player cooperation.
I was originally pointing out how the interview implied that this was something old-school MMOs had lost when in fact they never had something on this level simply because of their instrinc game mechancs. Heck, the orignal interview question seems to say that guild groups are responsible for the loss of the very camaraderie you talk about. I would agree with you that what camaraderie (in its limited fashion) that there has been in previous MMOs was the result of EQ-style guilds.
But ArenaNet has decided that they can make a game that can do far better than that.
I supose it's possible that people had a different experince than i did but i never only socialized within my guild and friends list, in the early years of EQ. The thing that made the community strong wasn't only forced grouping but time sinks and ease of play. You had so much downtime in EQ in the early years and even if you were killing something , combat consisted of hitting auto attack or casting 1-2 spells then sitting for 10min. You used all this extra time to socialize. Sometimes with your guild or a friend but sometimes it was zonewide conversations or just someone who was hunting near you. You actually had time to really get to know people.
This was all in the very beginning though after the first couple years things started to change. Especially when SoE took over. The game got easier, people got greedy, and then it started to lose some of that close community. So if you didn't start playing til the game was 3-4 yrs old , you never really got to experience that close knit community some of us talk about.
GW2 like everything else these days is a button mashing game. They even took it one step further , now you have to manually dodge as well as hit skill buttons. So forget about having any type of conversation while fighting unless it is on some type of voicechat. Which is a whole nother nightmare in itself. It's never been a great tool for community interaction and even works against it in some ways.
I do like that GW2 is trying to get the community together, but putting 100 people in the same place doesn't mean they are going to socialize and become a close community. It may give you more of a community feel being around many other players. In reality though everyone is still in there own little social circle. Having 100 people in the same area can also lead to a lot of fighting and bickering. There are certain types of gamers who just dont get along with each other. PvPer's dont like PvEer's , hardcore players dont like casual players , and of course everyone hates the WoW kids. There are exceptions of course but i think you get what i am trying to say.
It's a really ugly thing to think about , and i'd like nothing more than to be wrong and have them prove me wrong. I think you'd have a better chance of getting Osama bin Laden to sing the Star Spangled Banner though. =/
What Colin means is out of those hundred or so people, they hope that atleast a few would come out and interact with you when the event is over and possibly even decide to group later. I like this approach better than forced grouping. Grouping should only be encouraged or rather inspired if you enjoyed playing with them. So after an event, a few of you might decide to party up and do the next events together without having anyone else that was forced into a group because you needed them but you dont like them, that is their goal. With this mechanic, there is some sense of community, why simply because you aren't competing in the PvE areas anymore as others have pointed out. There is no stealing kills, xps and loot. You're all fighting in the same side.
Playing now: Cities: Skyline / Ori and the Blind Forest / Banished
I'd rather them not release any info so there is still content to "wow" us. The marketing department hopefully knows what the heck they're doing. I guess we'll see.
Well, they are leading the hype meeter right now, that seems to say that marketing are competent.
What Colin means is out of those hundred or so people, they hope that atleast a few would come out and interact with you when the event is over and possibly even decide to group later. I like this approach better than forced grouping. Grouping should only be encouraged or rather inspired if you enjoyed playing with them. So after an event, a few of you might decide to party up and do the next events together without having anyone else that was forced into a group because you needed them but you dont like them, that is their goal. With this mechanic, there is some sense of community, why simply because you aren't competing in the PvE areas anymore as others have pointed out. There is no stealing kills, xps and loot.
Ok i thought he was talking about the community as a whole. I can see your points where it will help in smaller ways. I agree encouraged grouping is better than forced. Thanks for clearing that up for me. 8)
I see nothing wrong with playing solely with Guildmates, or with close friends, etc - because, by implication, one has already spent a degree of time playing with PUGS [pick-up groups] and as another poster had pointed out, has experienced mixed results that have been detrimental to one's gameplay.
I'm all for anything that encourages player interaction, however I strongly believe it is / has been player interdependence that encourages, nay, demands socialization; whether it be through grouping to achieve a particular aim, face-to-face trading (life before Auction Houses e.g. localized economies) or crafting.
I disagree with the assumption that dynamic scripting will encourage socialization. It's a bit of a red herring, when to my mind, the real innovation is through dynamic scripts (i) effecting gameplay, irrespective of whether one interacts with them or not, and (ii) persistent effect e.g. if a village is razed by an army of orcs then the following conditions will be true: the village will remain burnt (unless rebuilt), and the orcs will remain to terrorize other locales (unless dealt with).
I used to play LoTRO and there was a lot of player socializtion either through RP or grouping as part of the questing system. In that regard, nothing had really changed from my EQ days - except when quests started to get toned down in challenge and a solo option added to the main quests. Then I found "Need help with x quest", "I also need that quest! I'll be right there!", "Sorry, I've just ran it solo. Thanks for the offer!" to be more commonplace.
There is nothing wrong with casual play - but everything wrong with the contemporary definition of casual play as streamlining / removing any semblance of player interdependence that has killed socialization. As another poster on another thread pointed out, one suspects that [contemporary] MMO play is a single-player experience, but with other players as background noise.
That said, I am excited about dynamic scripting because aside from the decline of player interdependence, I've become increasingly disappointed with persistent worlds with non-persistent content i.e. everything 'resets' x minutes later irrespective of player action, provides for only a couple of inches of sand with which to make castles. Barely enough sand to kick in the other kids' faces
Cheers!
"If you think I'm plucky and scrappy and all I need is love, you're in way over your head. I don't have a heart of gold or get nice. There are a lot nicer people coming up. We call them losers."
Probably having two major events organized on close dates, as GamesCom and Pax, kind of exhausts the information one could release about Guild Wars 2, in this particular moment - however this PvP system choice they speak of in the interview is news to me. Having played Warhammer online and simply loving theyr Realm vs Realm PvP, i couldnt be happyer about Guild Wars 2 opting for a similar system.
I haven't played any of the GW2 demo versions so far, but from what i've red on the net and from the videos i've seen so far, i noticed there are common classes (warrior, ranger, elementalist and necromancer), in the game with a common NPC that sells you spells (nothing new so far). Personally i would have appreciated an original at least terminology, and/or class progression, like for instance Age of Conan the Herald of Xotli or the Conqueror, or as old Lineage 2 with its Spellsingers, Overlords and all the others, along with a class evolution step. Guess we'll still have to wait and see if the remaining 4 professions to be revealed are stereotypical classes or maybe they'll bring out something new.
That's because they've already released every bit of information the game has to offer. We've already seen everything there is to see for GW2.
Oh, great. Then you might answer a few questions to me:
How will crafting work?
Will you actually get armor dropping or will they be crafted so they actually fit you like in the first game (I do know you can upgrade the armor).
How will Norns work, can they shapeshift at will and what are their froms?
Which animals will be pets? Minipets?LOL Minipets
Which are the all the 8 classes, I only know 4?
Either you are working on ANET yourself or that was some weird sarcasm becuse there are a lot of unknowns yet. The reason they havn't said so much news is the fact that they revealed loads at Gamescon a few weeks ago and they only talks about stuff that already works now.
Crafting and PvP are the 2 big subjects which we heard very little about yet. But I think many people forget that it was only a few weeks ago we got to see the game and were shown a lot of this content.
Just relax, they will release more things when they work as they should, besides, it would be stupid to hype up the game so long before launch and reveal nothing new after that.
good stuff cant wait for this game! I just really want more info. From the info and videos I have gathered from these events it looks like to be a fun, social and very poished product.
I'd say its time for some real news... They are only repeating things we (atleast me ) allready knew
I think this guy thought this was a Jumpgate: Evolution article.
Apparently the last few weeks don't count for much to you, then?
No Lord.Bachus knows his onions, that's the downside of being on top of the info/marketing dowload for a new game ; )
I was interested in their ideas about making the mmo more about players reacting positively with each other, & their acknowledgement to DAOC's 3-FACTION system - one of the BEST examples of ArenaNet choosing the right features and design to implement.
Still only half-way on some of the features revealed: Professions, PvP, End-Game, Crafting, Guilds, Story.
So when's the release date? "When it's ready." : O
GW2 looks great - and sounds great. Ive been an avid MMO fan for many years, dating back to Earth and Beyond; and have played a dozen or so MMO's.
I truly hope the devs ideas and VERY optimistic hopes and dreams dontcome crashing down though.
One thing I believe many developers completely and utterly fail to capture and grasp is the nature of much of the modern day MMO community. Perhaps I am a bit jaded, but sadly there are a lot of very nasty and vicious groups of players out there. Griefing for some people is the ultimate fun.
Every Game I have played has had more than its share of players and entire guilds that can simply ruin a server or game for everyone else. I'm sure everyone here who has played MMO's understands this.
You have players and guilds that will do anything and everything they can to get ahead. Exploit, cheat, bend other people to their devices. Griefing can be quite prominent. You have players that no matter how great a game is will bash it, the community, and spoil the fun for others - even while still playing the game and moaning constantly about it.
You simply cannot gauge how far a community of players can twist an MMO.
Instead of asking so many questions about the Dynamic Events system, etc and sounding all enthralled and amazed by it... why isnt MMORPG.com and others asking harder questions? How is GW2 going to prevent your hardcore "ill win at any cost" players from damaging the concept of the game for casual players? How fast will they get a handle on exploiting and cheats? How much in-game support is there going to be to handle the ugly stuff?
It doesnt seem possible... but I can GUARANTEE you that someone will find a way to grief someone else during these dynamic events. How is GW2 going to fix that?
Could be the most well thought out, designed, and greatest game ever. But if the Community turns out to be riddled with punks, elitist jerks and the like it will be no better than anything else around.
GW2 looks great - and sounds great. Ive been an avid MMO fan for many years, dating back to Earth and Beyond; and have played a dozen or so MMO's.
I truly hope the devs ideas and VERY optimistic hopes and dreams dontcome crashing down though.
One thing I believe many developers completely and utterly fail to capture and grasp is the nature of much of the modern day MMO community. Perhaps I am a bit jaded, but sadly there are a lot of very nasty and vicious groups of players out there. Griefing for some people is the ultimate fun.
Every Game I have played has had more than its share of players and entire guilds that can simply ruin a server or game for everyone else. I'm sure everyone here who has played MMO's understands this.
You have players and guilds that will do anything and everything they can to get ahead. Exploit, cheat, bend other people to their devices. Griefing can be quite prominent. You have players that no matter how great a game is will bash it, the community, and spoil the fun for others - even while still playing the game and moaning constantly about it.
You simply cannot gauge how far a community of players can twist an MMO.
Instead of asking so many questions about the Dynamic Events system, etc and sounding all enthralled and amazed by it... why isnt MMORPG.com and others asking harder questions? How is GW2 going to prevent your hardcore "ill win at any cost" players from damaging the concept of the game for casual players? How fast will they get a handle on exploiting and cheats? How much in-game support is there going to be to handle the ugly stuff?
It doesnt seem possible... but I can GUARANTEE you that someone will find a way to grief someone else during these dynamic events. How is GW2 going to fix that?
I'm sure ArenaNet will monitor the launch and the early days of the game more heavily than any other day of the game since they recognize this period is the most important. They've done this with Guild Wars 1, very quick to fix any unforseen flaws in mechanics. And even during the life, sometimes even hours of an exploit being exposed, they take action. They read and reply in the fansite forums. Probably the quickest way to bring out problems and get attention quickly. ArenaNet can take severe actions as well from suspension to permanent ban.
In GW1, there are youtube videos of people getting banned by the Bhan of Dhuum, he slices you in half and burns your corpse. They only do this when you are online so everyone sees that they mean business! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fFYug8nXcMIn spring alone, they've banned 3700 accounts. So expect that they will continue something like this. They also have an in-game reporting sytem that's very quick to use.
Could be the most well thought out, designed, and greatest game ever. But if the Community turns out to be riddled with punks, elitist jerks and the like it will be no better than anything else around.
Playing now: Cities: Skyline / Ori and the Blind Forest / Banished
GW2 looks great - and sounds great. Ive been an avid MMO fan for many years, dating back to Earth and Beyond; and have played a dozen or so MMO's.
I truly hope the devs ideas and VERY optimistic hopes and dreams dontcome crashing down though.
One thing I believe many developers completely and utterly fail to capture and grasp is the nature of much of the modern day MMO community. Perhaps I am a bit jaded, but sadly there are a lot of very nasty and vicious groups of players out there. Griefing for some people is the ultimate fun.
Every Game I have played has had more than its share of players and entire guilds that can simply ruin a server or game for everyone else. I'm sure everyone here who has played MMO's understands this.
You have players and guilds that will do anything and everything they can to get ahead. Exploit, cheat, bend other people to their devices. Griefing can be quite prominent. You have players that no matter how great a game is will bash it, the community, and spoil the fun for others - even while still playing the game and moaning constantly about it.
You simply cannot gauge how far a community of players can twist an MMO.
Instead of asking so many questions about the Dynamic Events system, etc and sounding all enthralled and amazed by it... why isnt MMORPG.com and others asking harder questions? How is GW2 going to prevent your hardcore "ill win at any cost" players from damaging the concept of the game for casual players? How fast will they get a handle on exploiting and cheats? How much in-game support is there going to be to handle the ugly stuff?
It doesnt seem possible... but I can GUARANTEE you that someone will find a way to grief someone else during these dynamic events. How is GW2 going to fix that?
Could be the most well thought out, designed, and greatest game ever. But if the Community turns out to be riddled with punks, elitist jerks and the like it will be no better than anything else around.
I have hardly seen a more empty interview than that.
I wonder if MMORPG.com dudes are not paid by game companies, seeing the empty questions they are asking.
Guys, seriously, get a journalist card, do some internship at CNN and come back to ask real questions and not just write a story about "i'm a game designer and i'm talking bout my life".
If we dig back the interviews u guys did with other games, then APB, WAR, SWG NGE, hell, even Darkfail would be top notch games.
CHALLENGE UR INTERVIEWEES or don't call it an interview, call it a blog.
You're a Hardcore Survivor!
You not only survived the zombie apocalypse, but did it with style! Your mastery of zombie knowledge, survival tactics, and weaponry is nearly unmatched. Congratulations, for you are hardcore!
GW2 looks great - and sounds great. Ive been an avid MMO fan for many years, dating back to Earth and Beyond; and have played a dozen or so MMO's.
I truly hope the devs ideas and VERY optimistic hopes and dreams dontcome crashing down though.
One thing I believe many developers completely and utterly fail to capture and grasp is the nature of much of the modern day MMO community. Perhaps I am a bit jaded, but sadly there are a lot of very nasty and vicious groups of players out there. Griefing for some people is the ultimate fun.
Every Game I have played has had more than its share of players and entire guilds that can simply ruin a server or game for everyone else. I'm sure everyone here who has played MMO's understands this.
You have players and guilds that will do anything and everything they can to get ahead. Exploit, cheat, bend other people to their devices. Griefing can be quite prominent. You have players that no matter how great a game is will bash it, the community, and spoil the fun for others - even while still playing the game and moaning constantly about it.
You simply cannot gauge how far a community of players can twist an MMO.
Instead of asking so many questions about the Dynamic Events system, etc and sounding all enthralled and amazed by it... why isnt MMORPG.com and others asking harder questions? How is GW2 going to prevent your hardcore "ill win at any cost" players from damaging the concept of the game for casual players? How fast will they get a handle on exploiting and cheats? How much in-game support is there going to be to handle the ugly stuff?
It doesnt seem possible... but I can GUARANTEE you that someone will find a way to grief someone else during these dynamic events. How is GW2 going to fix that?
Could be the most well thought out, designed, and greatest game ever. But if the Community turns out to be riddled with punks, elitist jerks and the like it will be no better than anything else around.
You can skip to the Q&A section or you can watch the whole thing. Its quite interesting but the Q&A section answers your question.
I was just about to link that video as well. Lol ^^
It is a good video to see as well even if you watch it from the beginning. I have been keeping up with it since they started releasing information and I have still found some other things that I did not know. They mention alot of good stuff in the video so check it out. Most importantly, they discuss some PVP things as well. It isn't much, but being a hardcore pvp fanatic like myself, I was jizzing in my pants.
Definitely shows like PAX are the greatest moment for me. We have spent three years building this game and the last few months we put out a ton of marketing material. We said we were going to do a lot and everything we set out to do we put into the game. We did not want to talk about them until they were in the game and they worked. There is a lot of danger to make a lot of bold claims and you don’t follow through on them. We don’t want to do that. We said a lot of stuff and we had a lot of people say we wouldn’t be able to do it. Or something like: yeah, that sounds awesome, but not one is ever going to build that.
Whoah wait time out. Is this a slip up? So the game IS DONE. given that they started the development in 2007?
Damn you ArenaNet, I want this game on the shelf now! This is torture. >.<'
Definitely shows like PAX are the greatest moment for me. We have spent three years building this game and the last few months we put out a ton of marketing material. We said we were going to do a lot and everything we set out to do we put into the game. We did not want to talk about them until they were in the game and they worked. There is a lot of danger to make a lot of bold claims and you don’t follow through on them. We don’t want to do that. We said a lot of stuff and we had a lot of people say we wouldn’t be able to do it. Or something like: yeah, that sounds awesome, but not one is ever going to build that.
Whoah wait time out. Is this a slip up? So the game IS DONE. given that they started the development in 2007?
Damn you ArenaNet, I want this game on the shelf now! This is torture. >.<'
If the game was done it would be out already lol. Obviously it is not done yet ><
GW2 like everything else these days is a button mashing game. They even took it one step further , now you have to manually dodge as well as hit skill buttons. So forget about having any type of conversation while fighting unless it is on some type of voicechat. Which is a whole nother nightmare in itself. It's never been a great tool for community interaction and even works against it in some ways.
Sounds like you've had some bad experiences with voice chat. Voice chat always made my gaming communities closer. It's always easier to get to know someone with voice than reading chat. I'm a great typist, but I'd prefer guilds with voice chat options because I feel more at home that way.
Anyways, this game is sounding cooler and cooler every time I read something new about it. Keep up the good work!
Not true that camaraderie exists only with PVP. Everquest you had to group or be in a tight or large guild or you were at a huge disadvantge in leveling. The community was really good and making friends or at least allies happened every time you played.
Of hundreds of people? DAOC if you were a hib most hibs you fight and die for. You didn't need to even know them other than if they were elf, lurikeen, firblog, etc. Thats the comradery daoc had. Most pve in the game were group efforts as it almost always relested in better exp (unless people were just fighting yellows [even daoc had solo time when you wanted to fight at your own pace]).
Most guilds had over a hundred people that you grouped with and talked to every day. You don't only fight and die for teammates in PVP. PVE Grouping in games that are actually hard, have death penalties, high end raiding in difficult locations, need strategies, etc. gets intense as well, plus the guilds were very tight and spent a lot of time together, not just pick up fights in pvp.
Comments
Every time they release a little more information, it just seems to build my hype for this game. They are doing SO many things right. Now, we still dont know what all they're gonna do, so there's lots of room for Wrong, but so far this is heading in a very favorable direction.
I'd rather them not release any info so there is still content to "wow" us. The marketing department hopefully knows what the heck they're doing. I guess we'll see.
Only problem with the PvP part is how they would explain it through the storyline. It seems to be lumped on and doesn't have much context with the PvE game. Sounds more like a giant fragfest than anything meaningful.
Don't get me wrong though, i am totally pumped for this game, just the PvP side doesn't do anything for me since it doesn't tie in with the rest of the game.
Archlinux ftw
I supose it's possible that people had a different experince than i did but i never only socialized within my guild and friends list, in the early years of EQ. The thing that made the community strong wasn't only forced grouping but time sinks and ease of play. You had so much downtime in EQ in the early years and even if you were killing something , combat consisted of hitting auto attack or casting 1-2 spells then sitting for 10min. You used all this extra time to socialize. Sometimes with your guild or a friend but sometimes it was zonewide conversations or just someone who was hunting near you. You actually had time to really get to know people.
This was all in the very beginning though after the first couple years things started to change. Especially when SoE took over. The game got easier, people got greedy, and then it started to lose some of that close community. So if you didn't start playing til the game was 3-4 yrs old , you never really got to experience that close knit community some of us talk about.
GW2 like everything else these days is a button mashing game. They even took it one step further , now you have to manually dodge as well as hit skill buttons. So forget about having any type of conversation while fighting unless it is on some type of voicechat. Which is a whole nother nightmare in itself. It's never been a great tool for community interaction and even works against it in some ways.
I do like that GW2 is trying to get the community together, but putting 100 people in the same place doesn't mean they are going to socialize and become a close community. It may give you more of a community feel being around many other players. In reality though everyone is still in there own little social circle. Having 100 people in the same area can also lead to a lot of fighting and bickering. There are certain types of gamers who just dont get along with each other. PvPer's dont like PvEer's , hardcore players dont like casual players , and of course everyone hates the WoW kids. There are exceptions of course but i think you get what i am trying to say.
It's a really ugly thing to think about , and i'd like nothing more than to be wrong and have them prove me wrong. I think you'd have a better chance of getting Osama bin Laden to sing the Star Spangled Banner though. =/
What Colin means is out of those hundred or so people, they hope that atleast a few would come out and interact with you when the event is over and possibly even decide to group later. I like this approach better than forced grouping. Grouping should only be encouraged or rather inspired if you enjoyed playing with them. So after an event, a few of you might decide to party up and do the next events together without having anyone else that was forced into a group because you needed them but you dont like them, that is their goal. With this mechanic, there is some sense of community, why simply because you aren't competing in the PvE areas anymore as others have pointed out. There is no stealing kills, xps and loot. You're all fighting in the same side.
Playing now: Cities: Skyline / Ori and the Blind Forest / Banished
Well, they are leading the hype meeter right now, that seems to say that marketing are competent.
Ok i thought he was talking about the community as a whole. I can see your points where it will help in smaller ways. I agree encouraged grouping is better than forced. Thanks for clearing that up for me. 8)
I see nothing wrong with playing solely with Guildmates, or with close friends, etc - because, by implication, one has already spent a degree of time playing with PUGS [pick-up groups] and as another poster had pointed out, has experienced mixed results that have been detrimental to one's gameplay.
I'm all for anything that encourages player interaction, however I strongly believe it is / has been player interdependence that encourages, nay, demands socialization; whether it be through grouping to achieve a particular aim, face-to-face trading (life before Auction Houses e.g. localized economies) or crafting.
I disagree with the assumption that dynamic scripting will encourage socialization. It's a bit of a red herring, when to my mind, the real innovation is through dynamic scripts
(i) effecting gameplay, irrespective of whether one interacts with them or not, and
(ii) persistent effect e.g. if a village is razed by an army of orcs then the following conditions will be true: the village will remain burnt (unless rebuilt), and the orcs will remain to terrorize other locales (unless dealt with).
I used to play LoTRO and there was a lot of player socializtion either through RP or grouping as part of the questing system. In that regard, nothing had really changed from my EQ days - except when quests started to get toned down in challenge and a solo option added to the main quests. Then I found "Need help with x quest", "I also need that quest! I'll be right there!", "Sorry, I've just ran it solo. Thanks for the offer!" to be more commonplace.
There is nothing wrong with casual play - but everything wrong with the contemporary definition of casual play as streamlining / removing any semblance of player interdependence that has killed socialization. As another poster on another thread pointed out, one suspects that [contemporary] MMO play is a single-player experience, but with other players as background noise.
That said, I am excited about dynamic scripting because aside from the decline of player interdependence, I've become increasingly disappointed with persistent worlds with non-persistent content i.e. everything 'resets' x minutes later irrespective of player action, provides for only a couple of inches of sand with which to make castles. Barely enough sand to kick in the other kids' faces
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Probably having two major events organized on close dates, as GamesCom and Pax, kind of exhausts the information one could release about Guild Wars 2, in this particular moment - however this PvP system choice they speak of in the interview is news to me. Having played Warhammer online and simply loving theyr Realm vs Realm PvP, i couldnt be happyer about Guild Wars 2 opting for a similar system.
I haven't played any of the GW2 demo versions so far, but from what i've red on the net and from the videos i've seen so far, i noticed there are common classes (warrior, ranger, elementalist and necromancer), in the game with a common NPC that sells you spells (nothing new so far). Personally i would have appreciated an original at least terminology, and/or class progression, like for instance Age of Conan the Herald of Xotli or the Conqueror, or as old Lineage 2 with its Spellsingers, Overlords and all the others, along with a class evolution step. Guess we'll still have to wait and see if the remaining 4 professions to be revealed are stereotypical classes or maybe they'll bring out something new.
I'm hoping they'll bring back the mesmer from GW1. There's a class you don't see in many other MMOs.
Loving this so much.
The more I read, the more I am won over.
I am SO looking forward to playing this EXPERIENCE--because it no longer seems like just a game to me.
good stuff cant wait for this game! I just really want more info. From the info and videos I have gathered from these events it looks like to be a fun, social and very poished product.
I think this guy thought this was a Jumpgate: Evolution article.
Apparently the last few weeks don't count for much to you, then?
No Lord.Bachus knows his onions, that's the downside of being on top of the info/marketing dowload for a new game ; )
I was interested in their ideas about making the mmo more about players reacting positively with each other, & their acknowledgement to DAOC's 3-FACTION system - one of the BEST examples of ArenaNet choosing the right features and design to implement.
Still only half-way on some of the features revealed: Professions, PvP, End-Game, Crafting, Guilds, Story.
So when's the release date? "When it's ready." : O
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
GW2 looks great - and sounds great. Ive been an avid MMO fan for many years, dating back to Earth and Beyond; and have played a dozen or so MMO's.
I truly hope the devs ideas and VERY optimistic hopes and dreams dontcome crashing down though.
One thing I believe many developers completely and utterly fail to capture and grasp is the nature of much of the modern day MMO community. Perhaps I am a bit jaded, but sadly there are a lot of very nasty and vicious groups of players out there. Griefing for some people is the ultimate fun.
Every Game I have played has had more than its share of players and entire guilds that can simply ruin a server or game for everyone else. I'm sure everyone here who has played MMO's understands this.
You have players and guilds that will do anything and everything they can to get ahead. Exploit, cheat, bend other people to their devices. Griefing can be quite prominent. You have players that no matter how great a game is will bash it, the community, and spoil the fun for others - even while still playing the game and moaning constantly about it.
You simply cannot gauge how far a community of players can twist an MMO.
Instead of asking so many questions about the Dynamic Events system, etc and sounding all enthralled and amazed by it... why isnt MMORPG.com and others asking harder questions? How is GW2 going to prevent your hardcore "ill win at any cost" players from damaging the concept of the game for casual players? How fast will they get a handle on exploiting and cheats? How much in-game support is there going to be to handle the ugly stuff?
It doesnt seem possible... but I can GUARANTEE you that someone will find a way to grief someone else during these dynamic events. How is GW2 going to fix that?
Could be the most well thought out, designed, and greatest game ever. But if the Community turns out to be riddled with punks, elitist jerks and the like it will be no better than anything else around.
Playing now: Cities: Skyline / Ori and the Blind Forest / Banished
Watch this http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1013691/Designing-Guild-Wars-2-Dynamic
You can skip to the Q&A section or you can watch the whole thing. Its quite interesting but the Q&A section answers your question.
This is not a game.
I have hardly seen a more empty interview than that.
I wonder if MMORPG.com dudes are not paid by game companies, seeing the empty questions they are asking.
Guys, seriously, get a journalist card, do some internship at CNN and come back to ask real questions and not just write a story about "i'm a game designer and i'm talking bout my life".
If we dig back the interviews u guys did with other games, then APB, WAR, SWG NGE, hell, even Darkfail would be top notch games.
CHALLENGE UR INTERVIEWEES or don't call it an interview, call it a blog.
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I was just about to link that video as well. Lol ^^
It is a good video to see as well even if you watch it from the beginning. I have been keeping up with it since they started releasing information and I have still found some other things that I did not know. They mention alot of good stuff in the video so check it out. Most importantly, they discuss some PVP things as well. It isn't much, but being a hardcore pvp fanatic like myself, I was jizzing in my pants.
Colin:
Definitely shows like PAX are the greatest moment for me. We have spent three years building this game and the last few months we put out a ton of marketing material. We said we were going to do a lot and everything we set out to do we put into the game. We did not want to talk about them until they were in the game and they worked. There is a lot of danger to make a lot of bold claims and you don’t follow through on them. We don’t want to do that. We said a lot of stuff and we had a lot of people say we wouldn’t be able to do it. Or something like: yeah, that sounds awesome, but not one is ever going to build that.
Whoah wait time out. Is this a slip up? So the game IS DONE. given that they started the development in 2007?
Damn you ArenaNet, I want this game on the shelf now! This is torture. >.<'
Ready for GW2!!!
If the game was done it would be out already lol. Obviously it is not done yet ><
Sounds like you've had some bad experiences with voice chat. Voice chat always made my gaming communities closer. It's always easier to get to know someone with voice than reading chat. I'm a great typist, but I'd prefer guilds with voice chat options because I feel more at home that way.
Anyways, this game is sounding cooler and cooler every time I read something new about it. Keep up the good work!
Most guilds had over a hundred people that you grouped with and talked to every day. You don't only fight and die for teammates in PVP. PVE Grouping in games that are actually hard, have death penalties, high end raiding in difficult locations, need strategies, etc. gets intense as well, plus the guilds were very tight and spent a lot of time together, not just pick up fights in pvp.