Considering TOR is mostly going to be Jedi centered, I see little interest for me PvP'ing in it.
Hah, SWG is not jedi centric now, right? I actually resubbed about 3 months ago, I think I lasted about a week before I ran out of fun. It was really nothing more then Jedi and Spies.
Anyways, I think you will be pretty wrong, I usually play mlee classes in MMOs, so far "all" the ranged classes shown in ToR seem more appealing then Jedi/Sith. There was actually a thread about a month back on the ToR forums, lots of people felt the same.
There's a "healthy" amount of Jedi, but there's a healthy amount of non-jedi. I encounter more non-Jedi then I do Jedi...
The number of jedi running around during this timeline beyond Luke, Yoda, Vadar and the emperor is not healthy. Also considering as the number of jedi increased in swg, the player population declined. I must disagree with your definition of healthy. Just as I disgree with your definition of successful.
It is funny how you demand proof of even the most obvious situations in swg or soe, but you have little problem making unsubstantiated claims about bioware and their star wars mmo without missing a beat.
People cannot say soe is on the decline, even when the company has closed more than half of their total game servers across their mmo division, but you can make claims about a game that has not been released yet and you have never played.
Very nice.
For the record, I don't like the Jedi profession (hence why I don't play it, nor did I persue it during the pre-nge days) and I despise the Spy profession (for the others who mentioned it).
As for the claim of TOR being Jedi centric, indeed, it is just my opinion. My opinion that is based on the the previous two KOTOR games, the fancy game trailer that they did for TOR featuring a stack of Jedi and the majority of their screenshots and what not of the game as a whole featuring Jedi. You're perfectly within your right to reject my opinion, just as I was yours
For the record, I don't like the Jedi profession (hence why I don't play it, nor did I persue it during the pre-nge days) and I despise the Spy profession (for the others who mentioned it). As for the claim of TOR being Jedi centric, indeed, it is just my opinion. My opinion that is based on the the previous two KOTOR games, the fancy game trailer that they did for TOR featuring a stack of Jedi and the majority of their screenshots and what not of the game as a whole featuring Jedi. You're perfectly within your right to reject my opinion, just as I was yours
So your opinion is based off of KoTOR, a Single Player RPG where you had no other option then to play Jedi . You also probably arn't thinking about the many charactes you encountered in KoTOR, which actually made the game far more enjoyable then playing a Jedi, Canderous Ordo being my favorite. Given the option, you don't believe players would have chose something other then Jedi, if it had a deep story behind it, like ToR will? And to add on top of that, most of the screen shots feature Jedi and Sith because it was the first classes to be known to ToR. After that it was Bounty Hunter which got a good amount of Screen Shots to follow it's announcment and the same for every class since then. The only reason you see more Light Sabers currently is because Sith Warrior was announced, and like I said before, screen shots follow the announcment. And just from glancing at the screen shots, most of them are scenery such as cities and creatures you encounter.
This isn't just outrage over ANYTHING soe does. Some may bitch about anything they do, but equally, some people praise everything they do not matter what. I think everyone understands that server mergers at this point are a positive step for the remaining populations. The manner surrounding the mergers is what sucks and it is worth pointing out, for example: These mergers comes far to late to fix the problems some players have been begging to get resolved for years... years. SOE left the only avenue for healthy populations at the expense of the players by charging for transfers. No argument here. The chaos and unorganized manner in how they conducted the free transfers in the first place. I thought it was straight-forward. I extracted my character to a populated server some months back with no problem. Then found the game sucks just as much with a population as without.
Springing mergers on players after saying they had no plans kind of sucks, but if it is necessary then so be it. I'm not sure I agree with "springing." No plans as of, what, a year ago? Situations and outlooks change. Charging any returning player $50 to transfer if for some reason they did not hear about this before Oct15th is shameless. I don't care if SOE has given up on regaining old players, that is no excuse to alienate them.... again. Here's my point: Nobody will be charged $50 for a transfer. Anybody who ever might return to that game has done so (and probably left again). Anyone marginally interested in the game will keep tabs on what is happening. Emails are sent out. If you care anything at all about SWG, you know what is happening and you have already moved your character (or are in process). Nobody is going to pop up next year and go "Kettemoor is gone? When did that happen?" (If someone does, let me know. I'll gladly admit I'm wrong. )
The original title question is "Has any other MMO charged for transferring off a closed server?" "Other MMO" presumes SOE will charge to xfer off a closed server. It hasn't happen and it won't happen. Might as well ask "What if God and Superman had a fight?"
Especially for a company that wants to rebuild their image as one who listens to the customers and cares about anything. I am not pretending that any sizable amount of players are going to return to SWG, including myself, but that is nothing I can control. The current soe is never going to do what is needed to win back players. From their complete lack of respect to their customers, the constant money grabs - RMT - loot cards, flawed designs and on and on. They are going to continue acting in this manner until they close shop, have a major change in leadership or somehow blindly stumble on success with how they run the company. I think the type of gamer/customer generally represented on this forum (myself included) is not the customer SOE is looking for. I think that is clear. They have decided whatever "image" problem they have with "us" is not worth it to them to fix. They are looking for a different demographic and are cutting their losses with whatever "we" represent.
Lets put it this way, if blizzard was doing mergers like this every other poster on this forum would be up in arms over and it would be front page news. If Blizzard did it, how many millions would be affected? In this case, all I hear is "what if." Nobody has been charged 50 bucks.
Since it is SOE behind this, it is just more of the same from a company that people have come to expect this type of behavior from. Well, yeah. All the more reason I don't get the faux outrage. "Damn, that scorpion stung me. Mother fu-"
For the record, I don't like the Jedi profession (hence why I don't play it, nor did I persue it during the pre-nge days) and I despise the Spy profession (for the others who mentioned it). As for the claim of TOR being Jedi centric, indeed, it is just my opinion. My opinion that is based on the the previous two KOTOR games, the fancy game trailer that they did for TOR featuring a stack of Jedi and the majority of their screenshots and what not of the game as a whole featuring Jedi. You're perfectly within your right to reject my opinion, just as I was yours
So your opinion is based off of KoTOR, a Single Player RPG where you had no other option then to play Jedi . You also probably arn't thinking about the many charactes you encountered in KoTOR, which actually made the game far more enjoyable then playing a Jedi, Canderous Ordo being my favorite. Given the option, you don't believe players would have chose something other then Jedi, if it had a deep story behind it, like ToR will? And to add on top of that, most of the screen shots feature Jedi and Sith because it was the first classes to be known to ToR. After that it was Bounty Hunter which got a good amount of Screen Shots to follow it's announcment and the same for every class since then. The only reason you see more Light Sabers currently is because Sith Warrior was announced, and like I said before, screen shots follow the announcment. And just from glancing at the screen shots, most of them are scenery such as cities and creatures you encounter.
Then I look forward to being pleasently surprised when TOR launches.
This isn't just outrage over ANYTHING soe does. Some may bitch about anything they do, but equally, some people praise everything they do not matter what. I think everyone understands that server mergers at this point are a positive step for the remaining populations. The manner surrounding the mergers is what sucks and it is worth pointing out, for example: These mergers comes far to late to fix the problems some players have been begging to get resolved for years... years. SOE left the only avenue for healthy populations at the expense of the players by charging for transfers. No argument here. The chaos and unorganized manner in how they conducted the free transfers in the first place. I thought it was straight-forward. I extracted my character to a populated server some months back with no problem. Then found the game sucks just as much with a population as without.
Springing mergers on players after saying they had no plans kind of sucks, but if it is necessary then so be it. I'm not sure I agree with "springing." No plans as of, what, a year ago? Situations and outlooks change. Charging any returning player $50 to transfer if for some reason they did not hear about this before Oct15th is shameless. I don't care if SOE has given up on regaining old players, that is no excuse to alienate them.... again. Here's my point: Nobody will be charged $50 for a transfer. Anybody who ever might return to that game has done so (and probably left again). Anyone marginally interested in the game will keep tabs on what is happening. Emails are sent out. If you care anything at all about SWG, you know what is happening and you have already moved your character (or are in process). Nobody is going to pop up next year and go "Kettemoor is gone? When did that happen?" (If someone does, let me know. I'll gladly admit I'm wrong. )
The original title question is "Has any other MMO charged for transferring off a closed server?" "Other MMO" presumes SOE will charge to xfer off a closed server. It hasn't happen and it won't happen. Might as well ask "What if God and Superman had a fight?"
Especially for a company that wants to rebuild their image as one who listens to the customers and cares about anything. I am not pretending that any sizable amount of players are going to return to SWG, including myself, but that is nothing I can control. The current soe is never going to do what is needed to win back players. From their complete lack of respect to their customers, the constant money grabs - RMT - loot cards, flawed designs and on and on. They are going to continue acting in this manner until they close shop, have a major change in leadership or somehow blindly stumble on success with how they run the company. I think the type of gamer/customer generally represented on this forum (myself included) is not the customer SOE is looking for. I think that is clear. They have decided whatever "image" problem they have with "us" is not worth it to them to fix. They are looking for a different demographic and are cutting their losses with whatever "we" represent.
Lets put it this way, if blizzard was doing mergers like this every other poster on this forum would be up in arms over and it would be front page news. If Blizzard did it, how many millions would be affected? In this case, all I hear is "what if." Nobody has been charged 50 bucks.
Since it is SOE behind this, it is just more of the same from a company that people have come to expect this type of behavior from. Well, yeah. All the more reason I don't get the faux outrage. "Damn, that scorpion stung me. Mother fu-"
As for "springing" the changes, I know situations change. However other companies were up front and honest enough months in advance that they were planning on merging servers when they were needed. Funcom and Mythic for example. Smed promised to fast track server mergers years ago, but then it suddenly became "impossible" to do, even though they did it already with the Asian servers when they closed the SOE-East project. My point was that SOE knew this was coming long ago, dragged their feet when they could make extra money on paid transfers at the expense of the community and then gave the shortest notice I can recall. Which just happens to have the threat of a $50 charge for those same transfers if you don't resubscribe right now.
This isn't the first time I have gotten an email from soe that basically said "come back to swg or else".
As for how they handled the mergers. SOE needed to merge servers with design. Instead they left if open to the players and a sort of panic or rather a herd mentaility took over. Everyone rushed "the popular" server and most of the intent of the mergers was undone. Even people on the destination servers left those servers to join "the popular" server. It didn't work in warhammer so I don't know why soe thought it would work here. Addressing a problem without a solid plan is rather pointless.
Sure no one has been charged $50 yet, but it isn't beyond Oct 15th yet either. How many times have did people say "what is the NGE" or "what happened to SWG" 30 days after Nov 15th 2005? Believe it or not, everyone doesn't read forums or get emails from soe. You will see people that are caught off guard by this and soe is throwing out the baby with the bathwater here.
We both agree that people are not going to come rushing back, but some do. SOE is effectively cutting relations with everyone by doing this and it is stupid business. There is no justifiable reason to charge $50 other than to piss on former customers, including the ones who are not angry vets and still occassional players. That is how soe is though.
Faux rage. I guess it can be seen that way. I don't like the message is sending, but it is something we have come to expect and it is never a good sign from a company. Would I like to see a time that soe stops doing this, yes. I think many people here would really like to be soe customers, but there is just so much keeping people away and this is just another example of that. I don't care how far seperated a company is from its customer base, this isn't good business.
I think "springing" the server closures fits for a number of reasons:
-People were told that there would be no server mergers because (a) it wasn't possible, and (b) players didn't want it. Specifically we were told that people enjoy their more intimate servers with smaller, close-knit communities.
-We were told that the transfer servers were actually growing, and that they would soon be home to large populations again.
-If SOE was planning to give people free transfers off of specific servers, and then close them, they could have shared this information a long time ago. They didn't have to wait until shortly before implementation, and give such a limit window for free transfer.
In my view, a respectful way of doing this would have been to tell people that the populations on certain servers were simply too low for them to be maintained. Anyone wishing to transfer to a new server prior to closure could do so for free. Servers that would remain open would be identified. The dev team could then work to ensure that people could take as much as possible with them from one server to the next.
In my opinion, someone at SOE seems philosophically opposed to open and honest communication with customers. Do they think it's a losing strategy for some reason? It seems to me that the alternative hasn't worked very well.
$OE still shows that they do not care about the player base of swg rather then just want to lie and rip whomever plays the nge off for whatever they can get out of them be it with loot cards or this. anyone who supports $OE or the nge has no right to call themselfs a gamer.
oh and i have 3 friends who are taking legal action on $OE for this
In my view, a respectful way of doing this would have been to tell people that the populations on certain servers were simply too low for them to be maintained. Anyone wishing to transfer to a new server prior to closure could do so for free. Servers that would remain open would be identified. The dev team could then work to ensure that people could take as much as possible with them from one server to the next. In my opinion, someone at SOE seems philosophically opposed to open and honest communication with customers. Do they think it's a losing strategy for some reason? It seems to me that the alternative hasn't worked very well.
This is pretty much what SOE did. 9 months isn't respectful? Although, at first they didn't intend to merge the servers, just gave a free transfer to larger population servers.
Originally posted by Silvermink This is pretty much what SOE did. 9 months isn't respectful? Although, at first they didn't intend to merge the servers, just gave a free transfer to larger population servers.
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I am not sure what the complaint is. No former player - especially one on this thread - is going to go back to SWG. No body. No how. If you were going to return at any time, you would have an active account now. "I don't want to resub now, I'm waiting for . . ." What? What could you possibly be waiting for? The game is now what it will be forever. Complaints getting stuck with a $50 fee after the FCTS runs out is an empty argument. SOE knows they now have all they players they are ever going to have for the game and it is those players targeted for the transfer. Not former players, because they ain't coming. Ever. Any former player making noise they might want to come back later and it is unfair they should pay is doing just that - making noise. You will not come back., either now nor anytime after October 15th. You will not.
This.... why complain if you would never go back in the first place? I agree anyone who wants to play is at this point, therefor those targetted for this offer should know about it. Much ado about nothing...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
If Blizzard did it, how many millions would be affected? In this case, all I hear is "what if." Nobody has been charged 50 bucks.
Well, of course not, unless you have an uncanny talent for prognosticating such outcomes. (This begs the following question, however: How in the world did you honestly expect anyone to be charged the fee when it isn't even October the 15th yet? I'm VERY curious.) You're calling out everyone else for saying "what if," but you are speculating as well. Hypocritical? Also, if you think that NO ONE will be slapped with the $50.00 fee before SWG closes its doors once and for all, you must be a naive individual.
Originally posted by Silvermink This is pretty much what SOE did. 9 months isn't respectful? Although, at first they didn't intend to merge the servers, just gave a free transfer to larger population servers.
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
Whats the fuzz really? I just transferred to Starsider, and it did not cost me anything.
There was alot of people running around too, so that is also a good thing.
Keep old servers online is a bad idea if you 1st let people transfer away. The only good way is to consolidate. The smart way would be tho to keep all the old servers in stasis, like DAoC is doing. So if someone returns at some point they can still transfer away, but not play on the old server.
It did feel awkward to have to choose a profession. Besides that, damn, I got alot of veteran rewards hehe
They even want to revive my collectors edition goggles
Still I doubt I will keep playing, it is just not the same.
If you are interested in subscription or PCU numbers for MMORPG's, check out my site : http://mmodata.blogspot.be/ Favorite MMORPG's : DAoC pre ToA-NF, SWG Pre CU-NGE, EVE Online
Originally posted by Silvermink This is pretty much what SOE did. 9 months isn't respectful? Although, at first they didn't intend to merge the servers, just gave a free transfer to larger population servers.
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
So, they expected people to transfer from those servers for free, and that they would still have viable populations?
So they identified specific servers to essentially empty, and yet all along had no plans to close them down?
Do you remember when we were told that the NGE information was not intentionally withheld from players? How about the line from Rubenfield that he found out about the NGE at the same time as the players? LOL.
What this looks like to me is players being strung along with bad information: SOE saying one thing, and again doing the exact opposite. And some people still wonder why so many of us won't pay SOE for gameplay in advance. Quite simply, we seem to have no clue what it is we are actually paying for. Believe it or not, I think customers like getting reliable information about a service they might choose to subscribe to.
All debating aside, here's a very simple question:
Why put a time-limit on the free tranfers from servers being shut down? Since the servers will cease to exist, and people's characters will be stored (so I'm told), why don't all characters get a free transfer whenever they log back in and find their server is gone?
All debating aside, here's a very simple question: Why put a time-limit on the free tranfers from servers being shut down? Since the servers will cease to exist, and people's characters will be stored (so I'm told), why don't all characters get a free transfer whenever they log back in and find their server is gone?
That is a good question. If SOE had any business sense - which they seldom demonstrate - they would leave that option open as a onetime event for every account. My gut feeling is they are not saving the data from the closed servers and moving resources to other games. I also think SOE is finally breaking from the past and giving up on ever getting vets to return.
Kinda like cleaning out the garage of all those old vinyl records I swore I'd transfer to CD, but 20+ years later I finally realize I never will - So off to GoodWill.
You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
Um...sure. Like what color shirt I was going to wear or what I was going to do for dinner...but never something of this magnitude...and I would certainly never do it without doing everything possible to ensure that any customer that might want to return COULD with as little effort as possible.
And while I'd like to give SoE the benefit of the doubt, I have this little thing called a "memory". Unlike many people, I won't forget how many lies they've fed us and even told ABOUT some of us. Forgive me for being skeptical, but it's not without merit.
Originally posted by Silvermink You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
Do you really think SOE was not planning to merge servers all this time and had a sudden revelation that OMG the servers really are empty and only now mergers were a viable option?
Projects like this have plans that span years. John Smedley promissed server mergers several years ago at fan faire. The devs tried to create tools to resolve the population issues. The free transfers were a prelude to mergers.
This isn't something they had no idea was coming. For heavens sake Smedley is already talking about the possibilty of sunsetting the game when bioware releases the old republic and that isn't happening for who knows how long.
Why was it kept from players for so long?
Why, for so long did soe say they had no plans to merge servers?
What possible good can charging a returning player $50 additional dollars do for the health of a game? That is effectively saying they don't want any customer who quit the game before October 15th 2009.
This should just be another case of a company merger servers to keep a game healthy, but it has that special brand of soe stink all over it.
Originally posted by Daffid011 What possible good can charging a returning player $50 additional dollars do for the health of a game? That is effectively saying they don't want any customer who quit the game before October 15th 2009.
THIS!!!
BAH! Why the hell didn't you start with that line? You summed up in 18 words what I couldn't do in 18,000. Nice
Originally posted by Daffid011 What possible good can charging a returning player $50 additional dollars do for the health of a game? That is effectively saying they don't want any customer who quit the game before October 15th 2009.
THIS!!!
BAH! Why the hell didn't you start with that line? You summed up in 18 words what I couldn't do in 18,000. Nice
This whole issue is simply amazing. SOE is again doing something that will further alienate customers. Again money is at the root of the issue. Still people rush to defend the actions of soe as if it is somehow the fault of the players. Simply amazing.
What kind of company puts such a bullshit barrier in place to people who want to be their customers?
Someone above called it a stupid tax on returning players and I think they are right, but not how they thought it works. Instead it is more like a stupidity entrance exam. You may only play SWG again if you re willing to pay far more than the game is worth and are willing to overpay for content through the new loot card lottery system.
I don't care how people want to rationalize this, it is a bullshit move for a company to do.
Originally posted by tman5 SOE is finally admitting they will never get the vets to return (in any substantial number). They are giving up in trying.
Nope. They know that SWG is like crack to some people and this is a last ditch effort to make money. There are undoubtedly former players ("hold outs") who have expressed a desire to avoid SWG until the GCW Update. It's obvious (to me) that this is an effort to get more money from them now or later. $15 to transfer now or $50 to hold out and hear the real reviews on the Update...either way, SoE wins.
The GCW Update is one of the few things that could have saved the game and one of the few features that WILL draw players back. The allure of a Neutral player being able to go fight for either or against either faction is powerful. They'll market it in a way that it will sound like a kick ass feature and the people who WANT to believe, will. And they'll fork over $50...
Had SoE devoted even a fraction of the time to the GCW that they did to profession revamps, Heroics, Hoth, parties, Battle Grounds and Chronicles, the game would NOT be in the shape it is. The WAR should have been the reason to run Hoth...not tokens. Instead of a meaningful "faction" system with multiple options, we got phat lewt from the TCG.
So...while you think they are giving up on Vets, I disagree. It looks to me like they're going for every last cent they can make off of them.
Well...
First off just wanna say I appreciate what you did as a volunteer over there...All respect due and such.../deepbow
Granted the GCW needed a re-vamp...No question about it...But it was not going to be the be-all, end all that you invision because with all due respect you see the game through PvP colored glasses...I played on Your Server since the beginning of the CU...I was a Council Member and Co-Founder of what became the largest Reb Guild on Flurry during the NGE (You know...that "Carebear/City Building" Guild...lol)...What killed SWG for Me, My Guild and My close Friends was not necessarily the lack of GCW content...Especially because the GCW had become nothing more than a code-name for PvP...What killed the Game for Me and My Guild was the lack of new end Game content like Hoth and the Instances along with SWG's absolute LOVE for taking earned things AWAY from us in game...We LOVED Hoth when it came out (dispite the bugs)...Ran multiple Groups daily...One of Our Council Members became know Server wide for His Hoth runs...No one I talked to daily seemed too concerned with Hoth's relevance to the War, infact most Folks in My Guild LOVED the fact they were getting decent GCW by running a PvE Instance...The tokens got them items they desired at the time...But that only lasts for a while...On a Game like LOTRO (and others) they are coming out with new and exciting Instances monthly...On SWG it's one a Year if we were lucky...Then finally they did the 90-Day Pack up garbage and that was that...They lost the PvE crowd by the masses (that's the casual crowd that keeps the gears moving and keeps the cash flowing...ie the non-vocal majority) because we were tired of having things taken away from us dating back to to the NGE, through the 1st GCW (that's right, I had not one but two Colonels stripped of their Ranks and returned to Private because according to SWG I could have purchased Faction from a Smuggler to Rank-up in a Day or two...That of coarse was a shock to me and just about everyone I knew...Basically I was told those countless, and I mean countless hours grinding Faction were all for nothing...notta...zip...That REALLY pissed a lot of Folks off...but I digress), and up until now...Plus we just got bored...we wanted more Heroics and End-Game content that was simply not coming any time soon if at all...
Not enough new and exciting STAR WARS PvE content, taking away Our Cities through that rediculous pack-up that in some cases (like my City on Talus) were more than 3 Years Old, and Zombies???? Those are the reasons I heard for Folks quitting for good...Sure they would have liked a GCW re-vamp that saw some meaningful PvE content...But that was only a piece of the puzzle...Not the main solution...
I remember how so many players advised SOE not to reset all the GCW ranks to zero with the new system. Of course people were pissed off. People are always pissed off when you wipe something out overnight that they have worked on for any length of time. This happened at a time when SOE was on a "we have learned from our mistakes and are now listening to our customers" kick too, if memory serves.
Repeatedly wiping out player progress in the game (professions, pets, jedi unlocks, crafting businesses, GCW rank) has been a recurring problem that I strongly agree does little more than alienate customers.
They always seemed to think that alienating customers would bring in more customers too. What, do they think we don't talk to each other? Do they think people don't watch how a company operates before handing them their Visa number?
You've also highlighted the lag in content development and how this has impacted long-time players. This is one reason I listed "lack of expansions" as one sign that the game isn't a healthy as it could be imo. People subscribing to a service want new, enjoyable and functional (have to throw that in for SOE) content for their money, in my experience.
I remember how so many players advised SOE not to reset all the GCW ranks to zero with the new system. Of course people were pissed off. People are always pissed off when you wipe something out overnight that they have worked on for any length of time. This happened at a time when SOE was on a "we have learned from our mistakes and are now listening to our customers" kick too, if memory serves. Repeatedly wiping out player progress in the game (professions, pets, jedi unlocks, crafting businesses, GCW rank) has been a recurring problem that I strongly agree does little more than alienate customers. They always seemed to think that alienating customers would bring in more customers too. What, do they think we don't talk to each other? Do they think people don't watch how a company operates before handing them their Visa number? You've also highlighted the lag in content development and how this has impacted long-time players. This is one reason I listed "lack of expansions" as one sign that the game isn't a healthy as it could be imo. People subscribing to a service want new, enjoyable and functional (have to throw that in for SOE) content for their money, in my experience.
Originally posted by KyngBills Well... First off just wanna say I appreciate what you did as a volunteer over there...All respect due and such.../deepbow Granted the GCW needed a re-vamp...No question about it...But it was not going to be the be-all, end all that you invision because with all due respect you see the game through PvP colored glasses...I played on Your Server since the beginning of the CU...I was a Council Member and Co-Founder of what became the largest Reb Guild on Flurry during the NGE (You know...that "Carebear/City Building" Guild...lol)...What killed SWG for Me, My Guild and My close Friends was not necessarily the lack of GCW content...Especially because the GCW had become nothing more than a code-name for PvP...What killed the Game for Me and My Guild was the lack of new end Game content like Hoth and the Instances along with SWG's absolute LOVE for taking earned things AWAY from us in game...We LOVED Hoth when it came out (dispite the bugs)...Ran multiple Groups daily...One of Our Council Members became know Server wide for His Hoth runs...No one I talked to daily seemed too concerned with Hoth's relevance to the War, infact most Folks in My Guild LOVED the fact they were getting decent GCW by running a PvE Instance...The tokens got them items they desired at the time...But that only lasts for a while...On a Game like LOTRO (and others) they are coming out with new and exciting Instances monthly...On SWG it's one a Year if we were lucky...Then finally they did the 90-Day Pack up garbage and that was that...They lost the PvE crowd by the masses (that's the casual crowd that keeps the gears moving and keeps the cash flowing...ie the non-vocal majority) because we were tired of having things taken away from us dating back to to the NGE, through the 1st GCW (that's right, I had not one but two Colonels stripped of their Ranks and returned to Private because according to SWG I could have purchased Faction from a Smuggler to Rank-up in a Day or two...That of coarse was a shock to me and just about everyone I knew...Basically I was told those countless, and I mean countless hours grinding Faction were all for nothing...notta...zip...That REALLY pissed a lot of Folks off...but I digress), and up until now...Plus we just got bored...we wanted more Heroics and End-Game content that was simply not coming any time soon if at all... Not enough new and exciting STAR WARS PvE content, taking away Our Cities through that rediculous pack-up that in some cases (like my City on Talus) were more than 3 Years Old, and Zombies???? Those are the reasons I heard for Folks quitting for good...Sure they would have liked a GCW re-vamp that saw some meaningful PvE content...But that was only a piece of the puzzle...Not the main solution... Just saying...
Kill All Imps huh?!?
Hey, your guild never got flamed by me mate. I didn't like the arrogance some of the members had, especially during the server transfers, but for the few a-holes that were vocal posters, you also had some unbelievably generous mayors who did offer their cities and overall, you had a very solid guild with some fantastic people!
Let me dispel your view of me first...I was NOT just a "PvP" monger as so many assume. True, I enjoyed PvP immensely and I did my best to represent PvPers during the PvP Update (fail!). PvP was the only truly dynamic combat SWG had. The only system where more than 8 players could "group" and do it together (until BF's ruined even that). The only activity that didn't have a "system" to beat it and the only activity where I really didn't know what I'd be facing each and every night (until BF's ruined that). The challenge of PvP was what drove ME to enjoy it.
For as vocal as I was about the PvP Update, I would have been equally, or MORE, vocal for the GCW Update. When I said the GCW needed to be the FOCUS, I meant for the GAME! Don't confuse GCW as being PvP...GCW is the Galactic Civil War...Imps vs Rebs. As a Rebel Mayor, you should have had the right to refuse Imperial usage of your shuttle port and vendors. If the planet fell under Imperial control, there should have been a "penalty" for your disloyalty to the Empire. While under Rebel control, you could have been granted a vendor in the NPC cities. There needed to be "perks" to you for being on the controlling side...and a penalty for being on the losing side. When I say "GCW", I really do mean a game wide system...not just PvP.
You mentioned how your guild loved Hoth because of the easy GCW points...SoE never realized how much those points worked. GCW points were the voluntary grind of the NGE - the "repeatable" content that so many want. Pilots, PvPers, Crafters, PvEers, Base Clubbers...they ALL wanted and had some interest in GCW points. SoE had a working system...but they squandered it. Rather than expanding the system to include ALL playstyles, they stuck by their thinking that "GCW points should come primarily from PvP".
The pace at which they're currently "developing" is sick. Hoth took 9 months, after Hoth, they began work on "the next big system" they said (verifiable in Producer Note)...that has taken a YEAR to release and isn't even finished. No rewards on TC yet, no space aspect, no ability to share, just another long ass boring grind added to the game. WTF!?!?!?! A YEAR?! To develop what is essentially a Storyteller update?! HOLY BUCKETS! When I read that Chronicles was in development since the release Hoth it made me laugh. ONE YEAR to develop Chronicles...ONE year. Wow...
So...while you may think I advocated just PvP, I assure you, that was not the case. GCW needed to include Entertainers, Crafters, Pilots, Politicians, Combat toons...everyone! Had the GCW been the main mini-game of SWG from the start, I highly doubt they would need to close 12 servers.
Comments
Hah, SWG is not jedi centric now, right? I actually resubbed about 3 months ago, I think I lasted about a week before I ran out of fun. It was really nothing more then Jedi and Spies.
Anyways, I think you will be pretty wrong, I usually play mlee classes in MMOs, so far "all" the ranged classes shown in ToR seem more appealing then Jedi/Sith. There was actually a thread about a month back on the ToR forums, lots of people felt the same.
There's a "healthy" amount of Jedi, but there's a healthy amount of non-jedi. I encounter more non-Jedi then I do Jedi...
The number of jedi running around during this timeline beyond Luke, Yoda, Vadar and the emperor is not healthy. Also considering as the number of jedi increased in swg, the player population declined. I must disagree with your definition of healthy. Just as I disgree with your definition of successful.
It is funny how you demand proof of even the most obvious situations in swg or soe, but you have little problem making unsubstantiated claims about bioware and their star wars mmo without missing a beat.
People cannot say soe is on the decline, even when the company has closed more than half of their total game servers across their mmo division, but you can make claims about a game that has not been released yet and you have never played.
Very nice.
For the record, I don't like the Jedi profession (hence why I don't play it, nor did I persue it during the pre-nge days) and I despise the Spy profession (for the others who mentioned it).
As for the claim of TOR being Jedi centric, indeed, it is just my opinion. My opinion that is based on the the previous two KOTOR games, the fancy game trailer that they did for TOR featuring a stack of Jedi and the majority of their screenshots and what not of the game as a whole featuring Jedi. You're perfectly within your right to reject my opinion, just as I was yours
So your opinion is based off of KoTOR, a Single Player RPG where you had no other option then to play Jedi . You also probably arn't thinking about the many charactes you encountered in KoTOR, which actually made the game far more enjoyable then playing a Jedi, Canderous Ordo being my favorite. Given the option, you don't believe players would have chose something other then Jedi, if it had a deep story behind it, like ToR will? And to add on top of that, most of the screen shots feature Jedi and Sith because it was the first classes to be known to ToR. After that it was Bounty Hunter which got a good amount of Screen Shots to follow it's announcment and the same for every class since then. The only reason you see more Light Sabers currently is because Sith Warrior was announced, and like I said before, screen shots follow the announcment. And just from glancing at the screen shots, most of them are scenery such as cities and creatures you encounter.
So your opinion is based off of KoTOR, a Single Player RPG where you had no other option then to play Jedi . You also probably arn't thinking about the many charactes you encountered in KoTOR, which actually made the game far more enjoyable then playing a Jedi, Canderous Ordo being my favorite. Given the option, you don't believe players would have chose something other then Jedi, if it had a deep story behind it, like ToR will? And to add on top of that, most of the screen shots feature Jedi and Sith because it was the first classes to be known to ToR. After that it was Bounty Hunter which got a good amount of Screen Shots to follow it's announcment and the same for every class since then. The only reason you see more Light Sabers currently is because Sith Warrior was announced, and like I said before, screen shots follow the announcment. And just from glancing at the screen shots, most of them are scenery such as cities and creatures you encounter.
Then I look forward to being pleasently surprised when TOR launches.
As for "springing" the changes, I know situations change. However other companies were up front and honest enough months in advance that they were planning on merging servers when they were needed. Funcom and Mythic for example. Smed promised to fast track server mergers years ago, but then it suddenly became "impossible" to do, even though they did it already with the Asian servers when they closed the SOE-East project. My point was that SOE knew this was coming long ago, dragged their feet when they could make extra money on paid transfers at the expense of the community and then gave the shortest notice I can recall. Which just happens to have the threat of a $50 charge for those same transfers if you don't resubscribe right now.
This isn't the first time I have gotten an email from soe that basically said "come back to swg or else".
As for how they handled the mergers. SOE needed to merge servers with design. Instead they left if open to the players and a sort of panic or rather a herd mentaility took over. Everyone rushed "the popular" server and most of the intent of the mergers was undone. Even people on the destination servers left those servers to join "the popular" server. It didn't work in warhammer so I don't know why soe thought it would work here. Addressing a problem without a solid plan is rather pointless.
Sure no one has been charged $50 yet, but it isn't beyond Oct 15th yet either. How many times have did people say "what is the NGE" or "what happened to SWG" 30 days after Nov 15th 2005? Believe it or not, everyone doesn't read forums or get emails from soe. You will see people that are caught off guard by this and soe is throwing out the baby with the bathwater here.
We both agree that people are not going to come rushing back, but some do. SOE is effectively cutting relations with everyone by doing this and it is stupid business. There is no justifiable reason to charge $50 other than to piss on former customers, including the ones who are not angry vets and still occassional players. That is how soe is though.
Faux rage. I guess it can be seen that way. I don't like the message is sending, but it is something we have come to expect and it is never a good sign from a company. Would I like to see a time that soe stops doing this, yes. I think many people here would really like to be soe customers, but there is just so much keeping people away and this is just another example of that. I don't care how far seperated a company is from its customer base, this isn't good business.
I think "springing" the server closures fits for a number of reasons:
-People were told that there would be no server mergers because (a) it wasn't possible, and (b) players didn't want it. Specifically we were told that people enjoy their more intimate servers with smaller, close-knit communities.
-We were told that the transfer servers were actually growing, and that they would soon be home to large populations again.
-If SOE was planning to give people free transfers off of specific servers, and then close them, they could have shared this information a long time ago. They didn't have to wait until shortly before implementation, and give such a limit window for free transfer.
In my view, a respectful way of doing this would have been to tell people that the populations on certain servers were simply too low for them to be maintained. Anyone wishing to transfer to a new server prior to closure could do so for free. Servers that would remain open would be identified. The dev team could then work to ensure that people could take as much as possible with them from one server to the next.
In my opinion, someone at SOE seems philosophically opposed to open and honest communication with customers. Do they think it's a losing strategy for some reason? It seems to me that the alternative hasn't worked very well.
it is clear
$OE still shows that they do not care about the player base of swg rather then just want to lie and rip whomever plays the nge off for whatever they can get out of them be it with loot cards or this. anyone who supports $OE or the nge has no right to call themselfs a gamer.
oh and i have 3 friends who are taking legal action on $OE for this
This is pretty much what SOE did. 9 months isn't respectful? Although, at first they didn't intend to merge the servers, just gave a free transfer to larger population servers.
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
This.... why complain if you would never go back in the first place? I agree anyone who wants to play is at this point, therefor those targetted for this offer should know about it. Much ado about nothing...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
Whats the fuzz really? I just transferred to Starsider, and it did not cost me anything.
There was alot of people running around too, so that is also a good thing.
Keep old servers online is a bad idea if you 1st let people transfer away. The only good way is to consolidate. The smart way would be tho to keep all the old servers in stasis, like DAoC is doing. So if someone returns at some point they can still transfer away, but not play on the old server.
It did feel awkward to have to choose a profession. Besides that, damn, I got alot of veteran rewards hehe
They even want to revive my collectors edition goggles
Still I doubt I will keep playing, it is just not the same.
If you are interested in subscription or PCU numbers for MMORPG's, check out my site :
http://mmodata.blogspot.be/
Favorite MMORPG's : DAoC pre ToA-NF, SWG Pre CU-NGE, EVE Online
You're missing the point...sure, they offered free transfers, BUT...<---- That is a HUGE BUT...BUT...they said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS. That is key to this.
That is why people are upset. SoE said they had NO INTENTION of doing what they're doing next month. For 8-1/2 months they maintained that they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
People like Badger went out and busted his ass to rebuild his server. Was it Starsider? No...but the people who did stay, were quite happy because they were told that SoE had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS...so they went about their playing. Fallen Earth is the hot new post apocalyptic MMO, but SoE beat them to it tbh.
Some players even started new accounts to help rebuild the community, often letting another lapse so they could help rebuild. And all that time, SoE said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
I've seen people say it was "obviously going to happen"...well, it's great that these people were right and knew all along...but the reality is, NOBODY really "knew"...nobody but SoE...and THEY said they had NO INTENTION OF CLOSING THE TRANSFER FROM SERVERS.
You've never changed your mind? SoE saw how few people were left on those servers and decided it was more cost effective to close the servers. I doubt they said they aren't going to close them knowing they would later. Circumstances changed and SOE made a new decision.
So, they expected people to transfer from those servers for free, and that they would still have viable populations?
So they identified specific servers to essentially empty, and yet all along had no plans to close them down?
Do you remember when we were told that the NGE information was not intentionally withheld from players? How about the line from Rubenfield that he found out about the NGE at the same time as the players? LOL.
What this looks like to me is players being strung along with bad information: SOE saying one thing, and again doing the exact opposite. And some people still wonder why so many of us won't pay SOE for gameplay in advance. Quite simply, we seem to have no clue what it is we are actually paying for. Believe it or not, I think customers like getting reliable information about a service they might choose to subscribe to.
All debating aside, here's a very simple question:
Why put a time-limit on the free tranfers from servers being shut down? Since the servers will cease to exist, and people's characters will be stored (so I'm told), why don't all characters get a free transfer whenever they log back in and find their server is gone?
That is a good question. If SOE had any business sense - which they seldom demonstrate - they would leave that option open as a onetime event for every account. My gut feeling is they are not saving the data from the closed servers and moving resources to other games. I also think SOE is finally breaking from the past and giving up on ever getting vets to return.
Kinda like cleaning out the garage of all those old vinyl records I swore I'd transfer to CD, but 20+ years later I finally realize I never will - So off to GoodWill.
SOE is about as trustworthy as that drug dealer on the corner who wears a mask.
This is not new information.
Um...sure. Like what color shirt I was going to wear or what I was going to do for dinner...but never something of this magnitude...and I would certainly never do it without doing everything possible to ensure that any customer that might want to return COULD with as little effort as possible.
And while I'd like to give SoE the benefit of the doubt, I have this little thing called a "memory". Unlike many people, I won't forget how many lies they've fed us and even told ABOUT some of us. Forgive me for being skeptical, but it's not without merit.
Do you really think SOE was not planning to merge servers all this time and had a sudden revelation that OMG the servers really are empty and only now mergers were a viable option?
Projects like this have plans that span years. John Smedley promissed server mergers several years ago at fan faire. The devs tried to create tools to resolve the population issues. The free transfers were a prelude to mergers.
This isn't something they had no idea was coming. For heavens sake Smedley is already talking about the possibilty of sunsetting the game when bioware releases the old republic and that isn't happening for who knows how long.
Why was it kept from players for so long?
Why, for so long did soe say they had no plans to merge servers?
What possible good can charging a returning player $50 additional dollars do for the health of a game? That is effectively saying they don't want any customer who quit the game before October 15th 2009.
This should just be another case of a company merger servers to keep a game healthy, but it has that special brand of soe stink all over it.
THIS!!!
BAH! Why the hell didn't you start with that line? You summed up in 18 words what I couldn't do in 18,000. Nice
THIS!!!
BAH! Why the hell didn't you start with that line? You summed up in 18 words what I couldn't do in 18,000. Nice
This whole issue is simply amazing. SOE is again doing something that will further alienate customers. Again money is at the root of the issue. Still people rush to defend the actions of soe as if it is somehow the fault of the players. Simply amazing.
What kind of company puts such a bullshit barrier in place to people who want to be their customers?
Someone above called it a stupid tax on returning players and I think they are right, but not how they thought it works. Instead it is more like a stupidity entrance exam. You may only play SWG again if you re willing to pay far more than the game is worth and are willing to overpay for content through the new loot card lottery system.
I don't care how people want to rationalize this, it is a bullshit move for a company to do.
Nope. They know that SWG is like crack to some people and this is a last ditch effort to make money. There are undoubtedly former players ("hold outs") who have expressed a desire to avoid SWG until the GCW Update. It's obvious (to me) that this is an effort to get more money from them now or later. $15 to transfer now or $50 to hold out and hear the real reviews on the Update...either way, SoE wins.
The GCW Update is one of the few things that could have saved the game and one of the few features that WILL draw players back. The allure of a Neutral player being able to go fight for either or against either faction is powerful. They'll market it in a way that it will sound like a kick ass feature and the people who WANT to believe, will. And they'll fork over $50...
Had SoE devoted even a fraction of the time to the GCW that they did to profession revamps, Heroics, Hoth, parties, Battle Grounds and Chronicles, the game would NOT be in the shape it is. The WAR should have been the reason to run Hoth...not tokens. Instead of a meaningful "faction" system with multiple options, we got phat lewt from the TCG.
So...while you think they are giving up on Vets, I disagree. It looks to me like they're going for every last cent they can make off of them.
Well...
First off just wanna say I appreciate what you did as a volunteer over there...All respect due and such.../deepbow
Granted the GCW needed a re-vamp...No question about it...But it was not going to be the be-all, end all that you invision because with all due respect you see the game through PvP colored glasses...I played on Your Server since the beginning of the CU...I was a Council Member and Co-Founder of what became the largest Reb Guild on Flurry during the NGE (You know...that "Carebear/City Building" Guild...lol)...What killed SWG for Me, My Guild and My close Friends was not necessarily the lack of GCW content...Especially because the GCW had become nothing more than a code-name for PvP...What killed the Game for Me and My Guild was the lack of new end Game content like Hoth and the Instances along with SWG's absolute LOVE for taking earned things AWAY from us in game...We LOVED Hoth when it came out (dispite the bugs)...Ran multiple Groups daily...One of Our Council Members became know Server wide for His Hoth runs...No one I talked to daily seemed too concerned with Hoth's relevance to the War, infact most Folks in My Guild LOVED the fact they were getting decent GCW by running a PvE Instance...The tokens got them items they desired at the time...But that only lasts for a while...On a Game like LOTRO (and others) they are coming out with new and exciting Instances monthly...On SWG it's one a Year if we were lucky...Then finally they did the 90-Day Pack up garbage and that was that...They lost the PvE crowd by the masses (that's the casual crowd that keeps the gears moving and keeps the cash flowing...ie the non-vocal majority) because we were tired of having things taken away from us dating back to to the NGE, through the 1st GCW (that's right, I had not one but two Colonels stripped of their Ranks and returned to Private because according to SWG I could have purchased Faction from a Smuggler to Rank-up in a Day or two...That of coarse was a shock to me and just about everyone I knew...Basically I was told those countless, and I mean countless hours grinding Faction were all for nothing...notta...zip...That REALLY pissed a lot of Folks off...but I digress), and up until now...Plus we just got bored...we wanted more Heroics and End-Game content that was simply not coming any time soon if at all...
Not enough new and exciting STAR WARS PvE content, taking away Our Cities through that rediculous pack-up that in some cases (like my City on Talus) were more than 3 Years Old, and Zombies???? Those are the reasons I heard for Folks quitting for good...Sure they would have liked a GCW re-vamp that saw some meaningful PvE content...But that was only a piece of the puzzle...Not the main solution...
Just saying...
I remember how so many players advised SOE not to reset all the GCW ranks to zero with the new system. Of course people were pissed off. People are always pissed off when you wipe something out overnight that they have worked on for any length of time. This happened at a time when SOE was on a "we have learned from our mistakes and are now listening to our customers" kick too, if memory serves.
Repeatedly wiping out player progress in the game (professions, pets, jedi unlocks, crafting businesses, GCW rank) has been a recurring problem that I strongly agree does little more than alienate customers.
They always seemed to think that alienating customers would bring in more customers too. What, do they think we don't talk to each other? Do they think people don't watch how a company operates before handing them their Visa number?
You've also highlighted the lag in content development and how this has impacted long-time players. This is one reason I listed "lack of expansions" as one sign that the game isn't a healthy as it could be imo. People subscribing to a service want new, enjoyable and functional (have to throw that in for SOE) content for their money, in my experience.
Agreed 100%!
Kill All Imps huh?!?
Hey, your guild never got flamed by me mate. I didn't like the arrogance some of the members had, especially during the server transfers, but for the few a-holes that were vocal posters, you also had some unbelievably generous mayors who did offer their cities and overall, you had a very solid guild with some fantastic people!
Let me dispel your view of me first...I was NOT just a "PvP" monger as so many assume. True, I enjoyed PvP immensely and I did my best to represent PvPers during the PvP Update (fail!). PvP was the only truly dynamic combat SWG had. The only system where more than 8 players could "group" and do it together (until BF's ruined even that). The only activity that didn't have a "system" to beat it and the only activity where I really didn't know what I'd be facing each and every night (until BF's ruined that). The challenge of PvP was what drove ME to enjoy it.
For as vocal as I was about the PvP Update, I would have been equally, or MORE, vocal for the GCW Update. When I said the GCW needed to be the FOCUS, I meant for the GAME! Don't confuse GCW as being PvP...GCW is the Galactic Civil War...Imps vs Rebs. As a Rebel Mayor, you should have had the right to refuse Imperial usage of your shuttle port and vendors. If the planet fell under Imperial control, there should have been a "penalty" for your disloyalty to the Empire. While under Rebel control, you could have been granted a vendor in the NPC cities. There needed to be "perks" to you for being on the controlling side...and a penalty for being on the losing side. When I say "GCW", I really do mean a game wide system...not just PvP.
You mentioned how your guild loved Hoth because of the easy GCW points...SoE never realized how much those points worked. GCW points were the voluntary grind of the NGE - the "repeatable" content that so many want. Pilots, PvPers, Crafters, PvEers, Base Clubbers...they ALL wanted and had some interest in GCW points. SoE had a working system...but they squandered it. Rather than expanding the system to include ALL playstyles, they stuck by their thinking that "GCW points should come primarily from PvP".
The pace at which they're currently "developing" is sick. Hoth took 9 months, after Hoth, they began work on "the next big system" they said (verifiable in Producer Note)...that has taken a YEAR to release and isn't even finished. No rewards on TC yet, no space aspect, no ability to share, just another long ass boring grind added to the game. WTF!?!?!?! A YEAR?! To develop what is essentially a Storyteller update?! HOLY BUCKETS! When I read that Chronicles was in development since the release Hoth it made me laugh. ONE YEAR to develop Chronicles...ONE year. Wow...
So...while you may think I advocated just PvP, I assure you, that was not the case. GCW needed to include Entertainers, Crafters, Pilots, Politicians, Combat toons...everyone! Had the GCW been the main mini-game of SWG from the start, I highly doubt they would need to close 12 servers.