As excited as Bioware are, and I can say they have a good right to be, they aren't really selling things very well with the people they are putting up on the videos.
The first guy on the video seemed...well....smug and full of cr*p to me. He was wayyyy overselling the product, and if there is one thing that we're steadily getting tired of, it's overselling products that are still over a year away. Is anyone out there not sick of Peter Molyneux and his constant b*llsh*t about his upcoming games?
Bioware have always had a steady reputation for good, innovative games with fantastic settings and storylines. The buildup so far has been pretty good, but this video just reeked of 'we are so awesome' instead of 'hey everyone! here's what we've been working on, what do you think? should we change anything? what do our fans think?'.
I know there'll be people responding with 'they're wayyyy too far into development to be bothered with changing how things are going to be' but that's just not true in an MMORPG. CoX are a perfect example of what happens over time as you listen to your fans, and the fans keep staying, and coming back.
Anyway, combat seemed a bit samey, but graphically pretty cool, if lacking much visibly on the teamwork side (what we saw wasn't teamwork - teamwork involves teams working together to be stronger than they are individually, not just shooting at the same target). The graphics have been deliberately designed to be constant so the game doesn't visibly age as better graphics cards come out. The cutscene was the same as we've already seen in previous videos, and it seemed ok, but they keep saying 'this will affect how things happen later' but they don't give a single example. Voiceover work is a huge operation, but not technically difficult. Will I be able to jump past the cutscenes? What happens if my teammate has already done that quest...do I have to sit through it again? Who makes the decisions? What about companion characters - I didn't see any input from them.
Well it sure beets SWG. From what I saw the interface is a bit clunky, that I think is due to the fact they actually made it KOTR like for consoles and for PC's alike. This was a mistake the valve made when they had servers for both CS for pc and console. The console was never as good as the PC.
I am not sure how the clunky controls are going to work in an mmorpg envoronment with groups, what I saw was more a solo with hired NPC's to help. Having clunky controls on the fly for stuff is going to make combat interesting for groups.
however it is still very interesting, and gave me hope that something might be close at hand.
It might not be eq2, or lotro. But its giong to be new, and something different.
Right now I need somethng different that the wow type killers like Lotro and others. Lotro has lost its shine and its way. The other MMO"s are getting stale. Im all for new and different, and not wow like in any aspect.
*Shrugs* That's all I'd need to say that FF14 isn't fully voiced and that Bioware isn't making an incorrect claim. Besides, considering the player character IS the most important character to the player having it fully voiced is something of a big deal.
Looks like both games have an advantage over the other now, then. TOR voices the player characters, FFXIV voices all but the player characters in 4-5 different languages.
Compared to what SE is doing Bioware's hard work seems quite laughable though.
So you speak all 4 different langauges then? What's that now? You don't?
Besides, TOR is going to have FAR more dialouge then FF14. It actually has branching conversations unlike SE games. So we're back to Bioware doing more work and you failing to push your FF14-Fapping Agenda in a SWTOR thread.. Yarp. World is back to it's original position.
I have to say that I am excited and hopeful that this game will turn out to be everything I am hoping for. I am an older MMO player (41 years old) and I saw Star Wars in 1977 in the theater and have been hooked on it ever since.
I must say that I prefer a more realistic looking game over the cartoon-ish look (stylized realism) but I think it is something that I can deal with. I am not too worried about the animations, character models, walking, etc. just yet as the game is still far off from release. I am sure there is a lot of polish that still needs to be done and hopefully these concerns that people posting here have about these issues will be fixed prior to release.
Some of the things that I am concerned about though is the longevity of the game. If it is all story driven taking you from level 1 all the way to max level with a deep story .. then what do you do when the story is over? Is it going to be something to keep me playing and paying each month? Lucky for me I have 8 characters and 8 stories to try out, but other people are only interested in 1 class and that is it. I always have tons of alts in MMO's but I would just hate to see the game do really well the first few months and then have a mass exoduse after people are done their story and there is nothing left to do.
I am also afraid that there wont be enough options or skills available to make one Sith Warrior seem different from another Sith Warrior standing right next to him. Cookie cutter classes are not the way of the future, at least I hope not. People want options and they want to be different then all the other people playing their class and are their level.
Another thing that I was afraid would happen (and I can see that I was right) is the fact that if you hit someone in the chest with a Lightsaber (a laser sword) its going to cut off something. Arms will fly, legs, etc. I know its a fantasy world and its not supposed to be realistic but during these fight scenes they were hitting mobs 4 or more times before they would die. I know there has to be a game balance and whatnot but when Luke got hit by Vaders blade, he lost his hand. Certainly, if he were to get hit 4 or more times in the chest (as in the demo video) he wouldn't have survived. The movies were all about the epic sword battle, dodging and blocking and then whoever would win would get that ONE shot in to end the fight. Certainly not get hit 4 or more times in the chest. I'm not sure how this could be worked out in the game to make it more realistic but it looks like they have taken some efforts in this area. At least it doesn't take 20 hits to kill a mob (like in most of the other games out there.) I can live with 4 rather then 20, but it still doesn't seem all that realistic to me. Also, in the video the PC's were shooting burst fire and sometimes automatic fire with pistols. I could see this with a laser rifle, but to me, I just don't see a blaster pistol shooting 4 or 5 shot bursts. Han would shoot 1 or 2 shots while running away or trying to find cover, not fire off 5 shots of automatic or burst fire from his pistol. With this being the case, how will a heavy laser rifle being weilded by a Trooper seem much different, if a little blaster pistol can shoot off that many rounds?
I would love to see some space combat since this is Star Wars .. I hope this will be in at launch.
I am really excited about the game and keep watching the same video's over and over. I am getting all wrapped up in it and cant wait till it comes out. I love Bioware games, I just hope they make this game so that people will have a reason to stay around for more then a few months.
Wow, this thread eats away at the brain. Though the game looked like an iteration of kotor & mass effect, It looked very good (as those games did in the past). I'm excited at a prospect of taking old games, and making them larger, bigger, with more people. Again people want to bash devs for reusing things THAT WERE FUN, MADE MONEY, AND WORK and expand on them. As for if this will be an MMO? Is it massive, mulitplayer, and online? Really...that argument is hilarious. But why not off a pre alpha assume everything is an instance, every decision must be multiplayer-related, and that the game is all done in cut scenes...because of course logic demands it.
As for FFXIV comparisons, the games are taking 2 entirely different paths...beyond them being MMOs thats their only similarity. I will try both, and both have a variety of strengths and styles - in line with how the developers have worked in the past. Never seeks to amaze me how bashing good games or developers to prove a point will always be the first attempt at poor logic...ugh
And I really hope people are not seriously thinking that a gameplay pre-alpha demo's difficult will be like anything in game...if you do, there may be no hope for your intellect. Dev's are showing off functionality and nothing to do with para-functionality, as its meant to show people the product being worked on's features...not difficulty, performance, balance, all of which change vastly during beta and later game versions/iterations.
I hope to see more of these videos and hope bioware sticks to what they are good at...as it should make for a solid game and a unique addition to the genre. I'm glad to see at least some sane people have gained something from them...although some posters may be lost in their own delusions. And please stop posting "FFXIV does this..." replies...the game will do fine on its own without your inane comparisons and it belittles how excellent the ffxiv news was to hear.
I have nothing against TOR really, looks like a decent game that could very well be the next WoW for all I know. But from what I've heard the devs say, it makes it seem like they're completely ignoring the MMO's that have already implemented things like stories for each class. Part of why I was irritated was also because they weren't specific with what they said.. if they said "stories with multiple choices that impact your character for each class" instead of "first MMO to have stories for each class", then that would be alright, since it's true.
Well, let me step in here and clear up this whole situation in English, not Korean. The whole voice over discussion: Every NPC you talk to will be voiced in TOR- as well as each player character (16 total voices- male and female of every class). Furthermore, this is the first MMO I have seen that you can affect the story through dialog, the only other MMO I have played that even lets you pick what you say next is Age of Conan. In that game all 3 choices eventually end up with you saying goodbye or I accept your quest. FFXIV will not have every NPC voiced, and they certainly won't allow the player to have his/her own voice and lines-hundreds even thousands of them. It will be some old guy for every one of your main story quests saying things while you hit next or one predetermined line. Furthermore, your story won't change based on any decisions you may make. Its also going to be in German and French. FFXIV's English VO is going to be worse than TOR if they have it, TOR brought in some of the industry's best, so if you don't like it your not finding much better in a game.
Second, the story. It is the first MMO with story for every class. If you knew about story beyond that video you would know that every quest in the game will be made for 1 class in mind. Meaning, a bounty hunter can't go do the quests on Korriban, like killing kor-slugs as shown in the video. That quest is for Sith only, your master gave you a task to go and retreive an artifact. They have said that not one quest in the game will be shared among any classes. Not 1. But yes, you can invite your friends who are not the same class, they will get xp and the rewards (but items will pretty much be 100% for the class who's quest it is). Thats what they mean when they say they are the first MMO with a story for each class.
Now, my overall impressions: The graphics, the running animations, and models are pretty bad-Bioware completely missed the mark with the stylized realism, but it has grown on me enough to were it doesn't make a negative impact. However, I can garuntee you the models and running animations will be greatly improved-the last time anything received so much outroar they changed it (that being light saber size). It is an MMO-they are showing what is 100% done. They are not showing PvP, crafting, PvE, or anything else that makes it an MMO right now because they are not 99% polished and complete, and if you didn't notice the three beggining parts were all open world, its just they didn't have other people running around at the time. Overall, I think it holds a lot of promise, especially if you can get over the graphics. It will have great story (come on its Bioware), the combat looks pretty fun for level 5s (I liked some of the animations such as a jedi deflecting blasters (no other game has remotely close choreographed combat), the AI actually having a brain such as taking cover, no auto attack, etc), and I beleive they are going to deliver on what makes an MMO also. They actually do as DEVELOPERS have a lot of experience with creating MMOs, as a company they don't, but they have some serious vets of the industry at the top of the chain as well as the bottom.
Voice overs seem pretty cool. But there is not evern a beta out so I'm not going to dog the whole (seems like single-player) game. I agree with the guy who said that they never took damage. I don't want to play on GOd mode the whole time. We will have to wait and see
Looks phenomenal and easily the best mmorpg to be released in the last few years.
Why? How? You're going to be paying $15 a month on a game that is a co-op multiplayer game with ass graphics and instanced gameplay. Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself. You won't even be a part of a greater whole which is the WHOLE POINT TO THE STAR WARS UNIVERSE!!! Hell, you are only get to choose from one race - human. How diverse!
I get the feeling Star Wars fans are always let down when games in that universe are released because they hype the bejesus out of it, only to find out it's not what they once thought.
This game is proving to be a major let down so far.
Conversation system is good in that you don't have to read; you can listen. From what it looks like it very rarely says what you want it to say and what you say doesn't matter except for when it comes to two-choice critical decisions.. and besides the next few seconds of video what does that really change? It hasn't been proven.
Graphics look slightly better than N64 graphics. You can see the square polygons on the characters' noses; that hasn't happened since like 2002. Hutta looked sorta neat (by being a beautiful skybox) but the world otherwise appears very flat, line-ride-ey and boring.
Gameplay is where everything matters, though, right? Looks like it has the same old gameplay as most MMOs, which is fine. They shouldn't try to plug it as something unique, though. Cover is just a system of randomly finding places where you decrease your damage taken and damage done.
Continuing gameplay - fighting multiple enemies is neat but doesn't really make you feel epic, just like some invincible behemoth who, when hit by a blaster, says 'NUH-UH, DIDN'T HIT ME, SEE MY LIFE? I'M NOT DEAD!'. Melee is very simple with very little graphical effect. Force choke is OP.
Want to feel awesome and heroic in a Star Wars game? How about dodging blaster fire instead of absorbing it like a sponge and only finally getting hit when your 'hp' is low (of course your HP goes down from dodging too, it just makes you feel epic until then). Deflect more than 1/10 blaster bolts with a light saber. Slice droids in half 10 at a time. A flamethrower should do more than make enemies cower for 2 seconds. Bounty Hunters should eventually learn to fly around for short periods of time instead of just jump to do special blaster attacks for iconic effect.
The Flash Point.. looks neat.. except that it was way, way, way, way, way..
..way too easy. I hope that that was simply because they put it on super-easy difficulty so that they couldn't possibly die on their demo. The jedi apprentice did more damage to the sith than the actual jedi until the last few seconds of combat, and still the sith was at 558/710 HP I believe. Not much of a boss fight.
I was really hoping for so much more, especially with all the hype. I like making decisions, but only when they matter. Choosing to kill the captain and causing 1 extra random squad of enemies appear will get old after a while (I push the change to the lack of extremity, I know, but still eventually people will figure out which is better and just do that). Combat needs to be much more flashy and fights shorter except when they are epic.
Combat, so far, is anything but epic. You don't feel heroic.
I am sad. It looks bad, it plays bad, VO is good but choices don't seem to matter.
Doesn't look like it will be very fun for long.
Oh, and customization.. I hope everyone isn't a brown-haired, square-nosed grump standing exactly the same height and barely looking different even armor-wise. So far, though...
This game could be good, but it would need to be re-worked heavily before 'deployment' to be little more than a pick-your-own-adventure story book with blurry letters and cream cheese spilled over all of the action parts.
God fix this game and help its fans who are stalwart enough to grit their teeth and convince themselves that their eyes have seen gold rather than tin.
Objectivity is delivered with a lack of personality made for the mainstream but never used for the mainstream.
Conversation system is good in that you don't have to read, can listen. From what it looks like very rarely does what you say matter except for when it comes to two-choice critical decisions, and besides the next few seconds of video what does that really change? It hasn't been proven.
Graphics look slightly better than N64 graphics. You can see the square polygons on the characters' noses; that hasn't happened since like 2002. Hutta looked sorta neat but the world otherwise was very flat and boring.
Gameplay is where everything matters, though, right? Looks like it has the same old gameplay as most MMOs, which is fine. They shouldn't try to plug it as something unique, though. Cover is just a system of randomly finding ways to decrease your damage taken and damage done.
Continuing gameplay, fighting multiple enemies is neat but doesn't really make you feel epic, just like some invincible behemoth who, when hit by a blaster, says 'NUH-UH, DIDN'T HIT ME, SEE MY LIFE? I'M NOT DEAD!'. Melee is very simple with very little graphical effect. Force choke is OP.
The Flash Point.. looks neat.. except that it was way, way, way, way, way..
..way too easy. I hope that that was simply because they put it on super-easy difficulty so that they couldn't possibly die on their demo. The jedi apprentice did more damage to the sith than the actual jedi until the last few seconds of combat, and still the sith was at 558/710 HP I believe. Not much of a boss fight.
I was really hoping for so much more, especially with all the hype. I like making decisions, but only when they matter. Choosing to kill the captain and causing 1 extra random squad of enemies appear will get old after a while (I push the change to the lack of extremity, I know, but still eventually people will figure out which is better and just do that). Combat needs to be much more flashy and fights shorter except when they are epic.
Want to feel awesome and heroic in a Star Wars game? How about dodging blaster fire instead of absorbing it like a sponge and only finally getting hit when your 'hp' is low (of course your HP goes down from dodging too, it just makes you feel epic). Deflect more than 1/10 blaster bolts. Slice droids in half 10 at a time. Flamethrower should do more than make enemies cower for 2 seconds. Bounty Hunter should eventually learn to fly around for short periods of time instead of just jump to do special blaster attacks.
Combat, so far, is anything but epic. You don't feel heroic.
I am sad. It looks bad, it plays bad, VO is good but choices don't seem to matter.
Doesn't look like it will be very fun for long.
Oh, and customization.. I hope everyone isn't a brown-haired, square-nosed grump standing exactly the same height and barely looking different even armor-wise. So far, though...
This game could be good, but it would need to be re-worked heavily before 'deployment' to be little more than a pick-your-own-adventure story book with blurry letters and cream cheese spilled over all of the action parts.
God fix this game and help its fans who are stalwart enough to grit their teeth and convince themselves that their eyes have seen gold rather than tin.
The burning question is, which game do you detest the most, SWTOR or Aion?
The burning question is, which game do you detest the most, SWTOR or Aion?
I don't detest either. I even went to show my friends the SWTOR videos in case my eyes had suddenly blown a fuse and I was bullshitting that it was bad. Turns out they didn't.
I -really- want a good sci-fi MMO. There are plenty of decent fantasy MMOs, which Aion will likely end up to be, but a GOOD sci-fi MMO would be EPIC just because there aren't really any. At least not any current ones.
And I don't count EvE, it's a sandbox rather than a MMO which is fine but just not my thing. This is closer to my sort of thing, but.. sigh.
EDIT: I guess I should add that I trust Bioware; they haven't led me wrong in any game yet, so they better not screw this up. They better make it better than it seems.
Objectivity is delivered with a lack of personality made for the mainstream but never used for the mainstream.
I've just watched all gameplay videos, and I CANNOT BELIEVE you people like it! Character models are horrible, and animations even worse! Gameplay has nothing even remotely special in it, and If these videos gets you excited, I'm sorry, but you must be very, VERY young. This is not an attempt at trolling, just expressing an opinion. I admit having similar opinion about WoW before trying it, though, but we have now many more quality games at the market, so I really don't think this has enough "dazzle" factor to compete. I'm an old fart, but I don't believe I would play this even in my younger days...
I'm with you, but then alot of people seem to like games that are so far dumbed down your computer can play by itself at the moment and if they like it let them play it, don't know why though. Only problem is that at the moment you don't have a lot of choice in mmorpg terms if you want something more intelligent
Phew I thought I was the only one, the whole thing looked just looked wooden and bland.
As far as the voice acted thing goes I tend to find myself clicking next as fast as I can with character based text I suspect after 50 Quests/Missions listening to a bunch of canned voice responses is going to make me want to throw my monitor through a window.
I also don't see me playing this game without some major changes which is very dissapointing as I was hoping that this this game was going to be all the SWG wasnt.
See this is what ticks me off with about 30% of the new generation of mmo players, guess what those graphics are not that bad. I started with the old school ones thats a step up. It actually looks better to me than say CO which I will say is a good game, even if I dissed on it a lot prebeta testing it. But I digress SWTOR is an mmo, it has a lot of story elements that can be single of multiplayer I likes me some good story. Yet I realize most of the new generation wants it to look pretty cause thats what they like, I am okay with that. Still, at some point you need to just shut up, if you don't like a game thats your choice.
Me I like the graphics cause that means my friends that have sub par comps can play with me, I spent two grand on my vista rig for all the top end mmo's with the awsome graphics. In the end all that hard ware just means more crap to replace when they up graphics again. As to the god mode thing, it was a demo they did they probably had those toons in the best of the best gear and fighting mobs a lvl or two lower with gm buffs on them. No one likes dieing when they are demoing something. Still they have said they want the game to feel like your a hero and everyone else isn't, so think back on the deathstar escape, how many people did Luke, Han, and Chewi kill?
Though the game is looking like it very possibly is further along than advertised.
Graphics: Work for me, but don't impress. Room for some improvement for sure (and I don't mean polygon counts..)
Animations: It's alpha, so no major concern yet - but at the moment some animiaitions just luck funky
Combat: My only real issue with the video. Combat looks very bland. Sure, the lightsaber moves are well done (motion captuered, I guess), but much seems to run fully automatic with out much player input. I hope they have something more than that up their sleeves (style chains, positonals, some way to make combat engaging)
Overall: As many said, doesn't look much like an MMORPG to me. An online version of KOTOR perhaps, but not a virtual Star Wars World.
Graphics look slightly better than N64 graphics. You can see the square polygons on the characters' noses; that hasn't happened since like 2002. Hutta looked sorta neat (by being a beautiful skybox) but the world otherwise appears very flat, line-ride-ey and boring.
Go play a N64 game, then check out the shadows while he moves into the cover combat area,... go go... go play an N64 game, a good one like Conker... are you seriously comparing this game to that? please get your eyes tested. you obviously probably find magaret thatcher as beautiful as jessica alba in that case
why are graphics so important to people, look at AoC lovely graphics.. siege warefare and PvP are hampered by it, hell... go into the cities and it's a lag fest, can you imagine if the game was actually successful :P
Besides to make a popular MMO, you have to cater for people with lower spec computers as well as higher (look how desperate WAR is... already trying out a new market and playble on a MAC soon). You have to hit the wider audience.
Amazingly when AOC was first released people cried for more voice acting, more polish like Tortage. Yet Bioware gives you the option and all you do is bitch.
There really is no pleasing some people... they'll bitch about anything, really hoping heaven doesn't exist... can you imagine MMORPG players there... jeez poor god.
"nothing actually matters, we're just slightly evolved monkeys clinging to a dying piece of rock hurtling through space waiting for our eventual death." - Frankie Boyle, Mock The Week
Looks phenomenal and easily the best mmorpg to be released in the last few years.
Why? How? You're going to be paying $15 a month on a game that is a co-op multiplayer game with ass graphics and instanced gameplay. Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself. You won't even be a part of a greater whole which is the WHOLE POINT TO THE STAR WARS UNIVERSE!!! Hell, you are only get to choose from one race - human. How diverse!
I get the feeling Star Wars fans are always let down when games in that universe are released because they hype the bejesus out of it, only to find out it's not what they once thought.
This game is proving to be a major let down so far.
Think what you will, but don't give out wrong information. Yes, the graphics may be crap your right there. However, instanced gameplay? Besides from the flashpoint and the room the bounty hunter was in, the rest of the game was open world. It will play out like AoC destiny quests or LOTRO's epic quest. Your story is instanced, but 90% of the world's side quests will be open world. It is too early to say its going to be co-op multiplayer, they have not released information on the MMO aspects yet. But, they do have a large budget and a large number of MMO vets on the project (for example Richard Vogel-some lead or senior something- has a resume of Senior Producer of Meridian 59, Senior Producer of Ultima Online, Executive Producer of SWG before the meltdown) that know that they need to deliver on the staples of MMO gameplay. As for the"Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself" thing: when has doing quests such as killing 10 boars ever affected other people, besides from boosting your realm's RvR bar, find me one example other than killing onyxia grants a buff for the people in stormwind? PvP quests are a bit different, but there is no info on PvP, so its too early to pass judgement. I dont understand the whole not being part of a greater whole. If you mean you are going to be the emperor in the story, no. You work for your faction, your story is only one in the war effort. If there is RvR, PvP, crafting, and end-game raids I don't know what else you want. Finally, you will be able to play other races than humans: Twileks, Kel Dor, Chagrians, and Togruta are 98% confirmed with many others having a good possibility of being included.
In the end, I think many of you guys-to all his own and some people have legitimate concerns-seem to be weary of MMOs, particularly the combat.
Comments
As excited as Bioware are, and I can say they have a good right to be, they aren't really selling things very well with the people they are putting up on the videos.
The first guy on the video seemed...well....smug and full of cr*p to me. He was wayyyy overselling the product, and if there is one thing that we're steadily getting tired of, it's overselling products that are still over a year away. Is anyone out there not sick of Peter Molyneux and his constant b*llsh*t about his upcoming games?
Bioware have always had a steady reputation for good, innovative games with fantastic settings and storylines. The buildup so far has been pretty good, but this video just reeked of 'we are so awesome' instead of 'hey everyone! here's what we've been working on, what do you think? should we change anything? what do our fans think?'.
I know there'll be people responding with 'they're wayyyy too far into development to be bothered with changing how things are going to be' but that's just not true in an MMORPG. CoX are a perfect example of what happens over time as you listen to your fans, and the fans keep staying, and coming back.
Anyway, combat seemed a bit samey, but graphically pretty cool, if lacking much visibly on the teamwork side (what we saw wasn't teamwork - teamwork involves teams working together to be stronger than they are individually, not just shooting at the same target). The graphics have been deliberately designed to be constant so the game doesn't visibly age as better graphics cards come out. The cutscene was the same as we've already seen in previous videos, and it seemed ok, but they keep saying 'this will affect how things happen later' but they don't give a single example. Voiceover work is a huge operation, but not technically difficult. Will I be able to jump past the cutscenes? What happens if my teammate has already done that quest...do I have to sit through it again? Who makes the decisions? What about companion characters - I didn't see any input from them.
I know...I know....work in progress....
I'm amazed to say that I am completely underwhelmed from what I just saw.
Looks phenomenal and easily the best mmorpg to be released in the last few years.
You mean like horizontal slap, vertical slap, shoot bow, shoot pixelated crap.
All the while circle strafing.
Cus that's what darkfall is about ...
They obviously upped the stats for the chars significantly to not die during their presentation...
You haven't set foot in Darkfall, have you?
Well it sure beets SWG. From what I saw the interface is a bit clunky, that I think is due to the fact they actually made it KOTR like for consoles and for PC's alike. This was a mistake the valve made when they had servers for both CS for pc and console. The console was never as good as the PC.
I am not sure how the clunky controls are going to work in an mmorpg envoronment with groups, what I saw was more a solo with hired NPC's to help. Having clunky controls on the fly for stuff is going to make combat interesting for groups.
however it is still very interesting, and gave me hope that something might be close at hand.
It might not be eq2, or lotro. But its giong to be new, and something different.
Right now I need somethng different that the wow type killers like Lotro and others. Lotro has lost its shine and its way. The other MMO"s are getting stale. Im all for new and different, and not wow like in any aspect.
You mean like horizontal slap, vertical slap, shoot bow, shoot pixelated crap.
All the while circle strafing.
Cus that's what darkfall is about ...
They obviously upped the stats for the chars significantly to not die during their presentation...
You haven't set foot in Darkfall, have you?
I did, for about 2 hours in beta, before I quit in horror.
And the above is all I saw, so if you have a point to make, prove me different.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Looks like both games have an advantage over the other now, then. TOR voices the player characters, FFXIV voices all but the player characters in 4-5 different languages.
Compared to what SE is doing Bioware's hard work seems quite laughable though.
So you speak all 4 different langauges then? What's that now? You don't?
Besides, TOR is going to have FAR more dialouge then FF14. It actually has branching conversations unlike SE games. So we're back to Bioware doing more work and you failing to push your FF14-Fapping Agenda in a SWTOR thread.. Yarp. World is back to it's original position.
Alltern8 Blog | Star Wars Space Combat and The Old Republic | Cryptic Studios - A Pre Post-Mortem | Klingon Preview, STO's Monster Play
I have to say that I am excited and hopeful that this game will turn out to be everything I am hoping for. I am an older MMO player (41 years old) and I saw Star Wars in 1977 in the theater and have been hooked on it ever since.
I must say that I prefer a more realistic looking game over the cartoon-ish look (stylized realism) but I think it is something that I can deal with. I am not too worried about the animations, character models, walking, etc. just yet as the game is still far off from release. I am sure there is a lot of polish that still needs to be done and hopefully these concerns that people posting here have about these issues will be fixed prior to release.
Some of the things that I am concerned about though is the longevity of the game. If it is all story driven taking you from level 1 all the way to max level with a deep story .. then what do you do when the story is over? Is it going to be something to keep me playing and paying each month? Lucky for me I have 8 characters and 8 stories to try out, but other people are only interested in 1 class and that is it. I always have tons of alts in MMO's but I would just hate to see the game do really well the first few months and then have a mass exoduse after people are done their story and there is nothing left to do.
I am also afraid that there wont be enough options or skills available to make one Sith Warrior seem different from another Sith Warrior standing right next to him. Cookie cutter classes are not the way of the future, at least I hope not. People want options and they want to be different then all the other people playing their class and are their level.
Another thing that I was afraid would happen (and I can see that I was right) is the fact that if you hit someone in the chest with a Lightsaber (a laser sword) its going to cut off something. Arms will fly, legs, etc. I know its a fantasy world and its not supposed to be realistic but during these fight scenes they were hitting mobs 4 or more times before they would die. I know there has to be a game balance and whatnot but when Luke got hit by Vaders blade, he lost his hand. Certainly, if he were to get hit 4 or more times in the chest (as in the demo video) he wouldn't have survived. The movies were all about the epic sword battle, dodging and blocking and then whoever would win would get that ONE shot in to end the fight. Certainly not get hit 4 or more times in the chest. I'm not sure how this could be worked out in the game to make it more realistic but it looks like they have taken some efforts in this area. At least it doesn't take 20 hits to kill a mob (like in most of the other games out there.) I can live with 4 rather then 20, but it still doesn't seem all that realistic to me. Also, in the video the PC's were shooting burst fire and sometimes automatic fire with pistols. I could see this with a laser rifle, but to me, I just don't see a blaster pistol shooting 4 or 5 shot bursts. Han would shoot 1 or 2 shots while running away or trying to find cover, not fire off 5 shots of automatic or burst fire from his pistol. With this being the case, how will a heavy laser rifle being weilded by a Trooper seem much different, if a little blaster pistol can shoot off that many rounds?
I would love to see some space combat since this is Star Wars .. I hope this will be in at launch.
I am really excited about the game and keep watching the same video's over and over. I am getting all wrapped up in it and cant wait till it comes out. I love Bioware games, I just hope they make this game so that people will have a reason to stay around for more then a few months.
Kev
Wow, this thread eats away at the brain. Though the game looked like an iteration of kotor & mass effect, It looked very good (as those games did in the past). I'm excited at a prospect of taking old games, and making them larger, bigger, with more people. Again people want to bash devs for reusing things THAT WERE FUN, MADE MONEY, AND WORK and expand on them. As for if this will be an MMO? Is it massive, mulitplayer, and online? Really...that argument is hilarious. But why not off a pre alpha assume everything is an instance, every decision must be multiplayer-related, and that the game is all done in cut scenes...because of course logic demands it.
As for FFXIV comparisons, the games are taking 2 entirely different paths...beyond them being MMOs thats their only similarity. I will try both, and both have a variety of strengths and styles - in line with how the developers have worked in the past. Never seeks to amaze me how bashing good games or developers to prove a point will always be the first attempt at poor logic...ugh
And I really hope people are not seriously thinking that a gameplay pre-alpha demo's difficult will be like anything in game...if you do, there may be no hope for your intellect. Dev's are showing off functionality and nothing to do with para-functionality, as its meant to show people the product being worked on's features...not difficulty, performance, balance, all of which change vastly during beta and later game versions/iterations.
I hope to see more of these videos and hope bioware sticks to what they are good at...as it should make for a solid game and a unique addition to the genre. I'm glad to see at least some sane people have gained something from them...although some posters may be lost in their own delusions. And please stop posting "FFXIV does this..." replies...the game will do fine on its own without your inane comparisons and it belittles how excellent the ffxiv news was to hear.
as expected, nothing short of amazing from bioware
can't wait to check it out.
This is news discussion forum, not TOR forum =P
I have nothing against TOR really, looks like a decent game that could very well be the next WoW for all I know. But from what I've heard the devs say, it makes it seem like they're completely ignoring the MMO's that have already implemented things like stories for each class. Part of why I was irritated was also because they weren't specific with what they said.. if they said "stories with multiple choices that impact your character for each class" instead of "first MMO to have stories for each class", then that would be alright, since it's true.
Well, let me step in here and clear up this whole situation in English, not Korean. The whole voice over discussion: Every NPC you talk to will be voiced in TOR- as well as each player character (16 total voices- male and female of every class). Furthermore, this is the first MMO I have seen that you can affect the story through dialog, the only other MMO I have played that even lets you pick what you say next is Age of Conan. In that game all 3 choices eventually end up with you saying goodbye or I accept your quest. FFXIV will not have every NPC voiced, and they certainly won't allow the player to have his/her own voice and lines-hundreds even thousands of them. It will be some old guy for every one of your main story quests saying things while you hit next or one predetermined line. Furthermore, your story won't change based on any decisions you may make. Its also going to be in German and French. FFXIV's English VO is going to be worse than TOR if they have it, TOR brought in some of the industry's best, so if you don't like it your not finding much better in a game.
Second, the story. It is the first MMO with story for every class. If you knew about story beyond that video you would know that every quest in the game will be made for 1 class in mind. Meaning, a bounty hunter can't go do the quests on Korriban, like killing kor-slugs as shown in the video. That quest is for Sith only, your master gave you a task to go and retreive an artifact. They have said that not one quest in the game will be shared among any classes. Not 1. But yes, you can invite your friends who are not the same class, they will get xp and the rewards (but items will pretty much be 100% for the class who's quest it is). Thats what they mean when they say they are the first MMO with a story for each class.
Now, my overall impressions: The graphics, the running animations, and models are pretty bad-Bioware completely missed the mark with the stylized realism, but it has grown on me enough to were it doesn't make a negative impact. However, I can garuntee you the models and running animations will be greatly improved-the last time anything received so much outroar they changed it (that being light saber size). It is an MMO-they are showing what is 100% done. They are not showing PvP, crafting, PvE, or anything else that makes it an MMO right now because they are not 99% polished and complete, and if you didn't notice the three beggining parts were all open world, its just they didn't have other people running around at the time. Overall, I think it holds a lot of promise, especially if you can get over the graphics. It will have great story (come on its Bioware), the combat looks pretty fun for level 5s (I liked some of the animations such as a jedi deflecting blasters (no other game has remotely close choreographed combat), the AI actually having a brain such as taking cover, no auto attack, etc), and I beleive they are going to deliver on what makes an MMO also. They actually do as DEVELOPERS have a lot of experience with creating MMOs, as a company they don't, but they have some serious vets of the industry at the top of the chain as well as the bottom.
ZOMG
BEST MMO EVER!!!!!!!!
Shadowlord Sage
CmdrAkbar
Napa Valley, UO, 1997.
hope the combat gets better other than that not bad.
I think "Not that bad" is all most of us hope for now.
I recently re-installed Starcraft and was actually having fun playing it. Times have changed.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Voice overs seem pretty cool. But there is not evern a beta out so I'm not going to dog the whole (seems like single-player) game. I agree with the guy who said that they never took damage. I don't want to play on GOd mode the whole time. We will have to wait and see
Why? How? You're going to be paying $15 a month on a game that is a co-op multiplayer game with ass graphics and instanced gameplay. Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself. You won't even be a part of a greater whole which is the WHOLE POINT TO THE STAR WARS UNIVERSE!!! Hell, you are only get to choose from one race - human. How diverse!
I get the feeling Star Wars fans are always let down when games in that universe are released because they hype the bejesus out of it, only to find out it's not what they once thought.
This game is proving to be a major let down so far.
This is what people having been hyping up...?
Conversation system is good in that you don't have to read; you can listen. From what it looks like it very rarely says what you want it to say and what you say doesn't matter except for when it comes to two-choice critical decisions.. and besides the next few seconds of video what does that really change? It hasn't been proven.
Graphics look slightly better than N64 graphics. You can see the square polygons on the characters' noses; that hasn't happened since like 2002. Hutta looked sorta neat (by being a beautiful skybox) but the world otherwise appears very flat, line-ride-ey and boring.
Gameplay is where everything matters, though, right? Looks like it has the same old gameplay as most MMOs, which is fine. They shouldn't try to plug it as something unique, though. Cover is just a system of randomly finding places where you decrease your damage taken and damage done.
Continuing gameplay - fighting multiple enemies is neat but doesn't really make you feel epic, just like some invincible behemoth who, when hit by a blaster, says 'NUH-UH, DIDN'T HIT ME, SEE MY LIFE? I'M NOT DEAD!'. Melee is very simple with very little graphical effect. Force choke is OP.
Want to feel awesome and heroic in a Star Wars game? How about dodging blaster fire instead of absorbing it like a sponge and only finally getting hit when your 'hp' is low (of course your HP goes down from dodging too, it just makes you feel epic until then). Deflect more than 1/10 blaster bolts with a light saber. Slice droids in half 10 at a time. A flamethrower should do more than make enemies cower for 2 seconds. Bounty Hunters should eventually learn to fly around for short periods of time instead of just jump to do special blaster attacks for iconic effect.
The Flash Point.. looks neat.. except that it was way, way, way, way, way..
..way too easy. I hope that that was simply because they put it on super-easy difficulty so that they couldn't possibly die on their demo. The jedi apprentice did more damage to the sith than the actual jedi until the last few seconds of combat, and still the sith was at 558/710 HP I believe. Not much of a boss fight.
I was really hoping for so much more, especially with all the hype. I like making decisions, but only when they matter. Choosing to kill the captain and causing 1 extra random squad of enemies appear will get old after a while (I push the change to the lack of extremity, I know, but still eventually people will figure out which is better and just do that). Combat needs to be much more flashy and fights shorter except when they are epic.
Combat, so far, is anything but epic. You don't feel heroic.
I am sad. It looks bad, it plays bad, VO is good but choices don't seem to matter.
Doesn't look like it will be very fun for long.
Oh, and customization.. I hope everyone isn't a brown-haired, square-nosed grump standing exactly the same height and barely looking different even armor-wise. So far, though...
This game could be good, but it would need to be re-worked heavily before 'deployment' to be little more than a pick-your-own-adventure story book with blurry letters and cream cheese spilled over all of the action parts.
God fix this game and help its fans who are stalwart enough to grit their teeth and convince themselves that their eyes have seen gold rather than tin.
Objectivity is delivered with a lack of personality made for the mainstream but never used for the mainstream.
The burning question is, which game do you detest the most, SWTOR or Aion?
I don't detest either. I even went to show my friends the SWTOR videos in case my eyes had suddenly blown a fuse and I was bullshitting that it was bad. Turns out they didn't.
I -really- want a good sci-fi MMO. There are plenty of decent fantasy MMOs, which Aion will likely end up to be, but a GOOD sci-fi MMO would be EPIC just because there aren't really any. At least not any current ones.
And I don't count EvE, it's a sandbox rather than a MMO which is fine but just not my thing. This is closer to my sort of thing, but.. sigh.
EDIT: I guess I should add that I trust Bioware; they haven't led me wrong in any game yet, so they better not screw this up. They better make it better than it seems.
Objectivity is delivered with a lack of personality made for the mainstream but never used for the mainstream.
I'm with you, but then alot of people seem to like games that are so far dumbed down your computer can play by itself at the moment and if they like it let them play it, don't know why though. Only problem is that at the moment you don't have a lot of choice in mmorpg terms if you want something more intelligent
Phew I thought I was the only one, the whole thing looked just looked wooden and bland.
As far as the voice acted thing goes I tend to find myself clicking next as fast as I can with character based text I suspect after 50 Quests/Missions listening to a bunch of canned voice responses is going to make me want to throw my monitor through a window.
I also don't see me playing this game without some major changes which is very dissapointing as I was hoping that this this game was going to be all the SWG wasnt.
See this is what ticks me off with about 30% of the new generation of mmo players, guess what those graphics are not that bad. I started with the old school ones thats a step up. It actually looks better to me than say CO which I will say is a good game, even if I dissed on it a lot prebeta testing it. But I digress SWTOR is an mmo, it has a lot of story elements that can be single of multiplayer I likes me some good story. Yet I realize most of the new generation wants it to look pretty cause thats what they like, I am okay with that. Still, at some point you need to just shut up, if you don't like a game thats your choice.
Me I like the graphics cause that means my friends that have sub par comps can play with me, I spent two grand on my vista rig for all the top end mmo's with the awsome graphics. In the end all that hard ware just means more crap to replace when they up graphics again. As to the god mode thing, it was a demo they did they probably had those toons in the best of the best gear and fighting mobs a lvl or two lower with gm buffs on them. No one likes dieing when they are demoing something. Still they have said they want the game to feel like your a hero and everyone else isn't, so think back on the deathstar escape, how many people did Luke, Han, and Chewi kill?
Though the game is looking like it very possibly is further along than advertised.
Graphics: Work for me, but don't impress. Room for some improvement for sure (and I don't mean polygon counts..)
Animations: It's alpha, so no major concern yet - but at the moment some animiaitions just luck funky
Combat: My only real issue with the video. Combat looks very bland. Sure, the lightsaber moves are well done (motion captuered, I guess), but much seems to run fully automatic with out much player input. I hope they have something more than that up their sleeves (style chains, positonals, some way to make combat engaging)
Overall: As many said, doesn't look much like an MMORPG to me. An online version of KOTOR perhaps, but not a virtual Star Wars World.
Go play a N64 game, then check out the shadows while he moves into the cover combat area,... go go... go play an N64 game, a good one like Conker... are you seriously comparing this game to that? please get your eyes tested. you obviously probably find magaret thatcher as beautiful as jessica alba in that case
why are graphics so important to people, look at AoC lovely graphics.. siege warefare and PvP are hampered by it, hell... go into the cities and it's a lag fest, can you imagine if the game was actually successful
:P
Besides to make a popular MMO, you have to cater for people with lower spec computers as well as higher (look how desperate WAR is... already trying out a new market and playble on a MAC soon). You have to hit the wider audience.
Amazingly when AOC was first released people cried for more voice acting, more polish like Tortage. Yet Bioware gives you the option and all you do is bitch.
There really is no pleasing some people... they'll bitch about anything, really hoping heaven doesn't exist... can you imagine MMORPG players there... jeez poor god.
"nothing actually matters, we're just slightly evolved monkeys clinging to a dying piece of rock hurtling through space waiting for our eventual death." - Frankie Boyle, Mock The Week
Why? How? You're going to be paying $15 a month on a game that is a co-op multiplayer game with ass graphics and instanced gameplay. Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself. You won't even be a part of a greater whole which is the WHOLE POINT TO THE STAR WARS UNIVERSE!!! Hell, you are only get to choose from one race - human. How diverse!
I get the feeling Star Wars fans are always let down when games in that universe are released because they hype the bejesus out of it, only to find out it's not what they once thought.
This game is proving to be a major let down so far.
Think what you will, but don't give out wrong information. Yes, the graphics may be crap your right there. However, instanced gameplay? Besides from the flashpoint and the room the bounty hunter was in, the rest of the game was open world. It will play out like AoC destiny quests or LOTRO's epic quest. Your story is instanced, but 90% of the world's side quests will be open world. It is too early to say its going to be co-op multiplayer, they have not released information on the MMO aspects yet. But, they do have a large budget and a large number of MMO vets on the project (for example Richard Vogel-some lead or senior something- has a resume of Senior Producer of Meridian 59, Senior Producer of Ultima Online, Executive Producer of SWG before the meltdown) that know that they need to deliver on the staples of MMO gameplay. As for the"Your dialogue decisions mean nothing to anyone but yourself" thing: when has doing quests such as killing 10 boars ever affected other people, besides from boosting your realm's RvR bar, find me one example other than killing onyxia grants a buff for the people in stormwind? PvP quests are a bit different, but there is no info on PvP, so its too early to pass judgement. I dont understand the whole not being part of a greater whole. If you mean you are going to be the emperor in the story, no. You work for your faction, your story is only one in the war effort. If there is RvR, PvP, crafting, and end-game raids I don't know what else you want. Finally, you will be able to play other races than humans: Twileks, Kel Dor, Chagrians, and Togruta are 98% confirmed with many others having a good possibility of being included.
In the end, I think many of you guys-to all his own and some people have legitimate concerns-seem to be weary of MMOs, particularly the combat.
If you'll excuse me, I have to go joygasm now...