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more of the same @ SWG
ArcAngel3
Member Posts: 2,931
So I popped over to the SOE boards to see what all the hubbub is lately around some recent nerf. I guess the devs gave players a block ability; they now think it's overpowered,and they're toning it down some. What makes this a bit more tense it seems is that players put really expensive mods into the block ability, and now feel that they have been wasted.
So I read a post where some guy is wanting the option of using his mods on something else in light of the change. Sounds like a reasonable request to me. The answers from other players are what prompted me to write this post. The guy that was asking for a way to move his mods was:
-called a noob,
-called a whiner,
-told to stop crying,
-blamed for the nerf,
-told that people like him are to be blamed for the CU,
-told that people like him are to be blamed for the NGE,
-told that people were stupid for spending 100 million on mods in the first place,
-told that he was just crying because he lost his "I win" button.
What is that, some kind of script you have to memorize if you want to support the way SOE manages the game? "Anytime people raise a concern about a game change, make sure you call them noobs, call them whiners, tell them to stop crying, blame them for the NGE etc. etc." These were the responses when people raised concerns about the CU. These were the responses when people raised concerns about the NGE. These were the responses when people raised concerns about deletion of faction status. These were the responses when people raised concerns about (insert pretty much anything you want here--collision detection, group xp nerf etc..
Man, that is one unfriendly community atmosphere if you ask me. It's just one more thing working against any chance of the game growing, and it's one more thing SOE needs to work to clean up: a history of divisive game changes, and of letting people who raise concerns get mutilitated by their peers.
Comments
It's so unfortunate that anyone with an ouch of critisism is drowned out by the chorus of "you're part of the minority" when it somes to this game.
When do all the minorities who have been chastised finally make a majority?
This "game" truely needs a revolution.
You pretty much summed it up there, I think the community is just full of confused ex-vets that still want their game back, myself included as well and the newer community that took our spots. Now being said this, the community is so afraid of anyone blurting out anything that may be reachable to SOE that may or may not arm their nerf clubs. That they would burn the poster on a witch hunt if it was so legally to do so.
There is a lot of hurt and mix feelings in the SWG atmosphere as well as any SOE owned space. Forever these memories will be, forever forgotten they will be not.
I've followed the block nerf issue a little bit and from what I can tell, they implemented Block but instead of making it 1/10 they made it 1/5. This led people to build suits with block ratings so high they were almost impossible to hit, much like a defense stacker back in the day. While I see no problem with them nerfing it, I do see problems in the fact that 1) SOE designed certain new "content" around the bugged block stat. so now they'll have to spend even more time re-balancing those encounters to compensate for the nerf and 2) they knew about this bug and decided to let it go just to see how it played out. If it was not intended why would they design encounters around it and not just fix it as they were designing that content? Also, to let it go this long without a fix was just asinine on the developers part. Of course, this is SOE we're talking about so I am somehow less than surprised.
The people that insult that poster are obviously so desperate trying to convince themselves that their game isnt run by an incompetent company they are willing to go to any lengths to quiet whatever opposition may stand in their way. It is always the fault of everyone else and not SOE.
If it was SOE's fault for being incompetent and not fixing this issue in a timely fashion when they have known it existed for quite awhile what else could (and should) SOE take responsibility for? It is just easier for these people to blame the poster for being a whiner. The truth hurts I guess and they just do not want to see the situation for what it is.
It is sad though. The game has such a dwindling population and yet they still turn on each other like scavengers fighting over the last piece of a rotting carcass. The attitude of the community seems to be mirroring the quality of the game.
Thanks for the extra info on the blocking issue, though I try to follow the development of the game from time to time to see what's going on without me and just curious to see if they are really improving the game, I don't catch everything and it's good to know the details on the issue.
I now have a solid theory that it is no longer the devs that is the problem, we all remember the firing of the old and the hiring of the new devs that said they had a new vision and was going to do everything possible to gain the respect back from the community. Well it's sad to say but every passing issue they are becoming more and more like the old devs, so my theory is it doesn't matter who works and takes the spots of devs it is the company and its executives. It must suck so much to work there that the devs just don't care anymore. Just give up because of the obsessive time crunches and impossible deadlines for the features that everything just gets half-assed or not enough attention to be developed correctly.
Call it for what it is, but I am now full sail that the management is the reason why SWG continues to get worse and not one person that steps in there can change it.
I've read part of that thread on the SWG forums. To be honest I was in utter disbelief at the attitude of the playerbase which was bashing this person who had spent a considerable amount of resources on an item which got considerably nerfed. According to them, it was HIS fault for not realising it would be nerfed, not SOE for not desinging it right in the first place.
Even a correspondants popped into the thread to suggest he shouldn't have paid that amount for the item(s).
Trully shocking.
i do feel for the guy but everyone by now should know how soe is. that is what you get for spending money with them and being part of the "target audience". now the community is made up of leet uber kiddies and
delusional vets who would follow soe off a cliff.
arguing with a corporate fanboi is like teaching special education.
even if you teach him something...at the end of the day he's still retarded.
The funny thing about this NGE is that all the old problems from pre-CU are still there, but much worse.
People complained in pre-CU about timesinks. So what did they do? Take out all the timesinks that actually made sense like BF and wounds, and replace them with lockout timers. Now tell me, which is better? Healing your BF and wounds, or sitting around waiting for some contrived timer to let you back into the place you want to go?
People complained in pre-CU about defensive stacking. Yet defensive stacking never went away, only transferred to high cost lootables, just like the old skilltape fiasco everyone hated in pre-CU.
People complained about weapons costing too much pre-CU. Yet today, anything worth anything at all is just some rare loot drop that you can't manufacture even if you tried, costing YT-1300's full of credits just to buy (I'm waiting for them to go to the SoJ-standard...Diablo II reference for those not in the know).
People complained about the game being too buff-heavy. They complained about not being able to get buffs from doctors and entertainers. So what did they do? Add more buffs, and make buffing a requirement for any serious progression. Instead of taking entertainers out of the buffing business (never knew any good ent that liked to buff), and giving buff responsibilities to the class that actually worked (doctor), they eliminated docs, they saddled ents as the buffing class, and now it's even harder and more time consuming to find them (and not much fun for the ent).
So did the NGE really fix all that was wrong with pre-CU? For anyone who knew what the real problems were in pre-CU, absolutely not. All the NGE did was take away all the good things that worked from pre-CU, and maginfy all the failings of pre-CU in bad and uninteresting ways.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
The only real problems with the Pre-Cu could easily have been fixed.
All they had to do was fix the broken abilities (which they never made any serious attempt to do), and either make the mind pool unattackable, or make it healable.
Some ideas were unneccessarily complicated, but others were incredibly simple. For example if buffs were too powerful then how about removing secondary buffs? Or you could have either primary buffs or secondary buffs - but not both at the same time?
Oh and BTW Salvaje, the mind pool was healable to some extent with blue milk or damage stim packs looted from mobs on Dantooine. Some of those damage stims were quite powerful, and I sold quite a few on my vendor.
Yeah, I've never heard of SOE screwing around with game mechanics making items people spent large amounts of credits on, worthless/useless/not effective in an instant.
How many people here had their crafting suit made useless after a nerf or update or the NGE? Probably most everyone. I spent most of 6 months and a ton of credits putting together my crafting suit only to have the CU mostly remove its utility.
Yeah, skill tapes were not the best system, but neither was it the worst. The worst SWG has now...
The official SWG forum is negative and very hostile, which paints a very clear picture of the pathetic state of the game and the player community is in. This is why I find it hilarious that current players are worried about negative comments on other forum sites when they have so much garbage littering their own 'backyard'. From huge nerfs, to exploits, to low population concerns, to bugs, etc. (the laundry list is far too extensive), the current players are non-stop complaining AND are quick to rabidly attack any fellow game player. It amazes me that these same players are just as quick to tell dissatisified players to quit the game (or go play WoW) in spite of the all-too-real problems of declining player numbers and ghost servers.
I think you hit the nail on the head, so to speak.
And, I would think now with the in game population being what they are, that the digruntled vets are more than the majority. Does SOE get it? Nope.
And you actually saw very little of what was happening on the SWG forums. The SOE forum mods were extreemly busy deleteing posts/threads as fast as they could be put on.
Case in point? 1 of the better known trolls made a post saying that the SWG forums were private and no one has freedom of speech there. I countered with the Supreme Court tended to disagree as there is case law that you can not agree, sign, or in any way limit these rights. They left the post stateing that u dont have free speach and deleted the counter. ROFL
I don't feel sorry for ANYONE who plays the current SWG. If they are actually willing to spend precious hours and money every month to play this monstrosity of a game, knowing full-well how pathetic SOE is with handling their playerbase after years of historical patterns to go off of, they get 100% what they deserve.
The development team CLEARLY isn't very capable and it shows each time they mess up something and fail to correct bugs from 2 years ago.
Some ideas were unneccessarily complicated, but others were incredibly simple. For example if buffs were too powerful then how about removing secondary buffs? Or you could have either primary buffs or secondary buffs - but not both at the same time?
Oh and BTW Salvaje, the mind pool was healable to some extent with blue milk or damage stim packs looted from mobs on Dantooine. Some of those damage stims were quite powerful, and I sold quite a few on my vendor.
The simple solution to the mind pool was to make it so zeroing out action or mind didn't incap you. Only zeroing out health.
The alternative from early CURB concepts was that to incap a player, you had to take all three pools down to zero.
Either one would make it so that the "unhealable pool" did not take you out. Instead, your special abilities dependent on mind pool would be restricted. You know, sort of like a cooldown? Many of the combat concepts SWG stole from WoW were already there, in a different form. It's just that the new set of devs were too kriffing stupid to realize it.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
Just adding a craftable mind stim would have worked for me and cutting the secondary buffs either in 1/2 or in 1/3.
It would have made ranged much more viable. I would have also liked more co-dependancy on professions instead of everyone capable of fulling the tank, damage dealer, medic roll in 1 build but that is another topic for another pre-cu thread.
You always had equibrium and dropping Muon and timing your brandy buffs to deal with a mind pool on low. I never used milk. I preferred a solid double brandy timed just right.
I think you hit the nail on the head, so to speak.
And, I would think now with the in game population being what they are, that the digruntled vets are more than the majority. Does SOE get it? Nope.
And you actually saw very little of what was happening on the SWG forums. The SOE forum mods were extreemly busy deleteing posts/threads as fast as they could be put on.
Case in point? 1 of the better known trolls made a post saying that the SWG forums were private and no one has freedom of speech there. I countered with the Supreme Court tended to disagree as there is case law that you can not agree, sign, or in any way limit these rights. They left the post stateing that u dont have free speach and deleted the counter. ROFL
Actually Esquire, company forums are private property and are not subject to freedom of speech. The whole freedom of speech right is that the GOVERNMENT will not impend upon your right of speech (or rather the press specifically, it has been expanded someone from the original intent). An private company CAN deny you the right to speak through their channels as long as the government isn't 'initiating' that denial, they can and rest assured will, deny certain people the ability to speak through their private channel.
I think you hit the nail on the head, so to speak.
And, I would think now with the in game population being what they are, that the digruntled vets are more than the majority. Does SOE get it? Nope.
And you actually saw very little of what was happening on the SWG forums. The SOE forum mods were extreemly busy deleteing posts/threads as fast as they could be put on.
Case in point? 1 of the better known trolls made a post saying that the SWG forums were private and no one has freedom of speech there. I countered with the Supreme Court tended to disagree as there is case law that you can not agree, sign, or in any way limit these rights. They left the post stateing that u dont have free speach and deleted the counter. ROFL
Actually Esquire, company forums are private property and are not subject to freedom of speech. The whole freedom of speech right is that the GOVERNMENT will not impend upon your right of speech (or rather the press specifically, it has been expanded someone from the original intent). An private company CAN deny you the right to speak through their channels as long as the government isn't 'initiating' that denial, they can and rest assured will, deny certain people the ability to speak through their private channel.
Actually thats not entirely true also. The Con. rights have been extended to even the private sector via case Law. The companies have the right to place "reasonable" limitations, as the SWG forums rules, but they CAN NOT have a citizen of the US agree away thier specific Con. rights. Speech always had some limitations, such as don't yell fire in a crowed theater. But, making a complaint, via the SWG forums, is in strict accordance with the forums rules and anything else leaves SOE, it's parent companies, etc, with at least civil liability.
The problem here for a civil case is actual damages. Some companies get away with alot due to the fact that the other side has no specific actual damages, Still, that in no way limits the responsibility of the company to comply.
The other catch with trying to assert constitutional rights on private entities (even corporations, which are legally creations of the state and thus subject to the laws of the state to a degree that individuals are not) is that the corporations have much deeper pockets for litigation than most individuals do.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
The more money they spend due to this type of thing... the less profit they make.
In the long run the only thing that gets Corporates attention is.. money.
Not something I'm interested in doing.. just saying.. if I was.. its the money it would cost them that would be the point to me.
The problem with case law is that it isn't 'real' law and can be countermanded at any time by any court. All case law is, is the CURRENT interpertation of the law and its application, not yesterday's or tomorrow's, but today's and it subject to change at any given point.
As for the corporate thing, no. All the paperwork to form a corporation does is create it as an 'virtual' person. It doesn't make them a governmental organization, but a person. They are not subject to the same limitations of government and are afforded the rights of individuals (including the right to pay taxes, to sue and be sued and others).
Which is why it is imperative for corporations to seek to control that penstroke by whatever means is necessary.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
Can i get a link to this? this doesnt sound like the community i play with, but theres always some i guess. The block thing is bound to cause a bit of a stir at first, because of the amount of players it affects, but people are starting to realise that it isnt such a huge thing, and that its a good thing becuase it was a bit overpowered beforehand -block suits are still very viable in PvP and PvE, its not as though they are useless now.
By the way, you might want to remind all those guys on the official forums that their forums are currently public and everything they say there, negative or otherwise, has the potential to attract or drive away more customers than anything we say on a forum such as this. When people want to know what's happening in WoW they go to worldofwarcraft.com. When they want to know what's happening in Star Wars Galaxies, they go to starwarsgalaxies.com. Only a handful would come to a site like mmorpg instead of the main site when researching a game they're interested in playing.
guess I'm weird. I always come here to research my games