- Focus on community. There would be a reason for people to get together, and you wouldn't be losing out if you didn't get together, but you would be rewarded and possibly have more fun in groups.
That would be great.
I think grouping should be much more rewarding then soloing.... I pay a monthly fee to play with other people.. not to play by myself.
Grymm MMO addict in recovery! EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH, Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
Everything from SWG and L2 sounded great to me that you mentioned (loved the thing about being able to attack anything- that would be neat), but I'm not sure if I liked the EQ things except for the type of quests you mentioned. Having to do corpse runs for your items, taking forever to level, and not having a map don't sound very fun to me personally
-------------------------- Playing: FFXIV, TERA, LoL, and HoTS My Rig: GPU: GeForce GTX 770, CPU: i7-4790K, Memory: 16 GB RAM
Asheron's Call would have been mostly perfect for you.
- More than just raiding or PvP. Like crafting, music, etc. You could have a character that only crafts, or one that only works on playing music, or you could have a character that does it all.
A character that does nothing but tinker (change item properties) and create things, yes. Music, on the other hand, no.
- Immersive world. Little to no loading screens, polished and detailed.
Check. No loading screens unless you were portaling from place to place, but thats understandable. Vanguard has similar system.
- Player creations. Players have a house somewhere in the world, guild forts, etc. Players could create their own items, or at least personalize their crafts.
House - check.
- A lot of mini games or puzzles. These would be for many of the quests (think about the zelda games or whatever). You would also be able to do most of them with other players.
Quests had a somewhat puzzle-ish nature. Some more than others. But there isn't (rather wasn't) any quest tracker, or GUI element telling you where you needed to be.
- Crafting: Could be done without ever having to fight, and you would be able to craft most things. Crafting would also have different mini games for each profession, and maybe even some games you could play with other people at the same time to craft.
There is a system to get xp for different crafting actions. But it wasn't huge.
- Focus on the story! The MMO of my dreams would have a huge focus on the story from the beginning of the game and until the last possible quest. There would be a lot of in game cinematic type things, and you would feel immersed in the story and would want to keep progressing just to see the story unfold.
While there wasn't a lot of cinematic, there was a heavy focus on the story arcs. Towns that were destroyed. Sever wide events. I could go into more detail, but PM for that. There was tons of story related stuff.
- PvP: All PvP would be based on traditional groups (DPS, Healer, tank). You would have the option to progress by only doing PvP if you wanted, but it would be a little slower than PvE. There would also be mass PvP battles, and PvP area.
This, sadly, did not exist.
- PvE: There would be many dungeons to explore, interesting quests, and epic raids.
Huge world with tons of quests and dungeons.
- Lots of emotes and player actions. There would be a lot of emotes in games or at least a few good ones, and there would be more than just walking around. Your character would be able to do things like dance, jump, crawl, etc.
There wasn't a huge list. But there was a decent amount.
- Decent graphics. They would have to be 3D, and they wouldn't have to be spectacular but good enough to look at and become immersed in the game world.
It was decent immersion 6 years ago for a fully 3d world.
- Focus on community. There would be a reason for people to get together, and you wouldn't be losing out if you didn't get together, but you would be rewarded and possibly have more fun in groups.
Always. Fellowships & Allegiences. With a fellowship the xp was split, but it wasn't like 50/50. The total percentage of xp added up to be more than 100%, so it was always a good deal, because you could kill faster and get better xp/hour. In the allegiance, you could have a number of vassels. Depending on the loyalty skill of the vassal and the leadership skill of the patron, the patron would earn a percentage of xp based on the total xp gained by the vassal.
- Gear wouldn't be that important. Gear would only have a slight increase on your performance in PvE or PvP. You would also be able to do both PvE and PvP in the same type of gear (there wouldn't be PvE only and PvP only gear). The game would be more skill based than anything.
The gear was the same, generally, for both. But since gear in Asheron's Call was tinkerable, you could create sets of armor that were more efficient for PvE or PvP and such. Asheron's Call's item system was by far the best ever implemented. Current MMOs have a cookie cutter system, as I call it. With the cookie cutter system, if two items have the same name (and are of the same rarity), then they have the same stats. In Asheron's Call, it was much more variable.
Unfortunately, Asheron's Call, while it is still alive, it is not alive by much. It still has a small but dedicated following, but most of the community is gone. Hopefully, one day, Turbine can update and redo Asheron's Call (without screwing it up). Or at least create a new game, that has the same formula as Asheron's Call.
let me try to peice together peices of mmo's that i've had the "joy" of playing...
to start off...
FFXI: My favorite MMO, going on 5 years now. I'll take FF's Story Line and the Leveling difficulty. I love FF's story line and with every expansion comes a new "main" quest. The difficulty used to be epic for leveling when the game first came out but has got substantionally easier, which to me makes sense as a mmo ages. The Job change at any time is completely amazing, I love that on one character i have multiple level caped out guys and thus you as a main character benefit for having as many jobs as you can leveld up. Merits, merits are what you earn for getting experience after leveling to the cap, they allow you to add skills,spells,attributes, and abilites to you on any job or a specific one based on the merit. It's a great way to enjoy playing a level caped job in an experience situation even after you're caped out. Level Sync is a new thing in the FF world, it allows players from any level to lower themselves to a party members level in order to help that person level up, it makes it possible for a guy who's level 75 every job to party with a friend just starting the game at level 10. By syncing the 75 will be lowered to 10 and level up along side of his friend, all the while gaining exp.
WoW: hmm, with WoW I would take the Accessiblity. Almost any comp can play it, hell even some cell phones can play it. This game has what every game wants, a Large community. I don't want the community of 10 year olds and idiots spaming chat in UC, but the number of people on and willing to group up at all times is a nice factor. End game pvp, I really love how this game gives pvp rewards, some of the best equip in game requires you to PVP which is a great way of making people enjoy that part of the game. Good vs. Evil, the faction based system is pretty cool, I really like how if your a boring alliance and I'm a horde, not only can I not understand you in chat, but I am sworn to destroy you. (WAR is very cool with this also, as are a lot of games i know. But WoW just brings it to the fore-front like most games don't)
GW: umm... I just like the fact of it being Free. Can anyone blame me here?
SWG (pre lame): With the original SWG you could honestly play the game and love it... without firing a blaster. The Choices of how to build your character were amazing. And the way they introduced people to being jedi's was fun,difficult, and rewarding. This is awesome to me, the way that you hade to find out within a quest what was needed for you personally to be a jedi was so cool.
EQ: I love the fact that after so long a dedicated player base is still existant. I tried this game for a few days, not for me, but I can definitly see why people are still in love with this.
Lineage(s): No level cap. I like the fact that you never have to stop.
Archlord: One player has a influence. This to me is pretty cool. The fact that one single player who works harder and is more dedicated than most others can actually attain claim to "Being the best". Screw leaderboards, honestly. Just wait 2 weeks and challenge the dude.
EVE: I didn't get into this game much, but i definitly could see why people enjoyed it. This game has so much to offer players interested in putting time into a game they want something out of. I really like the Completely open world. You can fly around and just feel like theres no end.
LoTRO: Again, played this game and enjoyed it, but backed off a bit a few weeks in. I really liked the Lore. The reason people even gave this game the look is because they wanted to be apart of the world of middle earth. A perfect MMO would have to capture players in this extent... to me anyway.
TR: I know it exists in many games, but in TR I especially enjoyed the fact of Changing classes/jobs as you level up. I really enjoyed how even after I went to next class i was still able to level up my mines from the previous class and strengthen my lightning from the first class. Also the character cloan is another concept of this game which is interesting. You are able to esentially "Save" your character and if you don't like the class you've selected post selection you are able to go back to your cloaned former self and switch it up.
Vanguard: Cool Diplomacy type gameplay. An interesting little "mini-game" as I would feel it is, it's pretty cool if you don't feel like fighting but want to sit around and still do something at least.
Yeah well thats all I can come up with on such a short notice (like 5 mins of thinking). Let me know if I've missed anything or any opinions.
I agree with just about all of Swift's ideas, except the lack of a map. I don't necessarily believe it should have the "you are here" function, but having a static one is realistic in populated and explored regions. Maybe for purchase or player created trade.
Also, I'd like to add two things to the list.
First, my ideal MMO would make the players feel as though they are exceptional and rare in the world. In every MMO I've played, I have had my immersion killed the moment I went back to town and hung out with the fifty or so heroes around the mailbox. Places where the only NPCs are there only to cater to the player's needs. I would do this by populating the cities with thousands of NPCs. Think of any of the cities in Assassin's Creed. There would certainly be masses of players in popular trade centers, of course, but they would still be a very small part of the overall population.
Second, I would have a realistic ecosystem. There is nothing heroic about the genocidal elimination of creatures simply because they reside just outside your towns gate. If the quest claims that Murlocs are raiding the village, then have them raid the village. Similarly, most animals fear and avoid humans. However, in MMOs, most animals wander around in the open, at all hours, then attack you when you are in range.
This ecosystem would also mean fewer animals in an area, not blobs of random creatures stacked on top of each other in starter areas.
I used WOW for my examples, but it is essentially the same in EQ, EQ2, GW, SWG, L2, Vanguard, Requiem, and Perfect World. Eve also falls under this, but being solely ship based, is excluded.
I agree with just about all of Swift's ideas, except the lack of a map. I don't necessarily believe it should have the "you are here" function, but having a static one is realistic in populated and explored regions. Maybe for purchase or player created trade. Also, I'd like to add two things to the list. First, my ideal MMO would make the players feel as though they are exceptional and rare in the world. In every MMO I've played, I have had my immersion killed the moment I went back to town and hung out with the fifty or so heroes around the mailbox. Places where the only NPCs are there only to cater to the player's needs. I would do this by populating the cities with thousands of NPCs. Think of any of the cities in Assassin's Creed. There would certainly be masses of players in popular trade centers, of course, but they would still be a very small part of the overall population. Second, I would have a realistic ecosystem. There is nothing heroic about the genocidal elimination of creatures simply because they reside just outside your towns gate. If the quest claims that Murlocs are raiding the village, then have them raid the village. Similarly, most animals fear and avoid humans. However, in MMOs, most animals wander around in the open, at all hours, then attack you when you are in range. This ecosystem would also mean fewer animals in an area, not blobs of random creatures stacked on top of each other in starter areas. I used WOW for my examples, but it is essentially the same in EQ, EQ2, GW, SWG, L2, Vanguard, Requiem, and Perfect World. Eve also falls under this, but being solely ship based, is excluded.
I liked this idea a lot. If monsters were actually attacking towns, and wolves or whatnot were actually hiding and afraid of humans that would certainly be a lot more interesting than mobs just pacing back in forth at one spot waiting to be killed.
But not sure if I would want to cut down the amount of mobs in each area personally ( I don't like waiting forever for respawns and at the same time if they spawned too quick it would hurt immersion)
-------------------------- Playing: FFXIV, TERA, LoL, and HoTS My Rig: GPU: GeForce GTX 770, CPU: i7-4790K, Memory: 16 GB RAM
But not sure if I would want to cut down the amount of mobs in each area personally ( I don't like waiting forever for respawns and at the same time if they spawned too quick it would hurt immersion)
I think that the area would have to determine the number and type of mobs. In high population areas, like cities and around larger castles, there would be no monsters and little wildlife...except rats.
It would dramatically change the way players are introduced to a game. Instead of having a set starting area for all characters, what if your choice in profession determined where you began? Let's say you make a ranger-type character. You would start in a small hamlet in a modestly populated area and have quests that fit that profession. The area around the hamlet would have plenty of wildlife and a few, weak mobs.
Now a thief-type character could start in a big city. If my large population idea was used, the thief would get few kill quests, but would be able to break into NPC homes, pickpocket, etc.. Combat could be against rival gangs, drug dealers, guards.
It would be a completely different starting experience and would eliminate the need for large number of mobs to farm. It also would allow those players who are not as interested in combat to have a viable area to live in.
I'm not suggesting that combat be reduced, just handled in a more realistic setting. The further from civilization you get, the scarier the world becomes... usually.
I'll actually mirror wjrasmussen, and simply answer your question with "I don't know". :-)
I've enjoyed a good number of MMOGs, with rather different takes on design, graphics and features. Saying an MMOG needs to have core focus A, or graphic style B, or features C, D and E, is futile for me, as I've enjoyed games that lack what I list and also not enjoyed games that have what I list.
And judging by what "most" people say they "need" in a game and what games most people actually play, I'm not so sure anybody else know exactly what they want or enjoy either. ;-)
Me too Aeroangel. Making a game both ideallistic and pratical in production is basically a nightmare.
I am drawing up a plan for a MMORPG right now, which I am actually not making, it is just a hobby.
60% complete. However, it has too many systems and intricacies to be practical already at this stage. Since designing a game is not just about ideas, but also about how to apply them. Even though I don't even plan on applying them, still best to do it that way.
- Focus on the story! The MMO of my dreams would have a huge focus on the story from the beginning of the game and until the last possible quest. There would be a lot of in game cinematic type things, and you would feel immersed in the story and would want to keep progressing just to see the story unfold.
I never read any of the NPC dialog in an MMORPG if I can help it, and I never read any of the lore. It seems boring and pointless to me, since it doesnt' affect the game play.
One of the few RPG's where the story has actually interested me, is KOTOR. But I wouldn't want to play that as a multiplayer game. I was enjoying watching the cut scenes, and listening to the NPC 's tell me the story. I wouldn't need anyone else around while I'm watching cut scenes.
Well on the subject of dialog I'm thinking the quest givers and NPCs would actually talk to you (like from oblivion), and it wouldn't be long winded and boring. You would be able to skip through or avoid the dialog if you wanted.
Like personally the one thing I enjoyed the most from WoTLK was the death knight quest line. It just felt epic to me, and it was almost like I was playing in a short movie or something. If you could make an entire game's quest line as interesting as that one I probably wouldn't mind doing the quests again
And I think pets would have to be in the game as well
I think MMO's with a storyline are a mistake.... and there are quite a few out there right now. I also believe Aion is going to have a storyline with cinematics etc. Quests with storylines are good but they should be individual storylines, not an overall story that encompasses the entire game.
The story you experience should be the story of your characters random travels through the world... I could write a nice story based on my EQ1 adventures!
Story lines are for single player games.. personally I love single player FPS games for that.
And Aero... if you want epic try an EQ1 epic quest
Grymm MMO addict in recovery! EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH, Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
I think story is important in any game. But at the same time, I feel that the most important story of all should be the one you are living and the adventures you are experiencing in the game personally. Because after you complete the entire story of the game, and have visited each and every NPC down to the very last quest, you are still going to need something there to captivate your attention. And that is where your OWN adventure is important. I think that is why there are alot of Role-players in games these days. Not saying there is anything wrong with that, on the contrary, I have Role-played myself at times.
So you think people should be able to make their own quests in the game or what =O I'm curious about this!
I also think it'd be great if, while the type of gear wouldn't be THAT importaint, it did affect how you performed in battle (i.e. Leather Armor wouldn't absorb all that much damage but would allow you to move around faster while something like Plate Mail would absorb a lot more damage but you would barely be able to move.) and there would be weak spots that people could get through to do max damage (i.e. someone with a bow could aim for an exposed arm pit or other area not fully covered by plates and do critical damage)
I also think... I'll just stop here with these two points before I spend forever typing something up...
I think that's an excellent idea! I love the idea about gear! I also love the idea that people who play ranged classes (caster, archer, etc.) would have to actually AIM in combat! Would definitely take a lot of skill, and now I need to think of something fun and skillful for healers, melee, and tanks
Chronicles of Spellborn is doing something along these lines (aiming spells and whatnot), and Age of Conan did this to some small extent with control of swinging your sword... and I think there was something about being able to aim your bow too.... dont know if it was implemented as I never used a bow in AoC.
Grymm MMO addict in recovery! EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH, Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
As long as I'm having fun while playing, then it's the perfect MMORPG at that particular time. My tastes change everyday lol. Sometimes I want to just sit around and talk. Other times I just want to sit around and craft. Sometimes I want to go pvp. etc etc. I guess that would mean, the Perfect MMORPG for me would have to have alot of different things I like to do and have fun doing at the same time.
ok this might take a bit of typing Eq death penalty- In EQ when you died two things happened... you lost at least several hours worth of EXP.... which was no joke. Even more serious...your body and all your items are left wherever you died. You had to form corpse runs to go get your bodies... but keep in mind unless you had a second set of gear in the bank you are naked and weaponless... trying to get back to a place that was bad enough to kill you in your best gear. Usually you hooked up with another group that was going the same way... but since there were so many dungeons spread all over this wasnt always easy. If you didnt recover your items within a week or so they disappeared forever! This made going deep into a dangerous place terrifying! EQ style quests- In EQ quests were started with a text dialog from an NPC. The NPC might say "I could really go for a <beer>" You had to take the keyword that was in brackets and for a sentence to say back to the NPC in the /say channel.... so you type "Here you go my friend, have a beer!"... the NPC would then thank you for the beer and say something else with a bracket. You had to form an intelligible sentence with the word.. you couldnt really cheat and just say "beer" and thats it. It was very engaging. EQ epic quests- Eq epic quests were truly epic adventures for endgame characters to get a special weapon for your particular class. The quests often took a month or more to complete and were very truly epic in scale and challenge... requiring full groups or even raids of max level people to help you. Challenge! Many played EQ for years without reaching max level... with the experience penalty upon death it was possible to play forever without making much progress if you were careless. Monsters were challenging and it was easy to get yourself in trouble. No MAPS!!!! You had to learn your way around by landmarks... it made the world seem huge and intimidating... made you feel more like you were really there. If something big and bad was chasing you you hoped like hell you were remembering the right direction to run in!
SWG- Allowed you to place your house nearly anywhere on certain planets... there were a variety of houses which could then be decorated with items either crafted or looted... display some of your old weapons and armor etc. My house was amazing.. I wish I had a fraps of it. Later they made player cities with elections for mayor and all. It was great but they mostly felt abandoned since there were so many and players were spread so thin.... there were tons of NPC cities.. and even more player cities. SWG character advancement: Instead of picking a class you leveled up skills in whatever class trees you wanted. There were a certain number of points you ultimately got to spend on skills so you couldnt possibly learn everything. I was a Master Pistoleer/Expert Bounty Hunter. You could mix and match however you wanted. Also crafting was a whole game in itself and plenty of people played SWG with pure crafting/marketing toons who never killed a single thing! They would set up a "house" and make it their shop. Shops were searchable on the world maps. L2 PvP rules: You can attack anyone at any time, but doing so makes you a murderer. This makes you a free target to any other players and makes guards aggro you. You could work this off by killing evil stuff untill you made up for your murder... but tryign to actually accomplish this before a group of players found you and saw your name was red and ganked you was very difficult! Also when players were killed they often dropped an item out of their inventory that the other players could loot and keep. L2 growing map: The L2 map isnt just an island with water all around it.... most of the edges of the map just fade out.... over time (with free expansions) the map gets bigger and bigger, giving you more land to explore. L2 would be my choice MMO to play but its totally unpopulated at low level areas, you pretty much need two accounts to play, and the economy is a disaster.
Hope that answers most of your questions!
I pretty much agree with all of this, with a few minor tweeks and a couple additions.
PVP- I like PVP to be faction based. Either you cannot fight your own faction (except duals, arenas or guild wars) or you can but with a heafty cost if you do. I like the going red and being catagorized as Murderer. I like city issued Wanted Posters, I like city issued bounties.
Maps- I have no problem with no maps at all, i actually like it. But i would be fine with, city maps and surrounding areas sold in the city. I even like maps sold for dungeons, but the more you pay the better the map, if you go cheap it could really really suck. This could even open up a new trade of map maker. I am also ok with in game maps that are blacked out until you explore the area, but no minimaps.
Travel- Very limited instant travel. I like boats, Airshps are ok i guess, Griffon rides are ok i guess but i would prefer not to have them or they are very limited. I do like certain "Jobs" to have the ability to port but it shoudl also be limited with not many ports locations.
Must have Fishing and Brewing. That is just a personnal thing.
Deity system- This is something i find very lacking in MMOs. EQ has a nice Deity base but it really didnt matter much what one you took, or if you took one at all. Your Deity choice should matter, perhaps the choice could increase or decrease certain spell types, or player stats. Perhaps a Deity choice would open up certain skills or spells only given to worshippers.
Also a nice PVP twist for the cant fight your own faction idea. If I am a Human and i pick a "Good" deity, and you are a human that picks a "Evil" Deity (or pretty much you just pick to Deities that dont like each other) then that opens you up to fight. Perhaps still with a faction penatly but it may be worth it. Perhaps you are granted a boon from your Deity if you send X amount of the rival Deities worshippers to meet thier maker.
Spells- I dont need new ones every level. I am fine with getting them every few levels. I also dont need them to automatically pop up as an option when i hit the appropriate level to use them. I dont mind going to a vendor or seeking them out. And i would also like spell components to reappear. Make me have bat wings if i want to cast levitate, or fish scales if i want to cast water breathing.
I also like player created selling points vise game bazaars or vendors who sell your wares. Yes you have to actually stop getting exp for a bit if you want to sell your stuff but it really adds to the community. And if you dont want to take the time standing around in the EC Tunnel ( memories) then you get one of your guildmates/friends to sell your stuff and you give them a cut.
AND PLEASE, make the game more about the trip from 1 to 50 and not just what happens after 50.
I won't go deep into what classes as the perfect MMO for me as i'm tired due to being up all night, but i'll say one game that used to be perfect for me and no other game has even come close sinse..
Star Wars Galaxies Pre-NGE
Not bothered about the theme (star wars in this case) but that game had it all for me.
perfect mmo is where it's exciting to explore, where it has interesting group dynamics to discover, where the game will suck you into a compelling rpg instead of a none-too-subtle grindfest. (a grindfest that gets you running all over and killing x and y mobs not as a purpose of a rpg but as a purpose to eat up a player's time while satisfying by very small amounts)
I think we need a MMO with devs that drop us on a planet and gives us tools and just take a step back and watch the evolution of a world/universe.
player created content with almost no involvement from devs except balancing and new tool additions.
Player created cities, player run shops, houses, a total economic system fully ran by players.
every Item in this game should be crafted and I mean everything from a battlecruiser to a bar to a NPC player owned bot that has dialog written by the owner and missions created by the player.
A living breathing world only as limited as the players own imagination.... that's my perfect MMO and something I won't ever see in my lifetime.
Edit: sorry for the typos I'm rushing to work at the moment.
I have something like this in mind, I'm working on it now. I'm excited about it and have several ideas about how it would evolve. I think this is the next level of MMO. I think this is where we go from here. give me a PM if you would like to talk specifics.
I know the definiton is subjective, so in your opinion: What qualities are necessary for a perfect MMORPG?
If you want go into detail for each quality that is necessary, and explain what should be avoided.
I think my perfect MMO would have:
- More than just raiding or PvP. Like crafting, music, etc. You could have a character that only crafts, or one that only works on playing music, or you could have a character that does it all.
- Immersive world. Little to no loading screens, polished and detailed.
- Player creations. Players have a house somewhere in the world, guild forts, etc. Players could create their own items, or at least personalize their crafts.
- A lot of mini games or puzzles. These would be for many of the quests (think about the zelda games or whatever). You would also be able to do most of them with other players.
- Crafting: Could be done without ever having to fight, and you would be able to craft most things. Crafting would also have different mini games for each profession, and maybe even some games you could play with other people at the same time to craft.
- Focus on the story! The MMO of my dreams would have a huge focus on the story from the beginning of the game and until the last possible quest. There would be a lot of in game cinematic type things, and you would feel immersed in the story and would want to keep progressing just to see the story unfold.
- PvP: All PvP would be based on traditional groups (DPS, Healer, tank). You would have the option to progress by only doing PvP if you wanted, but it would be a little slower than PvE. There would also be mass PvP battles, and PvP area.
- PvE: There would be many dungeons to explore, interesting quests, and epic raids. - Lots of emotes and player actions. There would be a lot of emotes in games or at least a few good ones, and there would be more than just walking around. Your character would be able to do things like dance, jump, crawl, etc.
- Decent graphics. They would have to be 3D, and they wouldn't have to be spectacular but good enough to look at and become immersed in the game world.
- Focus on community. There would be a reason for people to get together, and you wouldn't be losing out if you didn't get together, but you would be rewarded and possibly have more fun in groups. - Gear wouldn't be that important. Gear would only have a slight increase on your performance in PvE or PvP. You would also be able to do both PvE and PvP in the same type of gear (there wouldn't be PvE only and PvP only gear). The game would be more skill based than anything.
Of course everything would have to be polished, and the combat system would have to be somewhat interesting. There would be more focus on just playing and having fun vs. getting bigger and better gear all of the time, and there would be a lot more then what I listed, and plenty of things to avoid but that would take me all day to write about
I do not expect to ever get all the features I desire in a MMO, so, I decided to develop The Perfect MMORPG myself .
Key Features of Techlord's MMORPG:
1. Real-Time First Person Shooter/Arcade/Puzzle Game Mechanics
2. Full Support Tools for Player-Creation at every level {Media, Content, Logic, Dialog, Quest, Movie}.
I do not expect to ever get all the features I desire in a MMO, so, I decided to develop The Perfect MMORPG myself . Key Features of Techlord's MMORPG: 1. Real-Time First Person Shooter/Arcade/Puzzle Game Mechanics
2. Full Support Tools for Player-Creation at every level {Media, Content, Logic, Dialog, Quest, Movie}.
- Crafting and professions with a much larger and more meaningful impact on the world. Crafted items being far superior to vendor items. Totally player-oriented economy.
- Random mobs, items and encounters. Change according to world events.
- Non-linear gameplay, but with a series of overarching quests that you complete at your descretion. They would be dynamic and change according to world events and your own actions.
- Character alignments that change according to in-game actions. Physical features and NPC responses would reflect your alignment.
- Living world. NPC's going about their daily lives, indepedant of the players. What the hell, where is the bread vendor?! He's sleeping at the moment. Give the guy a break...
Comments
That would be great.
I think grouping should be much more rewarding then soloing.... I pay a monthly fee to play with other people.. not to play by myself.
Grymm
MMO addict in recovery!
EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH,
Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
Thanks for the response Swift
Everything from SWG and L2 sounded great to me that you mentioned (loved the thing about being able to attack anything- that would be neat), but I'm not sure if I liked the EQ things except for the type of quests you mentioned. Having to do corpse runs for your items, taking forever to level, and not having a map don't sound very fun to me personally
--------------------------
Playing:
FFXIV, TERA, LoL, and HoTS
My Rig:
GPU: GeForce GTX 770, CPU: i7-4790K, Memory: 16 GB RAM
Asheron's Call would have been mostly perfect for you.
- More than just raiding or PvP. Like crafting, music, etc. You could have a character that only crafts, or one that only works on playing music, or you could have a character that does it all.
A character that does nothing but tinker (change item properties) and create things, yes. Music, on the other hand, no.
- Immersive world. Little to no loading screens, polished and detailed.
Check. No loading screens unless you were portaling from place to place, but thats understandable. Vanguard has similar system.
- Player creations. Players have a house somewhere in the world, guild forts, etc. Players could create their own items, or at least personalize their crafts.
House - check.
- A lot of mini games or puzzles. These would be for many of the quests (think about the zelda games or whatever). You would also be able to do most of them with other players.
Quests had a somewhat puzzle-ish nature. Some more than others. But there isn't (rather wasn't) any quest tracker, or GUI element telling you where you needed to be.
- Crafting: Could be done without ever having to fight, and you would be able to craft most things. Crafting would also have different mini games for each profession, and maybe even some games you could play with other people at the same time to craft.
There is a system to get xp for different crafting actions. But it wasn't huge.
- Focus on the story! The MMO of my dreams would have a huge focus on the story from the beginning of the game and until the last possible quest. There would be a lot of in game cinematic type things, and you would feel immersed in the story and would want to keep progressing just to see the story unfold.
While there wasn't a lot of cinematic, there was a heavy focus on the story arcs. Towns that were destroyed. Sever wide events. I could go into more detail, but PM for that. There was tons of story related stuff.
- PvP: All PvP would be based on traditional groups (DPS, Healer, tank). You would have the option to progress by only doing PvP if you wanted, but it would be a little slower than PvE. There would also be mass PvP battles, and PvP area.
This, sadly, did not exist.
- PvE: There would be many dungeons to explore, interesting quests, and epic raids.
Huge world with tons of quests and dungeons.
- Lots of emotes and player actions. There would be a lot of emotes in games or at least a few good ones, and there would be more than just walking around. Your character would be able to do things like dance, jump, crawl, etc.
There wasn't a huge list. But there was a decent amount.
- Decent graphics. They would have to be 3D, and they wouldn't have to be spectacular but good enough to look at and become immersed in the game world.
It was decent immersion 6 years ago for a fully 3d world.
- Focus on community. There would be a reason for people to get together, and you wouldn't be losing out if you didn't get together, but you would be rewarded and possibly have more fun in groups.
Always. Fellowships & Allegiences. With a fellowship the xp was split, but it wasn't like 50/50. The total percentage of xp added up to be more than 100%, so it was always a good deal, because you could kill faster and get better xp/hour. In the allegiance, you could have a number of vassels. Depending on the loyalty skill of the vassal and the leadership skill of the patron, the patron would earn a percentage of xp based on the total xp gained by the vassal.
- Gear wouldn't be that important. Gear would only have a slight increase on your performance in PvE or PvP. You would also be able to do both PvE and PvP in the same type of gear (there wouldn't be PvE only and PvP only gear). The game would be more skill based than anything.
The gear was the same, generally, for both. But since gear in Asheron's Call was tinkerable, you could create sets of armor that were more efficient for PvE or PvP and such. Asheron's Call's item system was by far the best ever implemented. Current MMOs have a cookie cutter system, as I call it. With the cookie cutter system, if two items have the same name (and are of the same rarity), then they have the same stats. In Asheron's Call, it was much more variable.
Unfortunately, Asheron's Call, while it is still alive, it is not alive by much. It still has a small but dedicated following, but most of the community is gone. Hopefully, one day, Turbine can update and redo Asheron's Call (without screwing it up). Or at least create a new game, that has the same formula as Asheron's Call.
let me try to peice together peices of mmo's that i've had the "joy" of playing...
to start off...
FFXI: My favorite MMO, going on 5 years now. I'll take FF's Story Line and the Leveling difficulty. I love FF's story line and with every expansion comes a new "main" quest. The difficulty used to be epic for leveling when the game first came out but has got substantionally easier, which to me makes sense as a mmo ages. The Job change at any time is completely amazing, I love that on one character i have multiple level caped out guys and thus you as a main character benefit for having as many jobs as you can leveld up. Merits, merits are what you earn for getting experience after leveling to the cap, they allow you to add skills,spells,attributes, and abilites to you on any job or a specific one based on the merit. It's a great way to enjoy playing a level caped job in an experience situation even after you're caped out. Level Sync is a new thing in the FF world, it allows players from any level to lower themselves to a party members level in order to help that person level up, it makes it possible for a guy who's level 75 every job to party with a friend just starting the game at level 10. By syncing the 75 will be lowered to 10 and level up along side of his friend, all the while gaining exp.
WoW: hmm, with WoW I would take the Accessiblity. Almost any comp can play it, hell even some cell phones can play it. This game has what every game wants, a Large community. I don't want the community of 10 year olds and idiots spaming chat in UC, but the number of people on and willing to group up at all times is a nice factor. End game pvp, I really love how this game gives pvp rewards, some of the best equip in game requires you to PVP which is a great way of making people enjoy that part of the game. Good vs. Evil, the faction based system is pretty cool, I really like how if your a boring alliance and I'm a horde, not only can I not understand you in chat, but I am sworn to destroy you. (WAR is very cool with this also, as are a lot of games i know. But WoW just brings it to the fore-front like most games don't)
GW: umm... I just like the fact of it being Free. Can anyone blame me here?
SWG (pre lame): With the original SWG you could honestly play the game and love it... without firing a blaster. The Choices of how to build your character were amazing. And the way they introduced people to being jedi's was fun,difficult, and rewarding. This is awesome to me, the way that you hade to find out within a quest what was needed for you personally to be a jedi was so cool.
EQ: I love the fact that after so long a dedicated player base is still existant. I tried this game for a few days, not for me, but I can definitly see why people are still in love with this.
Lineage(s): No level cap. I like the fact that you never have to stop.
Archlord: One player has a influence. This to me is pretty cool. The fact that one single player who works harder and is more dedicated than most others can actually attain claim to "Being the best". Screw leaderboards, honestly. Just wait 2 weeks and challenge the dude.
EVE: I didn't get into this game much, but i definitly could see why people enjoyed it. This game has so much to offer players interested in putting time into a game they want something out of. I really like the Completely open world. You can fly around and just feel like theres no end.
LoTRO: Again, played this game and enjoyed it, but backed off a bit a few weeks in. I really liked the Lore. The reason people even gave this game the look is because they wanted to be apart of the world of middle earth. A perfect MMO would have to capture players in this extent... to me anyway.
TR: I know it exists in many games, but in TR I especially enjoyed the fact of Changing classes/jobs as you level up. I really enjoyed how even after I went to next class i was still able to level up my mines from the previous class and strengthen my lightning from the first class. Also the character cloan is another concept of this game which is interesting. You are able to esentially "Save" your character and if you don't like the class you've selected post selection you are able to go back to your cloaned former self and switch it up.
Vanguard: Cool Diplomacy type gameplay. An interesting little "mini-game" as I would feel it is, it's pretty cool if you don't feel like fighting but want to sit around and still do something at least.
Yeah well thats all I can come up with on such a short notice (like 5 mins of thinking). Let me know if I've missed anything or any opinions.
I agree with just about all of Swift's ideas, except the lack of a map. I don't necessarily believe it should have the "you are here" function, but having a static one is realistic in populated and explored regions. Maybe for purchase or player created trade.
Also, I'd like to add two things to the list.
First, my ideal MMO would make the players feel as though they are exceptional and rare in the world. In every MMO I've played, I have had my immersion killed the moment I went back to town and hung out with the fifty or so heroes around the mailbox. Places where the only NPCs are there only to cater to the player's needs. I would do this by populating the cities with thousands of NPCs. Think of any of the cities in Assassin's Creed. There would certainly be masses of players in popular trade centers, of course, but they would still be a very small part of the overall population.
Second, I would have a realistic ecosystem. There is nothing heroic about the genocidal elimination of creatures simply because they reside just outside your towns gate. If the quest claims that Murlocs are raiding the village, then have them raid the village. Similarly, most animals fear and avoid humans. However, in MMOs, most animals wander around in the open, at all hours, then attack you when you are in range.
This ecosystem would also mean fewer animals in an area, not blobs of random creatures stacked on top of each other in starter areas.
I used WOW for my examples, but it is essentially the same in EQ, EQ2, GW, SWG, L2, Vanguard, Requiem, and Perfect World. Eve also falls under this, but being solely ship based, is excluded.
I liked this idea a lot. If monsters were actually attacking towns, and wolves or whatnot were actually hiding and afraid of humans that would certainly be a lot more interesting than mobs just pacing back in forth at one spot waiting to be killed.
But not sure if I would want to cut down the amount of mobs in each area personally ( I don't like waiting forever for respawns
and at the same time if they spawned too quick it would hurt immersion)
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Playing:
FFXIV, TERA, LoL, and HoTS
My Rig:
GPU: GeForce GTX 770, CPU: i7-4790K, Memory: 16 GB RAM
I think that the area would have to determine the number and type of mobs. In high population areas, like cities and around larger castles, there would be no monsters and little wildlife...except rats.
It would dramatically change the way players are introduced to a game. Instead of having a set starting area for all characters, what if your choice in profession determined where you began? Let's say you make a ranger-type character. You would start in a small hamlet in a modestly populated area and have quests that fit that profession. The area around the hamlet would have plenty of wildlife and a few, weak mobs.
Now a thief-type character could start in a big city. If my large population idea was used, the thief would get few kill quests, but would be able to break into NPC homes, pickpocket, etc.. Combat could be against rival gangs, drug dealers, guards.
It would be a completely different starting experience and would eliminate the need for large number of mobs to farm. It also would allow those players who are not as interested in combat to have a viable area to live in.
I'm not suggesting that combat be reduced, just handled in a more realistic setting. The further from civilization you get, the scarier the world becomes... usually.
What would be required for that to happen?
I'll actually mirror wjrasmussen, and simply answer your question with "I don't know". :-)
I've enjoyed a good number of MMOGs, with rather different takes on design, graphics and features. Saying an MMOG needs to have core focus A, or graphic style B, or features C, D and E, is futile for me, as I've enjoyed games that lack what I list and also not enjoyed games that have what I list.
And judging by what "most" people say they "need" in a game and what games most people actually play, I'm not so sure anybody else know exactly what they want or enjoy either. ;-)
Well with my Bounty idea they could just make the players come up with the money and post how much they're willing to pay for so and so's ear.
I'd post more but I've got to get to work right now...
1. No lag
2. Responsive combat, you press a key and your instant attack is instant.
This is why WoW is #1, no lag. You never lose control of your character because of lag. And even WoW could improve.
What would be required for that to happen?
lol Aeroangel.. I like you already!
Me too Aeroangel. Making a game both ideallistic and pratical in production is basically a nightmare.
I am drawing up a plan for a MMORPG right now, which I am actually not making, it is just a hobby.
60% complete. However, it has too many systems and intricacies to be practical already at this stage. Since designing a game is not just about ideas, but also about how to apply them. Even though I don't even plan on applying them, still best to do it that way.
I want an MMO where I can walk around in 3D with some super high-tech goggles and feel like Im actually swinging a sword into someones face...
...ahh dreams...
I never read any of the NPC dialog in an MMORPG if I can help it, and I never read any of the lore. It seems boring and pointless to me, since it doesnt' affect the game play.
One of the few RPG's where the story has actually interested me, is KOTOR. But I wouldn't want to play that as a multiplayer game. I was enjoying watching the cut scenes, and listening to the NPC 's tell me the story. I wouldn't need anyone else around while I'm watching cut scenes.
Well on the subject of dialog I'm thinking the quest givers and NPCs would actually talk to you (like from oblivion), and it wouldn't be long winded and boring. You would be able to skip through or avoid the dialog if you wanted.
Like personally the one thing I enjoyed the most from WoTLK was the death knight quest line. It just felt epic to me, and it was almost like I was playing in a short movie or something. If you could make an entire game's quest line as interesting as that one I probably wouldn't mind doing the quests again
And I think pets would have to be in the game as well
I think MMO's with a storyline are a mistake.... and there are quite a few out there right now. I also believe Aion is going to have a storyline with cinematics etc. Quests with storylines are good
but they should be individual storylines, not an overall story that encompasses the entire game.
The story you experience should be the story of your characters random travels through the world... I could write a nice story based on my EQ1 adventures!
Story lines are for single player games.. personally I love single player FPS games for that.
And Aero... if you want epic try an EQ1 epic quest
Grymm
MMO addict in recovery!
EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH,
Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
So you think people should be able to make their own quests in the game or what =O I'm curious about this!
I also think it'd be great if, while the type of gear wouldn't be THAT importaint, it did affect how you performed in battle (i.e. Leather Armor wouldn't absorb all that much damage but would allow you to move around faster while something like Plate Mail would absorb a lot more damage but you would barely be able to move.) and there would be weak spots that people could get through to do max damage (i.e. someone with a bow could aim for an exposed arm pit or other area not fully covered by plates and do critical damage)
I also think... I'll just stop here with these two points before I spend forever typing something up...
I think that's an excellent idea! I love the idea about gear! I also love the idea that people who play ranged classes (caster, archer, etc.) would have to actually AIM in combat! Would definitely take a lot of skill, and now I need to think of something fun and skillful for healers, melee, and tanks
Chronicles of Spellborn is doing something along these lines (aiming spells and whatnot), and Age of Conan did this to some small extent with control of swinging your sword... and I think there was something about being able to aim your bow too.... dont know if it was implemented as I never used a bow in AoC.
Grymm
MMO addict in recovery!
EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH,
Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
As long as I'm having fun while playing, then it's the perfect MMORPG at that particular time. My tastes change everyday lol. Sometimes I want to just sit around and talk. Other times I just want to sit around and craft. Sometimes I want to go pvp. etc etc. I guess that would mean, the Perfect MMORPG for me would have to have alot of different things I like to do and have fun doing at the same time.
I pretty much agree with all of this, with a few minor tweeks and a couple additions.
PVP- I like PVP to be faction based. Either you cannot fight your own faction (except duals, arenas or guild wars) or you can but with a heafty cost if you do. I like the going red and being catagorized as Murderer. I like city issued Wanted Posters, I like city issued bounties.
Maps- I have no problem with no maps at all, i actually like it. But i would be fine with, city maps and surrounding areas sold in the city. I even like maps sold for dungeons, but the more you pay the better the map, if you go cheap it could really really suck. This could even open up a new trade of map maker. I am also ok with in game maps that are blacked out until you explore the area, but no minimaps.
Travel- Very limited instant travel. I like boats, Airshps are ok i guess, Griffon rides are ok i guess but i would prefer not to have them or they are very limited. I do like certain "Jobs" to have the ability to port but it shoudl also be limited with not many ports locations.
Must have Fishing and Brewing. That is just a personnal thing.
Deity system- This is something i find very lacking in MMOs. EQ has a nice Deity base but it really didnt matter much what one you took, or if you took one at all. Your Deity choice should matter, perhaps the choice could increase or decrease certain spell types, or player stats. Perhaps a Deity choice would open up certain skills or spells only given to worshippers.
Also a nice PVP twist for the cant fight your own faction idea. If I am a Human and i pick a "Good" deity, and you are a human that picks a "Evil" Deity (or pretty much you just pick to Deities that dont like each other) then that opens you up to fight. Perhaps still with a faction penatly but it may be worth it. Perhaps you are granted a boon from your Deity if you send X amount of the rival Deities worshippers to meet thier maker.
Spells- I dont need new ones every level. I am fine with getting them every few levels. I also dont need them to automatically pop up as an option when i hit the appropriate level to use them. I dont mind going to a vendor or seeking them out. And i would also like spell components to reappear. Make me have bat wings if i want to cast levitate, or fish scales if i want to cast water breathing.
I also like player created selling points vise game bazaars or vendors who sell your wares. Yes you have to actually stop getting exp for a bit if you want to sell your stuff but it really adds to the community. And if you dont want to take the time standing around in the EC Tunnel ( memories) then you get one of your guildmates/friends to sell your stuff and you give them a cut.
AND PLEASE, make the game more about the trip from 1 to 50 and not just what happens after 50.
LOTRO meets the majority of those requests OP. Reason its the best MMO on the market/.
I won't go deep into what classes as the perfect MMO for me as i'm tired due to being up all night, but i'll say one game that used to be perfect for me and no other game has even come close sinse..
Star Wars Galaxies Pre-NGE
Not bothered about the theme (star wars in this case) but that game had it all for me.
perfect mmo is where it's exciting to explore, where it has interesting group dynamics to discover, where the game will suck you into a compelling rpg instead of a none-too-subtle grindfest. (a grindfest that gets you running all over and killing x and y mobs not as a purpose of a rpg but as a purpose to eat up a player's time while satisfying by very small amounts)
The perfect MMORPG would be one without:
1. WoW fanboi.
2. Propaganda flamers.
3. People without common sense.
If the game is good however, I'd play even if the above people are present.
I think we need a MMO with devs that drop us on a planet and gives us tools and just take a step back and watch the evolution of a world/universe.
player created content with almost no involvement from devs except balancing and new tool additions.
Player created cities, player run shops, houses, a total economic system fully ran by players.
every Item in this game should be crafted and I mean everything from a battlecruiser to a bar to a NPC player owned bot that has dialog written by the owner and missions created by the player.
A living breathing world only as limited as the players own imagination.... that's my perfect MMO and something I won't ever see in my lifetime.
Edit: sorry for the typos I'm rushing to work at the moment.
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
Metal,
I have something like this in mind, I'm working on it now. I'm excited about it and have several ideas about how it would evolve. I think this is the next level of MMO. I think this is where we go from here. give me a PM if you would like to talk specifics.
I do not expect to ever get all the features I desire in a MMO, so, I decided to develop The Perfect MMORPG myself
.
Key Features of Techlord's MMORPG:
1. Real-Time First Person Shooter/Arcade/Puzzle Game Mechanics
2. Full Support Tools for Player-Creation at every level {Media, Content, Logic, Dialog, Quest, Movie}.
3. Fully Customizable Modular Game Entities {Terrain, Characters, Weapons, Vehicles, Props, Building, Structures, Machines, Plants).
4. Fully Customizable Character Race, Class, Skills Attributes.
5. Integrated Communication & Dialog System for Interactive Story Crafting between GMs & Players.
7. Group-Centric Reward System from Parties to Guilds.
8. Economy System based on a Real-Time Strategy Input/Ouput Model.
9. Advanced AI for distinguishable PVE Mob Behaviors.
10. Tournament-Driven PvP.
11. Meaningful Day/Night Cycle, Weather Effects and Conditions.
12. Meaningful Visual Effects, such as Infra-vision.
Sounds very interesting; I love some of the concepts! You are developing it yourself you say
Lately I've been planning out my own MMO ... quite irksome just planning one and having to figure out all of the details
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Playing:
FFXIV, TERA, LoL, and HoTS
My Rig:
GPU: GeForce GTX 770, CPU: i7-4790K, Memory: 16 GB RAM
Hmm. I would have to say:
- No PvP. Balance issues are the bane of MMO's.
- Crafting and professions with a much larger and more meaningful impact on the world. Crafted items being far superior to vendor items. Totally player-oriented economy.
- Random mobs, items and encounters. Change according to world events.
- Non-linear gameplay, but with a series of overarching quests that you complete at your descretion. They would be dynamic and change according to world events and your own actions.
- Character alignments that change according to in-game actions. Physical features and NPC responses would reflect your alignment.
- Living world. NPC's going about their daily lives, indepedant of the players. What the hell, where is the bread vendor?! He's sleeping at the moment. Give the guy a break...