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Horizons:Still Alive?
ttomm46
Member UncommonPosts: 446
HI
I was thinking of trying this game but remembered something about the accounts being hacked at one time being posted on here..Besides that ,would the game be worth it in the long run..?..Mature acting community?
Tom
Comments
For a quick recap; the game had several major problems on release. Although it had some players who have been remarkably loyal because of the game's unique features, many left because of the problems.
Two major changes were eventually made; playing as a dragon was made much more fun as dragons were made powerful, and the beginning tutorials and areas were greatly improved.
As a result, the subscriber population began to grow, and the game reached break-even profitability. The game was now salable, and the venture capitalist sold the game to EI/PE (?) who were not experienced in the business.
Because of required changes by the billing co. at the same time, EI decided instead to institute their own (insecure) billing system. It was not hacked (AFAIK) but it could have been. The ownership reverted to the VC, who then sold the game to a group of Hz former developers and engineers, Virtrium. So far, Vi has been excellent; they've done what they said they would (secure billing system first thing of course), do not overpromise, and make sure that what they do is tested and works. First. Amazing concept. They announce what they might do, and they LISTEN (another amazing concept) and modify the plans to meet the players' suggestions. Very good, professional group. One of the devs posted that they are in the black, so yes, I expect them to be around for a long time.
Sorry, got carried away. The community has always been one of Hz's strengths. Even better these days, as many of the players have "done it all" and get a lot of their enjoyment from mentoring. Order server has fewer people who are somewhat more into Roleplay, Chaos has more players.
Dragons are the most popular race, and most players have at least a dragon alt. They are slightly weak in the lower levels, and cannot fly until they become adults by completing the Rite of Passage quest series; a very good quest. Full strength is achieved by becoming Ancient, who are BIG, and powerful.
Crafting is unique, and some players primarily craft, including building/garden/shop construction as well as the usual tools, weapons and armor.
Great post..thanks..
I'm a new player on the trial and I have really enjoyed the trial so far.
imo from what I've seen, a long term commitment to this game would be worthwhile. Based on the community, devs, and what the game has to offer.
The skill system doesn't confine you to one class so if you'd like to branch out into other skills you can.
Crafting is cool too. There is the ability to own property and build your own place if you level up the skills. There are community building projects to help out on, work for hire, etc.
There isn't alot of chatting going on, but I've found the community helpful and mature.
There is no credit card needed to play around with the 14 day trial. So if your reading this and wondering about giving the trial a shot, I'd say it's definitely worth your time.
How populated is the game? If I make an account will there be enough people to adventure with?
There are two servers, Order and Chaos. Order is more into Role Play, and has fewer players, so I'd suggest Chaos, especially if you play at unusual times. There is a chat channel for new player assistance, and the Marketplace channel is where a lot of questions get asked also.
Horizons is a crafting game with a little Adventuring thrown in.
Watch your thoughts; they become words.
Watch your words; they become actions.
Watch your actions; they become habits.
Watch your habits; they become character.
Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
Lao-Tze
Many guilds have members who maintain low level alts for just that purpose. See Quietcamper's post above; it is a welcoming community.
I once did the trail, but decided not to continue with the game because of schoolwork, but now I'm back (gained another 14 days for free because of the possible return), and I have kind of one big question.
Based on the time I've been playing now, it seems like the game is just one big grindfest. I then ask myself, do I want to pay € 15,- a month to grind stuff...
Please, if someone can assure me that the game contains more then that, tell me.
(note: At the moment, I'm not in a guild or anything, wich gives me not really someone to talk to, wich in turn leads to the fact that I just watch tv as I play, wich make that I don't really watch the chat channel, wich directs me to the fact that I won't join a guild that way. If someone is interested in welcoming a new person in his/her/it's guild...
)
Welcome back.
It's up to you whether it's a grindfest. One can say that any game is a grindfest, and every game has been accused of it at varying frequency. Ultimately it depends on what activities you choose to spend your in-game time doing.
Here are a few of the obvious, non-socialising-based things you can do other than grinding. I've played Horizons less than six months, though, so I'm by no means an expert and may've neglected some points.
Socialising-based things are abundant as well. There are guilds, of course. A helpful community known for relative maturity. Rampant roleplaying on the RP server, "Order."
----------Quests:
It has quests, many of which are actually interesting and more involved than the standard quests one encounters in other games. The interesting ones tend to come from non-standard NPCs (i.e. not trainers), so you have a bit of a hunt to do.
----------Exploration:
There are out-of-the-way locales to explore, portal destinations to attune to...
I've particularly enjoyed exploring the snowy land around Kirasanct and Mahagra, where glittering ice buildings and Fiendish ruins lay half-hidden.
Now that hatchling dragons can glide off precipices, one can make it a goal to find the highest places to glide from.
There are plots of land owned (or not, in which case you can buy them) and built by players, as well as dragon lairs. Plots are generally near other plots, which in some cases forms towns. You can explore plots/lairs, seeing what others have built; some are quite beautiful.
You can use their crafting machines: Mark on your map the locations of high-teir crafting machines, because these grant you a bonus to the skill associated with the machine.
In many plots/lairs, the owners install storage silos, and sometimes these are publically accessible: Mark these on your map too, especially if they're close to resources. You can determine if the silo is public by finding the plot's plaque-thing-on-the-ground-at-the-edge / the lair's entrance and double-clicking it, which shows ownership information and a list of structures. Check each storage structure; the permissions are displayed on the right, and if it's public, it will be "Allow All."
----------Crafting:
There are several aspects of crafting. A good crafter is generally someone who can create an item quickly, by knowing exactly where to go to get the resources, which portal(s) to use to get there, etc. It's also important to have technique resources on hand.
Techniques are like mini-formulae, which you can scribe without fulfilling any requirements, and which are added to an item you are about to create via the crafting window. They enhance or add to a spell's effect or an item's statistics, dye armour a different colour, etc.
First you have to have the technique and scribe it. They can be bought from other players either directly or from Consigners, bought from Quartermaster NPCs, or looted while adventuring.
Second you have to have the resources a technique requires. Usually this is a small number of a couple different looted Technique Resource types, plus some normal resources which compensate for the technique application. If you don't want to adventure, or the creature bearing the tech' resource you need is too strong for you, you can buy tech' resources off other players (or, if you're lucky, a Consigner). To find players who might have what you need, join the Marketplace channel. Otherwise, you can do the adventuring yourself, hunting the creature(s) which have a chance to drop the tech' resource(s).
You can sell your craftings, tech'ed or not, on Consigners. Or you can give them away to players who can use them. Or, if you're a dragon, you can hoard them; if you know a dragon, you can give them to them to hoard.
Collecting formulae that will allow you to craft more / higher teir items is also useful, important for a serious crafter, and can be fun. They're obtained with the same methods as techniques, except that they're sold by crafter trainer NPCs instead of Quartermasters.
----------Building:
If you play a biped and you buy a plot, you have a variety of buildings (houses of different sizes and racial styles, silos, crafting machines, a guild hall, a consigners or pawnbroker, a tavern, a pagoda, vault, etc.) and fluff (trees, walls, flooring, themed decorations, fountains, etc.) which can be installed. Here's an article about it, which includes screenshots. Here is more in that vein.
If you play a dragon and buy a lair, you can build assorted tunnels and chambers, many of which are huge by biped standards, some even by dragon standards. Crafting machines, storage, halls and "lair chambers" (and in the lairs of a very few longstanding and dedicated players, OMGWTFmassive "grand halls"), consigners and pawnbrokers, etc. All available in two styles, one reddish/warm/lava, the other plain/cold/water, based on the two draconic idealogical factions Lunus and Helian.
Lairs come in different sizes and dimensions. Some have more space to the sides, some more to the front and back, some have relatively little horizontal space but great vertical space resulting in nine or ten floors, and some are balanced. Plots do not have a vertical dimension, but I think that is made up for with their wider variety of structures.
Planning your plot/lair can be very fun. The actual building of it can also be fun if you have the right temperament: It takes a long time and large numbers of resources in multiple resource processing stages. As a result, it's very satisfying to complete a building/chamber.
In the case of lairs, few players consider theirs "finished." Since plot/lair construction is so freeform, what qualifies as finishing is entirely up to the individual player. Maybe one could say it is finished when there's no more room on the plot / in the lair, but one can deconstruct buildings/chambers at any time, recouping 80% of the resources.
----------Events:
Horizons has a history of exciting live storyline events. Attacks by the PvE enemy, the Withered Aegis...an outbreak of plague...one of the capital cities and two of the eleven playable races were unlocked by players in live events...
It's been a long time since these were held, due to Horizons being owned for one year by a very unsavoury company called EI Interactive. Now that the wonderful Virtrium (I call it that with honesty and the corroboration of experience) owns Horizons, I have faith (which is amazing, considering my cynicism) that the events will return, probably within the year. Already two new holiday events, Hammer's Rest in autumn and Gnomekindle in winter, have occurred. No doubt storyline events are following, especially since the latest newsletter foreshadows a renewal of Withered Aegis activity.
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
I think the security problems have been addressed.
Community... Horizons has an odd mix of the very best and the very worst. I think the former outnumber the latter, but the latter can be more vocal. Horizons still has a nasty core of really old (game-wise) players who have played since the beginning and are bitter and twisted about all of the improvements - cos they had it harder when they started playing....
The chat channels can become incredibly feral - worse than anything you'll ever see in any other mmo, and the devs generally turn a blind eye to it.
If you can get into a good guild it's less noticeable - you can turn off the global chat channels and enjoy the game.
I wouldn't say anyone turns a blind eye to the occasional outburst of vitriol; it's more that such outbursts generally don't violate any of the TOS limitations. People are going to gripe and complain and be rude, but those aren't against the rules.
However, if someone's behavior DOES violate the TOS due to things like racist comments, sexual harassment, or other prohibited conduct, that's different. That sort of conduct should be documented and reported because it is not acceptable. Fortunatly, such conduct is exceedingly rare; anyone who makes a habit of acting like that can pretty much be considered to be a self-correcting error.
Guildleader, Mithril Council, Chaos
I can assure you from personal experience that the devs turn a blind eye to things that expressly violate the ToS. The concrete example I can give is someone making jokes about reducing the middle east to a layer of glass. Personally I don't think genocide's funny and racial/religious slurs expressly violate the ToS.
However, when I reported it, along with a screenshot of everything, the response I got back was thanks for the "information". When I pointed out that I wasn't providing them with information but had made a complaint and felt that a warning was in order, they disagreed and said they were going to do nothing.
While the last thing the person who made the joke said was:
"I really don't give a flying f%^k that I offend you and your holier than thou attitude is pretty f%^king humerous"
the dev's official response was:
"It appears to us that [Player's name] understood that no one really wanted any more of that kind of inappropriate chat - and we don't think he'll continue such behavior."
I know how these processes are supposed to work - where a violation can be substantiated, the appropriate action is to talk to the perpetrator, explain how what they did violates the ToS and issue a warning.
Doing nothing is a... novel approach.
So I gave my lair to a friend and stopped playing. There's just no way I'll pay money to play a game where the devs tolerate this kind of stuff. And having had this experience I could now understand how some chat channels could become so feral.
Got that slightly wrong - was more religious than racial. Dug up the old screenie:
"if I were in charge mecca would be a large continuous sheet of glass"
With all the craziness going on over in that area of the world it doesnt suprise me that folks joke about that. However, I think joking about nuking the middle east is a bit far from a religious or racial slur.
Im usually one to get bent out of shape about religious and racial bigotry, but nuking the middle east... its very similar to saying lets nuke the germans back in the 40's (granted that was before the weapons were created but still)
Last I checked burning the american flag over there was a past time, so I wont get to hard on folks who jokingly comment about WMD's
Ah my bad then. I must have missed the clause in the ToS which permits religious/racial slurs aimed at countries the US has recently invaded.
Nope, still not finding genocide funny...
How exactly is that a racial slur?
Green13, the statement that you are citing may be upsetting, but it doesn't qualify as a breach of the TOS. It is not a racial or religious slur. I would say it's close to the line, yes, but it doesn't cross it.
The issue is not that Virtrium refused to do anything; it's that what you reported was determined not to be a violation. I can tell that decision bothered you, and I understand your anger over it, but saying something ignorant isn't against the rules.
Personally, I find the statement ugly, offensive, and it says a lot about the person who made it. I think you did the right thing in confronting this person. Sadly, people like this are often very skilled at skating the very edge of acceptability, but never actually passing over it. You are also going to find them anywhere you go, and in any game you play, doing the same things you saw them do in Horizons. You can't stop them, any more than any game company you care to name is able to.
What you can do is stand up to them, report them when you can, and work to make the game community as a whole a better place.
Best of luck, where ever your journeys take you, and good gaming!
Guildleader, Mithril Council, Chaos
Seriously? Suggesting Mecca be nuked doesn't cross the line? Vitrium certainly had the opportunity to claim it didn't violate their ToS and they didn't. And they didn't because that's silly.
What they claimed is what I cited in my earlier post.
Suggesting that Mecca be nuked.... I can't think of anything comparably insulting in western culture. My experience with Islam is fairly limited but I can't think of any other modern day religion that treats a geographical location with such reverence.
But trying to come back to topic, the kind of chat that goes on in Horizons is something you don't see in other mmos. In all my time playing other mmos I only ever once saw a chat channel approach the sheer nastiness that erupts on a regular basis in Horizons. And I've never seen a comment like the mecca one in any other mmo - because they deal with even small infractions seriously.
Horizons has a lot to recommend it, but I think the claim to 'good community' is only partly true. The good is definitely very good - Ryzom would be the only other mmo I've played that's in the same ball park. But the bad is bad, vocal and largely unrestrained. Personally I think their player base been so small for so long that the devs shy away from dealing with problems like this for fear of losing the subscriptions of this bunch.
The second time I tried a Horizons free trial I was in there for all of four hours, the last two spent watching three players viciously attacking practically everyone else in the chat channel and all I could think was, "how does this happen?" And then I uninstalled it and went back to playing some other mmo.
I'm seriously not angry over the decision. It's Vitrium's game and they can run it however they like. I'm not so cynical that I connect their pro-US military thing with tolerance of anti-middle-eastern remarks. I think they knowingly turn a blind eye to ToS violations for fear of losing players.
Which server have you played on?
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
Most recently it was Chaos. Somewhat aptly named :P
Well there you go.
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
Well fair enough - I'll qualify that the community problems I've seen I've only seen recently on Chaos - which is the most populated server.
Is Order better? Cos the Marketplace channel on Chaos - supposedly the trade channel - at least once or twice a week just turns into an all-out slagfest. And all you can do when it starts is leave the channel. I've seen stuff get heated before in other mmos - but it tends to be over in a few minutes as opposed to lasting for an hour or more at a time.
Though my more general criticism of the devs - that they turn a blind eye to ToS violations still stands. Unless you can somehow reconcile these two statements? Virtrium couldn't when I asked them to.
I'm not sure, since as a dedicated roleplayer I've stuck to low-population and limited-scope channels most of the time. But this isn't the first time I've heard of Chaos having community problems that I've never heard of Order having. When there's drama on Order, usually it's just In-Character conflict.
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
The Chaos slagfests are pretty much players being nasty for the sheer pleasure of it.
As well as the devs ignoring the ToS, I think maybe the Horizons playerbase has become overly tolerant. They've suffered such a long time with a game with so many problems and with shonky owners... that they've had to lower their standards. And this has included permitting the hands-off approach (or should I say retreat? :P ) to dealing with problem players.